Kerry's Gombeen Cllrs Strike Again

ballooba

jmayo wrote: »

Yes there should be one law for everyone and living in rural Ireland is not excuse for drink driving of any sort, but could the South Dublinities please stop using this as excuse to ban one off housing in rural Ireland.

Stereotyping people as city slickers who just don't understand is a poor defence. I grew up on a farm. I intend moving back close to where I grew up when I start my own family. My older siblings have done so but live in towns.

jmayo wrote: »

Most of the people living remotely using the pub as social center of sorts, that the ones in Kerry and other parts of Ireland are talking about, live in homes that were probably built 40 plus years ago and not some effing southfork lookalike that are now been built.
There is a place for one off housing, but like everything it should be controlled and the houses should not be modelled on US tv shows.

These houses have continued to be built and continue to be built. These people want to continue living in the country despite having no business there and yet want to have infrastructure and services to sustain them.

jmayo wrote: »

PS a lot of the one off houses built in my area are bought by ex-pats retiring and Dubs moving out of the big smoke or looking for weekend getaway down with the culchies.

Many of them were probably built for the children of locals and sold on for a profit too. It doesn't matter who owns them or where they came from. If they have no business in the rural environment then they should not be there.

ballooba

partholon wrote: »

that would get you locked up on cough medicine.

No it wouldn't. If you are taking enough cough medicine to put you above 0.2 limit then you shouldn't be driving. Read the label. A blood test determines this, not a breath test.

patslatt

The_Minister wrote: »

I completely disagree with this, but you have to be fair, they have a point.

It is impossible to have a public transport system in the country (scattered population etc), so they have to rely on public transport. And, since the pub plays a gigantic role in the social life of the country (there isn't much else for a 60 year old retiree to do), if they can't drink anything, then many old people will have no social outlet to meet others.

The incredibly strict drink-driving limits (the lowest of which are not IMO based on real evidence), are going to destroy country life for many of the older generation.

Its a price that I think can be paid, but to ignore the reality is insulting to all those people.


EDIT: And that councillor is completely right Ballooba, its not a problem in the city, because we have public transport and taxis. If you listen to what he seems to be saying, its not really that OTT.

Why can't rural the Irish use the designated driver system and contact each other on the mobile? Even the driver can have one drink within the limits? Of course,the visit to the pub will lose the pleasure of satisfying an impulse.

ballooba

partholon wrote: »

i seem to remember years ago ,when there was a spate of roberies down the country by gangs driving down from limerick and dublin, one or two old biddies ringing radio shows saying their gardai station shuts down at night and theyre left with a glorified answering machine which basically said theyd get to them when they could get around to it.

called a "green box" or something?

hardly inspires feelings of safety.

Another mystery problem of rural living. Heaven knows why Ballyoneoffhousingcluster doesn't have as many Gardai as the local metropolis.

po0k

The ignorance of 'urban city dwellers' is astounding.

ballooba

po0k wrote: »

The ignorance of 'urban city dwellers' is astounding.

Care to elaborate? Make us understand...

El Stuntman

po0k wrote: »

The ignorance of 'urban city dwellers' is astounding.

thanks, I'm glad to confirm your prejudices, we are a bunch of eejits and no mistake!

but what's your point or are you just trolling?

partholon

ballooba wrote: »

Another mystery problem of rural living. Heaven knows why Ballyoneoffhousingcluster doesn't have as many Gardai as the local metropolis.

i dont think it was one of these one off housing places. for the life of me i cant remember the name of the place but i do remember em saying they relocated the gardai to limerick

in fairness its not the preserve of the country. i was raised in tallaght and to this day we have half the ratio of gardai to resident than that of the aran islands. i remember working it out once that if 1% of the population went mental and started kicking the **** out of the gardai it'd work out as 17 people per gard.

and they wonder why tallaght had a bad name

ballooba

partholon wrote: »

in fairness its not the preserve of the country. i was raised in tallaght and to this day we have half the ratio of gardai to resident than that of the ara islands.

Your right. The bungalow blight doesn't help though. It only worsens the problem.

knipex

Riskymove wrote: »

1. Why can't they go to pub, meet friends, discuss issues etc and just not drink alcohol???? better than being isolated...lonely...etc

2. why can't a few get together and take turns and one be designated driver??

and so on.....

As someone whop was born in the country, grew up in the country and lives in the country (OK its now a different county but still rural).

Riskymove is spot on.

When I started to drive if I drove to the pub I stayed off the booze. We shared cars and rotated the driver. I went somewhere else instead of the pub.

If the only reason people have to leave there houses is drink then they have bigger problems than drink driving. You can by a glass of coke in a pub you know, or a coffee or a glass of water.

FFS no wonder people laugh at the whinging of the rural people of Ireland. Its a small minority making a laughing stock of the rest of us.

There are enough real issues facing rural Ireland besides inventing stupid ones.

jmayo

ballooba wrote: »

Stereotyping people as city slickers who just don't understand is a poor defence. I grew up on a farm. I intend moving back close to where I grew up when I start my own family. My older siblings have done so but live in towns.

These houses have continued to be built and continue to be built. These people want to continue living in the country despite having no business there and yet want to have infrastructure and services to sustain them.

Many of them were probably built for the children of locals and sold on for a profit too. It doesn't matter who owns them or where they came from. If they have no business in the rural environment then they should not be there.

Did I condone drink driving or say they should have their own drink driving laws and say it was becuase city slickers didn't understand the issues ?

I do have a problem where people seem to use this as excuse to sound off about why people should not be allowed live in rural Ireland in one off housing. Saying that I want more control on what is allowed in terms of one off houses.
Southfork lookalikes have no place and are a blight on the countryside.

Are you saying that older people who have lived all their lives in the country should leave, move to urban area, becuase they may have retired and are pensionsioners?
Thus there would be no demand for services of any kind.
Yeah lets apply one of Stalins solutions and forceably relocal people.

ballooba wrote: »

Another mystery problem of rural living. Heaven knows why Ballyoneoffhousingcluster doesn't have as many Gardai as the local metropolis.

So you feel people living in rural Ireland (in villages and small towns) should not have any local garda presence, they should wait for the nearest garda to arrive from station maybe 30 odd miles away.
So much for community garda, or does that just apply to certain upmarket urban areas.

ninty9er

bob2000 wrote: »

"I'm saying drink driving laws should apply to them the same as everyone else."

Even though they don't have the same transport facilities as everyone else ?

The suggestion that these guys living 10 miles up a dirt track should club together with their mates - any recollection of the furore when the government wanted to crack down on learner drivers ?

boo hoo ...We won't be able to get to work, I wouldn't have bought a house here if someone had told me this might happen......etc etc etc etc

They could've clubbed together with more ease you would have thought.

How many accidents caused by Learner drivers I wonder ?

Result - law put back.

Applying the same rule to a kid driving around dublin city centre as an old guy driving in the middle of nowhere is nuts.

Why, the kid in Dublin is just as likely to drive into town on a Saturday night due to the lack of taxis available between 2 and 5 am. Liklihood is he won't consume alcohol either. Why shouldn't that standard be applied to some aul fella in a rural area, be it Ballyshannon, Lismullen, Ardrahan, Borris-in-Ossory, Killorglin, Ardagh or Clonakilty.

ballooba

jmayo wrote: »

Did I condone drink driving or say they should have their own drink driving laws and say it was becuase city slickers didn't understand the issues ?

You dismissively referred to "south dublinites".

jmayo wrote: »

I do have a problem where people seem to use this as excuse to sound off about why people should not be allowed live in rural Ireland in one off housing. Saying that I want more control on what is allowed in terms of one off houses.
Southfork lookalikes have no place and are a blight on the countryside.

No one off housing has a place in the countryside unless it's a farm. Rural isolation is one of a whole host of reasons for this. It's not an excuse.

jmayo wrote: »

Are you saying that older people who have lived all their lives in the country should leave, move to urban area, becuase they may have retired and are pensionsioners?
Thus there would be no demand for services of any kind.
Yeah lets apply one of Stalins solutions and forceably relocal people.

No, I'm saying that they should not allow further people to repeat the mistakes of the past and continue the problem into the next century. These gombeens should think before they open their mouths. Their left hand doesn't seem to realise what their right hand is doing.

jmayo wrote: »

So you feel people living in rural Ireland (in villages and small towns) should not have any local garda presence, they should wait for the nearest garda to arrive from station maybe 30 odd miles away.
So much for community garda, or does that just apply to certain upmarket urban areas.

No, I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying that rural areas get more than their fair share of Gardai. We only have 14,000 Gardai in the country. That's around 2700 round the clock Garda postions. That's about 1 per 1600 people. We don't have enough Gardai to police every backwater in the country round the clock.

lostexpectation

there is no rural right to drink and drive, who cares whether there a police about?

Liam Byrne

ballooba wrote: »

Solutions like booze buses are all well and good for the moment but are urban dwellers expected to continue to subsidise transport for rural dwellers while gombeen councillors continue to campaign for more one-off housing. These people talk about the challenges unique to living the rural lifestyle while they are the very ones causing these problems.

I REALLY can't believe that someone is as arrogant as to post something like that!!!

OK, let's all move to the capital and add to the roads congestion, house prices, etc

Where could the money currently being spent upgrading the M50 be spent if the taxes of the rural-dwellers weren't being spent on it ??? Likewise the Luas and the proposed Metro ??

While I have less than zero time for Miss Ferris and the rest of her two-faced types, she does have a major point in this regard. It's fine for areas that have loads of public transport facilities and cabs to smugly say "why not"; in addition, it's not like they moved out there and knew the law; they moved (or were born/grew up) out there knowing the CURRENT law and now the powers-that-be in Fianna Failure want to change that law while - AS USUAL - not providing the necessary alternative.

I'm all for safer roads - be it cutting out the idiots that drink and drive or inexperienced L drivers driving on their own - but the fact is that THERE IS NO ALTERNATIVE. Not only that, but if the CURRENT LAW was strictly imposed, we'd be fine.....

Naw, B-b-bertie would be delighted if we all had to up and move into his constituency; sure doesn't he even make sure that your house is paid for if you vote for him!!!!

Give us proper road and rail and buses and trams, etc, and then we'll get rid of our cars altogether.....but until you implement a proper alternative, feck off!

Of course, this is the same Government that reckons there's no problem with access to broadband, so there's feck-all chance of them being realistic about what goes on outside their own back-yards..... :mad:

ballooba

Liam Byrne wrote: »

I REALLY can't believe that someone is as arrogant as to post something like that!!!

I fail to see your point. The level of subsidy required per passenger trip on Luas or Metro is nowhere near what would be required to provide public transport for those living in one off houses.

I have no problem with a subsidised tranport system being provided for existing one off dwellings. Not however while these gombeens continue their irresponsible policies of allowing further one-off hosuing.

Liam Byrne wrote: »

OK, let's all move to the capital and add to the roads congestion, house prices, etc

Dublin is not the only urban centre in this country. There are town planners in every local authority in the country available to provide planning guidance.

Oh and for yourself and all those saying Toireasa Ferris has a point. Indeed she does. She voted against the gombeens. She quite rightly pointed out that the proposers had vested interests.

fly_agaric

Liam Byrne wrote: »

OK, let's all move to the capital and add to the roads congestion, house prices, etc

Despite your sarcasm, the poster has a point. Not allowing so many one off houses (or indeed one off housing estates!!) will help.

No matter what you say further down about "cabs" and the like, the agencies involved (the govt., CIE, Irish Rail etc) are failing to provide a good standard of public transport in many parts of Dublin with quite large populations - it's hardly shocking that they are far, far worse in the parts of the country with much lower population density. Ireland's largely rural electorate likes public transport to make a profit if possible...

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Where could the money currently being spent upgrading the M50 be spent if the taxes of the rural-dwellers weren't being spent on it ??? Likewise the Luas and the proposed Metro ??

Dublin is not a net recipent of state funds AFAIK. Though I must admit, all those are are just totally unnecessary vanity projects! Who knows what could have been done instead and sure isn't the LUAS losing cash hand over fist...bloody trams are empty most of the time I use it...

I'm all for safer roads

You remind me a bit of the hypocrites who cry over the life wasted on the road + criticise stuff like garda speed traps/cameras as a money-rasing scam when they get caught! Maybe there should be special speed limits for country drivers??

Naw, B-b-bertie would be delighted if we all had to up and move into his constituency; sure doesn't he even make sure that your house is paid for if you vote for him!!!!

LOL. I live in D Central + grew up in it. He never bought me a house and the funny thing is most people I grew up with who would still be in Ireland cannot afford to live in D Central any more. Unfortunately, my parents and their parents did not have little biteens of land they could get quick permission from the local burghers to build a house on...

lostexpectation

Liam Byrne wrote: »

I REALLY can't believe that someone is as arrogant as to post something like that!!!

OK, let's all move to the capital and add to the roads congestion, house prices, etc

Where could the money currently being spent upgrading the M50 be spent if the taxes of the rural-dwellers weren't being spent on it ??? Likewise the Luas and the proposed Metro ??

While I have less than zero time for Miss Ferris and the rest of her two-faced types, she does have a major point in this regard. It's fine for areas that have loads of public transport facilities and cabs to smugly say "why not"; in addition, it's not like they moved out there and knew the law; they moved (or were born/grew up) out there knowing the CURRENT law and now the powers-that-be in Fianna Failure want to change that law while - AS USUAL - not providing the necessary alternative.

I'm all for safer roads - be it cutting out the idiots that drink and drive or inexperienced L drivers driving on their own - but the fact is that THERE IS NO ALTERNATIVE.

there's an alternative ,don't drink!

you justifying drinking by saying there no public transport etc, there have nothing to do with each other. the countryside will never have good public transport, keep your cars use em but don't drink and drive.

DeepBlue

lostexpectation wrote: »

there's an alternative ,don't drink!

There's another alternative - ban cars.
If we didn't have any cars then no-one would be killed by cars on the roads.

Sorry if this comment sounds facetious but since most contributing to this thread seem to view the issue in black and white terms I thought I'd keep my contribution on the same level .

lostexpectation

banning cars and not drinking on a night out are too totally different things, one easily achievable

DeepBlue

Part of the problem of politics is that politicians like to implement "easily achievable" measures in order to be seen to be "doing something" about an issue.

Will reducing the alchohol limit made a difference? If so then why not present the research to back that assertion up?

partholon

that makes sense to me.

i'd love to know what the breakdown is of deaths on the road from drink driving in comparison to other causes. i.e speeding, drugs, unsuitable roads and the general incompetance of near half a million drivers on provisionals liscences.

must say though, healy ray came off as a complete fool on the repeat of the last word. dear gods.

lostexpectation

still no reason to drink and drive

ballooba

DeepBlue wrote: »

Will reducing the alchohol limit made a difference? If so then why not present the research to back that assertion up?

It's slightly off topic but reducing the limit will get rid of the idea that it's ok to have one drink and drive. Of course the ideal situation is that they actually enforce the laws (exisitng or reformed) but we all know that seldom happens.

ballooba

partholon wrote: »

i'd love to know what the breakdown is of deaths on the road from drink driving in comparison to other causes. i.e speeding, drugs, unsuitable roads and the general incompetance of near half a million drivers on provisionals liscences.

The statistics from the RSA are difficult to decipher. It's between 30 and 40% though. It's pretty much as prevalent a contributory factor as speed.

Sponge Bob

ballooba wrote: »

The statistics from the RSA are difficult to decipher. It's between 30 and 40% though. It's pretty much as prevalent a contributory factor as speed.

Drugs are not measured because they are not tested for . Therefore they are an unknown known and particularly so in conjunction with alcohol.

On the margins its fair to say a reduction in blood alcohol limits will not save many lives, it may save a few on the road but will increase suicides and misadventures in the home ( while drunk )

Its a diminishing marginal return to reduce these limits , possibly worse , I agree with the Kerry Councillors .

lostexpectation

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Drugs are not measured because they are not tested for . Therefore they are an unknown known and particularly so in conjunction with alcohol.

On the margins its fair to say a reduction in blood alcohol limits will not save many lives, it may save a few on the road but will increase suicides and misadventures in the home ( while drunk )

Its a diminishing marginal return to reduce these limits , possibly worse , I agree with the Kerry Councillors .

it may save a few on the road but will increase suicides and misadventures in the home ( while drunk )

with this sort of logic im not surprised

Sponge Bob

lostexpectation wrote: »

with this sort of logic im not surprised

Diminishing Marginal Returns are not that hard to understand...anyway we will never know until drug testing of drivers is more prevalent .

As a start, everyone on long term medication should have a note on their drivers licences that they are supposed to carry with them .

lostexpectation

trying to distract from drinking driving, pathetic

Mr. Incognito

These councellors are all publicans. They don't give a crap about the issues or the decline of rural ireland. they care about profits.