Does anybody here care about Tibet?

Precociousg

I certainly care about the plight of Tibet, any people who have their culture surpressed and their wish for a free nation denied by force deserve sympathy and support! Although with the growing economic influence of China on the global stage, I doubt any other country can have a major impact on their internal policy, its still worth protesting about the issue to show the people of Tibet that they are not alone in their struggle!

Grudaire

lonesome wrote: »

The Chinese Ambassador walked out of the convention in Dundalk as Gormley referred to Tibet as a country.

however RTE 9' didn't mention that and only partially braodcasted Gormley condemned human rights abuses in Tibet.

the whole story you could find from http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0413/green.html

Yea, they did that to us before- there was a protest on outside Croke Park about the local handball alley, and they basically said that it was about one of the motions, which it wasn't.
tbh RTE are sh*te

lonesome

Cliste wrote: »

Yea, they did that to us before- there was a protest on outside Croke Park about the local handball alley, and they basically said that it was about one of the motions, which it wasn't.
tbh RTE are sh*te

I have been living in the Ireland for 8 years. Most of Chinese here previously thought the western media is quite objective and professional.
but they did disappoint us so much

Grudaire

lonesome wrote: »

I have been living in the Ireland for 8 years. Most of Chinese here previously thought the western media is quite objective and professional.
but they did disappoint us so much

The beauty of 'western' media is that if you're unhappy with RTE watch TV3 (maybe not TG4;)) if that doesn't do it for you go to CNN BBC SKY Al Jazeera, whoever, same with papers etc.

If you're still not happy set up your own media outlet, and as long as you don't defame/incite people you're grand!

Unlike elsewhere....

SeanW

+1

leninbenjamin

SeanW wrote: »

+1

i have no idea what your plusing but +1

:pac:

Precociousg

Cliste wrote: »

The beauty of 'western' media is that if you're unhappy with RTE watch TV3 (maybe not TG4;)) if that doesn't do it for you go to CNN BBC SKY Al Jazeera, whoever, same with papers etc.

If you're still not happy set up your own media outlet, and as long as you don't defame/incite people you're grand!

Unlike elsewhere....

This is a very good post in the context of this discussion, we should consider ourselves lucky here to have so many media outlets or different news resources, The freedom to choose the news you wish to receive is, I believe, one of the most important tools of a modern democratic society.

OK-Cancel-Apply

SeanW wrote: »

They grew up, and live with, Red propoganda, day in, day out. I love Ireland, but I don't like it's present government too much and I hate the P/C/R IRA.

Like I said, I've been there, and it's not quite what you make it out to be.

SeanW wrote: »

The point is, if you control the media, you will control people's - especially children's mentalities. Because the Chinese people have only ever had State run media to influence them, it should come as no surprise that you have more Chinese people singing off the Commie's hymn sheet, much more so than in the West. Because here, all voices are heard and at least you get to choose who you want to listen to. You can compare individual free media outlets to each other, as I said, if you don't like the Telegraph, you can read the Guardian, if you believe the media in general is "Too Liberal" you watch Hannity & Colmes on Fox or tune into whatever radio station Rush Limbaugh etc have their show on, so you can hear them "tell it like it is." In China, you just have the Red Communist PR machine, with its position always taken as Gospel.

The Chinese are not as brainwashed as you think, and do, believe it or not, have a capacity to decide what's right and wrong, moral and immoral.

You say that our media here (in the west) is structured in a manor that allows us to pick and choose what to believe, and the truth will always find its way out. Do you really think the general population is that discerning? How many Americans still think that Iraq had WMD's? How many of them think that Iraq carried out 9/11? How many people would support the bombing of Iran? Can Muslims walk down the streets in Britain without others thinking that they are fanatics who are only one order away from blowing everyone up? Don't forget, the United States media sets the stories, and the rest of the world follows. And now, the United States is leading the anti-China campaign.

How many people who bleat 'Free Tibet' could tell you the first thing about the Dalai Lama?

I don't know how anyone could hold the western media in the regard that you do.

SeanW wrote: »

Like I said, if [boycotting London 2012 is] what floats your boat, go for it.

What floats YOUR boat? Do you support a Beijing 2008 boycott? If so, why do you NOT support a London 2012 boycott?

SeanW wrote: »

Again, you mention the British only when it is convenient to do so ...

I mention anything that I think will help to illustrate the point I'm trying to make.

SeanW wrote: »

Nope. Healthiest thing would be if we didn't have any [superpowers]. The present situation is just multiple sides of the same coin.

Can I take that to mean that you'd rather have a relatively poor world than have China ever do as well economically as the United States?

SeanW wrote: »

But I never made any claims. I merely said that if this were true, then the Chinese should expect no sympathy.

Yes but what you said sounds like spin and smear. Just like when the Israelis claim that all Arabs hate Jews, support Nazis and want to push Jews into the sea.

SeanW wrote: »

Again, I'm quite sure the British Empire had similar thoughts about Ireland and the island's inhabitants.

Now you are talking about the British. So you're allowed to, but I'm not?

SeanW wrote: »

The question therefore must be, how strong is the identity of the indiginous Tibetans, and what role to the migrating Han play?

But that's the sort of question that can be asked of any group or individual on earth. How strong was the Viking identity in Dublin? How strong is the Swabian identity in Germany, or the Cornish identity in Britain? The point is, how does one tell a separatist from a freedom fighter? I think it's time we stopped telling our Chinese friends that the GPO is 'inappropriate' for them to use as a platform to have their voices heard, and start listening to what they are telling us here, and remembering that there's a FAR bigger picture here - one that involves the United States' interest in playing political and economical games. As usual.

Pro C

It is getting ridiculous to keep going like this, you want to talk about China, I give you China and every single point below relates to China, so here is my summary,

Our ambassador’s job here is to form good relationship with Irish people, negotiating trade, encourage understanding of differences, exchanging cultural diversities, not tolerating impolite gestures. In fact, you did not see his work does not mean he did not do. It was well covered in our newspaper here, as it has interest in the mutual benefits and well-being between the people of the two nations. We have come with friendly mindset and in China we are genuinely welcoming foreign people with love, not like so many Irish only show it on the face. It has to be said that there are vast amount of Irish people with open mind-set, and we do respect those people, very much.

We do have human rights issues; nobody denied that, our government did not deny that. But so does the Americans and British with their prisoners of war, they have problems as well. I am not switching the focus; I am just comparing the like with like. We are improving, doing a better job than years ago. So, why do the West focus your comments on China all the time?

We do have censorship in China, but by and large we are happy where we are, the country does not appreciate your way of freedom, thanks very much. By the way, your media has control of what they want you to know as well, for instance, so many Westerners saw the photo that a student standing right in front of the Chinese Army tank on 6.4 and making assumptions that it crashed over him or fired at him, but the guy simply left after climbing up the tank and having a look, and how many of you knows that. The BBC simply stopped the tape right at where it gives you a scene that you can imagine what the worst scenario might be, why did they do that and isn’t it a form of censorship?

About Tibet, very clear, it was and is always part of China, 99% of Irish have never been there themselves, which is nearly 10,000 miles away from Ireland. How on earth do you think you know everything right through the LCD, maybe through your biased Western media, like the one above? If your media is always right, why did the Express Newspaper compensate Gerry McCann? If the Western government is always right, why there is no Weapon of Mass Destruction found in Iraq?

I am a patriot, in fact majority of Chinese are patriots even they may not be happy with the corruption of the government, but so is Bertie, corruption is everywhere; your government is not doing much better than ours at the end of the day. A slip of the tongue of a minister by calling Tibet is a country is totally unacceptable. Let alone, Tibet never wanted freedom; the Dalai Lama never wanted freedom of control but of religion. They wanted autonomy and they had been a TAR for year and they can be TAR as long as they wanted, which is consistent with the Chinese government policy towards the 7 SARs in China. If you are trying to divide our country, it is a very very serious insult, (if you didn’t know so just to let you know) just as much insult you will get from saying the land we are now standing on is part of the Great Britain, the only way you left us to defend your unfair attack and accusation is fire with fire. You guys may think this is aggressive, but the nature of the aggressiveness comes with a reason.

China never point its fingers at any other country before it resolves its own problems, whereas foreign countries, especially the West, have long established history of suppressing other countries freedom of dealing their internal affairs in their own way, and the West are always nosy about others’ issues before having their own issues sort it our first, who has more sensible mentality here? Yeah, we may be suppressing some minority people, but you are suppressing another country, which is crazier?

To give you a perfect example, you have your point by saying your way of solving problem by open dialogue, which I personally agree. But what about the West boycott the Olympic if China doesn’t buy your suggestion, isn’t it a suppressing? Is that what you do when your point is not taken? Isn’t it another slap on your own face?

Having said that, if a war is required regarding on Tibet or Tiawan, the integrity of motherland has the highest priority, that’s called self-esteem. China will do it at all cost, the US has already financed two and half wars, they simply can’t afford this one and their people can’t see American people die in a much much larger scale, and by the way, Shannon is not needed this time, too far, too small. Also, Russia is our very good buddy, just in case you don’t know.

Let’s have some about economics, shall we? It is not our cheap labour to be blamed for your loss of jobs and employments such as in Iralco, it is your choice, it is the sheer greedy of the West, the capitalism’s hanger for profits and how your economic theory works - your demand. If the Irish companies want survive and compete successfully in the global market in manufacturing or service sector, they had better known that other countries are not as laid back as the Irish, well maybe not to include the French. Your favourable tax regime will not last forever, your EU mates won’t allow that happening, and when it is done, lots of jobs will go, either head North or the far East and once it is gone, it is gone, unless other unique value added industries can be created and developed in these short phase of time, you are heading into a disasters situation, plus your education and the depth of your R&D is not the greatest of the world, few institutes are known to the globe, well apart from Trinity – to be fair – it can’t be seen why the housing price will go up when the economy is going down. I am not targeting the Irish people in particular but simply pointing out the problem, take it or not, it is your choice. And, how about that? If we were not offended in the first place, this would not be said.

Back to politics, there is an old Chinese saying is that “frog at the bottom of the well”, it is perfect to define Irish position on the whole issue. You are so lazy to go out there and find the truth yourselves, and the sky you can see from the bottom of the well, will be always the same size as the well.

If you think I am all alone sharing this view, then you are wrong.

bob2000

"your government is not doing much better than ours at the end of the day. "

so we're living in a dictatorship, where summary executions and abuses of human rights are commonplace ?

Pro C

bob2000 wrote: »

"your government is not doing much better than ours at the end of the day. "

so we're living in a dictatorship, where summary executions and abuses of human rights are commonplace ?

No answers for all my question above, haa?

Use the same line again, right?

Seems you know China for your whole life, again, you are 10,000 miles away from there, better reserve your judgement until you have a go, tell me what you feel when you come back.

Pro C

Precociousg wrote: »

I certainly care about the plight of Tibet, any people who have their culture surpressed and their wish for a free nation denied by force deserve sympathy and support! Although with the growing economic influence of China on the global stage, I doubt any other country can have a major impact on their internal policy, its still worth protesting about the issue to show the people of Tibet that they are not alone in their struggle!

sounds like another one grown up in Tibet.

bob2000

"No answers for all my question above, haa?

Use the same line again, right?

Seems you know China for your whole life, again, you are 10,000 miles away from there, better reserve your judgement until you have a go, tell me what you feel when you come back. "

What did I say that was untrue, haa?

Pro C

bob2000 wrote: »

What did I say that was untrue, haa?

Obvious enough you haven't a clue about the logic of debate,

I admit there is human right issues, Chinese in general admit that, even our government admit that as well,

You are calling "the chinese government's murder is commonplace", the way to debate is not what I proof you said is untrue, the onus is on you to prove what you claimed is true.

Same as bring it to a larger scale, if the foreign media and government claim PRC's commonplace murder is true, the onus is on them to prove what they claimed, not the Chinese government to counter the claim.

Now, you learn something today.

donaghs

Pro C wrote: »

We do have censorship in China, but by and large we are happy where we are, the country does not appreciate your way of freedom, thanks very much.

Then why are you using our freedoms to protest? If you want to feel more at home, why don't you ask the Irish government for guidance, and then do what they say.

RedPlanet

donaghs wrote: »

Then why are you using our freedoms to protest? If you want to feel more at home, why don't you ask the Irish government for guidance, and then do what they say.

Probably because they are in ireland and are supposed to follow our laws, not chinese ones.

oscarBravo

Thread closed. Look here for explanation.