Is the English FA gone mad ?

Evil_Clown

I see this morning the Aliadiere suspension of 3 games has been upheld and that an extra game has been added for a 'frivilous' appeal
This now means that martin Taylor will be suspended for 3 games
while aliadiere will be suspended for 4
A slap in the face after provocation of being grabbed in the face in the first place or a reckless challenge that has left a player fighting for his career, which is worse ?
Then to add to things they have sent a letter to both parties in the Taylor/Eduardo incident offering their sympathies, fair enough send the letter to Eduardo the guy is shattered both mentally and physically but to just send a letter of sympathy to Taylor is crazy, they should at least mention that his tackle was late and reckless before jumping to sympathy. He may be a nice guy but his tackle was not nice and I'm sick of seeing all the sympathy for him (because of nationalities no doubt, if this was Richard Dunne on Rooney I wonder would we be seeing the same reaction)
Eduardo is the victim here not Taylor

Peyton Manning

You should work for The Sun.

~Rebel~

Evil_Clown wrote: »

I see this morning the Aliadiere suspension of 3 games has been upheld and that an extra game has been added for a 'frivilous' appeal
This now means that martin Taylor will be suspended for 3 games
while aliadiere will be suspended for 4
A slap in the face after provocation of being grabbed in the face in the first place or a reckless challenge that has left a player fighting for his career, which is worse ?
Then to add to things they have sent a letter to both parties in the Taylor/Eduardo incident offering their sympathies, fair enough send the letter to Eduardo the guy is shattered both mentally and physically but to just send a letter of sympathy to Taylor is crazy, they should at least mention that his tackle was late and reckless before jumping to sympathy. He may be a nice guy but his tackle was not nice and I'm sick of seeing all the sympathy for him (because of nationalities no doubt, if this was Richard Dunne on Rooney I wonder would we be seeing the same reaction)
Eduardo is the victim here not Taylor

point a) Both were given straight red cards, the punishment for which is a 3 match ban. The Alieadiere appeal WAS frivilous and adding an extra punishment is to stop clubs appealing for every single decision. How they could have that would be rescinded is beyond me.

point b) I would imagine they sent a sympathy letter because Taylor now has it on his conscience that he has caused a massive potentially career ending injury on a fellow professional, which will at best keep him out for 9 months of agony and recuperation.

To be honest I wouldn't mind if there was an added retorospective punishment (6 match ban or something) for horror tackles, i.e those which Can cause massive injury, whether they actually do in each circumstance or not.

SantryRed

I have no problem with Taylor having only a 3 match ban because of the straight red.There's no reason to give him more.

However I can't believe the Aliadere incident has been upheld, surely that should mean Mascherano will be suspended for three games aswell?
The referee didn't book him for it so The FA could do something about it.
Doubt they will though.

~Rebel~

SantryRed wrote: »

I have no problem with Taylor having only a 3 match ban because of the straight red.There's no reason to give him more.

However I can't believe the Aliadere incident has been upheld, surely that should mean Mascherano will be suspended for three games aswell?
The referee didn't book him for it so The FA could do something about it.
Doubt they will though.

?! That makes no sense?! Mascherano has absolutely nothing to do with Aliadiere's appeal. Boro wanted Aliadiere's punishment lessened, which was never gonna happen. Even if they did give Mascherano a retrospective punishment, it would not effect Aliadiere's in any way.

It was a frivolous appeal, and was treated as such.

Boggles

So he misses more than 10% of the season because of a bi-tch slap, ridiculous. IMO opinion the most horrific incident last weekend was the so called "Captain" of Arsenals behaviour. IF anything deservers a 4 match ban it was that muppetry!

yom 1

Boggles wrote: »

So he misses more than 10% of the season because of a bi-tch slap, ridiculous.

Yeah so if he's smart he wont do it again. And Boro wont either.

Evil_Clown

~Rebel~ wrote: »

?!
It was a frivolous appeal, and was treated as such.

Jon Obi Mikel and Essien both had appeals for far worse sendings off rejected but neither were deemed frivolous.
Why is one frivolous and not the other ?

~Rebel~

I dont know, and i also dont know what that has to do with this really beyond showing inconsistency..thats a totally different case. Im sure i could go look for a YouTube clip for them and agree that yes an appeal was frivilous in those cases, but the point remains, Aliadiere's was a pointless appeal.

Perhaps since those appeals you mentioned, more clubs have just been appealing everything so the FA has decided enough is enough and put the foot down.

Dubit10

Taylor in my eyes should have been banned for the rest of the season.Cant understand where all this sympthy in coming from.He went over the top and smiled after tackle.Disgraceful IMO.What if it had been rooney or lampard etc..(English star) who had have had a broken ankle? Do you think the press would have had this kind of sympthy if lets say tugay or some other non english player would have done the same thing.Like hell they would:rolleyes:

SantryRed

~Rebel~ wrote: »

?! That makes no sense?! Mascherano has absolutely nothing to do with Aliadiere's appeal. Boro wanted Aliadiere's punishment lessened, which was never gonna happen. Even if they did give Mascherano a retrospective punishment, it would not effect Aliadiere's in any way.

I know that Mascherano has nothing to do with Aliadere's appeal.

What I meant was that in terms of consistency by the FA, Macherano has to get a 3 match ban IMO.

SantryRed

Dubit10 wrote: »

Taylor in my eyes should have been banned for the rest of the season.Cant understand where all this sympthy in coming from.

You honestly think he was smiling after that tackle?
You can't be serious?

Vokes

SantryRed wrote: »

I know that Mascherano has nothing to do with Aliadere's appeal.

What I meant was that in terms of consistency by the FA, Macherano has to get a 3 match ban IMO.

Then that wouldn't be consistent - he wasn't sent off.

SantryRed

SofaKing wrote: »

Then that wouldn't be consistent - he wasn't sent off.

Well if Aliadere's suspension has been upheld, Mascherano did worse and because it wasn't dealt with on the day the FA can ban him for it.
And if they think what Aliadiere did warranted the three match ban to be upheld then I think Mascherano should be banned too.

ditpoker

Dubit10 wrote: »

Taylor in my eyes should have been banned for the rest of the season.Cant understand where all this sympthy in coming from.He went over the top and smiled after tackle.Disgraceful IMO.What if it had been rooney or lampard etc..(English star) who had have had a broken ankle? Do you think the press would have had this kind of sympthy if lets say tugay or some other non english player would have done the same thing.Like hell they would:rolleyes:

:eek:

what game/incident did you see? taylor smiling?! are you kidding me!? as soon as the tackle went in he knew he'd done something wrong, he sat up on one knee, got shown a red card and didnt care... watch it again, he gets sent off, barely reacts and looks back down at eduardo looking quite concerned for him.

also there are much worse tackles week in week out in every division from schoolboy football to pro's. what made this one worse was the angle/eduardo's foot being planted on soft ground. if it had been summer on a drier pitch, his stud slip from beneath him and he rolls the tackle, if his foot was in the air, he rolls the tackle. if it had been at another angle, he;d probably roll the tackle. it was a bad accident. a youtube search for "good tackles" would find many similar ones.....

~Rebel~

SantryRed wrote: »

Well if Aliadere's suspension has been upheld, Mascherano did worse and beacause it wasn't dealt with on the day the FA can ban him for it.
And if they think what Aliadiere did warranted the three match ban to be upheld then I think Mascherano should be banned too.

First off, how was Mascherano's worse?! Are you saying that because he acted first? in that case if he had provoked Aliadiere by saying something to him, would that be worse too? In terms of the actions themselves, Aliadiere's was obviously worse.

Now, on the actual rule itself, the rule IS NOT "raise your hands, your off", Its more like "Do something with the intent of harming an opponant" and in a match situation more often then not the ref takes a player raising his hands to be just that. But, in this case he obviously didn't and probably said so in his match report. Masch raised his hand clearly with no force and just touched Aliadiere's face, obviously to somewhat provoke him, but not to cause harm. Aliadiere meanwhile actually did 'hit' masch, however girly.

One way i was thinking of looking at it, is if both incidents were carried out to a child, Maschs probably wouldn't hurt, Aliadiere's would probably make them cry.

Mossy Monk

Boggles wrote: »

IMO opinion the most horrific incident last weekend was the so called "Captain" of Arsenals behaviour. IF anything deservers a 4 match ban it was that muppetry!

I hope you are never in a position of power. That would idiocy. What exactly did Gallas do to warrant a suspension? Kicked an advertising hoarding? Get real.

Savman

It's easy. Taylor accepted his card and wrongdoing. Obviously Aliadiere didn't. If he ain't man enough to accept his mistakes, then yeah, he probably well deserves the extra game ban.

At least Taylor has shown humility and genuine regret, Aliadiere was just girls blouse stuff.

SantryRed

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Masch raised his hand clearly with no force and just touched Aliadiere's face, obviously to somewhat provoke him, but not to cause harm. Aliadiere meanwhile actually did 'hit' masch, however girly.

So squeezing someone's face isn't force then?

Mascherano should be given a three match ban as well as he was as much in the wrong as Aliadiere.

citytillidie

SantryRed wrote: »

Well if Aliadere's suspension has been upheld, Mascherano did worse and because it wasn't dealt with on the day the FA can ban him for it.
And if they think what Aliadiere did warranted the three match ban to be upheld then I think Mascherano should be banned too.

FA can only ban him the the match ref ask them to look at the video

PHB

This is the English FA gone nuts, but not in the Taylor sense.

Last week Fergie asked the FA to look at Gallas kicking Nani on three seperate occassions, the FA took no action. Aliadiare touches Mascheranos face, appeals the ban, and is given an extra day ban for daring to question the FA's decision.

The FA are utterly inconsistant all the time.

citytillidie

PHB wrote: »

This is the English FA gone nuts, but not in the Taylor sense.

Last week Fergie asked the FA to look at Gallas kicking Nani on three seperate occassions, the FA took no action. Aliadiare touches Mascheranos face, appeals the ban, and is given an extra day ban for daring to question the FA's decision.

The FA are utterly inconsistant all the time.

FA cant take action if a manager asks them it has to ne the match ref.

If they took action after Fergie asked them how many times would you then seen Wenger and every other manager ask them to look at videos

PHB

Well I don't know about procedure but,
the FA did review the footage and said

"Having viewed the footage, the referee was not satisfied that it showed evidence of violent conduct and therefore no further action will be taken."

citytillidie

If the ref has booked the player for it the FA will not upgrade it to a red card they will see the yellow card as enough.

I cant comment as I did not watch the match as i had more important things to be done, and would never go out of my way to watch Man U

Mr. Presentable

Boggles wrote: »

IMO opinion the most horrific incident last weekend was the so called "Captain" of Arsenals behaviour. IF anything deservers a 4 match ban it was that muppetry!

That's a reallly typical Man Utd fan post - nothing sporting in it, just hurt the competition however possible. Shallow.

Dave!

Can someone find the actual rule/law relating to hitting/touching someone's face during a match? I don't see how Masch and Aliadiere's incidents were so different -- they were both intentional, both involved force (one squeeze, one strike), and neither caused injury.

PHB

The ref didn't book Gallas. It's a joke.

PHB

nipplenuts wrote: »

That's a reallly typical Man Utd fan post - nothing sporting in it, just hurt the competition however possible. Shallow.

And that's a typical boards.ie persons post. What? That's a stupid thing to say? Why is generalising in general just stupid?

~Rebel~

SantryRed wrote: »

So squeezing someone's face isn't force then?

Mascherano should be given a three match ban as well as he was as much in the wrong as Aliadiere.

Come on, i really cant honestly believe that you think Masch's is as bad. Its clealry not forcefull. there's no push to the face or anything, its quite simply a touch, (I definately didn't see this "forceful squeeze") which would definately piss someone off. definate yellow imo. aliadiere's was clearly a swing in reaction. If i had my way that would have been a yellow too since it was so girly, but unfortunately in the current game, whatever about raising your hands, if you swing - you're off.

The ref looked like he had seen both incidents and decided there was no intent to harm from Mascherano since he did nothing.

Dave, Ref365 did an article on this a while back stating what i stated above, thats it not about raising your hands, its about showing an intent to harm. I tried looking for it there quickly but no joy. Id imagine if the ref thought there was a "squeeze of force" on Aliadiere he would have been off too, but to be honest i saw no such thing and i guess he didn't either. There isn't even contact long enough for a squeeze. The ref has since said he "had a good clear view of the whole incident"

Dave!

Any links to a replay? Can't find it on y00t00b. And if anyone else can find the relevent law then post away por favor

Loomis

Evil_Clown wrote: »

Jon Obi Mikel and Essien both had appeals for far worse sendings off rejected but neither were deemed frivolous.
Why is one frivolous and not the other ?

Nail on the proverbial head!
That's what pissed me off. Not that he got an extra match ban. The inconsistency of the FA. It's the same as referees - we'd all bitch and moan about them far less if even their crap decisions were consistent. They're not and that's what annoys people

astrofool

Masch can't be touched, because the ref reported that he saw what he did, and chose not to book him. In reality, both should be sent off, it was a case of poor refereeing (yet again), but according to the rules and regs, the FA can do nothing.

If Essien and Mikel appealed now, and weren't seen as frivolous, then it's a problem, obviously the FA has had enough with clubs coming to them with waste of time appeals, and are stamping down on it. The FA is allowed to change how it deals with these cases over time. I bet we'll see very few similar appeals for a while.

I think if a ref doesn't see an incident correctly, he should not do anything about it at all, rather then guess, and let the video panel decide. However, there's probably some code of refereeing where they get a demerit if they miss an incident.

Nunu

Lads, forget the Mascherano / Aliadiere / Gallas bickering...this guy has got to be ridiculed...

Dubit10 wrote: »

Taylor in my eyes should have been banned for the rest of the season.Cant understand where all this sympthy in coming from.He went over the top and smiled after tackle.Disgraceful IMO.What if it had been rooney or lampard etc..(English star) who had have had a broken ankle? Do you think the press would have had this kind of sympthy if lets say tugay or some other non english player would have done the same thing.Like hell they would:rolleyes:

How can anyone have this sort of view on that incident (and he's not the only one). The thing that's really annoying me are people saying he smiled after the tackle:mad: Total bollox!
Anyone who has seen it play through on tv knows he never smiled and anyone who condemns him of doing so because of a still photo doesn't deserve to have their views heard.

astrofool

That photo is also quite badly pixellated. I'm sure if you look closely, you can see scaly skin and some horns, he's a lizard person.

kryogen

Dubit10 wrote: »

Taylor in my eyes should have been banned for the rest of the season.Cant understand where all this sympthy in coming from.He went over the top and smiled after tackle.Disgraceful IMO.What if it had been rooney or lampard etc..(English star) who had have had a broken ankle? Do you think the press would have had this kind of sympthy if lets say tugay or some other non english player would have done the same thing.Like hell they would:rolleyes:

do you work for the sun? nice sensationalism, and dont let facts get in the way of a good stone throwing

gucci

Nice to see the English FA are totally consistent with their judgments. Frank Lampard got his red card rescinded from Saturday (in fairness he probably shouldn't have been sent off, but i fail to see how this is ANY different to Aliadieres incident)

event

gucci wrote: »

Nice to see the English FA are totally consistent with their judgments. Frank Lampard got his red card rescinded from Saturday (in fairness he probably shouldn't have been sent off, but i fail to see how this is ANY different to Aliadieres incident)

well tbh, aliadiere should have been sent off

disregarding whether mascherano have or anything else, he raised his hand to an opposing players face and was rightly sent off.

the rules are there in black and white. The rules are also there that if an appeal is frivilous, you will get an extra game, which Boro's was.
Can anyone tell us what reason were they using to try and get him off, why he shouldnt have been sent off?

Dave!

I'd love if someone knew the actual law he broke!

event

DaveMcG wrote: »

I'd love if someone knew the actual law he broke!

who?

aliadiere?

its violent conduct is it not?

raised hands to the face, is violent conduct, regardless of a slap or a punch

pickarooney

What exactly did Aliadiere's appeal consist of and is anyone capable of answering without using the F word?

gucci

event wrote: »

well tbh, aliadiere should have been sent off

disregarding whether mascherano have or anything else, he raised his hand to an opposing players face and was rightly sent off.

So is Lampards different because he had to lower his hand to slap at Boa Morte? Is a headlock like Carvallagho's one straight after the incident within the laws of the game? Of course he was only diffusing the situation, which is why he would wrestle an oppositions player rather than his own.

~Rebel~

anyone have a link to Lampards straight red? Haven't seen it myself. Aliadiere's looked a fairly cut and dried red anyway.

gucci

~Rebel~ wrote: »

anyone have a link to Lampards straight red? Haven't seen it myself. Aliadiere's looked a fairly cut and dried red anyway.

Video
Its not awfully clear (and looking at it again now Carvallagho's "head lock" wasnt as agressive as i thought-oops!)

joe123

I think lampard being let off is a disgrace imo. I think it was a fairly deserved sending off in the first place. Not for the push but when he first fell on top of him he brought down his heel which looked like he tried to hurt boa morte.

Is this the fa favouring the big club with the england international? Fair enough if allieadiare hadnt been given an extra match just for appealing...no lampard is a great english player playing for a big club of course we have to let him off.:rolleyes: Disgrace.

~Rebel~

Cheeers gucci

From the little pushy thing, it didn't look like there was any intent to harm or anything so could see the FA's point, same with how there was no violent intent with Mascherano's but was with Aliadiere's.

I didn't see bringing his heel down thing though, sounds worse then the actual sending off offence, will try and spot it again in that video above.

gucci

maybe at 1.30?he brings in his feet.....cant tell from that angle whats going on really.

event

joe123 wrote: »

I think lampard being let off is a disgrace imo. I think it was a fairly deserved sending off in the first place. Not for the push but when he first fell on top of him he brought down his heel which looked like he tried to hurt boa morte.

Is this the fa favouring the big club with the england international? Fair enough if allieadiare hadnt been given an extra match just for appealing...no lampard is a great english player playing for a big club of course we have to let him off.:rolleyes: Disgrace.

christ, do people not understand?

HE WAS SENT OFF FOR THE PUSH, NOT THE ACTION WITH HIS HEEL.

maybe he should have been, but he wasnt, it was the push, so thats all that they can look at, end of story

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Cheeers gucci

From the little pushy thing, it didn't look like there was any intent to harm or anything so could see the FA's point, same with how there was no violent intent with Mascherano's but was with Aliadiere's.

thats the issue really.

there was no violent intent, but it wont stop people here going mad

some of the posts are worse than the Sun

lpool2k05

I heard on SSN last week when discussing alliadiere that a panel of 3 sit to review the footage and its not neccesarily the same 3 sitting for every incident so different views will bring different decisions i guess!!Plus these people were never pro's which doesnt help them!

I think the FA defo have to sort their appeal process out!!Bit of a joke at the moment IMO!!

joe123

event wrote: »

christ, do people not understand?

HE WAS SENT OFF FOR THE PUSH, NOT THE ACTION WITH HIS HEEL.

maybe he should have been, but he wasnt, it was the push, so thats all that they can look at, end of story



thats the issue really.

there was no violent intent, but it wont stop people here going mad

some of the posts are worse than the Sun

very angry man.

event

not really

just when its about issues that can be explained easily