Would you accept this?

Irishcrx

To cut a long story short, I own half a house, no mortgage on it with another person (Family), I wanted to buy the other half out and was refused, so I said I'll take my share and buy another house although I did want the one i'd a share in. The house is based in Kilmore just in front of Beumount hospital, south facing garden , side entrance and large mechanics garage to back, 3 bedrooms and in need of a bit of modernization. 3 evaluations were done by the other party with me present at two but they didn't kow I owned half, they said it was worth 320 k but when I had my 2 evaluations done I was told 350k.

Getting to the point i'm being offered 160 k for my share in it, but I really think i'm being done here as checking the area prices for a house like mine it really does look at least 340k - 350k , The person who owns the other half is well off, has her own house already were as i'm young and only starting in life (21), if this was to go to court what could happen what would you guy's do.

It's not so much the money but the princable of being screwed with that has me annoyed. Advice please?

Beruthiel

Tell this person that you want half of 350k or you're putting it on the open market.
Get yourself a solicitor asap for correct advice.

andrewh5

Get 3 independant valuations carried, ensuring that the valuer is aware that you are being bought out. Also make sure that the other party agree with the valuers you select and that they are present when they are carried out as well as yourself.

Once you have the three valuations, work out the average of the 3 and go firm on that as the price that will be paid to you.

seamus

Cut and run.

The housing market is in a nosedive and will remain so for the next few months at least. If you start getting solicitors and multiple valuers involved, then you'll see a massive chunk of that €15k wasted on nothing - that's if you even get it in the end. At 21 years of age, "doing well" for most people is simply not having any debt. You're facing the possibility of having €160k in the bank and no depreciating property. This time next year, the other family member won't be able to get €320k for their property.

Take your €160k, sit on it for six months and then go looking for a better property in a better area for a better price. You don't need the hassle of solicitors and the other crap that comes with it, particularly seeing as you're dealing with family. Is €15k really worth more than your family?

beeno67

seamus wrote: »

Cut and run.

The housing market is in a nosedive and will remain so for the next few months at least. If you start getting solicitors and multiple valuers involved, then you'll see a massive chunk of that €15k wasted on nothing - that's if you even get it in the end. At 21 years of age, "doing well" for most people is simply not having any debt. You're facing the possibility of having €160k in the bank and no depreciating property. This time next year, the other family member won't be able to get €320k for their property.

Take your €160k, sit on it for six months and then go looking for a better property in a better area for a better price. You don't need the hassle of solicitors and the other crap that comes with it, particularly seeing as you're dealing with family. Is €15k really worth more than your family?

Agree completely

Zambia

Take the money.

bren2002

Take the money and run for the hills. You are not being done, if anything the other half is being done. If the house was put o the market you would get less then you think you will and you'll also have to wait months for the sale to go through.

Take the money (and don't fall out with the other family member)

antoinolachtnai

Would you say that you would be happy to pay 175k for half the house if it were available to you?

Have you made this offer to the other party or would you consider it? If they only believe the house is worth 320k, they would need to be on drugs to refuse an offer for 175k for half of it.

It would seem unreasonable in those circumstances for them to only offer you 160k for the same thing and expect you to take it.

At the end of the day, the person who is willing to pay the most money for the other's share of the house should get it. It has nothing to do with who is younger or older or wealthy or poor or any of that stuff.

The other people are right that you can't fall out with relatives over this.

That said, you can't let yourself be walked upon either. You have to be very friendly and professional in your dealings, but you still have to be very clear about what you want. You shouldn't fall out over stuff like this. It's hard to believe when you're 21, but it is possible to stay on friendly terms with someone whilst having a very hard haggle. You won't believe me, but this is actually an opportunity to grow closer to your relative, rather than grow apart.

Re the property market stuff, I don't know, I think you are wise to try to take the opportunity to own your own home. Beside Beaumont hospital, you know you can always get it rented.

What's wrong with staying invested in the house for a few more years until your relative sees sense or just decides to sell up and live the good life?

You don't want to go to court over this. There's no point, your fallback position if you don't get what you want is to keep your share in the house and get a steady cashflow from the rent.

The court - if you end up there could do a lot of things, but you will probably end up selling the house on the open market. With the legal fees and the bitterness and all the rest, everybody loses. Then you'd have a reason to fall out with your relatives! And over what is really a relatively small amount of money (for you I know it's not, but down in the Four Courts, it is.)

You should consider talking to a solicitor, but really, your problem is commercial, not legal.

Good luck with it and don't forget how lucky you are, no matter what happens!

Gurgle

Irishcrx wrote: »

I wanted to buy the other half out and was refused... i'm being offered 160 k for my share in it, but I really think i'm being done here as checking the area prices for a house like mine it really does look at least 340k - 350k ,

Irishcrx wrote: »

The person who owns the other half is well off, has her own house already were as i'm young and only starting in life (21), if this was to go to court what could happen what would you guy's do.

If you couldn't reach some agreement and it went to court, the house would be put up for auction and the proceeds divided equally after costs. You would be lucky to get €320k for it in today's market, and afaik the fees are more selling it that way.

As for him/her being rich and you being poor, that couldn't be less relevant to your rights vs his/her's.

So, in summary, take the money and run.

iguana

Just to put another spin on it. If you take the €160k and put it in a savings account with a 5% interest rate, your €160k will become €176,400 after 2 years. You will have to pay tax on the interest though. In that time the property market will most likely have fallen significantly and you will be in a very strong position to buy a better property.

Also I don't meant to sound patronising, but you are only 21 and the house you buy now may not be what you want in 2 years. The area I bought in at 27 was not the area I wanted to be in at 29. Even if you already have a family you may find that your needs will change in time. Your best bet is to take the €160k, save it in the most secure place possible and let the market drop.

antoinolachtnai

If he takes the 160k and puts it in the bank, he'll have a 5 percent return. If on the other hand he borrows 160k and rents the place he will have (some rough numbers)

outgoings/month: 960. (6 euros per thousand, which is pretty conservative)
income/month (avg over 2 years): 1700.

net: 740/month

some tax per month: maybe 200/month, there's a fair amount of interest to be allowed.

540 after tax. Over two years, that's 12960 in cash flow, but a gross profit of around 16000 (because you've also made some payments down on the mortgage)

At the same time, the property will maintain most of its value. Why? Because of the place it's in. It's not just any old property.

If he wants to buy some other house, it will cost him 16000 in moving fees to move in or set up an investment by the time he is done.

Depending on the circumstances, he may have to pay cgt on the proceeds of the sale.

I think the OP would be nuts to sell this if he can avoid it.

Pete4779

To the OP: Take the money and run.

If you can get 160k get it. The market is tanking, and you are being given a get out of jail free card.

Take the money, rent the place you want to live in for 1-2 years (by paying it all down in cash first). Then with the remaining, invest it - buy gold, whatever.

Do not think that you will get the same offer in 6 months, and do not expect the valuations to reflect what the market will actually pay.

You can stay in the current situation forever, or get 160k in cash (that someone else is borrowing and paying interest on) and get a jump start on life that most people never get. Finish your course, do an MBA at Harvard? It's half price now with the euro being so strong.

Money will open a lot of doors, a house will only ever have one! And if you do take the cash, DON'T buy another house in Ireland over the next 12-18 months.

johnnyskeleton

Irishcrx wrote: »

To cut a long story short, I own half a house, no mortgage on it with another person (Family), I wanted to buy the other half out and was refused, so I said I'll take my share and buy another house although I did want the one i'd a share in. The house is based in Kilmore just in front of Beumount hospital, south facing garden , side entrance and large mechanics garage to back, 3 bedrooms and in need of a bit of modernization. 3 evaluations were done by the other party with me present at two but they didn't kow I owned half, they said it was worth 320 k but when I had my 2 evaluations done I was told 350k.

Who did the valuations?

If Sherry Fitz did one and Joe Randomer did the other 4 valuations, I'd tend to trust the established valuer. That is not to say that they are correct in the value (as no one can be accurate in the current market) but the established firms carry more weight and so would be more persuasive.

Some people have mentioned the legal costs etc as not worth the €15,000 difference, but I'm guessing that is not important to you, when it is the prinicple involved. However, think of it another way. €15,000 is 4.3% of 350,000. If, for the sake of argument the house actually is worth €350k at the moment, by the time it gets sold, I would imagine it will have dropped by at least that amount. Or put another way, this difference is there to compensate your relative for the likely drops in the market over the coming months. The most conservative estimates say that property prices dropped by 8-10% last year, the more reasonable estimates say a fair deal more. Things going as they are, they are more likely to drop by the same or a greater amount over the next year. You will not get a court date in Dublin Circuit in the next year.

So while no one here can tell you what to do, and I understand that you have a principled objection to taking the lesser amount, it seems to me that there are three options:

Option 1, take the money and invest or save it, and it's worth a bit more in a few years.

Option 2, litigate, get a court order to sell the house in two year's time for (in all liklihood) even less than 320k, then pay the costs of sale (several grand), then the remainder is shared between you, then pay your legal costs of €4,500 or more, and, unless prices go up significantly(see the housing bubble bursting thread), you're left with a much smaller piece of the pie.

Option 3, consult a solicitor, if necessary get a report from a well respected estate agent and use this to either bargain a better deal with your relative (if it turns out that 350k is more realistic) or decide that taking the money is the best option (if it turns out that 320k is more realistic). You might get more or less than in Option 1, but you'll have certainty that the choice you made was correct.