question on restricted ?

the hunter

hi lads
someone asked me about the upcoming restricted list
if he gets his semi plugged to 3 shots will he still have to
get a restricted license ???

IRLConor

the hunter wrote: »

hi lads
someone asked me about the upcoming restricted list
if he gets his semi plugged to 3 shots will he still have to
get a restricted license ???

That's not clear yet, AFAIK. It was one of the questions sent to the DoJ by DeVore.

the hunter

thanks irl

clivej

I hope not as I'm just waiting on my license for a Mossburg Maverick 88 pump action shotgun. It takes 6 cartridges, 5 in the mag. But the way I read it is that the mag must be "Modified or Amended" to only allow the gun to only take 3 cartridges, 2 in the mag. This will be the plug, long piece of dowel timber in the mag. Nowhere does it state that the "Modified or Amended" bit must be a permanent modification to the gun.

the hunter

thats the way i read it too ... unplugged restricted .. plugged unrestricted .. will they be happy enough with a home made plug or will the plug have to be permanent ????

bunny shooter

Plug comes with all new mossbegs AFAIK

José Alaninho

So do most semis and pumps.

Amazing isn't it: gun is restricted, ten seconds later it isn't, but can become restricted again at any time in under the said ten seconds. :rolleyes:

the hunter

José Alaninho wrote: »

So do most semis and pumps.

Amazing isn't it: gun is restricted, ten seconds later it isn't, but can become restricted again at any time in under the said ten seconds. :rolleyes:

yeah but it these little loopholes that could loose you your license and firearm ?? all these little questions will have to be sorted before they bring the new rules in ...

johngalway

I'd reason to ask about this in my local gunshop, owner says that a plug such as a dowel will siffice. Already made mine and to be honest I've stopped worrying. Anyone remember the much feared .223 restrictions

Don't believe it until it happens, enjoy your shooting

Mellor

I'm not sure if i should post this, info verses ammo,

I'm not too sure on the comments above, re switching between restricted and not.
I'm pretty sure that modifying a pump or semi will be ok, as in a plug.
But im not sure on removable plug issue,
its not strictly true that its not mentioned anywere. If I remember correctly, the EU publication/document that deals with firearm class (A, B, C, D) mentions thew issue. This is from memory so exact wording may be off, but in general it says that the class of a pump or semi is partly determined by the number of rounds it can hold. It says that any plugginh must be fixed/permanent.
Now I know that this doc is not directly related to the restricted list, but alot of the restricted list was lifted from here and the doc was also refered to in a recent correspondance with the DoJ
food for thought

Trojan911

Mellor wrote: »

I'm not sure if i should post this, info verses ammo,

I'm not too sure on the comments above, re switching between restricted and not.
I'm pretty sure that modifying a pump or semi will be ok, as in a plug.
But im not sure on removable plug issue,
its not strictly true that its not mentioned anywere. If I remember correctly, the EU publication/document that deals with firearm class (A, B, C, D) mentions thew issue. This is from memory so exact wording may be off, but in general it says that the class of a pump or semi is partly determined by the number of rounds it can hold. It says that any plugginh must be fixed/permanent.
Now I know that this doc is not directly related to the restricted list, but alot of the restricted list was lifted from here and the doc was also refered to in a recent correspondance with the DoJ
food for thought

So in theory, you don't have a clue then....

IRLConor

Mellor wrote: »

If I remember correctly, the EU publication/document that deals with firearm class (A, B, C, D) mentions thew issue. This is from memory so exact wording may be off, but in general it says that the class of a pump or semi is partly determined by the number of rounds it can hold. It says that any plugginh must be fixed/permanent.
Now I know that this doc is not directly related to the restricted list, but alot of the restricted list was lifted from here and the doc was also refered to in a recent correspondance with the DoJ

food for thought

For reference, the relevant EU directive that Mellor is talking about is Council Directive 91/477/EEC of 18 June 1991 on control of the acquisition and possession of weapons. The bit defining the classes of firearm is as follows:

Category A - Prohibited firearms

1. Explosive military missiles and launchers.
2. Automatic firearms.
3. Firearms disguised as other objects.
4. Ammunition with penetrating, explosive or incendiary projectiles, and the projectiles for such ammunition.
5. Pistol and revolver ammunition with expanding projectiles and the projectiles for such ammunition, except in the case of weapons for hunting or for target shooting, for persons entitled to use them.

Category B - Firearms subject to authorization

1. Semi-automatic or repeating short firearms.
2. Single-shot short firearms with centre-fire percussion.
3. Single-shot short firearms with rimfire percussion whose overall length is less than 28 cm.
4. Semi-automatic long firearms whose magazine and chamber can together hold more than three rounds.
5. Semi-automatic long firearms whose magazine and chamber cannot together hold more than three rounds, where the loading device is removable or where it is not certain that the weapon cannot be converted, with ordinary tools, into a weapon whose magazine and chamber can together hold more than three rounds.
6. Repeating and semi-automatic long firearms with smooth-bore barrels not exceeding 60 cm in length.
7. Semi-automatic firearms for civilian use which resemble weapons with automatic mechanisms.

Category C - Firearms subject to declaration

1. Repeating long firearms other than those listed in category B, point 6.
2. Long firearms with single-shot rifled barrels.
3. Semi-automatic long firearms other than those in category B, points 4 to 7.
4. Single-shot short firearms with rimfire percussion whose overall length is not less than 28 cm.

Category D - Other firearms

1. Single-shot long firearms with smooth-bore barrels.

The bit Mellor was probably thinking about was in B, 5:

where it is not certain that the weapon cannot be converted, with ordinary tools, into a weapon whose magazine and chamber can together hold more than three rounds

I have no idea how the Gardai/DoJ will treat this issue though. They might go the way of trying to follow the spirit of the EU directive or they might see it as equivalent to a magazine for a rifle (i.e. magazines are easily changeable to render a firearm restricted).

Bananaman

Don't bother with plugs and apply for a restricted license.

Mellor

Trojan911 wrote: »

So in theory, you don't have a clue then....

Thats hardly helpful, I never said I knew,
I'm being being careful based on precedent

IRLConor wrote:

The bit Mellor was probably thinking about was in B, 5:

Thanks for finding that link.
And yeah it was part B,4 and B,5
Basically if it not certain that it can't be converted then it is in the same class as a firearm with over three

I have no idea how the Gardai/DoJ will treat this issue though. They might go the way of trying to follow the spirit of the EU directive or they might see it as equivalent to a magazine for a rifle (i.e. magazines are easily changeable to render a firearm restricted).

In honest, I think they will treat it the same as a mag. It would be silly not to. But I was pointing this out as its the only similar issue I know of.

dimebag249

Bananaman wrote: »

Don't bother with plugs and apply for a restricted license.

Yeah, there's a significant number of people with automatics. If every one of them applies for a restricted licence it might put pressure on the guards to issue licences, and help set precedence for granting restricted licences. If most people just install plugs and a dozen people apply tor restricted licences, well it's very easy to refuse a handful of people, and no one will ever get a licence for a proper:D shotgun.

Grizzly 45

Exactly,go for the restricted liscense for the above mentioned reasons,and the only time you would need the mag restricted is if you were game hunting.3 min job to pop in the dowel.

It wasn't me!

Let's not forget the rather large extra cost of the restricted licence fees. Would certainly be prohibitive to most I should think.

Grizzly 45

Thought that had been bashed out .That firearms are now 66 lids for the three years???Irrespective of restricted or not??No doubt in the future when some bloated politicans need a pay rise,that will increase.

dimebag249

It wasn't me! wrote: »

Let's not forget the rather large extra cost of the restricted licence fees. Would certainly be prohibitive to most I should think.

AFAIK there's no price difference, as Grizzly said. Therefore there's no reason not to apply for a restricted licence. If it gets refused, bung in the plug and apply again for unrestricted.

It wasn't me!

I seem to remember some horrific cost, 400-odd quid or something, or was that only for dealers? Legal jargon can get a bit headwrecking...

rrpc

It wasn't me! wrote: »

I seem to remember some horrific cost, 400-odd quid or something, or was that only for dealers? Legal jargon can get a bit headwrecking...

No, that was for a restricted dealers licence: €405 AFAIR.

It wasn't me!

Ah, thanks for clearing that up so.

Saddlebags

Anyone who has anything that is deemed restricted should apply for a restricted licence. If we fearfully give up everything now, where does that leave us in the future?