Pamela Izevbekhai - Should She Be Deported?

rkeane

I think a few people are having a real problem keeping on topic here.

Permabear

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opo

I could be wrong but I think the entire campaign has changed from one of championing Pamela Izevbekhai to one of apparently raising the “awareness” of FGM. I would have thought there are hundreds of individuals working in this area all over the world that would have been better informed and qualified to do this if we needed this in the first place.

To be fair to Pamela Izevbekhai, she has highlighted the manipulation of the asylum process, the media and the gullible, in fact, almost all of the latter day experts on this subject.

rkeane

opo wrote: »

I could be wrong but I think the entire campaign has changed from one of championing Pamela Izevbekhai to one of apparently raising the “awareness” of FGM. I would have thought there are hundreds of individuals working in this area all over the world that would have been better informed and qualified to do this if we needed this in the first place.

To be fair to Pamela Izevbekhai, she has highlighted the manipulation of the asylum process, the media and the gullible, in fact, almost all of the latter day experts on this subject.

Well she has given strength to the arguement for the new Immigration, Residence and Protection Bill 2008....this bill will end the kind of abuse that we have seen in this case. This case is likely to be done and dusted very soon, she hasn't got a leg to stand on.

Permabear

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rkeane

You don't hear a peep out of her supporters, it seems many have abandoned her to the inevitable deportation. Her entire "case" was based on a very elaborate story based on fabricated evidence, unfortunately for her none of it held any water. I would bet my new car on the Supreme Court dismissing the case....I just hope they don't decide to prosecute her....this long and expensive saga needs to end.

doomedtofail

How will the Immigration, Residence and Protection Bill 2008 stop such fraudulent applications in the future though?

HollyB

donegalfella wrote: »

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She's due back before the Supreme Court on 1 May, I believe, but she has to respond to the ECHR on 29 April. I would assume that, unless she can provide a satisfactory response to the new testimony presented by the State, proving her story, they won't list the case for the ECHR to try, which would mean that they would have no valid reason to continue to ask the Irish government to postpone her deportation. They hadn't decided whether they were going to list the case before the new evidence became known, so I imagine that they'd be less likely to do so now, with such serious doubt cast over her credibility.

My guess would be that, while some of Pamela's previous supporters may be treading cautiously, to see if she can salvage the credibility of her case before they renew their support for her, there will still be some who will campaign on her behalf, no matter what, and insist that Naomi and Jemima can never be safe in Nigeria, since there is FGM there and they are girls, ignoring the fact that it's not a straight case of 25% (or whatever) prevalence in the country = every girl in the country has an automatic 25% chance of being mutilated, no more, no less.

In the absence of Pamela's secret (so secret that, to the best of my knowledge, no newspaper or investigator has managed to find them to interview them) and powerful (but not so powerful that they can't kidnap a couple of girls whose faces, home and school have all been publicly displayed on newspapers, television and the internet) network of in-laws, it would be their parents who would be the ones who would decide whether or not to subject them to FGM, and they don't seem in any way inclined to do that.

Nodin

doomedtofail wrote: »

How will the Immigration, Residence and Protection Bill 2008 stop such fraudulent applications in the future though?

That would require a change in human nature. Any and every thing that may be of benefit to some one risks being exploited by a minority. Certainly not all have the same amount of "neck" as others though...

HollyB

doomedtofail wrote: »

How will the Immigration, Residence and Protection Bill 2008 stop such fraudulent applications in the future though?

Does the Bill reduce the period of notice that must be given prior to somebody being deported? Isn't something like 14 or 21 days at the moment? I could see that being one of the causes from problems when it comes to deporting people, since there's likely to be quite a few who would take advantage of the opportunity to disappear before they can be removed from the State.

jmcc

HollyB wrote: »

She's due back before the Supreme Court on 1 May, I believe, but she has to respond to the ECHR on 29 April.

The case is listed for mention on 30th of April.

For Thursday, 30th April 2009
The Chief Justice
At 10.45
For Mention
54/06 Flanagan -v- Halley
64/09 Izeubekhai -v- Minister for Justice Equality and Law Reform
***
Mrs. Justice Denham
Mrs. Justice Macken
Mr. Justice Finnegan
392 & 397/08 Director of Corporate Enforcement -v- Byrne

I would assume that, unless she can provide a satisfactory response to the new testimony presented by the State, proving her story, they won't list the case for the ECHR to try, which would mean that they would have no valid reason to continue to ask the Irish government to postpone her deportation.

Well the fact that forged documentation was submitted to the Supreme Court and was used as the basis for the appeal is quite serious. The ECHR asked that the Irish government stay the deportation order until the ECHR had a chance to consider whether they should hear the case. The same forged documents were submitted to the ECHR and the State has notified the ECHR that it does not intend to reach any friendly settlement of the case (put simply, the State will deport at the earliest opportunity).

My guess would be that, while some of Pamela's previous supporters may be treading cautiously, to see if she can salvage the credibility of her case before they renew their support for her,

It is interesting to see, even on this thread, that many pro-PI posters have disappeared.

Boucher-Hayes' career as an "investigative" journalist would be terminated in any real news organisation for failure to follow the basic rules of journalism. Antonia Leslie is a Sindo columnist so the standards are considerably lower than they would be for an investigative journalist. Those who have so gullibly supported PI will now be tainted and they are more likely to be keeping a low profile. There is a noticable change in how some of the Irish media has been reporting the story and it has damaged some of the more Politically Correct publications and organisations. It should be interesting to see the fallout and whether any journalists or editors will get the sack. This is Ireland and instead of a Media we have a Mediocrity.

Regards...jmcc

rkeane

HollyB wrote: »

Does the Bill reduce the period of notice that must be given prior to somebody being deported? Isn't something like 14 or 21 days at the moment? I could see that being one of the causes from problems when it comes to deporting people, since there's likely to be quite a few who would take advantage of the opportunity to disappear before they can be removed from the State.

The aim of this bill is to comprehensively reform our inadequate immigration and asylum legislation. No advance notice will be given to failed asylum seekers...that is one of the key measures of the bill.

opo

jmcc wrote: »

Boucher-Hayes' career as an "investigative" journalist would be terminated in any real news organisation for failure to follow the basic rules of journalism. Antonia Leslie is a Sindo columnist so the standards are considerably lower than they would be for an investigative journalist. Those who have so gullibly supported PI will now be tainted and they are more likely to be keeping a low profile. There is a noticable change in how some of the Irish media has been reporting the story and it has damaged some of the more Politically Correct publications and organisations. It should be interesting to see the fallout and whether any journalists or editors will get the sack. This is Ireland and instead of a Media we have a Mediocrity.

Regards...jmcc

Whereas other countries seem to enjoy the benefits of investigative journalists in such matters, we are slectively spoon fed lies and "Hello" style tripe by reporters.

Lets not call them what they have proved they are not.

PapaQuebec

They are not "reporters", they are "journalists" and to quote an age-old press maxim: "A journalist is someone who bums drinks from a reporter"

Vinegar Hill

PapaQuebec wrote: »

They are not "reporters", they are "journalists" and to quote an age-old press maxim: "A journalist is someone who bums drinks from a reporter"

I would refer you to the RTE website to see exactly what his title is.

opo

PapaQuebec wrote: »

They are not "reporters", they are "journalists" and to quote an age-old press maxim: "A journalist is someone who bums drinks from a reporter"

I stand corrected

irishjohn25

she should be booted the hell out - to hell with her

sorry for her kids - but its not our fault

what the hell is wrong with this country

what the hell is wrong with the irish

this country is in big trouble.

but lets forget our decreasing wages, - o so what 350k + irish unemployed and fear loosing their homes - infact lets just forget the irish completly

and lets spend all our time and money looking after a woman who we didnt ask to come here. who lied through her teeth and used her kids as part of her case.

no problem -

we didnt ask her here - but we will just forget our own problems and fix hers.

irish people - ask yourselves this - if we went to nigeria - what fu%^&* help would we get




none

to hell with her and boot her out

maidenireland

People that do this type of thing to women and female children should be shot, NO woman should go through female genital mutilation it's disgusting and barbaric and serves what purpose???......religion and culture is just a smoke screen, I mean what have we got? no drink or meat on good friday etc etc, we can live with that can't we? (not such a bad religion after all) These countries are backward and some higher authority should step in and just STOP it and move on.
I mean we still have countries that don't allow women to be educated!!!!

World..cop on.

No.. I'm a guy

97i9y3941

maidenireland wrote: »

People that do this type of thing to women and female children should be shot, NO woman should go through female genital mutilation it's disgusting and barbaric and serves what purpose???......religion and culture is just a smoke screen, I mean what have we got? no drink or meat on good friday etc etc, we can live with that can't we? (not such a bad religion after all) These countries are backward and some higher authority should step in and just STOP it and move on.
I mean we still have countries that don't allow women to be educated!!!!

World..cop on.

No.. I'm a guy

you could say that but who care,for instance look at china,has terrible human rights record,but the irish gov still does business with them because money talks

kathy2

People that do this type of thing to women and female children should be shot, NO woman should go through female genital mutilation it's disgusting and barbaric and serves what purpose???......religion and culture is just a smoke screen, I mean what have we got? no drink or meat on good friday etc etc, we can live with that can't we? (not such a bad religion after all) These countries are backward and some higher authority should step in and just STOP it and move on.
I mean we still have countries that don't allow women to be educated!!!!

World..cop on.

No.. I'm a guy

:DYou are right 100% but that is not the case here. There was no dead baby Pamela made the whole story up, you are mixing up the issues!:D

rkeane

kathy2 wrote: »

People that do this type of thing to women and female children should be shot, NO woman should go through female genital mutilation it's disgusting and barbaric and serves what purpose???......religion and culture is just a smoke screen, I mean what have we got? no drink or meat on good friday etc etc, we can live with that can't we? (not such a bad religion after all) These countries are backward and some higher authority should step in and just STOP it and move on.
I mean we still have countries that don't allow women to be educated!!!!

World..cop on.

No.. I'm a guy

:DYou are right 100% but that is not the case here. There was no dead baby Pamela made the whole story up, you are mixing up the issues!:D

She has less than 1 week left to concoct another story backed up with some proof of the existance of this child. The case is likely to be dismissed in the event she has no proof within the above time period, she could likely face criminal charges...I hope they don't do this as it would delay her deportation.
The minister has signed the deportation order, it will come into effect the moment her case collapses.

Merch

maidenireland wrote: »

People that do this type of thing to women and female children should be shot, NO woman should go through female genital mutilation it's disgusting and barbaric and serves what purpose???......religion and culture is just a smoke screen, I mean what have we got? no drink or meat on good friday etc etc, we can live with that can't we? (not such a bad religion after all) These countries are backward and some higher authority should step in and just STOP it and move on.
I mean we still have countries that don't allow women to be educated!!!!

World..cop on.

No.. I'm a guy

I understand the reason you are annoyed but there are a lot of injustices in the world, who should step in and stop it? and at what cost, not just financially. It is up to them to sort out themselves, do you suggest we invade, tell them what to do in a sovereign state? impose our values on them? (we as in the west)
Look she's lied, she's been found out send her home, exceptions cant be made or that will make bigger fools of us.
Its not the only thing wrong in the world but we simply cant take on all the injustices of the world, I'd much rather see genuine issues in Ireland sorted out with all the money that is spent on this, not through selfishness but I believe we should be looking at our own problems and faults and not taking on board other nations.
Besides we are hardly perfect, our education and health system is in tatters, there are plenty of people below the poverty line here (not just now that the recession has hit)

JonathanAnon

maidenireland wrote: »

People that do this type of thing to women and female children should be shot, NO woman should go through female genital mutilation

Someone hasnt been listening. Her baby never existed ffs.

rkeane

JonathanAnon wrote: »

Someone hasnt been listening. Her baby never existed ffs.

Well unless she offers some evidence to the contrary, that is the obvious conclusion. To date she has offered nothing credible to support her claim other than fake documents...I think it's gonna be a case of Bye Bye Pammie.

AlekSmart

Merch wrote: »

Do you suggest we invade, tell them what to do in a sovereign state? impose our values on them? (we as in the west)
Look she's lied, she's been found out send her home, exceptions cant be made or that will make bigger fools of us.
Its not the only thing wrong in the world but we simply cant take on all the injustices of the world, I'd much rather see genuine issues in Ireland sorted out with all the money that is spent on this, not through selfishness but I believe we should be looking at our own problems and faults and not taking on board other nations.
Besides we are hardly perfect, our education and health system is in tatters, there are plenty of people below the poverty line here (not just now that the recession has hit)

Well said that person !!!
Probably THE post of the thread.

Permabear

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Papad

donegalfella wrote: »

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And when people cried "Wolf" about this a few years ago, they were branded as racists. The politicians were first to the fore with their war cries defending the newcomers. But back then, Ireland was awash in money, and in her quest to become mulitcultural at all cost (to the eyes of Europe) brought us to this unfortunate moment in time, where as you said, genuine cases have now become needles in the mass of a fraudulent haystack.

zynaps

donegalfella wrote: »

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QFT. I'd like to think that genuine, honest immigrants are welcome here if we can possibly accomodate them, and it's a shame that people like Izevbekhai not only overwhelm and slow down the system on many levels, but also cause many Irish to retaliate with racism and unwelcome towards genuine immigrants, both refugees and economic.

maidenireland

JonathanAnon wrote: »

Someone hasnt been listening. Her baby never existed ffs.

It's like this.....I'd lie too if it meant protecting my kids, wouldn't you if you have any.

We're being lied to every day by Dail Eirann but us dopey Irish people just keep on taking it.

Maybe if we took up for ourselves more in this country and grew a pair we wouldn't be so narrow minded.

rkeane

maidenireland wrote: »

It's like this.....I'd lie too if it meant protecting my kids, wouldn't you if you have any.

We're being lied to every day by Dail Eirann but us dopey Irish people just keep on taking it.

Maybe if we took up for ourselves more in this country and grew a pair we wouldn't be so narrow minded.

Sorry I think you would find 99% of the population would disagree with you. Pamela Izevbekhai is in fear of nothing....all the evidence thus far points to the child never existing, her team of lawyers abandoned her ffs....she has no case.
She will be deported very soon and most people will be delighted to hear of it.