Immigration checks

RadioCity

The Garda Immigration bureau is carrying out more and more roadside checks on Bus Eireann and Ulsterbus vehicles operating on cross border services.

It seemed to be regular around the A1/N1 crossing between Newry and Dundalk, but it appears people trying to get into the Irish Republic are becoming more resourceful (well sort of!). Instead of travelling the shortest route between Belfast to Dublin, some are travelling on the bus from Belfast to Armagh, changing to the slow bus from Armagh to Monaghan, then getting on one of the expresses between Letterkenny/Derry and Dublin at Monaghan.

Needless to say, the Garaga Immigration people have caught onto this and are now checking the buses originating in Derry and Letterkenny, randomly and more frequently. The 0615 from Derry to Dublin was directed to stop on the M1 hardshoulder earlier today where a spot check was carried out.

patrickc

RadioCity wrote: »

The Garda Immigration bureau is carrying out more and more roadside checks on Bus Eireann and Ulsterbus vehicles operating on cross border services.

It seemed to be regular around the A1/N1 crossing between Newry and Dundalk, but it appears people trying to get into the Irish Republic are becoming more resourceful (well sort of!). Instead of travelling the shortest route between Belfast to Dublin, some are travelling on the bus from Belfast to Armagh, changing to the slow bus from Armagh to Monaghan, then getting on one of the expresses between Letterkenny/Derry and Dublin at Monaghan.

Needless to say, the Garaga Immigration people have caught onto this and are now checking the buses originating in Derry and Letterkenny, randomly and more frequently. The 0615 from Derry to Dublin was directed to stop on the M1 hardshoulder earlier today where a spot check was carried out.

I thought they were only at this temporarily last year, still at it so..

do they check trains and cars also?

must get a new visa

Pete4779

It's about time.

90% of our illegal immigration comes from the UK through the Northern Ireland/republic border.

I'm sure the UK would love for the Republic to follow them into the same mess that is the modern UK. Well done to the Gardai for getting onto this.

berliner

We have immigration police here???? With all the foreginers here I thought we had an open door policy.Come one come all.

Studoc

To be honest, I am gravely suspicious of this and find the whole idea of immigration checks on a now, virtually non existent border to be absurd and blatantly discriminatory. Why? Because you will only get stopped if you don't "look" Irish. If you are going to police the border in such a manner, look at everyone's id, even if they have red hair and freckles.

dam099

Are you supposed to carry ID going north?

Tha Gopher

Studoc wrote: »

To be honest, I am gravely suspicious of this and find the whole idea of immigration checks on a now, virtually non existent border to be absurd and blatantly discriminatory. Why? Because you will only get stopped if you don't "look" Irish. If you are going to police the border in such a manner, look at everyone's id, even if they have red hair and freckles.

Lol :rolleyes:x three million


If the Gardai were looking for Travellers who were involved in a robbery an hour ago, should they bother pulling over black or Indian looking motorists?

That post is beyond retarded. Please...just, please

andrewh5

dam099 wrote: »

Are you supposed to carry ID going north?

Yes because you are crossing an international border (whether you agree with it or not).

Studoc

Tha Gopher wrote: »

Lol :rolleyes:x three million


If the Gardai were looking for Travellers who were involved in a robbery an hour ago, should they bother pulling over black or Indian looking motorists?

That post is beyond retarded. Please...just, please

Just because you disagree is no reason to refer to a post as "retarded." I actually think that to draw an analogy between immigration (illegal or otherwise) and a robbery is a spurious and frankly ill thought one. A friend of mine (black and Irish) is constantly stopped and basically harrassed whenever she enters this country.

Studoc

Tha Gopher wrote: »

Lol :rolleyes:x three million


If the Gardai were looking for Travellers who were involved in a robbery an hour ago, should they bother pulling over black or Indian looking motorists?

That post is beyond retarded. Please...just, please

Just because you disagree is no reason to refer to a post as "retarded." I actually think that to draw an analogy between immigration (illegal or otherwise) and a robbery is a spurious and frankly ill thought out one. A friend of mine (black and Irish) is constantly stopped and basically harassed whenever she enters this country. Fair?

ardmacha

Robberies and illegal immigration are all crimes. If you were investigating a rape you'd might be better to investigate men rather than stop a load of woman on the basis of some sort of spurious equity.

Studoc

ardmacha wrote: »

Robberies and illegal immigration are all crimes. If you were investigating a rape you'd might be better to investigate men rather than stop a load of woman on the basis of some sort of spurious equity.

Stubbing your cigarette out on the street, jay walking and going at 85mph on a motorway are crimes too. The crime of rape cannot compare to some unfortunate individuals tyring to make their way (albeit unlawfully) south on a bus from Newry to Monaghan. I think it is an incredible waste of garda (and by extension, our) resources.

Terrontress

I had noticed that the red Transit had not been as evident on the M1 as before.

Zoney

Either it's a free travel area or it isn't. I do not like this, because no Irish or British citizen should have to prove their citizenship. Anyone with a different accent or skin colour gets different treatment the way things are at present. And it would not be a solution to equalise treatment by jumping down on white properly accented Irish or British citizens who don't have ID - it's not like any Irish or British citizens are required to carry ID in either jurisdiction. People born in the North in particular can be either and there is no requirement for them to carry ID. As such, there's no way there should be differentiation of anyone else from the rest of the UK or the rest of Ireland.

Polar101

berliner wrote: »

We have immigration police here???? With all the foreginers here I thought we had an open door policy.Come one come all.

If there was one, I'd expect they'd check peoples' passports at Dublin Airport - now you can get through if you wave something resembling a passport at the official from 30 yards away.

The_Conductor

Polar101 wrote: »

If there was one, I'd expect they'd check peoples' passports at Dublin Airport - now you can get through if you wave something resembling a passport at the official from 30 yards away.

I'm not sure what you mean by this- I go through Dublin airport several times a month, and while my passport may not merit detailed examination- it most certainly is checked.

Ham'nd'egger

Zoney wrote: »

Either it's a free travel area or it isn't. I do not like this, because no Irish or British citizen should have to prove their citizenship. Anyone with a different accent or skin colour gets different treatment the way things are at present. And it would not be a solution to equalise treatment by jumping down on white properly accented Irish or British citizens who don't have ID - it's not like any Irish or British citizens are required to carry ID in either jurisdiction. People born in the North in particular can be either and there is no requirement for them to carry ID. As such, there's no way there should be differentiation of anyone else from the rest of the UK or the rest of Ireland.

As I understand it, the free travel extends only to Irish and UK citizens and not to others; there has been many cases of people being turned back at airports and ferry ports for not having the correct papers. The powers that be may argue that they are not looking for British or Irish citizens, merely those from other countries traveling between the two States. It may sound racist in one sense but equally reasonable in another sense that somebody who is "coloured", wearing a turban etc may not be either Irish or British.

berliner

Polar101 wrote: »

If there was one, I'd expect they'd check peoples' passports at Dublin Airport - now you can get through if you wave something resembling a passport at the official from 30 yards away.

I know exactly what you mean.

Calina

I think this is more a political issue than a Commuting & Transport issue.

Politics mods - if you disagree, let me know.

Pete4779

Zoney wrote: »

Either it's a free travel area or it isn't

It's isn't. It's recognised in legal terms only in that the travel area is not part of the wider EU Schengen free travel area. There is no and never has been a local UK or Irish law enacted that defines a free travel area between the Republic and UK.

it's not like any Irish or British citizens are required to carry ID in either jurisdiction.

You are required (since several years ago) to carry your driving license with you at all times when driving in the Republic.

purple'n'gold

Of course we have to have immigration checks between here and the North. And of course the gardai will check people that do not look Irish/British. They are looking for illegal immigrants for god’s sake. A huge percentage of illegals coming into this country are getting here via the UK, and that means Northern Ireland. If these immigration checks are upsetting the nonsensical pc brigade, well, good! It’s near time we got a handle on this illegal trespassing into our country.

RadioCity

Calina wrote: »

I think this is more a political issue than a Commuting & Transport issue.

Politics mods - if you disagree, let me know.

I posted in the Commuting forum as my original intention (although it may not have been clear) was to highlight the manner in which bus was pulled in on the Motorway to do an immigration check when it could have been done more safely and effectively on the N33, the N33/M1 interchange or at the Airport Interchange.

berliner

purplengold wrote: »

Of course we have to have immigration checks between here and the North. And of course the gardai will check people that do not look Irish/British. They are looking for illegal immigrants for god’s sake. A huge percentage of illegals coming into this country are getting here via the UK, and that means Northern Ireland. If these immigration checks are upsetting the nonsensical pc brigade, well, good! It’s near time we got a handle on this illegal trespassing into our country.

Couldn't agree more.

mick72

Then,

why not put permanent border crossing with border police?

Most of the EU operates Schengen, I think Ireland should join too

purple'n'gold

mick72 wrote: »

Then,

why not put permanent border crossing with border police?

Most of the EU operates Schengen, I think Ireland should join too

No need for anything as dramatic as that at all, just keep the gardai checking the trains, bus’s and cars and turning back anyone they catch coming into the republic (British citizens apart) who do not have proper documentation. The word will soon go out on the bush telegraph and the illegal traffic will slow down. We will not join Schengen without the UK. The common travel area with the UK is far more beneficial to us than joining a common travel area on mainland Europe.

Chunky Monkey

Tha Gopher wrote: »

Lol :rolleyes:x three million


If the Gardai were looking for Travellers who were involved in a robbery an hour ago, should they bother pulling over black or Indian looking motorists?

That post is beyond retarded. Please...just, please

Every single f***ing time I come into this country I'm pulled over while everyone else goes on. My mum's side of the family used to visit us quite regularly when we lived in the UK. They haven't visited us here because my parents had to warn them about the hassle they would receive. My aunty is in quite a fragile state and would be very upset by the ignorant attitude customs people have towards travellers who don't look/sound Irish.

Studoc's post was far from 'retarded', he was simply stating the facts.

Studoc

purplengold wrote: »

Of course we have to have immigration checks between here and the North. And of course the gardai will check people that do not look Irish/British. They are looking for illegal immigrants for god’s sake. A huge percentage of illegals coming into this country are getting here via the UK, and that means Northern Ireland. If these immigration checks are upsetting the nonsensical pc brigade, well, good! It’s near time we got a handle on this illegal trespassing into our country.

What exactly does to "look Irish/British" mean? I assume you mean non-white? What about the many, many, thousands of non-white Irish citizens? What about an undocumented immigrant from say, the Ukraine asleep on the cross border buss with red hair, poor dress sense, freckles and a pot belly? Will he be woken and asked for ID? I doubt it, which is unfair, since the black Irish citizen on the same bus almost certainly would be.

And what happens to the undocumented when they are found out? Sent back North across the NI border and probably back into the 26 counties the next day. A complete waste of time. Illegal immigration is a fact of life, in every country, and the levels of it here are low compared to other countries.

purple'n'gold

Studoc wrote: »

What exactly does to "look Irish/British" mean? I assume you mean non-white? What about the many, many, thousands of non-white Irish citizens? What about an undocumented immigrant from say, the Ukraine asleep on the cross border buss with red hair, poor dress sense, freckles and a pot belly? Will he be woken and asked for ID? I doubt it, which is unfair, since the black Irish citizen on the same bus almost certainly would be.

And what happens to the undocumented when they are found out? Sent back North across the NI border and probably back into the 26 counties the next day. A complete waste of time. Illegal immigration is a fact of life, in every country, and the levels of it here are low compared to other countries.

So, you are saying illegal immigration is a fact of life and we should just accept it? I disagree; we should do everything possible to make sure our borders are secure. And if that means gardai asking people who in their opinion could be illegal immigrants for travel documents or their name and address or some sort of identification so be it. Its not exactly infringing on someone’s civil rights to ask them politely who they are and where they are going.

Studoc

purplengold wrote: »

So, you are saying illegal immigration is a fact of life and we should just accept it? I disagree; we should do everything possible to make sure our borders are secure. And if that means gardai asking people who in their opinion could be illegal immigrants for travel documents or their name and address or some sort of identification so be it. Its not exactly infringing on someone’s civil rights to ask them politely who they are and where they are going.

No, I don't think we should just accept it. What I object to is judging whether someone is an illegal immigrant or not on the colour of their skin, which is exactly what happens.

There are passport checks in airports and ports, and airlines etc check your id before you board, which is entirely proper. This will stop the vast majority of illegal immigration. Stopping a bus on the border is a complete waste of time. Anyone sent back will be across the border the next day.

The_Conductor

Studoc wrote: »

What exactly does to "look Irish/British" mean? I assume you mean non-white?

I'd actually assume it to mean the way someone was attired. I've a friend from NewYork who travels between here and London frequently- he's constantly randomly stopped- he reckons its the cut of his clothes and/or his haircut (he does look like a marine, not even on a day off). We used play games of trying to guess where people were from, from looking at their clothes (in Dublin airport). You'd be surprised at how rarely you'd be wrong.....

purple'n'gold

Studoc wrote: »

No, I don't think we should just accept it. What I object to is judging whether someone is an illegal immigrant or not on the colour of their skin, which is exactly what happens.

There are passport checks in airports and ports, and airlines etc check your id before you board, which is entirely proper. This will stop the vast majority of illegal immigration. Stopping a bus on the border is a complete waste of time. Anyone sent back will be across the border the next day.

No, stopping a bus at the border is certainly not a waste of time, and if anyone is sent back and is caught again the next day he should be handed over to the PSNI and the authorities in the United Kingdom should then be alerted to him. If he is trying to enter our country illegally chances are he is illegal in the UK as well.