The Dog Whisperer

BeauZak

Great article published by the APDT (Association of pet dogs trainers)

http://www.apdt.co.uk/pdfs/Choke_Chain_leaflet.pdf

C.M uses all sorts of collars and IMO these are highly inappropriate.

I am with the professionals on CM. Especially Ian Dunbar (who will be coming to Ireland soon we hope). His take on C.M is here http://dogtime.com/cesar-millan-and-ian-dunbar.html

I am looking forward to the day when C.M's contract with the T.V company ends. At which stage I believe and HOPE he won't be on T.V anymore.

Anyone who understands and works with dogs can watch the body language and understand why his techniques are outdated and in my professional opinion dangerous for owners and dogs.

As regards pack theories and the incorrect portrayed anyone who really wants to understand canine behaviour and "pack" should refer to Ray and Lorna Coppinger studies also Barry Eaton, Ian Dunbar and others referred to in posts above.

http://www.workingdogweb.com/Coppinger.htm

http://www.deaf-dogs-help.co.uk/help/dominance.htm

Wokie

I've read one of Barry Eatons book on dominance! It's called 'Dominance Fact or Fiction' and it is an excellent book.

I agree with you Beauzak...the sooner Caesar Milan is off the air, the better! Along with 'dog borstal' for that matter!!!!

cowzerp

The problem with people is they dont understand what he's doing! he's not training the dogs, he's getting them acting like(DOGS) instead of unstable human like confused dogs!

these dogs are timebombs..im a believer and so are most people who actually watched the program, the people who oppose his ways are mostly dog trainers, its not the same thing.

Morganna

Caesar knows his job .he doesnt train dogs he is more a behaviourist .He is good at what he does.He treats dogs as dogs animals and not humans in animal skins.A dog is a dog not a human Caesar is great and any one who is succesful will have jealous people trying to knock them

Morganna

well i went on that site and dont know what to think.But i do know that Caesar knows dog behaviour .

peasant

Cesar Millan is a businessman who dabbles in dog bahaviour.

No more, no less.

He knows one or two things about dog behoviour, I grant him that. But his interests lie not with the wellbeing and/or good behaviour of the dogs, but with making money.

My problem is that he doesn't practice what he preaches on his television shows. For the sake of a quick, televisable result, more often than not he resorts to physical dominance of the dog ...exactly what he SAYS you shouldn't do.

Transforming yourself into a credible leader and your dog into a happy "follower" is a long drawn out process, plagued by slow progress and the odd setback ...not fit for television.

So he rushes in to see a "problem dog", pushes it around a bit, asserts his dominance (often unseen by the uninitiated viewer/ dog owner), makes the dog "perform" for the camera, spouts a few of his mantras and then disappears.

Neither dog nor owner are helped by this.

The man's a fake. But he does rather well out of it.

phoenix-MT

lakes wrote: »

i watch it & sometimes it seems to good to be true,the fact that within 2 mins he can control a dog! I was on another forum on another website & the people thier reckoned that he used electric shocks wit the dogs & that they wouldnt show this on tv! they reckon that when he says psst that this gives the impression to the dog of the electric buzz from the collar & frightens the s**t of them! when i try to use psst wit my dog or any dog they just look at me like im mad!

I have trained and worked with german shepherds in aggresive environments and now i own a staff, who came from a really bad background of being abused. The 'psst' that you are refering to is just a noise to distract the dog from what they are doing or thinking and getting their attention. I am against shock treatment as there is no need for it, its a quick fix to a problem that the dog does not understand and the trainer cannot be bothered spending the time to rectify. I have seen shock collars for perimeter fences in use, and the majority of dogs actually learn that when the collar is off, they can go where they want...is this fixing the problem? Ceasers methods are correct, but like all tv shows, it is not done in 2mins, he can spend a week or two with the dog and just film bits to keep the audience entertained. Dog training is a 24 hour job, for someone who can cope with severe frustration and has a lot of patience, otherwise my advice would be get *professional* help but make sure you are involved in the training, so you can continue it afterwards. Oh and if you are not good at making dominating noices like 'pssst' use a rattle bottle. goodluck

peasant

In 90% of cases of "problem dogs" from a normal family dog background the problem doesn't lie with the dogs anyway. Dog training is a waste of time in those cases, it's the owners that need training

phoenix-MT

I agree, the only really psycological problems a dog may have are from inter-breeding or genetic diseases, all of the rest are from human interaction, mainly from people who havent got a clue how to look after a dog or train it even in basic obedience ie. Sit, Down etc. And what really annoys me is this dangerous dogs act and lists that ban the dogs that i love best like staffs, g/s, akitas, rotties etc But then last week i got bit on my foot by a Jack Russell for no reason from behind!!! lol

Does anybody remember Barbara Woodward (I think??) She used to have a TV program lightyears ago training dogs. A choker chain was her preferred method too if I remember rightly.

Morganna

Barbara woodhouse did use check chains she was an excellent dog trainer .I have defo changed my opinion on ceasar .but Barbara Woodhouse was good and as she always used to say there are no bad dogs its bad owners.I

Morganna

phoenix-MT wrote: »

I agree, the only really psycological problems a dog may have are from inter-breeding or genetic diseases, all of the rest are from human interaction, mainly from people who havent got a clue how to look after a dog or train it even in basic obedience ie. Sit, Down etc. And what really annoys me is this dangerous dogs act and lists that ban the dogs that i love best like staffs, g/s, akitas, rotties etc But then last week i got bit on my foot by a Jack Russell for no reason from behind!!! lol

I have owned German shepherds all my life and worked obedience shown dogs in breed ..shows .worked with a variety of different breeds and the only dogs to have bitten me where a chihuhua a westie and a yorkie I have never been bitten by any large breeds.

WECpoker

Personally, I love the show...but more for the friendly character he portrays and the different stories of the dogs and their owners. I guess if I was using it as a learning technique on how to train my own dog I would view it with a more critical eye.

I am entertained by the show for some reason so that is good enough for me

phoenix-MT

Morganna wrote: »

I have owned German shepherds all my life and worked obedience shown dogs in breed ..shows .worked with a variety of different breeds and the only dogs to have bitten me where a chihuhua a westie and a yorkie I have never been bitten by any large breeds.

lol then you feel the same, the dogs that you love best (german shepherds) are banned because of how aggresive they are, but all the little dogs with little dog syndrome are allowed bacause when they bite it doesnt hurt....is that the point though, what about when a westie bites a baby?!

Morganna

I doubt if a little dog did attack a child it would make the papers it wouldnt be sensational enough its only the big dogs the media pick on.The little dogs can be very aggressive and yet a gsd would lay down his life for you

Morganna

phoenix-MT wrote: »

lol then you feel the same, the dogs that you love best (german shepherds) are banned because of how aggresive they are, but all the little dogs with little dog syndrome are allowed bacause when they bite it doesnt hurt....is that the point though, what about when a westie bites a baby?!

Yep i do feel the same its so damn annoying .

Morganna

Do you all remember in the 70s it was gsds are dangerous attacking then it went to rotties in the 80s then to pitbulls .What breed will be next but i do admit some of Caesars techniques are just common sense.

phoenix-MT

yea true, however just some dog owners dont have any common sense! yea were due a new breed to bully now aint we!!! lol any one got any ideas what will be next?

Morganna

Phoenix thats it precisley what will the next breed be
bet it aint anything small .

phoenix-MT

just a couple of quick true personal stories about german shepherds.

when my sister was a baby they had a 4 year old gsd. My sister got out of her cot and crawled towards the fire, every1 was in the kitchen next door and heard the dog growling at her, so they ran in with a shot gun, but only to find the gsd lying in front of the fire growling at my sister to keep her away, sadly the gsd was that severly burnt that the vet had to put him down, but he sacrificed himself to save her.


When my grandad had a gsd, unfortunetly it bit one of the sheep and turned, became aggresive, so he brought it up into the hills one day where he lived to shoot it, but the weather changed so quickly that he got lost in the severe fog....it was the gsd that led him down the hill and 3 miles back home safely, and ever since then it changed and would never leave his side....almost like it knew the reason for going up into the hills. He had that dog for 10 years and was the best dog he ever had.

Thats why i like them so much.

peasant

phoenix-MT wrote: »

just a couple of quick true personal stories about german shepherds.

when my sister was a baby they had a 4 year old gsd. My sister got out of her cot and crawled towards the fire, every1 was in the kitchen next door and heard the dog growling at her, so they ran in with a shot gun, but only to find the gsd lying in front of the fire growling at my sister to keep her away, sadly the gsd was that severly burnt that the vet had to put him down, but he sacrificed himself to save her.

Very heroic story and all ...but no offence ...proper supervision of baby (and dog) could have prevented all that.

phoenix-MT

lol yea meant to say.........., bad parenting im just the middle man nothing to do with me!! :-)

Morganna

heres another heroic story invoving a gsd .When i was about two or three we where living in england.We had gsds .My companion was a black dog called Prince.Anyway one day i got out of the front garden and headed off .Prince was with me i crossed many busy roads and Prince never left me .my parents where frantic and i was eventually found.People told my parents that the dog kept me from crossing the road when it was busy and wouldnt let any one near me .till my parents found me he even had hold of my coat .

WECpoker

For those that get it....

Cesar Milan to appear Tuesday evening States Time, On the O'Reilly Factor - Fox News Channel