Doctor Who Se 4 x 01 Partners in Crime(could be spoilers!)

daithi_student

Jack B. Badd, we're act more on the same page than i thought! i agree that there are episodes with writing that does match the up to the overall standard of the show, "daleks in manhatten" springs to mind... but i must say i've enjoyed most of RTDs episodes i mean "doomsday" was excellent!

However the point i was originally making was that this series should not be judged on peoples preconceptions of Catherine Tate! who i think is proving to be quite a good actress!

p.s you do make a very interesting point about how the budjet effects the series!:D

daithi_student

Stark wrote: »

I must remember to check who wrote the episode in future and not bother watching any RTD episodes.

So you wont be watching the series finale then?

Stark

I might ask to see what people thought of it. I enjoyed the S1 and S2 finales but the S3 finale was absolute ****e. It seems to me that RTD has grown lazy with his writing. His older episodes were fun and witty, whereas the newer ones seem to be the produce of a "running, explosions, sonic screwdriver and random aliens" automatic script generator. It reminds me of South Park's critique of Family Guy with the manatees and the idea balls.

pixelburp

Stark wrote: »

Season 1: Top notch entertainment.
Season 2: Lacked some of the finesse of Season 1 but still highly entertaining.
Season 3: Rubbish barring the 3 excellent episodes by Cornell and Moffat.

Funny, I would be the opposite of that; much of Season1 I thought was rubbish; "Rose", "The Long Game", "Bad Wolf" - the biggest stinkers for me; apart from Moffat's double header I didn't enjoy the first series at all. In fact, looking back on my reaction after "Rose", it was a mixture of bafflement and sheer disappointment.

Season two was good, had some great eps, but the ending was a bit pat. The third I thought was the darkest, the most adult. The "Human Nature" stories were easily on par with anything the series, old and new, ever produced. And the concluding trilogy of episodes were drama on toast. It was also the season that got a few people I know into Doctor Who with it's more compelling stories.

Bet you'll still watch Season4 though

Stark

pixelburp wrote:

The "Human Nature" stories were easily on par with anything the series, old and new, ever produced.

Well yes, most people including myself would classify the "Human Nature" stories as the saving grace of Season 3, along with "Blink". Had those episodes not come along when they did, I wouldn't have bothered with the rest of the season. I know a few people who dropped out before that point. I thought the finale was more pantomine on toast than drama on toast.

daithi_student

Stark wrote: »

"running, explosions, sonic screwdriver and random aliens"

Don't know about anyone else but i think thats quite a good recipe to kick off the series! action action action!!! you couldn't start the series with one of moffats episodes even though they're normally brilliant! i think RTDs episodes are at the same high standards as ever!

Jack B. Badd

Stark wrote: »

...Soniccing...Sonic screwoff...Soniccing. Running soniccing.

I have to say that I lol'd when I saw the Doctor use his sonic screwdriver not only to open the office windows from the outside but also needlessly from the inside in one case where he could have just flicked the catch. That bloody screwdriver and associated technobabble have become total overkill and this episode had to be the worst - it's falling into the same trap that ST: Voyager did.

I don't mind Catherine Tate in this tbh, she's a definite improvement on Martha. I found myself liking Rose on my second watching of the first two seasons (after I found out she "died") but an attempt to bring her back is pretty annoying, it just gives the impression of a lack of a decent story arc.

daithi_student

Jack B. Badd wrote: »

she's a definite improvement on Martha.

I liked Martha! i fact the only companion who i haven't liked was Astrid Peth (if shes counted as a companion!)

pixelburp

Stark wrote: »

Well yes, most people including myself would classify the "Human Nature" stories as the saving grace of Season 3, along with "Blink". Had those episodes not come along when they did, I wouldn't have bothered with the rest of the season. I know a few people who dropped out before that point. I thought the finale was more pantomine on toast than drama on toast.

But hasn't Who always played things a little bit more OTT than most? I mean it's not like RTD is playing fast and loose with some previous show that was all dark, brooding and intense. Exise the Hinchcliffe era, which most consider the "golden" era of the classic series (in that it was the most dark, brooding and intense), and around and after that point was a fairly OTT show.

Show me how the finale of series 3 was any less pantomine than, say "The Claws of Axos" (I pick it because it highlighted how the early 70s show was totally off the charts with goofiness), or any of the late Tom Baker stories, or anything from the moment Peter Davison left, and I'll accept it. But I think there's a lot of preciousness about what Who "is".

popebenny16

I think there's way too much sonic screwdriving myself - but they are a big seller in the shops so it's not going to end soon - there's way too much running around, but it was ever thus, and yes, there is too much lazy dialogue and plotting.

I personally think that the root of it all is RTD. It's the Eddie O'Sullivan thing - no matter how energised and motivated he says he is, it is clear that, four years into it, his leadership is becoming jaded. He got his jollies with Kylie, I'm just waiting for Abba to turn up this year.

As pointed out above, this is nothing new, a lot of last years stories were not that great, and as head man and script editor he has to bear that. The series finale last year was a grood example. As I said at the time, never mind taking an established character and simply re-write his entire motiviation and history just so you can play whats in the car CD player (here come the ****ing drums indeed)..... to sort it out by pressing the reset button actually almost annoyed me. 13 weeks of building up, not forgetting the other previous Master/Saxon references, and for THAT?

As for saying that otjer shows were equally as bad, yes, true, Tom Baker spent much of his last two years taking the mick IMO, but it wasnt the show it was then that it is now. Back then it was a staple, like the two ronnies, allo allo, it was just there. Now, it is anticipated, and it is expected to be the flagship of BBC1's Saturday night schedule.

For such a show you should expect every story to be good, and with only 13 in a run, you cant waste the first one on fluff. Granted, it is still officially childrens TV, I had wondered why it was a 7pm show last year, now its 6.20..... but as blink showed last year, it is possible to bridge the gap.

God damn it, even the SJA can do it.....

Next week - Rome. Week after Ood. Lazy lazy lazy.

pixelburp

I'm actually looking forward to the Ood episode - it was an untouched element in series of why the Ood were both mind controlled by humans & a herd race to begin with.

Rev Hellfire

I think people are expecting too much from Doctor Who, I know I was.
Lets face it, this is a kids program and when taken at face value the ropey 'special' effects and ropey dialogue are fine.

My 6 year old loved the aliens in this weeks episode, if you're looking for something intellectual or profound then I'm afraid you're looking at the wrong show.

Nevyn

It was ment to be a bit of fun, not serious scifi.
It was a deligth to see Bernard Cribbins back.

Ginny

I hated it.
Catherine Tate sounded like her gran character for half of the episode, they ran for a quater of it and sonic-ed for the other quarter.
Its slowly turning into a parody of what it was, Torchwood has come on leaps and bounds this season, it seems to the detriment of DrW.
I agree with Thaedydal great to see Bernard Cribbins back:D

ixoy

Rev Hellfire wrote: »

I think people are expecting too much from Doctor Who, I know I was.
Lets face it, this is a kids program and when taken at face value the ropey 'special' effects and ropey dialogue are fine.

I don't accept that Not withstanding the fact that we've seen clear demonstrations of being able to tackle more adult storylines - Father's Day, The Satan Pit, Girl in the Fireplace, Family of Blood, Blink - we can still write quality for children without writing badly. "The Sarah Jane Adventures" is written for kids and was, for the whole, better written than this opening episode.

popebenny16

pixelburp wrote: »

I'm actually looking forward to the Ood episode - it was an untouched element in series of why the Ood were both mind controlled by humans & a herd race to begin with.

Yes indeed, my point was only that it's the same pattern of the previous seasons. I'd be very happy if the Doctor is about to free to Ood from human bondage.

Doctor DooM

Thaedydal wrote: »

It was ment to be a bit of fun, not serious scifi.
It was a deligth to see Bernard Cribbins back.

"The Satan Pit" and "Blink" are a bit of fun?

Doctor Who, apparently, in England has basically brought back the idea of a "family" program, which is watched by young and old together. The figures are huge, and I think RTD always plays to the younger element, but forgets to put in something for those of us over ten. When Who is great its incredible, and it should be sending kids behind the sofa, damnit!

Doctor DooM

popebenny16 wrote: »

Yes indeed, my point was only that it's the same pattern of the previous seasons. I'd be very happy if the Doctor is about to free to Ood from human bondage.

Agreed, that would be a great episode.

Stark

SDooM wrote: »

"The Satan Pit" and "Blink" are a bit of fun?

Doctor Who, apparently, in England has basically brought back the idea of a "family" program, which is watched by young and old together. The figures are huge, and I think RTD always plays to the younger element, but forgets to put in something for those of us over ten. When Who is great its incredible, and it should be sending kids behind the sofa, damnit!

Exactly. And as ixoy also pointed out with the Sarah Jane Adventures, fun child-focused sci-fi doesn't have to be tedious and repetitive.

markw999

The aliens were cute, especially when there was a group shot (I'm thinkin of when they're on the road) and the one in the foreground is skipping)

As for the reveal (which is spoilered already so I won't repeat); the shivers that went down my spine.

Tate is better than I expected and there's less shouting (which is a good) but just a bit more less would be better.