any poker players out there?

breadmonkey

Fine - have fun, people.

There's really no need to be so catty, what I'm telling you is the truth.

If you think the only difference between online and offline Poker is the amount of money involved, then there's no point discussing this further.

All I said was that you could play for stakes that suit your budget online. You could try and get a live game going in UCD for similar stakes because afaik there is nothing else on offer. Unfortunately, it is my belief such a game would most likely resemble a game where no money is at stake and as such, would be crap. By "crap" I mean people "bulldozing [their] way in to a hand with a near-total disregard for the cards" {seriously}. It's a simple fact about that game of poker that one needs to be playing for non-insignificant amount of money* (which will of course vary from person to person) in order to be playing the game in a serious manner.

If your post - offensive comments and all - represents Poker today, in Ireland, I have better ways to spend my time and money.

I have reread my post and I really think that if you found it offensive you need thicker skin.

*or playing with a view to generating enough money to play for significant sums at a future point.

Theresalwaysone

Steroid Head, Your kidding yourself if you think poker isnt about money.

The "over the top, bulldozing" is a strategy and like all strategies can be countered. You really don't have a clue about the basics of poker. It is simply, always has, always will be, about money.

Bubs101

stereoroid wrote: »

Is that what I said? Try again.

There's bluffing, and then there's bulldozing your way in to a hand with a near-total disregard for the cards. Of course it happens sometimes, but if it happens every other hand, you're not fooling anyone - yet that is what I saw last time I played. Killed the game stone dead for me - most of the time I never even saw the flop. The balance shifted too far towards bluffing, and away from - remember them? - the cards. If you think that's "the way it is", fine - if it's that way in Irish casinos, I won't bother with those either. I don't need this.

OK, let me put it another way: what about thinking in terms of a "poker university"? Somewhere students (i.e. financially-challenged) can learn more about the game before hitting the casinos? It takes a lot of hands before you get a feel for the cards, and you can't do that if you get treated like a "cash cow" for the more-experienced players.

That's why social games - even pub games - are for chips, not hard cash on every hand: it lets you stay in control of what you spend, not get badgered in to spending your rent on "one more hand". (No, I was not suggesting freeroll only - just keep cash off the tables & limit rebuys.)

stereoroid, the answer for you is quite simple. Don't play NL poker. Limit poker will guarantee you can see some flops and if you wanted to find out more about it I'd suggest that you check out the poker forum but the lads are right, without monetary value on the chips it's a joke. People will lump in with 2 7 and the such

Bubs101

lemur option wrote: »

and bubs, while I imagine the policy is meant to extend to private friendly on-campus games I doubt there's much they can do in that situation.

So whats the problem then?

lemur option

wow. Guys, we're just looking for some friendly games here, no need to start a fight over it.

Stereroid what you're talking about is a valid strategy, it's what works for some people. I'm hoping that you haven't been put off too much and that if we do start weekly games you'll come along to see how you counter such a risky stratey

As for the rest of you, yes I know I know poker is a casino games, it was designed for gambling and will remain as such for many years to come. I also think that playing for nothing is pointless. but the thing is we had a table going at the coffee morning for free last week and we actually had a lot of fun. It probably wouldn't be great every week but to have a game that was just practice lead to a much more interesting game. you were more relaxed and were able to try new styles of play or focus on other players strategies.

just as a matter of interest did anyone sign up for the championships this saturday?

I was at the bar at 7 and couldn't see anyone signing people up. Interestingly enough, we started a poker game ( granted it was for pennys) and no1 raised an eyebrow. It's a step in the right direction!!!

Slash/ED

Stereoid thats like saying "i dont wanna play football against that team. They keep shooting from outside the box. They've no regard for lumping the ball forward aimlessly". What you're talking about is a style of play, it's one of many, part of the fun of the game is trying to counteract it. If people are going all in literally every hand, it's not entirely challenging to do so...

When people say it has to be for money, they don't mean it has to be a cash game (where chips represent real money, which is what you seem to think people are suggesting). Have a tournament structure where you can't lose more than your buy in and the chips don't represent real money if you want, but you kinda need there to be cash invested (even tiny amounts) and be up for winning at the end of the tournament. Nobody would see this as a 'cash cow' - we used to play for a fiver a head last year every week, that was fine. Nobody made a living off it, trust me...

The best way people will learn the game, and trust me on this, is from playing people who are better than them anyway. In a tournament, for a tiny buy in, they can do this at no cost and given the nature of tournament poker, beat the better players a decent amount of the time too. It's a bit of craic, the money doesn't matter all that much, and you can improve your game if thats what you want...And if you did that, you'd probably figure out just why people were raising pre flop even without aces or kings and how to counter-act it...

"you were more relaxed and were able to try new styles of play or focus on other players strategies"

The problem here is you can't realistically see how your strategy and ideas will work against people in a freeroll. You may make a great read pre flop, but get called by king-four anyway...If it's not worth winning, people wont play to win, so really you'll learn nothing about a real poker game. Ever play a play money game online? It's pointless even from a purely learning perspective.

lemur option

Ok, here's the story.

Talking to Richard Butler, who was surprisingly encouraging of the gamesoc poker idea, we have concluded that playing for money isn't completely banned. There are however limitations.
1) no sit and go. (no betting money as in casino play) something I have no intention of doing and never have had any intention of doing. Don't like it, go to a casino.
2)cash pots are strongly discouraged but are ok for smaller pots where buying a prize would be silly, or the knowing the prize pool prior to the tournament would be impossible.
3) If the prize pool is not small, aka more than 100/200 for first prize the prizes should be gift vouchers/ online poker vouchers/ other non-cash money-like alternatives.
4) we can set a cash prize.. say 50-100e, charge 5-10e entry and then any money (aka profit) would be spent on future tournament prizes.

I think you'll agree these are very lenient restrictions and we thank richard for allowing us such terms. one of the things mentioned was a big tournament sometime soon. aka before the end of the semester.
so taking this all in to account;
next thursday 10th there will be a beginners free-roll with the prize being entry to a later tournament with an entrance of not more that 10e.
Also that day (if there's enough interest) there will be a pay-in tournament, 5e entry 1e re-buy for first half an hour. Prize completely dependant on entrance pool.
I'm hoping for two tables of each with myself and darwin as tournament directors. Anyone who's interested please Pm me or comment below to give me a rough idea of figures.

Theresalwaysone

I dont understand.

Butler isnt lenient at all, these are the exact terms he gave any pokersoc and they are bs. They gut is living in the past. Strangely, he doesnt mind poker being played for SVdeP in a charity game. Guys an idiot.

Referring to your points:

1) Do you know what a sit n go is?

2)Blah small is a relative term.

3)No poker players who actually arent retarded and want value for their money dont want vouchers. If the majority rules however, well the market is always right.

4) So you pay into the tournament? Win your 100euro or whatever, but there is 300 in the prize pool and the other 200 goes to buy prizes for the winner of the next tournament in which all likelihood you won't win?

Do you lads actually play poker?

lemur option

hey man these are the terms we were given, and no of course they're not gonna be any better than what pokersoc was given. I said I'd look into college policy and I have. We're now, based on these limitations, trying to provide poker games for those who want to play. If you're not interested fine, don't play. Why do you have to be so negative about this?

look, myself and darwin are players not organisers, so I'm sorry if we're starting small, by holding smaller tournaments we're hoping to build up a group of regular players so if we do decide to grow to bigger tournaments we know that there will be players.

PS I just reread how I wrote the fourth rule. my bad. of course we wouldn't give only a third of the prize to a winner. it'd prob be 100e up front (being pretty much the max cash we're allowed to give) and then more in gift vouchers (unless you can suggest a better non-cash alternative). if there's an odd number left over it will be put into future pools. i.e we're not making a profit from games.

PPS yes I did get my terms mixed up I didn't mean sit and go there it's been a long day. Vaticon planning is starting to take it's toll.

tribulus

I'd have to agree with Theresalwaysone. If you get regular players from that set of rules then fair enough but they're so restrictive.

Point 4 is enough to make me not play it. You might think it will encourage regular players by giving them the chance to win the rest of their money but the nature of tournaments means that winning or even placing high enough to win a prize each week isn't very likely (depending on the numbers and structure but even still). And if I play a tournament I want all of the prizepool going to those who place.

Again I admire your commitment to this but it would be a sinking ship imo.

Theresalwaysone

pee-tee wrote: »

ever heard of playing for ****s and giggles?

Yeah, I have another name for it though, "Wasting time".

Theresalwaysone

lemur option wrote: »

hey man these are the terms we were given, and no of course they're not gonna be any better than what pokersoc was given. I said I'd look into college policy and I have. We're now, based on these limitations, trying to provide poker games for those who want to play. If you're not interested fine, don't play. Why do you have to be so negative about this?

look, myself and darwin are players not organisers, so I'm sorry if we're starting small, by holding smaller tournaments we're hoping to build up a group of regular players so if we do decide to grow to bigger tournaments we know that there will be players.

PS I just reread how I wrote the fourth rule. my bad. of course we wouldn't give only a third of the prize to a winner. it'd prob be 100e up front (being pretty much the max cash we're allowed to give) and then more in gift vouchers (unless you can suggest a better non-cash alternative). if there's an odd number left over it will be put into future pools. i.e we're not making a profit from games.

PPS yes I did get my terms mixed up I didn't mean sit and go there it's been a long day. Vaticon planning is starting to take it's toll.

I'm not being negative. Well Im trying not to be and Im sorry if I came across that way but the fact remains that poker is about money.

I will give you all the help with this that you need. I have no problem with that and I don't want you thinking Im out to see this fail because the one thing id love to see on campus is a return of a bit of poker.

Saying that, The terms are far too restrictive, the games arent worth a ****e. Its not your fault I know and I admire the effort but Butler is an old man who outlaws fun.

breadmonkey

pee-tee wrote: »

<snip>

Lol, bye bye.

Raphael

pee-tee's post removed, personal abuse is against the charter. This is a warning, next offence will be a ban.

pee-tee

Fair enough, I didnt expect it to stay there. Still, was worth it.

:rolleyes:

lemur option

thanks theresalwaysone. you probably think I'm being too positive but the thing is when I was first told that I was to organise this I was told that we weren't even allowed to have gift vouchers as prizes, so you see to be allowed to have prizes up to 100e it's given me a lot more room to play with. Richard even said that if we did require a bit more slack he would listen but he would need to see some regular interest and would have to be persuaded that we weren't gonna create a sudden rise in gambing addiction which would have the counseller's on his back. I don't know how he treated pokersoc last year but he seemed very welcome to the fact that the game was starting back up in the college.

We'll start small and see where it takes us.

Theresalwaysone

Age old argument is poker gambling or not? Butler is an ill informed idiot. But I rant about him enough.

Also, he is a snake in the grass. Be wary. lol.

Zounds

Right, I'll admit from the start that I don't play poker and I'm only reading this thread because of my involvement in GameSoc but I can't understand what the issue is.

You've been told you can play casual games for cash. That if there's a prize that would go over €100 the surplus has to be converted to vouchers (which if you get something like All4One are almost as good as cash) and that the society running it can't make a profit off it which is a given anyway.

What's the problem with this?

(Yes, I've ignored the no sit and go bit because I don't know what it is).

lemur option

Ok, it wasn't no sit and go, as I said before, that was a mix up on my part. I meant no cash games. i.e. you don't have €5 = 500 in chips and then buy as many chips as you want. I'm not interested in playing this type of game.

we'll be playing tournament poker. all entrance money goes into a prize pool. you pay €5 for entrace get a set amount of chips and play until there is only one player left with chips. this player gets the majority if not all the prize pool. 10% of players = number of prizes. cash prizes are less than or equal to €100. I doubt with €5 as the entrance we'll get over €100 in first prize so we'll probably be able to give all the prizes in cash.

So far we have about 5 people confirmed for the €5 tournament next thurs and a few for the beginners tourney. So that's only one table for each. any more interest please PM me.

Brimmy

I'll jump on this but wont be able to play next Thursday as I have plans.

Good to see poker back on campus again as I was always working last year when pokersoc had their games.

gerry87

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Strangely, he doesnt mind poker being played for SVdeP in a charity game.

What about gunning for a deal with butler to get say a regular €10+1 rebuy or freezeout game going, the 1 going to charity. On condition that there's no cap on prizepool. Possible?

Or you could just offer one/two table sit n go's. The players decide the buy in (prob 5/10/15). It would still be proper poker, the prizepool wouldn't be an issue and it might suit people who don't want to have to stay all evening.

If you do get something going, do everybody a favour and get some sort of felt and/or more suitable tables.

Theresalwaysone

It isnt as easy as setting up a game in the student centre and hoping it works. There is advertisement needed, A good player pool, decent "worth your while buy ins". Then there is the tables, chips, felt, clock for the tournament, Td's etc etc.

tbh, Butler despises everything to do with gambling on campus unless it helps his SVdeP so I wouldnt bother trying to talk to him, he will give you the same rhetoric he gave every other poker soc before.

Also, the reason pokersoc was disbanded is because the organisers never kept accounts which always did look dodgey to me but when In was playing then I never needed the transparency but as you get more into the game you want to know that 100% of the prizepool is paid out and where all the dough is going.

Also to the poster who said something about not understanding the issue. You obviously dont understand and thats cool but any one who plays poker and knows even a bit about the game will want cash as a prize not a voucher that restricts them.

But this has been done to death, Gamesoc heads PM me when the next gake is and I'll come down to give a bit of support and get the game going.

Bubs101

I'll probably play depending on how my essays are going.

As for Butler being against all gambling, I'm really curious as to how he managed to prevent all of the betfair markets to load but still lets you play those poker games on it

jimi_t

Bubs101 wrote: »

I'll probably play depending on how my essays are going.

As for Butler being against all gambling, I'm really curious as to how he managed to prevent all of the betfair markets to load but still lets you play those poker games on it

Proxy settings and port blocking in short... AFAIK you can't use the Betfair or PPP clients on-campus for the same reasons - hence why you see the hardcore heads in the library with their Vodafone 3G modems :cool:

Bubs101

But you can still use certain elements of betfair . Just seems strange

lemur option

for all those who didn't get the gamesoc newsletter.

Thursday

Poker tournaments
6pm Meeting Rooms 1 & 2 in the Student Centre. All experience levels welcome.

1) NL TH (No Limit Texas Holdem) tournament- €5 entry and €1 re-buys for the first half hour. All cash goes into prize pool. Prize- depends on prize pool.

2) Beginners Freeroll Tournament. Beginners only please. Free entry and experienced dealer available to teach the basic rules and to help you learn the game. The prize will be entry to a later pay-in tournament (worth €5).

hope to see some of you there.

gerry87

Saw a sign today looking for committee members for the poker society. Anyone know who the new management is? Are they looking for people for this year or next?

seraphimvc

lemur option wrote: »

for all those who didn't get the gamesoc newsletter.

Thursday

Poker tournaments
6pm Meeting Rooms 1 & 2 in the Student Centre. All experience levels welcome.

1) NL TH (No Limit Texas Holdem) tournament- €5 entry and €1 re-buys for the first half hour. All cash goes into prize pool. Prize- depends on prize pool.

2) Beginners Freeroll Tournament. Beginners only please. Free entry and experienced dealer available to teach the basic rules and to help you learn the game. The prize will be entry to a later pay-in tournament (worth €5).

hope to see some of you there.

is the game on this thurday?10th april?

lemur option

Yes the thursday refers to this thursday 10th april.

I have also heard that pokersoc recruitment posters have been put up. Anyone want to take credit for this? Makes my job a lot easier. "mike. Put in the gamesoc newletter that if anyone want's to play poker they should get in touch with pokersoc." woo best poker organiser ever.

lemur option

The first poker tourney is over and the results are in.

beginners tourney
- CARL BOYLE - 1 €5 entry to a future gamesoc poker event.

advanced tourney
- 1st- Dylan "darwin" knapp- €50
- 2nd- Jim Cooney - €12

Thanks to all who attended. we saw some very interesting poker including a pair of threes and a pair of fives battle for a 43,000 pot. hope everyone enjoyed. With pokersoc trying to recruit for next year we're not gonna be in charge of poker so sometime in the next two weeks we'll hopefully run another tourney so as to give carl a chance to claim his prize.