Sunday Trading

Doctor DooM

jor el wrote: »

I don't quite understand that, but I certainly don't believe there should be any law imposed on people who have families to stop them from shopping/working whenever they want. Sounds a bit fascist to me. Why just pick on Sunday too, why not restrict Monday trading, or Wednesday trading?

Because Sunday has different legal and social conditions to late trading.

You have a funny definition of fascist, so. Bank holidays are fascist?

Design_Dude

I think sunday trading has gone over the top, do we really need to go shopping every day of the week, give the people a rest one day in a week.

themadchef

I work 50 out of 52 Saturdays / Sundays a year. it's my job.

I have a husband and kids but this is my line of work, i knew what i was getting into. No point complaining about it now.

If you choose a career that involves weekend work how can you then turn around and complain about it?

Design_Dude

Because it can be very hard to get a job you like, that doesnt envolve Sundays. And the more companies/business that open on Sundays, the more pressure there is on the other companies/businesses to do the same, making it harder for everyone.

Danno

I agree with the OP here. Sunday trading is a bummer. Out of principle I would not purchase anything on a Sunday really. I feel sorry for people's family lives that are ruined by it. A friend of mine who worked this regieme gave it up because he only got to sit down and have a family meal on a sunday with his family once every 21 days.

Design_Dude

same here, i take a break from shopping etc on a sunday, and would advise more people to do so as well.

Sam Vimes

when i worked part time, i needed to work sunday to get any kind of decent wage.

OP, you claim that you want sunday trading abolished so that people can spend time with their families. Can i ask you what is currently preventing people spending time with their families?

is bertie ahern showing up at people's houses and whipping them until they go out shopping?

no one is forced to go shopping on a sunday but some people want to and you have no right to force them to stop just because you don't like working that day. if you don't like working sundays, get a new job. don't try to force me to stay at home because you want to

dudara

Design_Dude wrote: »

same here, i take a break from shopping etc on a sunday, and would advise more people to do so as well.

I agree with you in principle, and I would also advocate people to undertake other activities on Sundays. However, I still believe that shops and other retails industries should be open to cater for people who want the service. The consumer drives the industry.

The consumer makes the choice ultimately.

And I would love it if all banks actually opened on a Saturday.

jor el

SDooM wrote: »

Because Sunday has different legal and social conditions to late trading.

You have a funny definition of fascist, so. Bank holidays are fascist?

I didn't say Sunday was fascist, I said that imposing your moral, social or religious beliefs on the masses (banning Sunday shopping) was fascist. I'd consider fascism to be a political ideology that considers the individual subordinate to the interests of the state based on cultural, social or religious attributes. Leaving the legal aspects of Sunday trading aside, because that already curtails the hours that a shop can open on Sunday, you're saying that nobody should be allowed to work or shop on Sunday because of your social or cultural beliefs. I believe that everyone should be allowed to choose for themselves. As others have said on this thread, they choose not to shop on Sunday and encourage others to do the same which is fair enough, but there should be no legal restrictions placed on them.

If you work Monday to Saturday and are up at 6AM for work, then the last thing you want to do in the evening is go shopping. If you live outside a main town or city then it may also require traveling a long distance to do it, so Sunday is the obvious, or only, option.

The original point raised by the OP in this thread was that people who have to work on Sunday, in the retail sector, were having their families destroyed by Sunday shopping. I don't buy that for one minute, but if there is any substance to it, why Sunday in particular? Why not close the shops on Monday, when the least number of people would be effected, and allow this day for the workers to spend time with their families, etc? Also, there are a lot more people working Sundays than just the retail sector. What about closing down the hospitals on Sunday so the doctors and nurses can spend time with their families? What about restaurants, pubs, fast food outlets, newsagents, local shops, etc?

At the end of the day, everyone has a choice of when to do the shopping, and when they work. It may be difficult to change jobs, require new training, schooling and so on, but it's not impossible for anyone to get away from a job that requires weekend work if they really want to. Saying that people who shop on Sunday are destroying the lives of people who have to work on Sunday is just a nonsense.

Doctor DooM

jor el wrote: »

I didn't say Sunday was fascist, I said that imposing your moral, social or religious beliefs on the masses (banning Sunday shopping) was fascist. I'd consider fascism to be a political ideology that considers the individual subordinate to the interests of the state based on cultural, social or religious attributes. Leaving the legal aspects of Sunday trading aside, because that already curtails the hours that a shop can open on Sunday, you're saying that nobody should be allowed to work or shop on Sunday because of your social or cultural beliefs. I believe that everyone should be allowed to choose for themselves. As others have said on this thread, they choose not to shop on Sunday and encourage others to do the same which is fair enough, but there should be no legal restrictions placed on them.

If you work Monday to Saturday and are up at 6AM for work, then the last thing you want to do in the evening is go shopping. If you live outside a main town or city then it may also require traveling a long distance to do it, so Sunday is the obvious, or only, option.

The original point raised by the OP in this thread was that people who have to work on Sunday, in the retail sector, were having their families destroyed by Sunday shopping. I don't buy that for one minute, but if there is any substance to it, why Sunday in particular? Why not close the shops on Monday, when the least number of people would be effected, and allow this day for the workers to spend time with their families, etc? Also, there are a lot more people working Sundays than just the retail sector. What about closing down the hospitals on Sunday so the doctors and nurses can spend time with their families? What about restaurants, pubs, fast food outlets, newsagents, local shops, etc?

At the end of the day, everyone has a choice of when to do the shopping, and when they work. It may be difficult to change jobs, require new training, schooling and so on, but it's not impossible for anyone to get away from a job that requires weekend work if they really want to. Saying that people who shop on Sunday are destroying the lives of people who have to work on Sunday is just a nonsense.

Two points.

Firstly, I think you are picking me up a little wrong- I don't think people shouldn't have the choice to work on Sunday- I just don't think they should be forced to. I don't think the country should be shut down- I just think the wheels of commerce should perhaps allow for the work life balance we keep hearing about.

And ireland lasted for a long time without Sunday. People used the wonderful day known as Saturday, the "Sunday is the only option" argument just isn't true.

Secondly, if you have children of school age, a mid week day off does not substitute for one at the weekend.

And yes, I do feel sorry for barmen/ nurses/ taxi drivers etc, and if I talk to them while in work I usually sympathise with them over their working hours.

Design_Dude

People arent physically forced to work on a Sunday, but with more and more business opening on Sundays they have little choice. Ireland is getting way to too consumeristic and it would be healthy for us to give it a break for one day in the week, and spend time doing something else for a change

Alun

Design_Dude wrote: »

... it would be healthy for us to give it a break for one day in the week, and spend time doing something else for a change

I do, on Saturday

watna

Alun wrote: »

I do, on Saturday

+1. Saturday is the day I relax at home with the paper and nice food and go for walks an switch off.

Sunday is the day I go shopping, if there's things I need to get. I worked in retail for years and working Sunday was fine, it was part of the job and expected. In fact, in college I liked it because it meant I had Saturdays off to do what I needed/sleep and still earned money for college by working Sundays. I suggest if you have a problem with it, you get a different job. It's your choice to work Sundays (to a certain degree) and my choice to shop on them. I'm sure there's lots of students who'd be happy to work on Sundays. If you're such a family man get a job that gives you the time to spend with them, the same way working mothers try and adjust their schedules by working, say 7 - 3.30. If there was no demand for it the shops wouldn't open. People have two days over the weekend to do it and Saturday is not always feasible.

Design_Dude

Family man, haha, im 18! Im a christian and believe in not working on sundays as a principle ans so do many in my family circle but over the last few years it has been getting increasingly hard to get jobs that dont envolve sunday work. I find it a good principle for life. Sin ea!

Wertz

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I thought it was pretty good for Des Kellys to advertise that they were closing on sundays to allow family staff time.

Really? I took it for the cynical advertising ploy it was, brought on by a downturn in consumer spending and hence less weekend business for Mssrs Kelly.
I notice when times were a wee bit better Des had no problem opening on Sunday...but suddenly once he and his family have made a packet, he suddenly "finds God" and decides that his grandchildren are more important than his business.
...and TBH that's fine...so why did he need to make issue of it with radio ads and an interview on liveline?


To the OP; go get a real job. The rest of us who work during the week have no bloody time to do everything we'd like to do on a saturday, hence sunday opening is a blessing (pardon the run)....I couldn't really give a damn about those working there...that's what they get paid for...
I'm old enough to recall when everything shut on sundays except a newsagent or a petrol station or the pub...and they were depressing days indeed. Go to a smaller town in the North sometime to see the effect sunday closing has....

Design_Dude

Wertz wrote: »

To the OP; go get a real job. The rest of us who work during the week have no bloody time to do everything we'd like to do on a saturday, hence sunday opening is a blessing (pardon the run)....I couldn't really give a damn about those working there...that's what they get paid for...
I'm old enough to recall when everything shut on sundays except a newsagent or a petrol station or the pub...and they were depressing days indeed. Go to a smaller town in the North sometime to see the effect sunday closing has....

Get a life

DublinWriter

DOS wrote: »

think of how many people you are keeping from spending time with their kids growing up...

Like the rest of us are away off in la-la land and not doing at least eight hours work on a weekday on top of a daily two-hour commute and that's not factoring in school-runs either.

You said you work four hours on a Sunday. Well Kudos to you mate. I bet the traffic is pretty light on a Sunday too.

DOS wrote: »

What the hell do people want in looking at washing machines, tumble dryers et all of a sunday, are yea really that Sad?

No, just cash-rich and time-poor.

I thought it was ironic that Irish people complain about immigration, now here's someone complaining that they have a job. Jesus wept, we're never happy.

Wertz

Design_Dude wrote: »

Get a life

lol Way to go champ, you sure told me!

ztoical

without sunday trading I never would have had a job while I was a student - I was in college monday - friday from 9am till nearly 10pm so working weekends was the only option to get some cash.

I've no pity for people working sundays - most people who work retail sundays don't work during the week. I work as a freelance artist so I'm self employed I don't have weekdays or weekends I just have days. My mums a GP and people have no shame arriving up to her house on a sunday and expect her to see them, just be glad people aren't showing up at your house asking to buy stuff.

Design_Dude

well in all fairness wertz, telling the OP to go get a real job and sayin you dont give a damn about the people working in the shops just becasue you want to go shopping on a sunday isnt very mature now is it?

Guy:Incognito

Design_Dude wrote: »

well in all fairness wertz, telling the OP to go get a real job and sayin you dont give a damn about the people working in the shops just becasue you want to go shopping on a sunday isnt very mature now is it?

Why should people give a damn about people who are moaning about working on a sunday? As I said, I spent 8 years working crap hours , includig Sundays. When I decided it wasnt for me anymore, I changed jobs. Simple as.

Wertz

I work all kinds of hours, nights, double shifts, sunday work, interspersed with periods of not working at all, can travel 600 mile in a week...if I don't like it I can find another job yeah? Well, no, I happen to like my job. Nobody walks up at the end of the day and thanks me for it...I get paid, that's my thanks. If I didn't like my job or found something to my distaste I'd make the effort to get other work, not complain about it and try and tell everyone to change their habits to suit little old me...

Years and years ago I worked collecting glasses and then behind a bar, never had a weekend night to myself, worked till 3am+ for a bunch of drunken merrymakers who couldn't give a toss about me. I didn't like it but it was all I could get; the moment something better came along I took it. It was still a job, it was still money and I got through it...I didn't tell everyone to just stop drinking to suit my social life.

Get a "real" job was an unfair term....supplement it with "another" so it falls within the parameters of human decency.
That said, I don't care about people doing a job...they'd be doing it whether I was in the shop or not. These days it would also seem (at least in retail) that the staff couldn't give a sh*te about the customer either...at least that's the impression I mainly get, being met with no manners or in some cases ignorance by staff too busy telling each other how pissed they were in club whatever last night and throwing you a cursory glance as you hand over your hard earned...

Design_Dude

Stekelly

Because as ive said already its not as simple as that. You cant always just change jobs. And increasingly more companies are working on sundays, which means it is very hard to find a company that youd like to work for that gives you sunday off. were talking about careers not just part time jobs, that you can pick and choose from.

Guy:Incognito

Design_Dude wrote: »

Stekelly

Because as ive said already its not as simple as that. You cant always just change jobs. And increasingly more companies are working on sundays, which means it is very hard to find a company that youd like to work for that gives you sunday off. were talking about careers not just part time jobs, that you can pick and choose from.

I changed to a different line of work. There are plenty of options.

Design_Dude

That doesnt suit everyone.

Wertz

Working doesn't suit me fullstop.

But I'm stuck with it till the lotto comes up or some rich eccentric uncle wills me his fortune...

L1011

Lack of Sunday trading = backward society. Just look at Northern Ireland, where you can be stranded for TWELVE HOURS along their main thoroughfares if you run out of fuel due to their puritanical trading laws.

Oddly enough the same people who whinge about working Sundays are unlikely to have had issue with the Sunday operation of either my current job - keeping pharmacies and more importantly, doctors surgeries IT systems running; or my past one - keeping the phone and DSL broadband system running. Because they use the damn things.

If you object to Sunday trading, don't shop on a Sunday. Don't buy a Sunday paper, make damn sure you don't run out of petrol, milk, bread, whatever. Enjoy your utter tedium of watching imported sports on satellite (requiring people to, shock horror, work on Sundays to video, uplink, answer the phone when you complain about signal interruptions due to rain, whatever), go visit relatives (possibly using toll roads that, amazingly, require people to work...) and so on....

ztoical

MYOB wrote: »

Oddly enough the same people who whinge about working Sundays are unlikely to have had issue with the Sunday operation of either my current job - keeping pharmacies and more importantly, doctors surgeries IT systems running; or my past one - keeping the phone and DSL broadband system running. Because they use the damn things.

+ 1 everyone seems focused on retail but the majority of retail shops only have part time staff working on sundays [at least when I worked retail it was always part timers on sundays and bank holidays]

Guy:Incognito

Design_Dude wrote: »

That doesnt suit everyone.

Well unfortunately everyone cant be accomodated. You decide what suits you less, working sundays or changing jobs.

L1011

Design_Dude wrote: »

That doesnt suit everyone.

Were you forced to sign a contract saying you work Sundays under duress? Doubt it, really, and if you were thats another legal issue...