High second hand car prices

pontovic

Hi

I was just looking at the thread 'Recommend me a Diesel' and I had a look at some of the links provided to cars on carzone and it got me thinking.

Why is it that some cars are almost twice as expensive second hand in Ireland as they are over in England. I could pick up a very decent 2005 ford mondeo here for 5.5k Sterling with air conditioning, allow wheels... the works. In Ireland, dealers seem to look for about 12k Euro for the same car. With the current exchange rate that's nearly twice as much. I know about VRT etc but does it make that much of a difference ?

Private sellers seem to be doing the same thing. I know setting a slightly higher price than what your after is the thing do you sell the car at a price you and the buyer are comfortable with, but there is a huge difference I see.

Are cars sold for the money dealers and private sellers are looking for ?

Cmar-Ireland

Some people will just buy over here because of the hassle of buying from the UK. Most of the time there are better deals to be had over there, but it takes a fair bit of effort to actually go and buy them.

Guy:Incognito

They are dearer to buy new here in the first place o it would stand to reason they would be dearer 2nd hand. They most likely depreciate in tandem with a UK one but as the price was higher initially it stays higher all the way down.

jimbling

ah, are you forgetting the VRT charge with that calculation you did there.
5.5k sterling is €7.1+
there'll be about 3/4k VRT on top of that.
so, you only save a grand or so. makes the effort not look worth it.

HJL

jimbling wrote: »

ah, are you forgetting the VRT charge with that calculation you did there.
5.5k sterling is €7.1+
there'll be about 3/4k VRT on top of that.
so, you only save a grand or so. makes the effort not look worth it.

Dont forget that the VRT amount when importing a car is calculated using the market value of a car with VRT already added onto it.

So while its not always worth the effort to re-reg a car. In answer to the OP's question the cars in Ireland are much higher than in the UK.

Just look at the Corsa ads on tv, base model starting from £6995 sometimes, ring up any Opel garage and see what €9129 will get you!

Biro

If you bought a new Mondeo now for €30,000... (VRT dictates that price), and in 4 years time the dealer offered you €9,000 for it cause that's what it's worth in England, would you be happy?

JHMEG

A top of the range 2005 1.8TD Mondeo Ghia incurs €2700 VRT (should be less from July 1st).

£5500 = €7200

Add VRT and total is €9,900.

Same car on carzone is €16,000.

To answer the OP's question: most Irish people have a bit too much money and are very happy paying inflated prices. It makes them feel like they're getting more.

(I like my money and buy in the UK if it's cheaper.)

mickdw

Biro wrote: »

If you bought a new Mondeo now for €30,000... (VRT dictates that price), and in 4 years time the dealer offered you €9,000 for it cause that's what it's worth in England, would you be happy?

Well a choice of 4 year old mondeos can be had for €9,000 here on irish plates! Off thread but, for a mainstream car, the depreciation on a mondeo is very steep and im sure anyone could buy and audi a4 new and suffer less depreciation.

Biro

mickdw wrote: »

Well a choice of 4 year old mondeos can be had for €9,000 here on irish plates! Off thread but, for a mainstream car, the depreciation on a mondeo is very steep and im sure anyone could buy and audi a4 new and suffer less depreciation.

Well, my figures were from the top of my head, but the point remains the same. Dealers have to give somewhat reasonable 2nd hand prices because of the VRT on the new cars.

prospect

Also, don't forget the 21% VAT, on both the value of the car AND the cost of the VRT.

Thats right, they charge VAT on the VRT....!!!!!......!!!!!!

jimbling

prospect wrote: »

Also, don't forget the 21% VAT, on both the value of the car AND the cost of the VRT.

Thats right, they charge VAT on the VRT....!!!!!......!!!!!!

no they don't. They don't charge any VAT at all. Not unless you're talking about a car that's less than 6 months old. Or outside the EU.

yayamark

Dont forget aswell you get a better spec in in the uk.

N8

Should I buy an imported car from UK?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055249139

N8 wrote: »

In regard to the OP "Should I buy an imported car from UK?"

The answer is YES!

The exchange rate is excellent and will not be as good for years. Even with the VRT paid you will save money or for the same money buy a car that is younger and have more goodies.

The cars in the UK have a much higher spec ie leather, ABS, armrests, even down to mudflaps etc. Not only is this good for you but it will make the car more attractive when reselling it.

Put off paying the VRT until July and if you buy a diesel you will have less duty to pay again increasing your spending power. And added to this, VRT after July 1st and you can avail of lower annual tax for your new car - good for your pocket and again increasing resale value and making reselling or trading in easier.

Salt on the roads is a bit bogus. The fact is the roads here in Ireland, especially in rural areas, are a disgrace and cars in the UK esp England do not have this to contend with and so are in better condition all over. Also in england the resale value of a car without a service history is nil so owners esp private tend to look after their cars much better than we do.

I have bought in the UK on a regular basis (10 cars in 11yrs - 7 from the UK) and the last car I bought stood me just over €10K with the VRT paid, an independent check in England (£200 sterling) and the ferry home, got me a car with a very high spec and FSH, and single owner, and saved me over €5K on prices to be found in autotrader.ie and carzone.ie.....

"Should I buy an imported car from UK?"

YES!

The Dealers are forced into a position (VRT/VAT etc) however that is no reason for you to be.

Anan1

Used car prices are not set by sellers, either private or trade. They are set by buyers.

prospect

jimbling wrote: »

no they don't. They don't charge any VAT at all. Not unless you're talking about a car that's less than 6 months old. Or outside the EU.

Used car prices are based on new car prices, which include VAT, VRT and VAT on VRT, that is the angle I am coming from.

Anan1

prospect wrote: »

Used car prices are based on new car prices, which include VAT, VRT and VAT on VRT, that is the angle I am coming from.

Used car prices bear no relationship to new car prices, they are simply the amount a customer will pay for that car.

prospect

Anan1 wrote: »

Used car prices bear no relationship to new car prices, they are simply the amount a customer will pay for that car.

hmmmmm,

The starting point is the age/condition and original value of the vehicle. Then the real value is fine tuned based on demand.

For example, there is not as high a demand for SL500's as there is for VW Polos, but you'll pay more for a 2005 SL500 than you will for a 2005 Polo.

jimmycrackcorm

prospect wrote: »

hmmmmm,

The starting point is the age/condition and original value of the vehicle. Then the real value is fine tuned based on demand.

For example, there is not as high a demand for SL500's as there is for VW Polos, but you'll pay more for a 2005 SL500 than you will for a 2005 Polo.

It still applies. It's not the original price that matters but what people are willing to pay. That's why the depreciation is so much higher for an sl than a polo.

prospect

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

It still applies. It's not the original price that matters but what people are willing to pay. That's why the depreciation is so much higher for an sl than a polo.

Oh, I agree, but I think it is naive to say the OMP has no bearing on the used car price.

I also would like to say:
"Long live crippling depreciation on high end sports cars" Maybe I'll be able to afford one soon.

maidhc

Anan1 wrote: »

Used car prices bear no relationship to new car prices, they are simply the amount a customer will pay for that car.

True.

Funnily enough in Tenerife new cars are quite reasonable (€20k will get you a new golf TDI), but s/h cars are at least as expensive as here.

E92

The price of a used car is determined by supply and demand, which inherently includes the price a consumer is willing to pay.

If a dealer is charging too much for car X, then every rational person will pass by and buy an identical car Y, if car Y is cheaper. Dealers charge a price based on what they think consumers are willing to pay. If it's too high, they will get no business, if it's too low, the cars will fly out the door.

If you think a car is overpriced, then 99% of the time it's because other people think it's fine value. The reason Toyotas hold their value so well is because dealers know that they can get rid of one very quickly, if they knew they'd be stuck with one for a while, they'd sell them for less.

bat77

Watch the price of small engine cars soar with the price of petrol about to go up again, talk of it hitting the €2 ltr mark :eek:

JHMEG

E92 wrote: »

The price of a used car is determined by supply and demand, .

It's not quite that simple:
a) Prices on Carzone in particular are unnaturally high, because people look at what other people are asking and ask the same. Almost every seller does it and a sort of accidental cartel forms. Naive buyers get sucked in and think "we'll that's the going price" and pay up.
b) Actual cartels. Ford and Citroen dealers were recently in trouble over this, and these were the cartels that could be proved (remember there has to be written proof).

At the end of the day the prices are determined (as already stated) by what people will pay. My point is tell them that this is the going price for long enough and they'll start to pay up.

PS. 2nd hand car prices were actually reasonable in the days when Buy & Sell was the main means of selling a car. I remember a friend of mine noting that Carzone prices were much more expensive than B&S, so he put his Vectra is Carzone for £5000 and £4000 in B&S.

johnc22

hi i was thinking of buy 2 or 3 cars from the uk to sell over here,, i know i have to pay the vrt when i sell them,,, but what about this tax.... they are btween 3 and 4 years old,,, so any suggestions would be helpful

ART6

The problem with buying ex-UK cars is that they use salt on the roads there, and body corrosion (especially inside door sills) can be a big issue.

wingnut

Salt may damage untreated paintwork but at least they have proper roads in the UK. More damage is done to cars by shakey Irish roads, potholes and insane speed bumps.

gordon_gekko

wingnut wrote: »

Salt may damage untreated paintwork but at least they have proper roads in the UK. More damage is done to cars by shakey Irish roads, potholes and insane speed bumps.

agreed , were the exception to the rule in this country when it comes to salting roads, they do salt the roads here anyhow just not as extensivly

ART6

wingnut wrote: »

Salt may damage untreated paintwork but at least they have proper roads in the UK. More damage is done to cars by shakey Irish roads, potholes and insane speed bumps.

Having just paid out €750 for new shocks, wishbones, suspension repairs, and a couple of years ago €290 to replace an alloy wheel buckled in a pothole I am inclined to agree with you Wingnut:( I live in a road that the Army used to use for tank testing, but stopped when they couldn't cope with the damage to their tanks any longer.