Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Please note that it is not permitted to have referral links posted in your signature. Keep these links contained in the appropriate forum. Thank you.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2055940817/signature-rules

Lie in court to get off fines??? Opinions?

Options
  • 25-02-2008 6:17pm
    #1
    niceirishfella
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭


    so, just go to court, and swear blind that you never recieved the fine in the post -
    I dont condone this but it seems to be the case?
    discuss???

    from Breakingnews.ie

    Loophole helping drivers beat motoring fines, says judge
    25/02/2008 - 15:18:42


    A judge has hit out at the way that people get notice of speeding fines imposed on them.

    He said it was resulting in people getting off because sending out notice of fines imposed by ordinary post wasn’t working.

    Judge Michael Pattwell said that in his courts, and others, cases for non payment were being thrown out because there was no proof that they had received notice of the fine.

    Defendants who went into the witness box and swore they did not receive the notice of a fine had their cases thrown out, around the country. Judge Pattwell said the matter was so serious that it needed to be redressed.

    The Department of Justice said today that they had raised the matter with the garda authorities, who would respond in due course. The National Road Safety Authority also placed the onus on the gardaí.


Comments

  • Options
    #2
    Turner
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,934 Mod ✭✭✭✭Turner


    Hundereds do it every day in the courts.

    Normally after the first person does it everybody else gets up and does the same. And all are struck out.

    If it does get to the point of being sent out by registered post I can see a huge increase in the workload for our Gardai.

    As it stands if people refuse to accept a summons that arrives as registered post it gets returned to the Gardai for personal service.

    I presume this will be the same way with fines if they are posted by registered post.

    Thats alot of Gardai spending alot of time searching for offenders to serve them with their fines by personal service.


  • Options
    #3
    Steve
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 22,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭Steve


    Until the day comes when the skanger joyrider / car thief with 47 previous convictions gets more than a slap on the wrist and "don't do it again" - it seems fair that the average motorist who is a victim of the revenue cameras can avail of the same inefficiency in the justice system.


  • Options
    #4
    Turner
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,934 Mod ✭✭✭✭Turner


    Its not only about speeders.

    Its also parking, driving without due care and attention, red lights, bald tyres....etc, anything you can get a fine for.


  • Options
    #5
    maidhc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,661 ✭✭✭maidhc


    Chief--- wrote: »
    If it does get to the point of being sent out by registered post I can see a huge increase in the workload for our Gardai.

    How? You don't need a garda to put a €5 frank on an envelope, and stick on a few stickers!


  • Options
    #6
    Steve
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 22,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭Steve


    Chief--- wrote: »
    Its not only about speeders.

    Its also parking, driving without due care and attention, red lights, bald tyres....etc, anything you can get a fine for.

    AFAIK If it's something serious like dangerous driving or drunk driving, the Guards will deliver the summons in person. It's only the "trivial" offences that are sent by post.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #7
    Turner
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,934 Mod ✭✭✭✭Turner


    maidhc wrote: »
    How? You don't need a garda to put a €5 frank on an envelope, and stick on a few stickers!

    When people know its a fine they wont sign for the post. The letter gets returned to gardai for personal service. That means they have to find the person and hand it to them.

    Happens already with summons'.


  • Options
    #8
    NBar
    Registered Users Posts: 591 ✭✭✭NBar


    Seen this happen in Court one day and the judge started asking did people recieve other bills, gas, electricity etc in the post etc and he started to convict/fine people, it all depends on the judges


  • Options
    #9
    maidhc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,661 ✭✭✭maidhc


    Chief--- wrote: »
    When people know its a fine they wont sign for the post. The letter gets returned to gardai for personal service. That means they have to find the person and hand it to them.

    Happens already with summons'.

    Then apply for substituted service by ordinary post? Like the rest of the population have to do?

    Or else send it by courier post whereby the postman certifys it was delivered...


  • Options
    #10
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    maidhc wrote: »
    Then apply for substituted service by ordinary post? Like the rest of the population have to do?

    Or else send it by courier post whereby the postman certifys it was delivered...

    Is it signed for or does the postman just sign somethign to say he dropped it through the letterbox? If it's not signed for then people will just keep saying it went missing out of the porch/someone must have thrown it out etc.


  • Options
    #11
    alo1587
    Registered Users Posts: 460 ✭✭alo1587


    Its fairly common to lie in court, just ask Bertie..


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #12
    I.S.T.
    Registered Users Posts: 893 ✭✭✭I.S.T.


    I don't understand why they don't send it by registered post. And to avoid the situation where someone will refuse to sign for it, just sent it in a white envelope with no markings on it. Most people are going to sign a registered letter.


  • Options
    #13
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 65,414 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    IrishSpeedTraps wrote: »
    I don't understand why they don't send it by registered post. And to avoid the situation where someone will refuse to sign for it, just sent it in a white envelope with no markings on it. Most people are going to sign a registered letter.

    +1

    I'm amazed they're not sent by registered post atm!

    My ads on adverts.ie

    https://www.adverts.ie/member/5856/ads



  • Options
    #14
    I.S.T.
    Registered Users Posts: 893 ✭✭✭I.S.T.


    unkel wrote: »
    +1

    I'm amazed they're not sent by registered post atm!
    It would eat into their profits if they had to pay the extra euro or so ;)


  • Options
    #15
    vectra
    Registered Users Posts: 15,554 ✭✭✭✭vectra


    alo1587 wrote: »
    Its fairly common to lie in court, just ask Bertie..

    ROFL :D


  • Options
    #16
    buckfast4me
    Closed Accounts Posts: 314 ✭✭buckfast4me


    lol! Be careful, my uncle tried this and ended up with a fine of €400 I think it was. The judge said to him "even if you didnt receive the letter, you knew you were supposed to be getting one" or something to that effect (it was a garda speedcheck and the garda pulled him in when he got caught).


  • Options
    #17
    WHITE_P
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭WHITE_P


    stevec wrote: »
    Until the day comes when the skanger joyrider / car thief with 47 previous convictions gets more than a slap on the wrist and "don't do it again" - it seems fair that the average motorist who is a victim of the revenue cameras can avail of the same inefficiency in the justice system.


    Seconded.

    Why should motorists be treat like public enemy No. 1, when many people guilty of far more serious offences walk out of our courts smiling everyday.

    Anyway, I've heard quite a few guards lie / embellish the truth in court over the years, paticularly when giving evidence in relation to motor offence's.


  • Options
    #18
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,993 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    alo1587 wrote: »
    Its fairly common to lie in court, just ask Bertie..
    The Mahon Tribunal is not a court of law!


  • Options
    #19
    Mr. Presentable
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,496 ✭✭✭Mr. Presentable


    WHITE_P wrote: »
    Anyway, I've heard quite a few guards lie / embellish the truth in court over the years, paticularly when giving evidence in relation to motor offence's.

    Woah! How often have you been summonsed for motoring offences? Or are you a Judge?


  • Options
    #20
    WHITE_P
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭WHITE_P


    nipplenuts wrote: »
    Woah! How often have you been summonsed for motoring offences? Or are you a Judge?

    Unfortunately I'm not a judge, however in 20 odd years of driving I've had reason to be in court a few times.

    Been a witness a few times to other people's misfortune, as well as my own.


Advertisement