Is it wrong to use drugs.

DeVore

Naos wrote: »

DeVore wrote a great post about cannabis being a gateway drug a while ago, not going to try find it as ye know how many posts he has...

This is from loose memory so is not gospel, however it went something like this:

Cannabis is deemed a gateway drug because we are told growing up in school that if we smoke it we will become addicted, have to quit our jobs and rob old people to support that addiction and generally become social outcasts.

Then we try it and say to ourselves "Holy $hit, I'm fine. So the school and media have been feeding me horse**** all this time". So we try something else and realise again that the affects/reprucussions were not at all like the schools/media portrayed it as.

DeV worded it better than I, maybe if he spots this post he can jot up his opinion on cannabis being a gateway drug again.

Basically thats what I said but i will expand on it.

Adults and guardians are basically appealing to experience for their authority on the topic. When they tell younger people not to do drugs they do so usually noting that they have no direct personal experience so they are "trading" entirely on a request to trust them on the topic.

The problem with this is two fold. Firstly the word "drugs" is such a broad term that it becomes almost meaningless. Are we talking about a spliff or a needle?? Since we have not been clear about it, the term becomes overly broad.

Secondly any investigation or experimentation (and lets face it, teens have those in spades!) will almost certainly show up the scare-mongering that has been going on about "drugs".

Once that happens the "trust" I referred to above, is gone. We've lied to them and every word now is suspect of adults simply being buzz-wreckers.

The problem is that no one wants to break down the word "drugs" into its constituent parts. The feeling seems to be, if they were to say "look, cannabis isnt good for you but its not going to kill you much more then smokes will... but heroin could kill you stone dead the first time you try it"... it will be taken up as "go fnkcin' nuts with the spliffs boys! Smoke it, eat it, shove it up your ass if it gets you off... wooooooo, I'm ****ing high right now!!!"

This is an effect of our conversion of politics and news into soundbitten entertainment. *

So, yes if we say "cannabis wont kill you" we might inadvertently create some more cannabis users (and I do think that teens should NOT smoke grass/hash, it kills natural enthusiasm and instead of having a life, you end up sitting in mashed all the time), but we might have more moral believability when we say "oh and Heroin, its a dirty, losers drug that can kill you right off the bat". That might save some lives....

DeV.

*at the time of the birth of the telegraph the presidential candidates in the US had their presidential debates reported on just as they do now. The difference is that in Jeffersons time the initial speaker of the debate had an hour to outline his vision, his opponent had one and a half hours of rebuttal and the original speaker has 30 minutes of response. The entire thing was transcribed in all daily newspapers in their entirity.
Today they get 30 seconds on the news.

Ross_Mahon

If there was no drugs, the world would be a better place, think of all the trouble caused by them throughout human history. I do believe that they should be given to people with problems or old people in pain.

Dragan

Dashticle wrote: »

Sup Bill Hicks.

The consistent referencing of Bill Hicks whenever anyone expresses an opinion even remotely like his is as old as the infamous quote itself.

DeVore

Agreed, otherwise we are saying that someone can't agree with Hicks at all now??

I agree with not parroting his opinions as your own, but its an entirely different thing to say you hold the same opinion.

As for the "drugs have caused more wars etc"... most of the problems surrounding drugs are as a result of their illegalisation rather then anything inherent in them. Alcohol is analogous to the effects of "illegal" drugs and you dont see it starting wars. Fights maybe, but not wars!


DeV.

Dragan

Ross_Mahon wrote: »

If there was no drugs, the world would be a better place, think of all the trouble caused by them throughout human history. I do believe that they should be given to people with problems or old people in pain.

Wars have been fought over all sorts of things, land, money, oil, gold, diamonds, political power and influence, place in society and religion.

This does not make these things bad, it makes the way certain people view them bad.

Earthhorse

Dragan wrote: »

I mean, how many of the "great" poets that are studied and worshipped now were on Absinthe and the like when writing their works?

Not many.

Dashticle

Dragan wrote: »

Wars have been fought over all sorts of things, land, money, oil, gold, diamonds, political power and influence, place in society and religion.

This does not make these things bad, it makes the way certain people view them bad.

He never said they caused wars, merely that they caused trouble. I do agree that the fact that they're illegal does seem to be the root of a lot of problems - it funds gangs, promotes violence etc.

Really it comes down to if you believe human beings can be trusted to be responsible for what they choose to pollute their bodies with, or if they need to be prevented from coming into contact with certain substances.

Personally I think the current situation is good. If you want to smoke a bit of weed or do a few pills the odd time, it's entirely possible - but not so readily available that it takes all the fun out of it.

Red Hand

Our teacher at school had a good line,

"I'm not going to tell you that drugs are good or bad or that you'll go to hell for using them. I'm sure that ye know or know of a few people in this town who deal? So...would ye buy a loaf of bread off of them?"

Dellboy2007

Jeremiah 16:1 wrote: »

Our teacher at school had a good line,

"I'm not going to tell you that drugs are good or bad or that you'll go to hell for using them. I'm sure that ye know or know of a few people in this town who deal? So...would ye buy a loaf of bread off of them?"

Yes if it was a good loaf of bread. Why, wouldn't you?

Sam Vimes

Jeremiah 16:1 wrote: »

Our teacher at school had a good line,

"I'm not going to tell you that drugs are good or bad or that you'll go to hell for using them. I'm sure that ye know or know of a few people in this town who deal? So...would ye buy a loaf of bread off of them?"

the thing about that argument is it's only valid because drugs are illegal.

the question is whether it's wrong to do drugs, not whether it's wrong to buy cocaine cut with rat poison off the local scum bag

Mr. CooL ICE

Is it wrong to do drugs? Legally, yes. Morally, no. As long as someone who is taking a drug is aware of the effects of what the drug does and is aware of consequences of taking them, then fire away.

Red Hand

Sam Vimes wrote: »

the thing about that argument is it's only valid because drugs are illegal.

the question is whether it's wrong to do drugs, not whether it's wrong to buy cocaine cut with rat poison off the local scum bag

Oh, I agree. It was just something that struck me at the time as being spot on...that some people are so concerned about calories and healthy diets etc, and then they relax by putting something totally unregulated into their bodies.

Davidius

conanm wrote: »

Words

Lol!

Best reaction ever! :pac:
Seriously you had me in stitches. Almost thought that you thought I was being serious.

dbs_sailor

Davidius wrote: »

Lol!

Best reaction ever! :pac:
Seriously you had me in stitches. Almost thought that you thought I was being serious.

it was a windup!!!!!!!!!!!??

sorry i was ****ing stoned when i read your post and replied.

:pac::pac::pac:

[edit] can't believe i didn't make the deduction based on your sig alone haha[/edit]

Dave!

Dashticle wrote: »

Personally I think the current situation is good. If you want to smoke a bit of weed or do a few pills the odd time, it's entirely possible - but not so readily available that it takes all the fun out of it.

Problem is -- there's still criminality and gangs being funded by it! If it were possible to take it out of the criminals' hands and legalise it but extremely restrict it, that would probably be the best option.

In response to the OP, no, there's nothing inherently wrong with using any drugs at all. Funding immoral activity is a different matter really, and one which there is some legitimate points to be made about. But then I wear Nike, drink Coke, and have a leather jacket.......... so......... I'm not on very sturdy ground morally anyway.

halfinch

everything in moderation

JC 2K3

including moderation.

Dashticle

DaveMcG wrote: »

Problem is -- there's still criminality and gangs being funded by it! If it were possible to take it out of the criminals' hands and legalise it but extremely restrict it, that would probably be the best option.

In response to the OP, no, there's nothing inherently wrong with using any drugs at all. Funding immoral activity is a different matter really, and one which there is some legitimate points to be made about. But then I wear Nike, drink Coke, and have a leather jacket.......... so......... I'm not on very sturdy ground morally anyway.

Criminals exist, they'll always exist, drugs or no drugs. The likes of people selling weed aren't always part of some shadowy underground organisation of pimps, murderers and music-downloaders like the government would have you believe.

Tar.Aldarion

No, it is not 'wrong'.

Crumble Froo

yeah, for all the shadowy characters hanging around back alleys that school and television had be believe in, not to mention the good-freinds-turn-bad who push the stuff on you, i've come across a *lot* of drugs in my life,a nd it's always from friends etc in a 'no worries if you dont wana try'.

and almost all weed i've come across has been grown locally.

hunter164

There's nothing wrong with the odd joint.....but heroins a different story.

JC 2K3

What's morally wrong with using heroin?

You put yourself at risk of addiction, but I can't see how it's inherently wrong....

hunter164

Like I just mean that with the odd joint you don't half lose your mind as you do when you take heroin.

Dave!

But there's nothing actually wrong with using heroin, surely.......

JC 2K3

Also, I think there's more medical evidence to suggest that occasional use of cannabis would cause more mental damage than occasional use of heroin.

Stigmas around drugs are both amusing and depressing. Cannabis is not harmless, nor is heroin some kind of inherently evil substance which will mess up the lives of anyone who even thinks about taking it.

hunter164

Sorry I meant for myself there's nothing wrong with the odd joint but I wouldn't touch heroin.

Fremen

Dragan wrote: »

I mean, how many of the "great" poets that are studied and worshipped now were on Absinthe and the like when writing their works?

Couldn't answer that, but Paul Erdos, the most prolific mathematician in history, had a pretty serious amphetamine habit, to which he credited most of his productivity.

FunkZ

No. I enjoy using them, I don't use them too much, and I only spend 80% of my weekly wages on them.

roadruner

Drugs drugs drugs, weak minded people use drugs apparently, but in saying that tests on animals (which should be punishable by a swift kick in the stones) have shown that animals get hooked on the use of mind altering chemicals.

It is estimated that about four percent of the world's adult population use cannabis annually and 0.6 percent daily.
Humans have been consuming cannabis since prehistory apparently.
At the lower end of our recreational drug culture is good ol Weed, grass, marijuana, cannabis, ganja, scag, hash, (Variety and bad mixture of cannabis) has been grown for donkeys years but some clever people decided to mix and match a few hemp seeds to come up with something that will turn you into a skyhighastrist and with heavier usage leads a person to want a bigger buzz, this then can lead to trying a bit of the white stuff at a house party which may give you the buzz you’ve been looking for or may not.
Some people on the other hand head down the road of H ingested in a various amount of ways it gives you the BIGGEST high you’ll ever get, after that you have a problem! you’re going to be looking for that same high again but you don’t find it you try bigger hits and cocktails until eventually (for some unfortunate people) you become totally addicted to finding the first H high.
It takes over your body and life until as we’ve all seen, you are a junkie looking for junk anyway you can find it.
Are drugs wrong that’s an individual decision, I can’t see a problem with recreational drugs as long as the person using them doesn’t get too attached to them.
Eventually it’s greed will kill off the drugs, mixing down good drugs with crap to bulk them up for more financial return is making it harder to get half decent stuff anywhere.
Weed is weak damp or too dry and useless.
E’s are like taking upjohns or Roche 5’s.
Acid is like taking anadin, 1 or 2 would send you flying before now it’s 4, 6 or 8
Cocaine is like baking powder.
Heroin is like dancing with the devil and playing Russian roulette.

Drugs the most lucrative and deadly business in the world.
Kept lucrative by abusers kept deadly by dealers

slipss

roadruner wrote: »

Drugs the most lucrative and deadly business in the world.

..........what about the arms trade?