Pamela Izevbekhai - Should She Be Deported?

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

kathy2

I think the FMG thing is kind of over now and has been disproved.

The racism card is just a nasty little trick that is pulled out when arguments are lost.

At this stage I am only racist against people who use the word!

There is no need to convince hollyB or anyone else, all they have to do is ask any Nigerian, telling lies is more part of the culture that fgm. This particular woman is in no danger and should go on home and apply properly

blackiebest

kathy2 wrote: »

I think the FMG thing is kind of over now and has been disproved.

The racism card is just a nasty little trick that is pulled out when arguments are lost.

At this stage I am only racist against people who use the word!

There is no need to convince hollyB or anyone else, all they have to do is ask any Nigerian, telling lies is more part of the culture that fgm. This particular woman is in no danger and should go on home and apply properly

In case I am mis-understanding you could you please elaborate a little on what you mean by the above highlighted part of your post?

kathy2

What I mean is that the FGM story as told by this lady is total fantasy on her part which would be fair enough in another context.

I believe her when she says FGM never touched her life and she never even heard of it until she was an adult and then when she needed a story she used it.

Why let the truth get in the way of a good story!

Every tradition in the world has story telling at its base, Ireland has great traditions of fairies and leprechauns and pots of gold at the end of the rainbow.

Nigeria also has great story telling traditions and its own ghosts and goblins. They also include Tall Tales or Lies, extravagant stories which though often nonsensical are highly entertaining

JohnMc1

Deleted User wrote: »

A lot of people seem to think that there is an racist tint to her deportation. I was discussing it with some people yesterday and when I said "She's knowingly broken our laws and cost us hundreds of thousands of euros in a time when we need to be looking after our own". I was called a racist, bigot and had two of the people I was talking to swore "To have nothing to do with you ever again".

I was trying to point out that I was'nt in fact making a racist comment and asked if it had been a white African male trying to save his two boys from mutilation would it be such a big issue. I was told "That's different, it's tradition in many African countries". After that comment I just gave up.

A better question would have been if the LTS group [and other like minded individuals] would give a **** about Pamela and her daughters if they were white.

banana66

Why are we continuing to pay this womans legal costs when a 5 year old can tell she is trying to fool the authorities to achieve her aims ??? I am angry after all the budget cuts that we as a nation should continue to pay for this obvious deception

rkeane

Dont worry she will be on a flight back to Lagos very soon.....thats if she is not sent to Jail.

JonathanAnon

rkeane wrote: »

Dont worry she will be on a flight back to Lagos very soon.....thats if she is not sent to Jail.

I dont know about that. She should see jail, but wont. If she was a working Irish person, she would have got NONE of the free benefits that the state has provided to her.

Sizzler

Not sure if this article was posted already?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/ireland/article5950490.ece

[QUOTE=Nigeria's minister for justice has offered to testify in an Irish court against Nigerian citizens who claim political asylum on the grounds they will be forced to undergo female genital mutilation (FGM) if deported.

Michael Aondoakaa, a senior figure in the Nigerian government who is also the African country’s attorney-general, made the offer to Conor Lenihan, the integration minister, at a meeting held at the justice ministry in Abuja, the Nigerian capital, last Friday, according to a memo seen by The Sunday Times.

Aondoakaa is thought to have been referring to the case of Pamela Izevbekhai, the Nigerian woman who has appealed against her deportation, on the grounds that her two daughters, Naomi, 8, and Jemima, 6, will be forced to suffer the fate of their sister, Elizabeth, who she says died after FGM in 1994.

Izevbekhai has fought a highprofile legal battle to stay in Ireland since November 2005 after her application for asylum was rejected by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. She appealed to the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg last year. It has yet to decide if it will hear the case.

The memo, written by Kyle O’Sullivan, the Irish ambassador to Nigeria, states that Aondoakaa had heard reports that “some Nigerian citizen” had claimed in court that FGM would be performed on her daughters if they were deported by the Irish authorities.

Aondoakaa told Lenihan the claim was a “blatant lie” and said he would be prepared to “personally attend any court case anywhere to set the record straight, to refute these kind of claims”, the memo said.

“Aondoakaa said he had asked the Nigerian director of public prosecutions to attend the meeting to confirm to us [Irish] that criminal prosecutions would result in any cases where someone could be shown to have performed FGM,” the memo added. It quoted Aondoakaa describing the allegations of FGM being performed widely in Nigeria as “ridiculous”.

“He [Aondoakaa] said that it [FGM] was no longer a cultural practice in any sizeable body of Nigerian population, even in the countryside. He [Aondoakaa] said it was a criminal offence [FGM] and that police would immediately take action if cases were reported,” the memo said.

It quoted Aondoakaa as saying that some Nigerians “were prepared to say anything about their country abroad in order to advance their immigration claims”.

Aondoakaa is said to have raised the issue with Lenihan and spoke “heatedly” on the subject for approximately 15 minutes while meeting a delegation of Irish businessmen and government officials, including Pat Folan, the director of the Irish Naturalisation and Immigration Service.

The meeting was also attended by Kemafo Chikwe, the Nigerian ambassador to Ireland, who has accused Izevbekhai of abusing the asylum process and challenged her to present evidence to support her claims.

It is unclear as to whether the Department of Justice is willing to accept Aondoakaa’s offer to testify.

Izevbekhai and her daughters presented themselves to immigration officials in Dublin in January 2005, claiming that a trafficker had smuggled them to Ireland via the Netherlands.

She claimed she had fled from Nigeria to stop her husband’s family performing FGM on her two daughters.

Gardai claim she is an economic migrant who wants to live in Ireland. They suspect she travelled from Nigeria to London using a holiday visa before travelling to Ireland.

Antonia Leslie, a supporter of Izevbekhai, said she was unaware of Aondoakaa’s offer.

“Pamela’s fight is not with the Nigerian government. Pamela knows the government is doing what it can to stop FGM but people still engage in the practice. I think the Nigerian government believes Pamela is criticising their efforts to stamp out FGM but this is not the case. If the Nigerian minister for justice and attorney-general wants to testify, that is fine by her,” said Leslie.

Izevbekhai declined to be interviewed by The Sunday Times
[/QUOTE]

walshb

Sizzler wrote: »

Not sure if this article was posted already?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/ireland/article5950490.ece

To some Irish, all the reports in the world and all the claims in the world from ACTUAL Nigerian people still will not sway them. They have an agenda to promote asylum and to allow
any Tom, Dick or Harry into this country no matter what the case.

So, Pamela herself could come out tomorrow and say this is all crap and you would still
have some Irish saying that (she) is lying:rolleyes: Antonia Leslie being a prime example of a true idiot.
But, I would say more a cunning and devious idiot

All to further their agenda and in the case of many, including mainly the judiciary, to further increase their financial gain!

blackiebest

Sizzler wrote: »

Not sure if this article was posted already?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/ireland/article5950490.ece

How much weight would you give to his assertions? Considering that is is a given, on both sides of the arguement, that up to a third of all Nigerian women have been subjected to FGM do you think this minister might be mis-representing the actual problem? We, or at least I, can not imagine how one in three women could suffer this 'tradition'. The equivilent IMO is Mary Harney offering to testify in any court, anywhere, that there are no patients on trolleys or any problems in our health care system. Dont jump down my throat as a LTS 'nut' but it is a similiar comparison IMO.

People should stay off high horses on this one and look upon this ministers offers for what they are.

O'Coonassa

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

I had heard of this in the news a while back but had no idea this murderer walked free. This for me just exemplifies everything that is wrong with the West today. Multiculturalist hippies telling people how bad they are for belonging to Western civilisation and to respect inferior cultural practices :mad:

????

"
Doctors are highly motivated to conceal the true cause of circumcision death. Neonatal circumcision has no medical indication and is now considered to be an unnecessary7 non-therapeutic8 operation. It is unethical to carry out such operations on minors who cannot consent for themselves.9 Consequently, most doctors who have a baby die after a circumcision would prefer to attribute the results of his unethical operation to secondary causes, such as infection or bleeding, while ignoring the primary cause, which is the circumcision that resulted in the infection or bleeding. It is, therefore, very hard to identify the total number of deaths that occur from circumcision. One senses that one may be seeing only the "tip of the iceberg," with the vast majority of deaths from circumcision being concealed. The deaths undoubtedly cause an increase in infant mortality. Male infant mortality is higher than female infant mortality. It is not known how much of this increased mortality is due to the practice of male circumcision.


Several doctors have given estimates of the number of deaths that occur each year. Douglas Gairdner reported 16-19 actual deaths a year in England and Wales from neonatal circumcisions in the 1940s.10 Sydney Gellis believed that "there are more deaths from complications of circumcision than from cancer of the penis.11 There are various figures for the number of deaths from penile cancer ranging from 200 to 480 deaths per year. Robert Baker estimated 229 deaths per year from circumcision in the United States."

http://www.cirp.org/library/death/

blackiebest

O'Coonassa wrote: »

????

"
Doctors are highly motivated to conceal the true cause of circumcision death. Neonatal circumcision has no medical indication and is now considered to be an unnecessary7 non-therapeutic8 operation. It is unethical to carry out such operations on minors who cannot consent for themselves.9 Consequently, most doctors who have a baby die after a circumcision would prefer to attribute the results of his unethical operation to secondary causes, such as infection or bleeding, while ignoring the primary cause, which is the circumcision that resulted in the infection or bleeding. It is, therefore, very hard to identify the total number of deaths that occur from circumcision. One senses that one may be seeing only the "tip of the iceberg," with the vast majority of deaths from circumcision being concealed. The deaths undoubtedly cause an increase in infant mortality. Male infant mortality is higher than female infant mortality. It is not known how much of this increased mortality is due to the practice of male circumcision.


Several doctors have given estimates of the number of deaths that occur each year. Douglas Gairdner reported 16-19 actual deaths a year in England and Wales from neonatal circumcisions in the 1940s.10 Sydney Gellis believed that "there are more deaths from complications of circumcision than from cancer of the penis.11 There are various figures for the number of deaths from penile cancer ranging from 200 to 480 deaths per year. Robert Baker estimated 229 deaths per year from circumcision in the United States."

http://www.cirp.org/library/death/

Post of the year in terms of refrence IMO:) Well done, you know your sh1t

EnigmasWhisper

Hopefuly this whole waste of money, time and energy will come to its obvious conclusion soon. I am in a work environment where I meet the public everyday, and this ladies situation has been brought up in conversation regularly. Its refreshing to know that not one person I have spoken to believe she and her family should be allowed stay. Although, Im sure these LTS nuts would label me and the majority of Irish people as racist, but who cares....it seems shes going home, so good riddance, and good luck to the droves of other frauds and liars that will follow her !

p.s. Why didnt we have such large numbers of Nigerians claiming asylum before our celtic tiger and booming economy. Surely the poor dears were desperate to escape to our emerald shores before.

Bye, bye Pam.....it seems not all of us are as naive and foolish as the LTS Sligo branch

O'Coonassa

EnigmasWhisper wrote: »

p.s. Why didnt we have such large numbers of Nigerians claiming asylum before our celtic tiger and booming economy.

Er...um..because we were practically a third world country ourselves and people were leaving in droves because there weren't any jobs to be had?

97i9y3941

they where coming here even before the boom,i remember it well,there was a loophole in the irish law at time,meaning if your wife came here pregnant at the time,and the child was born in ireland,it ment automatic citizenship for you and your wife and kid,when the justice minister mc dowell came in,we had a referendom to vote to change the loophole,not surprisely it was overwhelming voted to be closed

O'Coonassa

Fred83 wrote: »

they where coming here even before the boom

I beg to differ. AFAIK right up until the 90's Phil Lynott was about the closest thing we ever had to a Nigerian Irishman. When Don Letts came here with Johnny Rotten in the early eighties he had hordes of kids following him around everywhere he went because they'd never seen a "black" man. I certainly never met or even seen anybody of African descent (except on TV) until I went to the UK in 85. The referendum you're talking about only happened around four years ago, we'd been booming for a fair while at that stage.

jmcc

It looks like FF is finally realising that immigration and the abuse of the asylum system is going to be an electoral issue. The Minister is planning on introducing some changes to the system that would expedite the removal of failed asylum seekers from the state "even if they have launched legal appeals against their removal."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/ireland/article6078609.ece

Regards...jmcc

ParkRunner

jmcc wrote: »

It looks like FF is finally realising that immigration and the abuse of the asylum system is going to be an electoral issue. The Minister is planning on introducing some changes to the system that would expedite the removal of failed asylum seekers from the state "even if they have launched legal appeals against their removal."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/ireland/article6078609.ece

The conspiracy theorist in me leads me to believe that there is a link between the government's leaking of their affidavits in Pamela's case and the imminent enactment of the Immigration, Residence and Protection Bill.

Public support for the Act can have only surged after the coverage of this case recently. I don't think anything can save FF at this stage though.

O'Coonassa

FF and their voters should all be deported to Nigeria ASAP.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

jmcc

EF wrote: »

The conspiracy theorist in me leads me to believe that there is a link between the government's leaking of their affidavits in Pamela's case and the imminent enactment of the Immigration, Residence and Protection Bill.

This type of leakage occurs all the time. Though if Ireland had a real culture of investigative journalism, the firing of Boucher-Hayes and Antonia Leslie would become part of that coverage. Instead Ireland has a journalistic culture of mediocrity.

Public support for the Act can have only surged after the coverage of this case recently. I don't think anything can save FF at this stage though.

At a wild guess, the obvious fraud issue would have driven support up to at least 99.98%.

I think that the government chose this case to make a statement.

Regards...jmcc

Rafferty444

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Email+ Share+ Saturday, April 11, 2009

Pamela’s family get death threats
By Juno McEnroe

A NIGERIAN mother and her two daughters fighting deportation have received death threats warning the family will be shot dead if they remain in Ireland.

The violent threat has also been made to anti-racist campaigner Rosanna Flynn ahead of a landmark Supreme Court case that will decide the Nigerian family’s fate.

Gardaí have been contacted by Pamela Izevbekhai about the vicious threat to her and her daughters, Naomi, seven, and Jemima, six.

The group behind the threats, who do not identify themselves, wrote in an email to the Nigerian mother and her supporters:

"This is a serious warning, this Nigerian woman and children WILL be shot if she stays in Ireland along with the english b*** Rossana Flynn how dare she come into this country and tell us who to let in, she can f*** off back to england or be shot." [SIC]

The malicious message says "We will rid all Africans and Asians from Ireland. We have had enough of these asylum seekers costing us money that is needed for our people," a copy obtained by the Irish Examiner reads.

The group add: "If any of you do gooders (or so you think) can’t see that attacks are going to grow at a fast rate then your thick, you are fuelling our programme everytime you appear on TV, people are coming to us and asking for our help to evict africans from their areas, there are no persons in this state that can stop what is going to happen." [SIC]

Ms Izevbekhai has seen the email and is said to be shaken by it.

Ms Flynn said the email had added to the serious pressure the Nigerian mother was already facing over her Supreme Court appeal due to resume on April 30.

Ms Flynn has received threats before because of her campaigning for immigrants, including a letter delivered to her home address which warned her house would be burnt down as well as malicious text messages.

The threat comes as state lawyers attempt to quash Ms Izevbekhai’s asylum claim with new evidence that proves she used forged documents in her case.

The Nigerian mother claims her first-born child Elizabeth bled to death in Lagos, Nigeria, after undergoing female genital mutilation.

She wants to remain in Ireland with her daughters claiming they will meet the same fate if forced to return to the African nation.

A new solicitor has agreed to take up her case since the Supreme Court heard this month that her lawyers wanted to come off record.

It is understood a team of barristers will examine her files this coming week to decide whether to take up her case.

http://www.examiner.ie/ireland/idsnaumhkf/rss2/

Rafferty444

O'Coonassa wrote: »

I beg to differ. AFAIK right up until the 90's Phil Lynott was about the closest thing we ever had to a Nigerian Irishman. When Don Letts came here with Johnny Rotten in the early eighties he had hordes of kids following him around everywhere he went because they'd never seen a "black" man. I certainly never met or even seen anybody of African descent (except on TV) until I went to the UK in 85. The referendum you're talking about only happened around four years ago, we'd been booming for a fair while at that stage.

Phil Lynott was English born and bread and died in shropshire england , his father was Brazilian, we did have blacks in hospitals in the late 60's, or at least Dublin hospitals did as i rem seeing them in the mid 70's

The Orb

Fred83, the loophole you refer to was initiated in the anglo-irish agreement and then enshrined in the constitution, it stated that any child born on the island of Ireland was entitled to Irish citizenship. Clearly its intention was to enable northern catholics take out Irish citizenship. What this led to was Nigerians, (and other nationalities,mainly Nigerians) travelling to the Britian legally with visas, then travelling to Belfast, having a child there and hey presto, Irish citizen. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, clearly the wording in the agreement left it wide open to abuse. 95% of Nigerians in ireland entered via the UK. When the wording was changed after a referendum to change the constitution I believe all passports obtained in this way should have been invalidated, however I don't know if that was legally possible. This is precisely how Izevbekhai arrived in the state via the UK,despite her claims to the contrary. I work in the area and believe me, Nigerians are pi$$ing themselves laughing at the Irish state.

Rafferty444

Fred83 wrote: »

they where coming here even before the boom,i remember it well,there was a loophole in the irish law at time,meaning if your wife came here pregnant at the time,and the child was born in ireland,it ment automatic citizenship for you and your wife and kid,when the justice minister mc dowell came in,we had a referendom to vote to change the loophole,not surprisely it was overwhelming voted to be closed

geees i hate this part , although the referendom voted to close the loophole , it is still open, around the same time we had the irish language recognised as our first language, because of this in the constitution the irish verse can never be changed without another referendom, in short the only text chnaged is the English version, and not the irish which takes pressidence and needs another referendom.Why do you still see thousands of foreigners pregnant, mainly Nigerians and chinese. from 109,000 chinese here only 11,000 are registerd as students or work visas.

The irish government will allow the ilegalls and failed asylum seekers to get out of control, then they will say they will allow all of them to stay as citizens , just so they can then start from scratch, Obama has just started the same thing with 12 million in America, saying allowing them to stay will free the system up to start over where bush failed.

live2thewire

Rafferty444 wrote: »

Phil Lynott was English born and bread and died in shropshire england , his father was Brazilian, we did have blacks in hospitals in the late 60's, or at least Dublin hospitals did as i rem seeing them in the mid 70's

he was born in england and grew up in dublin

also black people have been in ireland(dublin) since middle ages, although virtually all assimilated into greater population due to their low numbers.

jmcc

Rafferty444 wrote: »

The irish government will allow the ilegalls and failed asylum seekers to get out of control, then they will say they will allow all of them to stay as citizens , just so they can then start from scratch, Obama has just started the same thing with 12 million in America, saying allowing them to stay will free the system up to start over where bush failed.

Read the Sunday Times article. Your interpretation of events seems to be at variance with the reality.

Regards...jmcc

ParkRunner

Rafferty444 wrote: »

geees i hate this part , although the referendom voted to close the loophole , it is still open, around the same time we had the irish language recognised as our first language, because of this in the constitution the irish verse can never be changed without another referendom, in short the only text chnaged is the English version, and not the irish which takes pressidence and needs another referendom.Why do you still see thousands of foreigners pregnant, mainly Nigerians and chinese. from 109,000 chinese here only 11,000 are registerd as students or work visas.

The irish government will allow the ilegalls and failed asylum seekers to get out of control, then they will say they will allow all of them to stay as citizens , just so they can then start from scratch, Obama has just started the same thing with 12 million in America, saying allowing them to stay will free the system up to start over where bush failed.

The loophole has well and truely been closed! Any child born on the island of Ireland since January 1st 2005 is not entitled to Irish citizenship. They are in the majority of cases however entitled to citizenship of their parent's country by descent. Many who did use the loophole came straight to Ireland and claimed asylum, subsequently withdrawing their asylum claim and making an application to stay on the basis of being the parent of an Irish born child.

EnigmasWhisper

O'Coonassa wrote: »

Er...um..because we were practically a third world country ourselves and people were leaving in droves because there weren't any jobs to be had?

I was always under the impression they were supposed to claim asylum in the first country they land in. As far as I know there are no direct flights to Ireland from Nigeria ? Seems odd that the poor darlings would have chosen soft and naive booming Ireland when escaping possible mutilation or death. Surely a 'third world' (hardly) Ireland would have been better than possible death ?