Sunderland going down?

LuckyLloyd

Xavi6 wrote: »

There's patriotism in supporting the Irish league week in week out as opposed to a foreign one tbh.

See, this all boils down to what is MORE patriotic then. Right? The Eircom league diehards think that they are the true footballing patriots - fine. And sure, that is more patriotic than following Sunderland. But to say that supporting Sunderland because they have heavy Irish involvement is not patriotic at all because there is a more patriotic alternative is bollocks quite frankly.

It's a game. Let people engage with it as they see fit.

Pigman II

Can we get back to the topic of Sunderlands impending relegation please?

Mr.Nice Guy

Xavi6 wrote: »

Fair enough. My point is that we all saw the bandwagon jumpers when Shels played Deportivo.

It's not bandwagon jumping it's exactly the kind of patriotism the guy was talking about. Think about the Irish cricket team in the last World Cup as another example.

Bungalow Bill

Xavi6 wrote: »

What if Drogheda played Barcelona in a Champions League? Would you be the model patriot then? If so then how come you can support them in a big game but not do it week in, week out as well as taking an interest in the lads who are abroad? It's a contradiction.

As per my logic, I would 'support' Drogheda because they are an Irish team. I wouldn't claim to be a lifelong follower or anything, but I would wish them well as I like to see Irish people doing well.

I wouldn't support them week in week out because it could be any irish team playing against barcelona, and I would support any of them in that game.


The contradiction is why you want to see Sunderland go down, surely this means that you are wishing bad luck on a huge amount of Irish players in England, yet you'll support to the grave the ones who probably aren't good enough to play at a higher level?

Xavi6

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

See, this all boils down to what is MORE patriotic then. Right? The Eircom league diehards think that they are the true footballing patriots - fine. And sure, that is more patriotic than following Sunderland. But to say that supporting Sunderland because they have heavy Irish involvement is not patriotic at all because there is a more patriotic alternative is bollocks quite frankly.

It's a game. Let people engage with it as they see fit.

Apologies, the word 'more' was missing from that post. Both are patriotic in their own right, I just don't understand how you can have one without the other i.e. support the Irish Sunderland players but not the eL players playing on your doorstep.

LuckyLloyd

Xavi6 wrote: »

Fair enough. My point is that we all saw the bandwagon jumpers when Shels played Deportivo. Now we see the same bandwagon jumpers at Sunderland. How come people will go buy Sunderland jerseys, organise trips to games and become followers yet won't pay a few quid to go to see Shels etc? Serious hypocracy.

Hypocracy? All sports are there on some level to entertain people. I reckon watching Kieron Richardson and Andy Reid go about their business is a million miles more entertaining than seeing Kevin Hunt and Jason Byrne strut their stuff because you get to see footballers that are more dynamic; intelligent and technically competent play at a level that is faster and laced with more creativity and guile.

So if someone wants to spend their freetime and disposable income watching the latter up close and they enjoy it then let them.

Xavi6

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

The contradiction is why you want to see Sunderland go down, surely this means that you are wishing bad luck on a huge amount of Irish players in England, yet you'll support to the grave the ones who probably aren't good enough to play at a higher level?

Nope I'd love to see the likes of Murphy, Reid and Stokes in the Prem. I just want Roy Keane to fail and get relegated. If he wasn't their manager my attitude would be different i.e. I love Reading.

Bungalow Bill

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Hypocracy? All sports are there on some level to entertain people. I reckon watching Kieron Richardson and Andy Reid go about their business is a million miles more entertaining than seeing Kevin Hunt and Jason Byrne strut their stuff because you get to see footballers that are more dynamic; intelligent and technically competent play at a level that is faster and laced with more creativity and guile.

So if someone wants to spend their freetime and disposable income watching the latter up close and they enjoy it then let them.

I guess this post sums up the prem vs LOI part of my argument perfectly. As I said, it is a wrench for me to watch a very average game of football between two teams I don't care for on a weeknight.

I support Sunderland because they have a massive Irish connection and are pitting their wits against best league in the world at the moment.

And for what its worth, initially I did just have an interest in Sunderland for the irish players, but have since grown to learn their squad inside out, the history of the club, the humour of the people and I find myself willing them to win more than any club ever, even if there are very few irishmen on the actual pitch. This may be a contradiction, and on some level i'm sure it is, but you can't help what you think.

LuckyLloyd

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

I guess this post sums up the prem vs LOI part of my argument perfectly. As I said, it is a wrench for me to watch a very average game of football between two teams I don't care for on a weeknight.

I support Sunderland because they have a massive Irish connection and are pitting their wits against best league in the world at the moment.

And for what its worth, initially I did just have an interest in Sunderland for the irish players, but have since grown to learn their squad inside out, the history of the club, the humour of the people and I find myself willing them to win more than any club ever, even if there are very few irishmen on the actual pitch. This may be a contradiction, and on some level i'm sure it is, but you can't help what you think.

And good for you imo.

Xavi6

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

And for what its worth, initially I did just have an interest in Sunderland for the irish players, but have since grown to learn their squad inside out, the history of the club, the humour of the people and I find myself willing them to win more than any club ever, even if there are very few irishmen on the actual pitch. This may be a contradiction, and on some level i'm sure it is, but you can't help what you think.

What if everyone that is Irish and associated with the club leaves? Players are sold, owners sell up, Keane gets the bullet etc? Will you honestly stay a fan then or will you move to Reading for example? If so then fair play and I can have no complaints.

Bungalow Bill

Xavi6 wrote: »

What if everyone that is Irish and associated with the club leaves? Players are sold, owners sell up, Keane gets the bullet etc? Will you honestly stay a fan then or will you move to Reading for example? If so then fair play and I can have no complaints.

I guess I won't know until it happens, I certainly wouldn't keep supporting them to save face. I certainly believe in what Roy Keane is doing there though. He is trying to instill a new mentality into the club. He demands that people don't just barely turn up for training and think they can walk into the first eleven. He wants the players to show respect for the club. A few years ago when they had the 15 point season, every saturday the team would get hammered and barely compete, and then during the week you'd see the likes of Liam Lawrence driving around Sunderland in sports cars without a care in the world. If Roy Keane even senses that a player is going to Sunderland for an easy option or a quick buck, he won't touch them.

Little things like transfer listing Liam Miller for being late is great for Sunderland fans, they think "Finally, a guy who is treating the club with respect and demanding that the players do too".

I honestly don't know how you can argue with what Roy Keane is doing there, especially when you see the likes of Middlesbrough year after year just paying huge money for anyone in the hope of a good league cup run to appease the masses. Keane is trying to change the mentality of a losing club, instill some pride and professionalism and provide some infrastructure.

I may have gone off the point, but Xavi there hoping that they go down out of a petty gripe against Keane is way off the mark.

Xavi6

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

I guess I won't know until it happens, I certainly wouldn't keep supporting them to save face. I certainly believe in what Roy Keane is doing there though. He is trying to instill a new mentality into the club. He demands that people don't just barely turn up for training and think they can walk into the first eleven. He wants the players to show respect for the club. A few years ago when they had the 15 point season, every saturday the team would get hammered and barely compete, and then during the week you'd see the likes of Liam Lawrence driving around Sunderland in sports cars without a care in the world. If Roy Keane even senses that a player is going to Sunderland for an easy option or a quick buck, he won't touch them.

Little things like transfer listing Liam Miller for being late is great for Sunderland fans, they think "Finally, a guy who is treating the club with respect and demanding that the players do too".

Meh. Keane is not some revolutionary. Managers have been dealing with players in this manner for years.

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

I honestly don't know how you can argue with what Roy Keane is doing there, especially when you see the likes of Middlesbrough year after year just paying huge money for anyone in the hope of a good league cup run to appease the masses. Keane is trying to change the mentality of a losing club, instill some pride and professionalism and provide some infrastructure.

And Sunderland haven't spent big money? Let me direct you to this -

https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/69985/51296.jpg

Sunderland are the fourth highest spending club in the WORLD for 2007/08. Where has it got them? Relegation candidates. Yes Roy's doing some sterling work.

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

I may have gone off the point, but Xavi there hoping that they go down out of a petty gripe against Keane is way off the mark.

My gripe, and that of many others, with the man is far from petty. I'm not going to open the can of worms again but as an Ireland and Manchester City fan my reasons are valid.

gosplan

Xavi6 wrote: »

Fair enough. My point is that we all saw the bandwagon jumpers when Shels played Deportivo. Now we see the same bandwagon jumpers at Sunderland. How come people will go buy Sunderland jerseys, organise trips to games and become followers yet won't pay a few quid to go to see Shels etc? Serious hypocracy.

ermm, because they might actually see a good game?

This stinks of the same attitude I've seen in the GAA tbh. Hard core parish club fans abuse the fair weather lot who simply turn up for the inter-county matches, who abuse the bandwagon jumpers that simply turn up for the Croake park runs. They all abuse Irish football fans for following an unpatriotic sport, the small EPL following minority of which abuse the ones that support the Premiership.

Self important crap. We should get some voluntary workers on here to abuse everyone for wasting their time following meaningless sports when they could be helping their fellow man.

Reminds me of that Monty Python 'when I was a lad' sketch.

ntlbell

I cant believe we're back here again a huge issue on this forum seems to be a lack of understand or perception of what words mean to certain people and the passion and love that grows from football.

"fan" "support" "follow"

Now as I support my local EL team and stand in the pi|ssing rain to watch average footballers fail to do school boy basics I can get on my moral high ground in my Sunderland shirt and scream from the high heavens.

Things in football attract our attention or hearts for a number of reasons some of them even unknown I have a huge soft spot for Luton Town and I have no idea why.

If a few Irish people go over and watch a match in sunderland and get a day out why let it bother you? you're not happy with their mentality so you despise the club? this makes very little sense.

Desf seems to be a very knowledgeable sound fellow so I'm left scratching my head why he acts like this.

*boggle*

_blank_

ntlbell wrote: »

Desf seems to be a very knowledgeable sound fellow

You've never met me, have you?

Look, it's an internet message board, for expressing opinions on a certain subject. I don't sit at home in a darkened room sticking pins in a doll wearing a half and half SundIreland shirt or anything. God no.

I'm here to chat about football, give my opinions on different aspects of it, and hear other people's thinking as well.

Some I disagree with, some I agree with.

Some people's opinions I cannot fathom, some people's attitude I cannot fathom, so I ask them about it in a bid to understand it.

That's all.

Bungalow Bill

Xavi6 wrote: »

Sunderland are the fourth highest spending club in the WORLD for 2007/08. Where has it got them? Relegation candidates. Yes Roy's doing some sterling work.

When Keane took over Sunderland had an awful squad that were bottom of the championship. They had a reputation for being a yo-yo club that always got relegated straight away. In an inflated market, Keane had to pay above market price to get players to sign.

Keane having 10 million to spend is a world of difference to Arsenal having 10 million to spend in terms of what players will sign for the club.

They have been very unlucky with injuries this year and have had to play large portions of the season without some of their best players. Edwards and Richardson have been out nearly all season. Imagine utd without Ronaldo+Rooney, look at the difference between Fulham with McBride+Bullard back.

Keane has invested for the future in those signings and they are long term signings.
Show me one player in this list that isn't going to keep getting better:

Kenwyne Jones
Craig Gordon
Kieron Richardson
Phil Bardsley
Andy Reid
Roy O Donovan
Paul McShane

You have to look at the money spent in context, yes they are having a rough year but they have been unlucky, they are newly promoted and it was Keane's first year.
If they stay up, they will be a different proposition.

Xavi6

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

Keane has invested for the future in those signings and they are long term signings.
Show me one player in this list that isn't going to keep getting better:

Kenwyne Jones
Craig Gordon
Kieron Richardson
Phil Bardsley
Andy Reid
Roy O Donovan
Paul McShane

1? I'll show you 3.

None of the bolded players will get any better imo. And I wouldn't be surprised if O'Donovan was in the Championship next season, with or without Sunderland.

ditpoker

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

See, this all boils down to what is MORE patriotic then. Right? The Eircom league diehards think that they are the true footballing patriots - fine. And sure, that is more patriotic than following Sunderland. But to say that supporting Sunderland because they have heavy Irish involvement is not patriotic at all because there is a more patriotic alternative is bollocks quite frankly.

It's a game. Let people engage with it as they see fit.

QFT.

When it comes to football, first and foremost i play the game.

Then when it comes to supporting football and watching football, i support the team i have developed a love for. When i was younger i was a regular at st pats games, in the days of paul osam, eddie gormley and paul soupy campbell. It was a very successful time for pats too, but i know my football, and despite the glory at pats, i still preferred the lack of success at spurs. They were the first non LoI team i saw (in a friendly against bohs) and were the first team i said i enjoyed watching.

when it comes to the national game obviously im an ireland fan, but if they arent in the world cup does that mean i cant watch it, i cant enjoy what argentina or holland do, can i not appreciate what the greeks did in the euro championships just cos they aren't ireland?!



re sunderland, i have no opinion of them either way. i think it has the potential to be a great thing as kids aged 5-10 might be more likely to support sunderland than united/liverpool etc. as far as i can see the more irish supporting clubs that arent the big 4 is all gooood!

Bungalow Bill

Xavi6 wrote: »

1? I'll show you 3.

None of the bolded players will get any better imo. And I wouldn't be surprised if O'Donovan was in the Championship next season, with or without Sunderland.

You don't think that Richardson and Reid, two undoubtedly talented players will thrive playing first team football week in week out in the premiership?

Neither of them have had much of a chance up until now. In flashes, they have both been brilliant this year, Richardson beat Portsmouth single-handedly earlier this year! Did you see Andy Reid get man of the match against Germany, he was fantastic.

O donovan just made the big step up from the eircom league to the premiership, it takes time to adapt. He had John Terry falling over himself nearly giving away a penalty at the weekend.

These players clearly haven't reached their full potential yet.

ditpoker

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

You don't think that Richardson and Reid, two undoubtedly talented players will thrive playing first team football week in week out in the premiership?

Neither of them have had much of a chance up until now. In flashes, they have both been brilliant this year, Richardson beat Portsmouth single-handedly earlier this year! Did you see Andy Reid get man of the match against Germany, he was fantastic.

O donovan just made the big step up from the eircom league to the premiership, it takes time to adapt. He had John Terry falling over himself nearly giving away a penalty at the weekend.

These players clearly haven't reached their full potential yet.

as a spurs fan i believe i am qualified to say andy reid could be a championship regular if he lost weight. he is not good enough to play in the premiership.

Jonny Arson

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

Xavi6 wrote: »

What if everyone that is Irish and associated with the club leaves? Players are sold, owners sell up, Keane gets the bullet etc? Will you honestly stay a fan then or will you move to Reading for example? If so then fair play and I can have no complaints.

I guess I won't know until it happens, I certainly wouldn't keep supporting them to save face.

oh god

as much as i detest Sunderland in this Niall Quinn-Oirish era my heart does go to the genuine Sunderland supporters who have stuck through their club during the good and hard times to have this type of sickening pseudo-patriotic consumerism attach itself upon their club, Sunderland really are doomed if this is the true fabric of their new 'support'

Bungalow Bill

Jonny Arson wrote: »

oh god

as much as i detest Sunderland in this Niall Quinn-Oirish era my heart does go to the genuine Sunderland supporters who have stuck through their club during the good and hard times to have this type of sickening pseudo-patriotic consumerism attach itself upon their club, Sunderland really are doomed if this is the true fabric of their new 'support'

lol, you are funny. Why do you detest Sunderland? You have no reason to, other than the fact that irish people work there! How logical:D

Why does an attachment to a club have to be a lifelong situation? I support what is happening at Sunderland right now. I support the people involved, the values they implement and what they want to achieve.

If one day, Sunderland are owned by a russian billionaire, have Steve McLaren in charge, and have a team full of overpaid mercenaries who I don't like and have no respect for the people of Sunderland, then yes, it is quite possible that I wouldn't support that regime as strongly.

I think that I will always have a soft spot for the club no matter what though.

Helix

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

The contradiction is why you want to see Sunderland go down, surely this means that you are wishing bad luck on a huge amount of Irish players in England, yet you'll support to the grave the ones who probably aren't good enough to play at a higher level?

i want sunderland to go down because they offer nothing to the premier league

whether they have a load of paddies on their team or not is irrelevant

i also want to see derby and newcastle go down for the same reason

Unearthly

Helix wrote: »

i want sunderland to go down because they offer nothing to the premier league

whether they have a load of paddies on their team or not is irrelevant

i also want to see derby and newcastle go down for the same reason

What about Fulham, Bolton and Birmingham?

Killme00

Helix wrote: »

i want sunderland to go down because they offer nothing to the premier league

whether they have a load of paddies on their team or not is irrelevant

i also want to see derby and newcastle go down for the same reason

In that case the premiership might as well just be a four team league.

Call Me Jimmy

ntlbell wrote: »

a lack of understand or perception of what words mean to certain people and the passion and love that grows from football.

"fan" "support" "follow"

This is I think the biggest problem on here. These words are getting mixed up and misunderstood as different people use them differently. I'de imagine there'd be a lot more agree ment on this forum if we all used the exact same language for supports/fans/followers.

For me, a supporter is someone who literally supports the club with their money/time, no matter what. ****e football, hard rain, they're there. I don't think a supporter is someone who simply has a sky subscription though (and I'm not having a go, I'm not any high horse here at all).

A fan is like a fan of anything else like music. They like a particular musician and generally like listening to them, will always be on the look out for their albums no matter how many bad ones they make, but won't really listen to the bad stuff.

A follower again in my book is a follower in the literal sense. They follow the progress of the club but don't consider it 'their' club, they wouldn't be bragging in the pub about a or anything.

On topic: I wouldn't like to see sunderland go down coz I'm more interested in their progress than bolton, fulham, derby etc. If it was my choice, Middlesborough would go down because everything about them - even their name - is boring :P

Helix

Unearthly wrote: »

What about Fulham, Bolton and Birmingham?

fulham have jimmy bullard, and i like him a lot
bolton are a good team who are struggling without allardyce
and even tho im a villa fan, small heath arent in the worst 3 in the premiership, not by a fair bit

Helix

Killme00 wrote: »

In that case the premiership might as well just be a four team league.

far from it, theres always 12-16 teams wholl give anyone a game on their day

Bungalow Bill

Helix wrote: »

i want sunderland to go down because they offer nothing to the premier league

whether they have a load of paddies on their team or not is irrelevant

i also want to see derby and newcastle go down for the same reason

Yeah? Well I disagree. It takes certain teams some time to adapt to the premier league. Newcastle and Sunderland need stability more than anything. If you look through both squads there is a lot of talent, and players who play the game the right way.

Now Bolton and Wigan on the other hand..

Unearthly

Helix wrote: »

fulham have jimmy bullard, and i like him a lot
bolton are a good team who are struggling without allardyce
and even tho im a villa fan, small heath arent in the worst 3 in the premiership, not by a fair bit

Bolton and Fulham are in the bottom 3 this season, they are there because they deserve to be. Rubbish this season.

Newcastle beat Birmingham earlier this season and got a draw with them last night and are ahead of them in the league. How are Birmingham better than Newcastle then?

Helix

since keggy took over newcastle look dead in the water

theres nothing to them at all any more, the players dont look interested

if they stay up itll only be because of points allardyce got them

SectionF

Sunderland for relegation please.

I admire Sunderland fans from Sunderland and environs who have stuck by their club through the hard years and who didn't defect to another EPL team so that they could shop around for 'quality' football, as seems to be accepted practice among a few contributors here.

I detest the cynicism of the Sunderland Irish syndicate's targeting of Irish supporters, at a time when the domestic game is making herculean efforts to win people back to the habit of attending live football without having to get on a plane. Their gestures in support of Irish football simply accentuate their hypocrisy.

On balance, and despite my high regard for Andy Reid, because I am more concerned with the game in Ireland, I would like to see them go down in flames.

The patriotism argument is a red herring. Supporting domestic football has nothing to do with being Irish. It has to do with loving real football, as something entirely distinct from telly football, and also, as is the case with football everywhere, with regional as opposed to national identity.

In fact, while I am sure we would all support the national team over others, I'd say that a lot of eL supporters would be less keen on the Boys in Green than are many EPL fans.

I don't care if Jason Byrne isn't as good as Liam Miller, or whoever Keane is hiring or firing this week. That's not the point. If it were, no one would follow Sunderland either, because Liam Miller sure as hell isn't as good as Frank Lampard. Or Jimmy Bullard for that matter.

Helix

lets be fair here, quinn made his money in england so at the end of the day he owes the english game more than the irish game

i have nothing against what hes doing trying to make his club money from the irish market

i just think the people who fall for it are a bit special

OhNoYouDidn't

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

lol, you are funny. Why do you detest Sunderland? You have no reason to, other than the fact that irish people work there! How logical:D

.

The issue is that the ONLY reason Irish guys work there is because someone sat down with a spreadsheet and came to the conclusion that there was more money in having an 'Irish' side in the English Premier Division than a Sunderland side. Players, management and chairman have been selected on nationality rather than ability and I find the fact that people like you can't see through the fact you have been specifically marketed at to be hilarious. They might as well have called the business plan "Fleece the Ole Ole Barstoolers"

It is a legitimate point Des makes- if you see Sunderland as Irelands English side and follow them out of patriotism, why arent you following one of Irelands Irish sides by the same logic? Same question to Celtic fans, btw.

On a footballing note, Keane has signed appalingly, spent a fortune on rubbish who are genreally former team mates. He appears to have no broader football knowledge. There are a number of reasons I would like to see them relegated, most pertinantly to end this horrible emasculation of Sunderland fans to rebrand their club.

OhNoYouDidn't

Helix wrote: »

lets be fair here, quinn made his money in england so at the end of the day he owes the english game more than the irish game

He is a member of Shamrock Rovers and has done alright by us.

You seem to be under the impression he has his own money in Sunderland - not so!

Helix

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

He is a member of Shamrock Rovers and has done alright by us.

aye but you always see people saying quinns this and quinns that, why didnt he buy an irish club etc, which is a load of hoop

OhNoYouDidn't

Helix wrote: »

aye but you always see people saying quinns this and quinns that, why didnt he buy an irish club etc, which is a load of hoop

But he didn't buy Sunderland either, that was Drumavale. He is an employee of Sunderland FC, not one of the owners.

Charlie

Helix wrote: »

since keggy took over newcastle look dead in the water

theres nothing to them at all any more, the players dont look interested

if they stay up itll only be because of points allardyce got them

Sorry to go off topic, but I can't let such trolling go unchecked.

Did you not watch the game last night? Keegan setup the most positive starting 11 that I have seen in a long time. The boys were playing for each other. The 3 men upfront gelled well, and Butt, Geremi and Barton (although the later two's passing was average) got a great engine going in midfield.

We are in this mess because of Ashley and Big Sam, not KK. Allardyce netted us 1 point from 2 games with Derby, had both Wigan and Reading turn us over and had us thumped by Pompey in our own backyard. We should have easily been picking up 10 points form those games, which would leave us well clear of a relegation battle at this stage.

But its ok, you're excused. Hating Newcastle and KK seems to be the in thing these days, nearly as much as a paddy suddenly supporting Sunderland.

Charlie

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But he didn't buy Sunderland either, that was Drumavale. He is an employee of Sunderland FC, not one of the owners.

OhNoyouDidn't wrote:

You seem to be under the impression he has his own money in Sunderland - not so!

According to Wiki, he holds a decent amount of shares, about as much as most of the other investors.

Jonny Arson

Bungalow Bill wrote: »

lol, you are funny. Why do you detest Sunderland? You have no reason to, other than the fact that irish people work there! How logical:D

logical?

i hate Sunderland afc under their current ownership because they are specifically targeting Irish people to 'support' and put their money into a foreign football club under a false marketing tactic that they are an 'Irish club' when these people should be putting their money into domestic football (if they are so patriotic themselves) and should be out supporting actual Irish clubs that they can experience be it Shels, Bohs, Kilkenny City(RIP), Glebe North or Letterkenny Rovers or whoever.

people are of course allowed to do whatever they want, people can choose to consume whatever they like, its a free world but it doesnt make it right.

if it was Italian owners of Sunderland doing the same thing by targeting the Irish i'd be saying the same thing and i would have an equal hatred so you would want to be careful when you laugh in the face of some people's rational logic when your logic of 'supporting' a football club is based on wishy washy Oirish patriotic hypocritical bullcrap


P.S. on topic i also hope Sunderland go down because they play piss poor football for a team that has spent almost as much money as any other premiership team

OhNoYouDidn't

charlie mchugh wrote: »

According to Wiki, he holds a decent amount of shares, about as much as most of the other investors.

I actually said he never invested his own money - not that he doesnt have shares.....

Charlie

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I actually said he never invested his own money - not that he doesnt have shares.....

And I suppose these were given to him out of the goodness of their hearts.

Helix

charlie mchugh wrote: »

Sorry to go off topic, but I can't let such trolling go unchecked.

jesus you express an opinion about a team who cant buy a win being crap and youre called a troll, cop on will you

charlie mchugh wrote: »

Did you not watch the game last night? Keegan setup the most positive starting 11 that I have seen in a long time. The boys were playing for each other. The 3 men upfront gelled well, and Butt, Geremi and Barton (although the later two's passing was average) got a great engine going in midfield.

and you were rubbish and looked entirely uninterested til you scored. too many players at that club blatantly have their eye on a move and couldnt care less about what happens to newcastle

charlie mchugh wrote: »

We are in this mess because of Ashley and Big Sam, not KK. Allardyce netted us 1 point from 2 games with Derby, had both Wigan and Reading turn us over and had us thumped by Pompey in our own backyard. We should have easily been picking up 10 points form those games, which would leave us well clear of a relegation battle at this stage.

oh right, so allardyce was rubbish and keegan is amazing with his super points haul this season?

charlie mchugh wrote: »

But its ok, you're excused. Hating Newcastle and KK seems to be the in thing these days

i dont hate keegan or newcastle. ive always quite liked toon actually, but the reaction to keegan taking over (the messiah stuff) was so hilariously misguided that the only fitting outcome would be relegation and keggy walking, which i would find hilarious

also, id like us to nick milner and martins in the summer and you going down would help

and again, grow up, just coz someone has an opinion that isnt the same as yours doesnt mean theyre trolling. where are your posts about people who were calling bolton or small heath rubbish? they mustve been trolling too

Helix

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But he didn't buy Sunderland either, that was Drumavale. He is an employee of Sunderland FC, not one of the owners.

did he not put a few bob of his own money in?

either way anyway, im not one of the people on quinns back for being chairman of an english side. fair play to him

Bungalow Bill

Look, Roy Keane is in his first full season in management at a club with no scouting system in place (disbanded under the previous regime), obviously he is going to start with players that he already knew.

And just for the record he never played with Kenwyne Jones,Carlos Edwards,Craig Gordon who are three of his best signings.

I already explained to anyone who would listen why they had to spend that much money and why they don't exactly get a great exchange rate for it.

I see that 'pseudo-patriotic' is the new phrase of choice for people following Sunderland.
I am not going to feel guilty because I don't watch the Eircom League, otherwise 9 in every 10 football fans in the country would feel guilty for wanting Irish players to do well in the premiership becuase they don't watch the Eircom league!

Just because I wish Irish players to do well in England, yet don't actively support the irish league does not make me a hypocrite.

They are clearly two separate entities. I, like everyone else, grew up watching Ireland, and watching the premiership.
Just because the Eircom league finally has some investment and the standard is slightly better, does not mean I should feel guilty for not watching it.
I play football once a week and watch a game or two on the telly each weekend, thats enough for me tbh.

Charlie

Helix wrote: »

i dont hate keegan or newcastle. ive always quite liked toon actually, but the reaction to keegan taking over (the messiah stuff) was so hilariously misguided that the only fitting outcome would be relegation and keggy walking, which i would find hilarious

Sigh....do you think they represent every Newcastle supporter, so much of that was egged on by the media. Throw a sky sports camera in a front of a few chav faces and they'll perform all sorts of monkey tricks.

The fact that you say relegation would be hilarious, and justified, because certain fans exerted possibly too much joy at a managerial appointment, is quite troll like.

But i'll say no more and leave it at that as this is a Mackems thread.

Mr.Nice Guy

Jonny Arson wrote: »

these people should be putting their money into domestic football (if they are so patriotic themselves) and should be out supporting actual Irish clubs that they can experience be it Shels, Bohs, Kilkenny City(RIP), Glebe North or Letterkenny Rovers or whoever.

people are of course allowed to do whatever they want, people can choose to consume whatever they like, its a free world but it doesnt make it right.

Who are my local team? I grew up in Cabra so I guess that makes it Bohs (grandfather was apparently a big fan) however they're upping sticks near to Dublin Airport and will be far from local to me then. Is there a point in me following them so?

Helix

charlie mchugh wrote: »

The fact that you say relegation would be hilarious, and justified, because certain fans exerted possibly too much joy at a managerial appointment, is quite troll like.

But i'll say no more and leave it at that as this is a Mackems thread.

no, its me expressing my opinion and backing it up with reasons for said opinion, which i think youll find doesnt fit into trolling

but yes, lets leave it at that

eirebhoy

DesF wrote: »

How do you feel about supporting Irish players and managers in their ventures at home?

It's to do with patriotism. Obviously that is the view foreigners have of our country. If LOI teams are representing Ireland on the European stage then patriotism will kick in and we'll cheer for the Irish team. My father was the stereotypical Irish patriot who wouldn't watch the Champions league final but would cheer his head off watching Shels or Cork play a French or Spanish team. He was the same with rugby, snooker, athletics, anything, and he has bred that on to me. If an Irish ant made it's way to England he'd want to know about it.

It's not just an Irish thing. You'll find similarities in every country, especially the smaller ones.

Also, considering how you feel about Sunderland, count yourself lucky Quinn, Keane and the Irish brigade didn't take over a Spanish team because I'm absolutely convinced the interest then would be multiplied.

ditpoker wrote: »

as a spurs fan i believe i am qualified to say andy reid could be a championship regular if he lost weight. he is not good enough to play in the premiership.

Andy Reid is one of the most gifted passers in the premiership. He's also one of the most intelligent. He has a good attitude, a sensible chap, he puts in a good shift, doesn't let confidence affect him. If he stays fit for the next year or 2 he'll make a name for himself in the premiership imo. The only doubt is whether he's suited to the British game where he won't get much space but footballers will respect his type of player. Obviously I come across as an incredibly biased chap so I'll compare him to other Irish players... he's our most influential player imo.

His performance against Germany was world class, literally. That's what he can do when he gets the space. We'll see what he can do when closed down quickly.

Jonny Arson

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Who are my local team? I grew up in Cabra so I guess that makes it Bohs (grandfather was apparently a big fan) however they're upping sticks near to Dublin Airport and will be far from local to me then. Is there a point in me following them so?

do you not support Bohs? or are you thinking of going along to Bohs?

last time i checked Bohs were playing in Dalymount Park in Phibsboro, they are due to move Harristown eventually down the line and im sure every Bohs fan will be delighted to travel that arduous journey up the road to their brand spanking new stadium accepting the reality that clubs do and have to move locations in order to move forward.

if you're a Cabra man and havent developed an attachment to a club yet you'll be delighted to hear that Beggsboro F.C. are on your doorstep with a decent little ground, playing in the LSL and play on Friday nights under the lights