Down converting HD to SD video

reece

Hi,
I'm almost about to jump ship from SD to HD video but will still need to deliver content in SD until HD is the norm. I've noticed on a lot of discussion boards that down converting HD to SD and maintaining quality seems to be a fine art. Has anyone any comments on the process and is it best to down convert using software or through the camera facility. I'd imagine software down converting requires alot of resources and would take time.
cheers

decob

what sort of set up have you got? If you generally capture via firewire let the camera do the work. I'd generally do it via hardware via the cameras down-convert or decent capture card

reece

setup - thinking to buying canon XH A1 - got an XM2 at the moment. pc - Dual Core Amd processor. 4 gigs of ram. 4 hard disks - 1 for video, 1 audio, 1 program installations, and one for general crap. I just noticed bulletin board comments from people noticing a downgrade in quality going from hd to sd via camera and via some of the NLE packages. S/w - I've Avid Liquid, Adobe Premiere Pro CS3, and After Effects 7 pro. I'm just a bit wary of spending 4k on a HD camera that may not suit my SD needs at the moment and at the same time am a bit wary of upgrading to a better SD camera - with HD beginning to kick off

decob

Well to be honest you are going to lose some quality going from an image that is (hdv) 1440x1080 to (SD) 720x576. But shoot the same scene with the XH A1 and the XM2, digitise both at sd, and believe me you will see a huge difference in quality. The footage that will come from the hdv camera will be a lot sharper that your old xm2.

As for the downconvert feature on the camera, given your setup, i would opt for it over a software solution. Editing native hdv has it's own problem, from frame accuracy to render times. You will probably spend a long longer working on your projects that before. Unless you are willing to spend money on a hdv deck with sdi out, a snell & wilcox alchemist and a decent capture card.. You will never get a pixel perfect conversion.

Don't get me wrong about HDV, it's a good format to capture to... just not to work with natively. Depending on the job, i'd usually downconvert it to sd and work away. If i need to work at hd - i tend to use prores or one of the the other aja codecs i have at my disposal.

One thing i will say is, try and hire or get a loan of the XH camera and test it out, and as i suggested above, shoot the same scene with it (@hdv) and your xm2. and compare the footage at sd....

extopia

Agree with decob. Conn's Cameras in Dublin will rent you the camera for a week or two and deduct the rental price from the cost if you decide to buy. Well worth it, I bought my A1 after a similar trial.

The other good thing about the A1 is that, with a bit of effort, you can create a setup (via component out) that will allow you to capture uncompressed HD. Check out the dvinfo.net forums for more detail on this, and any other questions you have about the A1 or any other popular camera.

Bushalicious

avid has major trouble with hdv. that is the hd standard you will prob end up using. i suggest final cut from for using hdv.

reece

sweet, hadn't thought about test driving it (renting) but a very good idea.

highdef

I almost always downconvert from HD to SD in-camera in my A1 and it's fine. Looks a lot better than if I had just recorded in SD in the first place. Also means I have HDV masters if I need them in the future.

reece

that's very reassuring - thanks. great to hear that - I had read a negative review on creative cow forum regarding the A1 down conversion. How do you find the camera btw

highdef

It really is fantastic. Literally everything can be tweaked. There are so many options and picture and sound quality is indistinguishable from full broadcast video cameras, IMO. I have recorded a couple of weddings in the "film" like mode and my clients have been extremely happy saying it looked like a film. I recently recorded a panto for a local musical society and they are more than happy with it. Well worth the money. Only thing I would have liked would have been for it to be shoulder mounted but there is a model that has that ability but its several thousand euro more expensive. I could only afford it because of my windfall with the SSIA scheme.

reece

I know the story with the SSIA - I've blown mine so I'm trying to finance the camera with a trade in of my XM2. The problem being - both camera shops in dublin that I went into , and that shall remain nameless are almost 1k above the odds for the XH-A1. Go figure

what setup did you record the wedding at - 1080i - 25F?

extopia

The prices aren't that different to other countries when you factor in the VAT and/or import duties where applicable. If you're registered for VAT the difference isn't worth the hassle, in my opinion, which is why I bought mine from an Irish camera dealer.

reece

bought mine previously from DABS uk. Saved 500. Now Dabs.ie is 900 cheaper. The only hassle you would have is if you had to send it back. And also having to wait for the post man to call

highdef

Sorry for delay replying Reece - Yeah, I recorded in 1080i at 25F and used a different preset than the factory preset. It gives it a very filimic look which is generaly what the client wants. When I meet a client before the shoot, I show them two examples of weddings I have shot, one in standard 50i mode and the other in 25F and they ALWAYS pick 25F.

reece

sweet thanks for your reply Highdef. Quick question for you and apologies for going slightly off thread. Have you done any camera moving (panning) slow mo shots and if so how good did it perform? I've never achieved a realistic similar shot with my camera - the pan was always jaggedy

extopia

reece wrote: »

the pan was always jaggedy

You're probably not panning slowly enough, have a read of this article:

http://hd24.com/dont_shudder_at_the_judder.htm