Recommend a diesel car 10 - 12 grand approx

Nuttzyy

Whats a decent diesel car to get, something around 2001 - 2004, the newer the better. The car will be kept for about 5 years minimum. Looking for a saloon sized car.

Ill narrow it down a bit.

No VAG cars, not interested in over-rated, over-priced, unreliable, poor dealer service which you get from the likes of Passats, golfs, and boring cars like Octavia's. The new Jetta would be the only Vag car i'd consider to be nice but they are too new for the budget above.

Have already considered Volvo S40's but they have Renault engines which is a bit of an off-putter and a friendly mechanic said they're apparently prone to overheating so, not too sure on these now.

Mondeo - A bit too bargey and can have niggly problems apparently and never really appealed to me.

Avensis - Very nice car, reliabe, economy and classier looking than a passat/mondeo i think, would you get a decent one for 12grand?

Peugeot 406 - Bit old, but a top of the range Hdi Rapier model could be worth considering. Bullet proof engines and comfortable. Dont really like the 407.

Santa Fe's were considered but mid-mileage ones dont really fall within budget.

What else is there, when did the Bmw diesels start being made, are the only bmw diesels the 320d's and 520d's models? Is there a diesel Bmw that could be got for around 13- 15 grand?

If anyone has any suggestions feel free to add them, i know the Octavia is probably going to be mentioned and perhaps it is worth considering but its very bland and basic and not up there with the Avensis imo.

axton1

Not to everybodies taste but I suggest you have a look at a citroen xantia hdi or c5.
I have had a few and for your money seconhand they are hard to beat.
comfort ,economy, and will out run a jap diesel for economy and longevity.
Hydro suspension gives incredible comfort/ roadholding even when fully laden,anti dive brakes, self centre steering ,certainly i found them ahead of their time in design. that my 2pw.

Cmar-Ireland

axton1 wrote: »

and will out run a jap diesel for economy and longevity.

Not a chance :rolleyes:

Quatre Mains

a mechanic I work with hs a Xantia with 200k up on it, he swears by them. Nuttzyy if you'd consider a 406 coupe Hdi (02,80k)pm me, I'm currently hmming and hawwing about flogging mine, the prospect of a quick sale would tip the balance

maidhc

Nuttzyy wrote: »

What else is there, when did the Bmw diesels start being made, are the only bmw diesels the 320d's and 520d's models? Is there a diesel Bmw that could be got for around 13- 15 grand?

Diesel BMWs have been around since the late 80's as far I as I am aware. The 525tds, and 318tds don't have a particularly good name from what I have heard.

Definately if you like the Avensis, go for it. One word of warning though, you will rarely better 43mpg with the D4D and they are not as reliable as the Toyotas of old.

MarkR

I seem to be Avensis hoaring today. I got my 04 one with 90k miles on it as an uncleared uk import for just under 9k. Further 4400 I think for VRT. Mpg is very good, if I fill up before a long run I can get over 60mpg. Normal city driving gets me 50-55 mpg usually. I've put on about 7k miles over the last 3/4 months so I think I'm getting my moneys worth.

Cionád

http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/SEAT/Toledo/1.9-TDI/992472/ - VAG though

http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/Alfa-Romeo/156/1.9-16V/961943/

Import a VRS Octavia(diesel), thats not boring

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/roadtests/202688/skoda_octavia.html

Eoin

Nuttzyy wrote:

What else is there, when did the Bmw diesels start being made, are the only bmw diesels the 320d's and 520d's models? Is there a diesel Bmw that could be got for around 13- 15 grand?

Apparently the 320d came out in 1999, but I have yet to see one earlier than 2000 in Ireland, so it may not have been available here until 2000. The 2000 ones start at around 8-9K on carzone, but will have over 100K on the clock, if that's a consideration for you. I've seen a few 530ds in your price range, but again the mileage will be quite high.

The 318tds and 525tds came out much earlier as maidhc says - I didn't realise the 525 wasn't considered too nice an engine, though have heard it about the 318.

siralfalot

easy. Alfa 156 2.4 JTD

Jonny303

Mazda 6, will litrelly NEVER break down

Keano

MarkR wrote: »

I seem to be Avensis hoaring today. I got my 04 one with 90k miles on it as an uncleared uk import for just under 9k. Further 4400 I think for VRT. Mpg is very good, if I fill up before a long run I can get over 60mpg. Normal city driving gets me 50-55 mpg usually. I've put on about 7k miles over the last 3/4 months so I think I'm getting my moneys worth.

Did you go over to the uk or buy it from a dealer in Ireland?

GERMAN ROCKS

1st Peugeot 406
2nd Citroen C5
Well They Would Be My Pick Of The Bunch

E92

Jonny303 wrote: »

Mazda 6, will litrelly NEVER break down

The diesel one is anything but reliable(like Mitsubishi's GDI petrol engine, curiously both have exactly the same symptoms when they're about to go belly up on you, and the reason they go belly up is exactly the same: poor fuel quality). Petrols ones are bulletproof though.

Nuttzyy

The Mazda 6 was considered from the start along with the S40, but they seem to have serious problems, lubrication problems leading to engines sieezing and fuel punp problems. From reading them peoples experiences on that honestjohn forum i linked i dont think their worth the risk, but its a pity as they seem like such nice cars from the exterior to interior. I forgot to say we looked at this car, in my originl post.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055266953&highlight=mazda

http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=57098

The Seat Toledo does seem like a good car but again want to stay away from Vag's, the toledo seems very plain and will date very easily, just something about it i dont like.

Alfas arent even going to be considered, but thanks for the laugh

The 406Hdi is a class engine and will last but they're very dated now when you park 1 beside an Avensis / Passat and the 407 is horrible so that natural choice of moving up to a 407 is out.

Citroens are out, i know they have the same engines as peugeots but my dad doesnt like them. Plus i know a few people with the citroen berlingo van and they gave trouble.

Its hard to know, the Avensis is probably the best bet.

What do ye folks think of this Bmw:
http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/BMW/320/D/735696/

Are these 320's reliable enough, and are they best in manual or automatic, just looking at carzone there and a lot seem to be automatics. Does the autotransmission give trouble when theres high miles up?

Its a pity the Honda Accord is so new in diesel form, they're just too expensive.
Cheers for all the feedback.
(Ps: This car is for my parents, not me)

xt40

Nuttzyy wrote: »

Is there a diesel Bmw that could be got for around 13- 15 grand?

yup, its called a rover 75. way cheaper, better spec, prettier (imo) and more reliable (jd power)
available in 115 bhp cdt or 131 bhp cdti

Nuttzyy

xt40 wrote: »

yup, its called a rover 75. way cheaper, better spec, prettier (imo) and more reliable (jd power)
available in 115 bhp cdt or 131 bhp cdti

Whatever car is bought will be kept for a good few years. What happens when you want parts for a Rover 75 seen as they're not being made and wernt a great seller so breakers wont be full of bits, who made that engine, is it Rovers own, out of interest, I wouldnt go near 1 personally.

Eoin

Nuttzyy wrote: »

Alfas arent even going to be considered, but thanks for the laugh

Side splitting stuff indeed

Nuttzyy wrote: »

What do ye folks think of this Bmw:
http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/BMW/320/D/735696/

Are these 320's reliable enough, and are they best in manual or automatic, just looking at carzone there and a lot seem to be automatics. Does the autotransmission give trouble when theres high miles up?

Pretty good spec, though I would say pricey enough. That said, there are some insane prices on carzone for 2001 320ds.

I think it will have the 136BHP engine which is a nice drive, but not the smoothest sounding. It's never bothered me though.

The newer engine has 150bhp and was also used in the 320 coupe. It sounds more refined, however earlier versions of this engine were known for having turbo problems. Have no idea about manual / auto in this model.

Eoin

Nuttzyy wrote: »

Whatever car is bought will be kept for a good few years. What happens when you want parts for a Rover 75 seen as they're not being made and wernt a great seller so breakers wont be full of bits, who made that engine, is it Rovers own, out of interest, I wouldnt go near 1 personally.

A lot of that sounds like cliche to me...

Anyhow, it's a de-tuned BMW engine - the 136 BHP one that I mentioned above, which is probably what xt40 was getting at.

E92

Rover borrowed the 320d engine for the diesel 75(though it has less power).

That 320d has the reliable engine i.e. the older 136 bhp unit. It's the 02-04 320d that eats turbos(it's reliable apart from that very expensive problem though:D).

S40s are seriously underrated cars. There always manages to be some light that's not working, but they're trouble free apart from that. Just stay away from the Mitsubishi GDI petrol engine and you'll be fine(it has all the trimmings inside, sounds dieselish on start up, and is badged "1.8 i" at the back). Oh and the diesel can be heard about a mile before it arrives too. The 1.8 Volvo engine is by far the best choice, which rules it out for you then unfortunately. They're seriously comfy and despite what people say about it's ride quality, it's a lot better than most cars over the bumps too. It's certainly not going to put a smile on a keen drivers face, which is why most car enthusiasts don't like them, but I don't think Volvos were ever about that anyway.

Nuttzyy

Cionád wrote: »

http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/Alfa-Romeo/156/1.9-16V/961943/

eoin_s wrote:

Side splitting stuff indeed

I was just joking, when the Alfa was suggested he put a Smiley grin beside it, i wouldnt consider the Alfa as a long term car so grinned back. No need to take offense.

Does anyone know what the saab diesel engine is like?

JHMEG

E92 wrote: »

S40s are seriously underrated cars.

Funny, as only 3 hours ago I was recommending a 1.6 S40 to someone who was looking at a Golf for 6k. 2nd place was a Focus... Better to drive, but not as nice inside. (this was for a girl)

E92

Nuttzyy wrote: »

Does anyone know what the saab diesel engine is like?

It's from a FIAT if that's any good to you, and also found in most Opels(aasuming we're talking about the 1.9 (T)TiD).

Eoin

I think there are at least two diesel variants. The 1.9 is supposed to be very good - if it is the FIAT engine, I could well believe it. There is also a 2.2 one which is supposed to be very rough. Someone told me that they have a newer 2.2 which is a lot better, but haven't seen that mentioned elsewhere.

unkel

maidhc wrote: »

The 525tds, and 318tds don't have a particularly good name from what I have heard

LOL, they do have a fairly good name, but they are old cars with old skool engines and those cars are only worth a couple of grand now at best. BMW were the second company in the world (after FIAT who owns the rights) to market a common rail modern diesel engined car back in '98

All those early common rail BMWs can be had well below the OPs budget. If the OP's dad is only after as cheap a car as possible and just wants something to transport him from A to B without hassle, he should go with an Avensis. If he likes driving and likes a bit of poke, get him to test drive a 530d and he'll never look back

unkel

E92 wrote: »

Rover borrowed the 320d engine for the diesel 75(though it has less power)

The other way around. BMW designed the Rover 75 from the ground up. And for good measure they stuck in the diesel engine from the 320d / 520d (detuned)

If the OPs dads budget was half of what it is, I would recommend a 75 diesel auto connoisseur. Actually I'd still recommend that car and the buyer could go on some seriously nice holidays or whatever else he fancies and still be better off

xt40

unkel wrote: »

If the OPs dads budget was half of what it is, I would recommend a 75 diesel auto connoisseur.

thats the model ive got. its brilliant . regarding parts etc, the dealer and parts networks are still in place so nothing has changed. they are also going back into production in china and will be back on sale in europe v. soon. someone mentioned that they were a poor seller . maybe here but in the uk they were extremely popular

E92

JHMEG wrote: »

Funny, as only 3 hours ago I was recommending a 1.6 S40 to someone who was looking at a Golf for 6k. 2nd place was a Focus... Better to drive, but not as nice inside. (this was for a girl)

Wow that's interesting, clearly performance isn't a priority then;). 1.8s are not fast at all at all, God only knows how slow the 1.6 is:eek:. I'm absolutely serious when I say it's a lovely car to drive. No it won't put a smile on your face in corners etc but some of the suppoesdly better to drive cars I've driven are a lot less involving than the Volvo in bends and don't grip the road half as well either. I'd choose one over many cars that are supposedly better than it, no bother at all. The Focus is a great car though, though whether it's better than the S40 is debatable as I haven't yet sampled it from the drivers' seat.

Most people here dislike them because a) they're a Volvo and all the negativity that goes with it and b) they're not about driving pleasure.

When was a Volvo ever about driving pleasure anyway?

I would simply say to the naysayers don't knock it till you've tried it. A bit like what you might say to hybrid bashers I suppose JHMEG;). It's a much better car than what the car mags make it out to be IMO anyway.

Just stay away from Volvo dealers(the labour rate is €100 per hour last time I checked:eek:), the Mitsubishi engine(because of it's capacity to self destruct though there's nothing wrong with the way that engine drives apart from not being fast enough for me), the diesel(because it's a Renault engine and I'm sorry but that doesn't bode well in my book for reliability, it also can be heard half an hour before it arrives) and it's a relable car apart from going through bulbs like there's no tomorrow. Electrics would be the main weakness as well as the paint quality not being the best.

Biro

E92 wrote: »

The diesel one is anything but reliable(like Mitsubishi's GDI petrol engine, curiously both have exactly the same symptoms when they're about to go belly up on you, and the reason they go belly up is exactly the same: poor fuel quality). Petrols ones are bulletproof though.

Come on E92, that's bullsh!t. You were praising them until you heard of ONE person's problems, who happened to link to a website with one other person who claims to have seen that problem a few times. What about all the reports that claim they've had zero issues with them? And what about if you went digging hard into other engines? You'll find problems with them all. Fuel filters being changed regularly will rule out these kind of problems.

R.O.R

Biro wrote: »

Come on E92, that's bullsh!t.

Nah, it's not actually.

I used to look after a company fleet that mainly comprised of diesel (120bhp) Mazda 6's. After about 80,000 miles they all started to need major work to keep them on the road, up to the point it wasn't worth spending further money.

Biro

R.O.R wrote: »

Nah, it's not actually.

I used to look after a company fleet that mainly comprised of diesel (120bhp) Mazda 6's. After about 80,000 miles they all started to need major work to keep them on the road, up to the point it wasn't worth spending further money.

The small fuel filter is a problem with them. I don't believe that any of those engines which have the fuel filter changed every 10k miles would have any problems.
What sort of "major work" was involved?

R.O.R

Biro wrote: »

What sort of "major work" was involved?

Unfortunately I'm not on the technical side so can't tell you specifics.

The last one I dealt with had 144,000 miles on, about €5,000 had been spent on it in the last 6 months before it ground to a halt again. Belgard quoted €7,500 ish for a new engine as it wasn't possible to repair.

Caught me a bit by surprise as I was under the impression the Mazda's were bulletproof and this was just a bad one, but the guys on the technical side said all of them were giving the same trouble. It probably only came to light as a problem due to the amount of the same type of car with one customer - the diesels were actually fairly scarce due to availability.