New expected car price list July 08

E92

Where are people getting these releases? I seem to have none of them:D:(!

It would be greatly appreciated if those in the know could tell us more, either by PM or a link to where I might find it, or else would people be so kind as to upload these official prices on this thread?

E92

sk8board wrote: »

From a value-motoring point of view, Mazda could have their timing right with the brand new Mazda 6 2.0D SE model being reduced to 29.5k (-€3,800). Looks and drives fantastic too.

Better still would be the entry level model, €27,800 for that roughly.

Citroen's C5 1.6 HDi is due to fall by €2,100 in July bringing to €28k dead.

E92

Phibsboro wrote: »

If anyone has any info on Fiat's pricelist for July I'd really appreciate a PM.

Thanks,
C

No change to the 500 and Punto. The Punto I'm definite, because Fiat passed on some but not all of the saving on in January and said that that would be the July price, and I'm reliably informed that the 500 was launched with "July prices" back in February(yeah right is what I'm thinking).

Others I don't know about.

return guide

E92 wrote: »

Where are people getting these releases? I seem to have none of them:D:(!

It would be greatly appreciated if those in the know could tell us more, either by PM or a link to where I might find it, or else would people be so kind as to upload these official prices on this thread?

I have asked the dealers i have visited, most will tell but only what they "expect".

But agreed there people here in the trade that are staying mum

Rob C

Good man E92, cheers for that!

God it's seriously depressing for the high end, powerful motors. Look at the Porsche section....

Look at the M3 as well

E92

@ AudiChris - where's our official July pricelist for Audi(and the rest of the VAG range while we're at it)?

You know, the one you promised you'd have "within 2 weeks" more than 2 weeks ago:D?

-Chris-

The figures you have on your spreadsheet are near as damnit afaik - all savings are being passed on and there's no playing with specs.

I think the two open loops are:
1) Optional extras pricing - the A4 currently straddles 4 or 5 CO2 bands, do we get 4 or 5 metallic paint prices? Do we have a different metallic price for an A5 1.8T manual than an A5 1.8T auto?
2) What will the effect of all the new engines you've posted about be? Is there a point in publishing and promoting a post-July price list when you know several of the prices are likely to change significantly in the next little while?

That being said, you're only waiting to see this new list out of curiosity. My customers are waiting for the list because they think they might buy a new Audi.

I, on the other hand, am getting married this year and was also planning to apply for a mortgage. The inability of my customers to place orders in a timely fashion is hurting my livelihood. I think the delay in releasing pricing will cause a lot of people to say "it's mid-May, by the time my car is delivered it'll be August, and that's if I place my order today! I think I'll just wait and order for January...".
If that happens (and I think it's started) it's going to dramatically affect Audi's market share and cost a number of people their jobs.

Bring on the pricelist!

E92

Thanks for that AudiChris.

Of course I've no interest in buying a new Audi.... I wouldn't throw away money on any new car even if I could afford it.... there'll be so much value to be had out there in the second hand market come July when people start trading in and even if that didn't happen I resent the idea of enriching the Government courtesy of VRT. In that sense telling me makes no difference cause you know and I know that I'm unlikely to be an Audi customer in the future(though I genuinely am overwhelmed by the S5, and the R8 V10 and in particular the return of the 5 pot Audi in the form of the "RSTT" certainly arouses more interest in the brand for me, and who knows maybe I will buy an RSTT when they're a lot cheaper in years to come:p? that's if the Government hasn't killed all the fun with speed cameras of course:() but at the end of the day if I know I'd certainly tell anyone who is interested in a new Audi/rival car, and I'd stick it into my sig as a link like I did for BMW/MINI.

But you pretty much hit the nail on the head with what you said about people humming and hawing about a new car.

I think you're dead right about it. (I don't want to be rubbing more salt into the wounds but I imagine that's why BMW put out their official July list at the start April on purpose, so that they'd get people in then to get the new cars out in July, I know how these things work timing wise between ordering a new car especially if it's not one in stock and has to be built specially at the factory)

BMW have different prices for the options depending on what VRT band the car is in anyway. I presume Audi will do likewise.

Any word on the 2.0 TDI 170 or the 2.0 TFSI 180/211 A5?

Now that Audi have technical updates for want of a better expression whereby the engines have been tweaked for lower CO2 but are otherwise identical to the higher CO2 versions, this is going to be a nightmare for dealers who will have the less desirable higher polluting vehicles.

How are the dealers going to work that one, and more importantly, how will they know which one is which?

It's not just Audi that have this problem though. Volvo's new S80 2.0D is quoted as doing 157 g/km for CO2 here, but 151 g/km elsewhere in Europe.

So that's a whole VRT and road tax band of a difference.

Interesting times ahead:)!

Phibsboro

E92 wrote: »

No change to the 500 and Punto. The Punto I'm definite, because Fiat passed on some but not all of the saving on in January and said that that would be the July price, and I'm reliably informed that the 500 was launched with "July prices" back in February(yeah right is what I'm thinking).

Others I don't know about.

Thats exactly what i'm hearing so i'm going to do a deal this week. Got an xtra grand against my 05 mini than first offer and i'm happy nuff with that. Reality is that if that i sold private for the first time in my life i'd make more but i'm not that kind of punter. I want to walk in with one car, walk out with another... wasn't quite that simple this time but almost. And I'm mad about the 500 (and getting slagged something fierce about it even before i've got it, but such is life )

c

GoneShootin

R.O.R wrote: »

Opel dealers have their pricing too now. I presume it's on general release, i've a full copy.

Not in Cork anyway. Two seperate dealers wouldn't/couldn't provide prices.

-Chris-

E92 wrote: »

Thanks for that AudiChris.

Of course I've no interest in buying a new Audi.... I wouldn't throw away money on any new car even if I could afford it.... there'll be so much value to be had out there in the second hand market come July

The value is on it's way - it's slowly dawning on people selling their cars (private or dealer) that if prices aren't dropped, the car won't sell. How many people do you know who've had their car on carzone for weeks or months without a single phonecall. If you're selling your car at the moment, you have to price it at a level where the buyer would be crazy NOT to buy it.

E92 wrote: »

In that sense telling me makes no difference cause you know and I know that I'm unlikely to be an Audi customer in the future

Yeah, I know you'd be hard to win over alright!:D

E92 wrote: »

But you pretty much hit the nail on the head with what you said about people humming and hawing about a new car.

For a new car salesman, that's the biggest threat at the moment. There's a fairly small window of opportunity left before '09 is looming. Even if you printed the pricelist tomorrow, the orders won't start rolling for a week or two - people need time to shop around and digest the new info.

E92 wrote: »

I think you're dead right about it. (I don't want to be rubbing more salt into the wounds but I imagine that's why BMW put out their official July list at the start April on purpose, so that they'd get people in then to get the new cars out in July, I know how these things work timing wise between ordering a new car especially if it's not one in stock and has to be built specially at the factory)

BMW got it bang on the button imho. I have customers who are thinking of buying BMW over Audi at the moment not because they prefer BMW, but because they can actually buy a BMW from a price and spec list.
A lot of people don't like the hazyness of provisional pricelists and don't trust the salesperson to give them unbiased advice.

E92 wrote: »

BMW have different prices for the options depending on what VRT band the car is in anyway. I presume Audi will do likewise.

I wasn't aware of that, that must be a nightmare for them (and their customers)!

E92 wrote: »

Any word on the 2.0 TDI 170 or the 2.0 TFSI 180/211 A5?

TDi is Sept afaik, not sure about the 2.0T - word late last year was that it wasn't available until Nov '08. I'm not sure if that's changed.

E92 wrote: »

Now that Audi have technical updates for want of a better expression whereby the engines have been tweaked for lower CO2 but are otherwise identical to the higher CO2 versions, this is going to be a nightmare for dealers who will have the less desirable higher polluting vehicles.

How are the dealers going to work that one, and more importantly, how will they know which one is which?

Yep, I'd say there's a lot of diesel cars ordered for stock so that in July people can buy from stock rather than waiting for a 3 month delivery time. I don't know what's going to happen to that overlap of cars. That's between the dealers and distributor I guess - the customers won't pay for it.

E92 wrote: »

It's not just Audi that have this problem though. Volvo's new S80 2.0D is quoted as doing 157 g/km for CO2 here, but 151 g/km elsewhere in Europe.

So that's a whole VRT and road tax band of a difference.

I'm not sure how that's even possible, surely the COC that's produced by the distrubutor works Europe wide. What's the difference between a German S80 and and Irish one? Could it be a typo?

E92 wrote: »

Interesting times ahead:)!

Hell yeah!

E92

AudiChris wrote: »

The value is on it's way - it's slowly dawning on people selling their cars (private or dealer) that if prices aren't dropped, the car won't sell. How many people do you know who've had their car on carzone for weeks or months without a single phonecall. If you're selling your car at the moment, you have to price it at a level where the buyer would be crazy NOT to buy it.

This is one of the consequences of people importing by the bucketload from the UK, where there is better value to be had and often cars that are in much better nick(the Brits are much more into their cars than we are, and don't see them as a device for moving people from A to B like most Irish buyers do), with bigger/more powerful engines and of much higher spec.

AudiChris wrote: »

Yeah, I know you'd be hard to win over alright!:D

I'm always open to persuasion. That's what you're here for:D! There are models in BMWs range that I regard as an insult to the brand(1 series, X3, X5, X6) and most of them are hideous to look at(though the X6 looks lovely, and the 1 series Coupé and Cabrio are showing a return to form, so the days of ugly BMWs are starting to disappear and not before time), and likewise there are models in the Audi range that very much interest me like the R8(but obviously not the diesel one), especially the twin turbo V10:D, and of course the RSTT should be fantastic!

AudiChris wrote: »

For a new car salesman, that's the biggest threat at the moment. There's a fairly small window of opportunity left before '09 is looming. Even if you printed the pricelist tomorrow, the orders won't start rolling for a week or two - people need time to shop around and digest the new info.

+1

AudiChris wrote: »

BMW got it bang on the button imho. I have customers who are thinking of buying BMW over Audi at the moment not because they prefer BMW, but because they can actually buy a BMW from a price and spec list.
A lot of people don't like the hazyness of provisional pricelists and don't trust the salesperson to give them unbiased advice.

Well provisional pricing is just that. Official on the other hand means that's what it's gonna be. +1 about BMW though. As I say that must be the logic behind putting the word out there nearly a month and a half ago. Of course some people will wait till next year, but that affects all brands, not just BMW.

AudiChris wrote: »

I wasn't aware of that, that must be a nightmare for them (and their customers)!

Indeed it must be, I'm glad I don't sell them:p!

AudiChris wrote: »

TDi is Sept afaik, not sure about the 2.0T - word late last year was that it wasn't available until Nov '08. I'm not sure if that's changed.

Thanks for that. When will we see the engine updates for the A4? I understand that the TDI 120 will be here next month, will the 2.0 TFSIs be here then?

AudiChris wrote: »

Yep, I'd say there's a lot of diesel cars ordered for stock so that in July people can buy from stock rather than waiting for a 3 month delivery time. I don't know what's going to happen to that overlap of cars. That's between the dealers and distributor I guess - the customers won't pay for it.

Oh but they will in the form of higher road tax and hence lower desirability in the used car market;)!

AudiChris wrote: »

I'm not sure how that's even possible, surely the COC that's produced by the distrubutor works Europe wide. What's the difference between a German S80 and and Irish one? Could it be a typo?

Probably the same things as what's happening with the A4 2.0 TDIs, which will be dropping down to 16% VRT shortly, as the 143 is going down to 139 g/km from 144 g/km and the 170 will do 140 g/km, while the 120 does 134.

R.O.R

GoneShootin wrote: »

Not in Cork anyway. Two seperate dealers wouldn't/couldn't provide prices.

They mustn't be on general relase yet then as my list came from our Opel dealer in Cork.

copacetic

AudiChris wrote: »

The figures you have on your spreadsheet are near as damnit afaik - all savings are being passed on and there's no playing with specs.

I think the two open loops are:
1) Optional extras pricing - the A4 currently straddles 4 or 5 CO2 bands, do we get 4 or 5 metallic paint prices? Do we have a different metallic price for an A5 1.8T manual than an A5 1.8T auto?
2) What will the effect of all the new engines you've posted about be? Is there a point in publishing and promoting a post-July price list when you know several of the prices are likely to change significantly in the next little while?

That being said, you're only waiting to see this new list out of curiosity. My customers are waiting for the list because they think they might buy a new Audi.

I, on the other hand, am getting married this year and was also planning to apply for a mortgage. The inability of my customers to place orders in a timely fashion is hurting my livelihood. I think the delay in releasing pricing will cause a lot of people to say "it's mid-May, by the time my car is delivered it'll be August, and that's if I place my order today! I think I'll just wait and order for January...".
If that happens (and I think it's started) it's going to dramatically affect Audi's market share and cost a number of people their jobs.

Bring on the pricelist!

well said chris, I expressed my frustration with my dealer again at the weekend. They had no answer really, they mentioned that the TT TDI and new A3 facelift prices with the CR diesels may be delaying the overall list?

-Chris-

copacetic wrote: »

well said chris, I expressed my frustration with my dealer again at the weekend. They had no answer really, they mentioned that the TT TDI and new A3 facelift prices with the CR diesels may be delaying the overall list?

I'd expect your dealer is right - with the bits you've mentioned PLUS the engine changes E92 has highlighted in his threads they may not want to release a price list only to supercede it a month later - go for a big bang approach with the price list.

copacetic

Possibly, I was pretty unimpressed with the spiel I got about Audi keeping it's exclusivity much more when they become more expensive than bmw in July. The dealer appears to be under the impression that Audi are up there with Mercedes now in image.

alpina

+1
On a recent day out to physically view some models was given exactly this impression

spuddy

E92 wrote: »

No change to the 500 and Punto. The Punto I'm definite, because Fiat passed on some but not all of the saving on in January and said that that would be the July price, and I'm reliably informed that the 500 was launched with "July prices" back in February(yeah right is what I'm thinking).

Others I don't know about.

E92 is right on the money there. The 500 couldn't have been launched with July prices, as the figures just don't add up.

Take the basic Fiat 500, the 1.2 POP (CO2 119g/km). That means the current price of €13995 includes VRT at 14%.

Let's do a little comparison...

IRELAND
If said price is at July rates:
€13995 - Ireland price
-€1959 - VRT 14%
-€2088 - VAT 21%
€9948 - PRE TAX IRELAND PRICE

If said price is at current rates:
€13995 - Ireland Price
-€3149 - VRT 22.5%
-€1882 - VAT 21%
€8964 - PRE TAX IRELAND PRICE

UK
€9950 - UK Price (£7905 @ 1 EUR = 0.794440 GBP)
-€1482 - VAT 17.5%
€8468 - PRE TAX UK PRICE

Germany
€10500 - Germany Price
-€1676 - VAT 19%
€8824 - PRE TAX GERMAN PRICE

France
€10200 - France Price (€10900-€700 Government Green Bonus)
-€1672 - VAT 19.6%
€8528 - PRE TAX FRENCH PRICE

As is clear from the above, according a 22.5% VRT rate, our pre tax price is in line with the rest of Europe.

The correct price in Ireland (incl VAT & VRT), post July 1st, for the said car will be €12611. If you hear otherwise, I'd like to see a clear explanation why.

-Chris-

copacetic wrote: »

Possibly, I was pretty unimpressed with the spiel I got about Audi keeping it's exclusivity much more when they become more expensive than bmw in July. The dealer appears to be under the impression that Audi are up there with Mercedes now in image.

alpina wrote: »

+1
On a recent day out to physically view some models was given exactly this impression

Well, you gotta ask yourself what you'd say if you were the salesperson...

People ask me all the time, "why should I buy an A3, isn't it just an expensive Golf?". If I was a VW salesperson I'd say that you're getting Audi quality for less, there are parts shared, same percentage residuals, etc. etc.
I'm an Audi guy however so I concentrate on the cachet of the image, the better quality materials, fit & finish.

If the house is too small, it's "cozy". If it's run down, it's a "handyman's dream".

Most people say Audi, BMW and Merc in the same breath nowadays.
It stands to reason that if BMWs become too common on the roads because they're much cheaper, then you can conversely say that Audi and Merc will be more exclusive.
I already have LOADS of people coming to me and saying that they want an A5 because they want something like a 3-Series Coupe but there's just too many of them on the road.

You may not like Audi or think that it's in the same league as the other German brands, but many people do and there's enough of them to make Audi neck-and-neck with Mercedes and catching up hard on BMW in Ireland.

Don't mean to hijack the thread, just felt that needed defending.

E92

You can't please everyone, but the exclusivity of the A5 has a lot to do with the fact it's a brand new car and the currently limited choice of engines as much as anything else(though there is a 2.0 TDI on the way).

Personally, I don't see what the big deal is about whether a car is exclusive or everyone has one. If it's a good car, then that should be the end of the matter. My idea of a good car is often different to other people, but that only means I am no more wrong than they are right.

-Chris-

E92 wrote: »

Personally, I don't see what the big deal is about whether a car is exclusive or everyone has one. If it's a good car, then that should be the end of the matter.

I'd agree with that, a good car is a good car no matter how many people own one!

but...

I think if you look at the kind of person who buys a luxury car/prestige brand, most of them are looking for something that not everyone else has.
They want others to know that they're "in the know", that they know what the latest/greatest car is. They probably also want others to know that they can afford an expensive car - that they are successful.

That's why as a salesperson you may remind the client that they're buying something not everyone else has or something not everyone else can afford.
I think the R8 is an amazing car and as such it has a waiting list, but I guarantee you that if that waiting list disappears and Audi builds them to demand that they'll go the way of the NSX - brilliant but "not a real supercar". If the waiting list remains and the image is cultivated (through posters on adolescent boys' walls, rather than crass product placement in superhero movies) they'll retain their cachet and stay cool.

The death-knell of a luxury brand is over-exposure - look at the fashion brands like Louis Vuitton etc. Or the white Bentleys of the rapper bling brigade - it's very easy to turn a brand from class to crass.

Buying a car (or any product) contains a certain amount of "how cool does this make me look", you can't deny that.
As soon as a brand like BMW has a car that outsells the Mondeo, as soon as Mercedes waters it's brand down by creating too many niches and overextending themselves, as soon as Audi and VW over-rationalise and start sharing from the same interior trim parts bin, then that's where the slippery slope begins.

</rant & thread hijack, seriously!>

E92

Undoubtedly a car with a limited production cycle and a healthy waiting list makes a car more desirable.

But it certainyl does not make a car better.

And if as you say AudiChris "a salesman(none of the PC bullsh!t please:D) may remind the client that they're buying something not everyone else has or something not everyone else can afford", then why do 80+% of A5 buyers buy the 1.8T, the cheapest model?

Indeed why do people always buy the cheapest version of any car in this country?

If you do indeed want to buy "something not everyone else has or something not everyone else can afford" and you have your sights set on an A5/3 series etc, then why don't people go and buy say the 3.0 TDI quattro A5 or the 3.2 FSI, or better still the S5?

Truth is that if Audi wanted the A5 to be an exclusive product, then they would start by ditching the 4 cylinder engines and only offer us the V6 models, which would guarantee exclusivity in this country straight away;)!

copacetic

AudiChris wrote: »

Well, you gotta ask yourself what you'd say if you were the salesperson...

People ask me all the time, "why should I buy an A3, isn't it just an expensive Golf?". If I was a VW salesperson I'd say that you're getting Audi quality for less, there are parts shared, same percentage residuals, etc. etc.
I'm an Audi guy however so I concentrate on the cachet of the image, the better quality materials, fit & finish.

If the house is too small, it's "cozy". If it's run down, it's a "handyman's dream".

Most people say Audi, BMW and Merc in the same breath nowadays.
It stands to reason that if BMWs become too common on the roads because they're much cheaper, then you can conversely say that Audi and Merc will be more exclusive.
I already have LOADS of people coming to me and saying that they want an A5 because they want something like a 3-Series Coupe but there's just too many of them on the road.

You may not like Audi or think that it's in the same league as the other German brands, but many people do and there's enough of them to make Audi neck-and-neck with Mercedes and catching up hard on BMW in Ireland.

Don't mean to hijack the thread, just felt that needed defending.

I see what you are saying Chris, and I bought the audi over the Vw for the reasons you state. However they are nearly all based on the same platforms as the VW equivalent (As people on here never tire of saying). Pushing themselves up there with rear wheel driver Merc and BMW cars isn't on imo. Trying to get me to pay more for a car based on a much cheaper platform isn't going to happen. Don't piss on my leg and tell me it is raining is the expression that comes to mind!

-Chris-

.

E92

copacetic wrote: »

I see what you are saying Chris, and I bought the audi over the Vw for the reasons you state. However they are nearly all based on the same platforms as the VW equivalent (As people on here never tire of saying). Pushing themselves up there with rear wheel driver Merc and BMW cars isn't on imo. Trying to get me to pay more for a car based on a much cheaper platform isn't going to happen. Don't piss on my leg and tell me it is raining is the expression that comes to mind!

+1.

FWD is considerably cheaper than RWD to make. In fairness these days the A4 uses the MLP platform rather than the PQ46 platform forund in the Passat.

But could someone tell me what is the point in a longitudinal engine with FWD? Longitudinal engine with RWD makes sense cause it's the only way you can lay out an engine in a RWD car. But the much more space efficient transverse layout works in FWD, so why not use that?

Don't give me the spiel about "well you can put the engine behind the axle and thereby improve weight distribution" because if one really is as bothered about it as that then you would have used RWD in the first place.

RedorDead

July prices have been loaded onto www.volkswagen.ie

You have to go in and build a car to find them though, not very user friendly.

Also, you cant make out whether they have gone up or come down?

169

2.0 TDI 140bhp 3dr is down to €28,470, was between €32 and €32.5 on cc VRT system

E92

Having checked a couple of different VW models, I can safely say that VW have followed BMW/MINI in passing on the VRT savings available to the consumer, which is good news for buyers.

Fair play to VW for being the third manufacturer to do so and giving us our July prices.

I therefore presume we'll see what Audi, Seat and Skoda are doing soon, and I'd be 99% certain that they'll also be passing on the VRT savings too.

Zube

spuddy wrote: »

The correct price in Ireland (incl VAT & VRT), post July 1st, for the said car will be €12611.

Especially since Mini, the car the 500 is aimed at, have already announced they will pass on VRT savings to customers. The Mini One drops €1500 to
€20346.The 500 1.4 Sport doesn't benefit as much from the new rules, but it should drop €500 or so from €18000 to €17500. The little 1.3 diesel will drop right down to the lowest CO2 bracket, and should be another€1000 cheaper.

return guide

Dingding has posted the Lexus price list for july 6k off an IS,
(sorry cont know how to do the link thing)