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Leaving Cert System - Idea(s)
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PurpleFistMixer wrote: »Then perhaps more standards need to be put in place to ensure the exams given are difficult enough, or your college should reassess the level of degree it gives at the end.
They give us simple tests; gruelling projects
Standards that might be applied to, say, the Leaving Cert? To ensure an appropiate level of difficulty? Eh? Eh?the LCA doesn't qualify you for any university courses, as far as I'm aware.
Must qualify you for some. Again, the style of learning in LCA would differ from the LC which is what most college courses would cater to - so I guess it makes sense.it is an example of one of the steps to make the education system more friendly to non-academics.
Indeedy-do. Colleges are academic institutes though. At the end of the day you have to remember that.Though, as I am not doing programming, I still think that to lose marks because you phrased something differently is wrong. For example we have a french assistant from Rouen, many things she has told us are marked as wrong, despite as being perfectly legitimate French as coming from a native speaker, because they're not how the department of education do things.
On more than one occassions we (students) have bent the rules of the college coding standards in order to perform our work. It does prove that sometimes your way isnt the best way or even the right way. You have to remember the examiner in question has to follow the department standards, not the assistant from Rouen.Learning the structure of an essay is acceptable (hell there's only so many things they can ask in the Comparative), but actually learning off chunks of text you barely understand? And being graded as if you can communicate well in that language? That's flawed, and wrong.
Ohhh...I agree with you there.0 -
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Yes, within a framework of continuous assessment. : pThey give us simple tests; gruelling projects
Standards that might be applied to, say, the Leaving Cert? To ensure an appropiate level of difficulty? Eh? Eh?
I have not yet seen a university which accepts LCA for any kind of matriculation. It qualifies you for colleges of further education and senior colleges though, which can eventually lead to higher level degrees etc. if you can link in to universities, it's just a longer path. I do take what you mean though about college being an academic place. But what kind of higher qualification options do we have for those whose skills lie outside the academic spectrum?Must qualify you for some. Again, the style of learning in LCA would differ from the LC which is what most college courses would cater to - so I guess it makes sense.
True. The marking schemes only allow for so many deviations, but it doesn't make it any more right.On more than one occassions we (students) have bent the rules of the college coding standards in order to perform our work. It does prove that sometimes your way isnt the best way or even the right way. You have to remember the examiner in question has to follow the department standards, not the assistant from Rouen.
I'll admit, the continuous pressure can be a little bad. But I think even if the exams were to be split between summer of fifth year and summer of sixth year it would be good. For example, in fifth year your Irish exam could be based on grammar and comprehension, then in sixth year you'd be examined on literature and writing. Of course, the instant problem with that is that then for that year you concentrate on nothing else, and you go insane from the boredom. But there must be some way to make it work. There's too much uncertainty regarding the summer exams. Three hours are given too much importance and it makes people too inclined to freak out over it.That might suit you, it certainly wouldn't have suited me.
The stress of constantly having to preform well in every exam you do in 5th and 6th year vs. learning at your own pace and just making sure you do your best over 2 weeks atthe end of 2 years. I know which I prefer.
And Jesus, I can't imagine what teachers would be like given a continuous assessment system. If you think they're bad for only teaching how to do well in exams and giving you notes to learn off as it is, think of what it'd be like if you had important exams regularly....
If the exams were regular, maybe the ridiculous amount of importance they're given would be somewhat diminished.
To say that some intelligences are more useful... I don't know about that. Academics are useful, yes, but we need artists and sportspeople (if that is a word) and carers and other things, surely such things have as important a role as anything else, if they're contributing to society. That's a little off the topic though, I guess.We can't let everyone into college... It's a harsh but true fact of life that there are some types of intelligences which are more useful than others.
I mean I totally understand what you're saying about there probably being something out there for everyone to excel in. Perhaps there should be more opportunities for people to find something they're good at in school. But I don't really see the relevence to the LC, which is a tool for evaluating whether someone is academically good enough to go to college.
And about getting into college... yes, well I understand that we can't let everyone in, but ideally everyone can go somewhere to pursue their interests, if they so desire. I guess what I'm saying is we just need to cater for the fact that people are different, and as such the LC must be adjusted accordingly.
I can't just walk out of class. I know these are techniques used to try increase grades, they're just horrible, I think. My Irish class all got a "Shortcuts to Success: The Aiste" book and it has a formula which it applies ad nauseum. Something like "Statement, filler of nice Irish phrase, seanfhocal, maybe another point, more filler". If you read any of the essays they constructed like this they're completely disjointed, random seanfhocail thrown in all over the place that had nothing to do with the essay. It's a bit of an extreme example, I guess, but it just demonstrates this mentality of "give them what they want" instead of, you know, "write an essay about a topic".You don't have to listen to that though. If you're a weak student then you can inflate your grades with such techniques, however, I got above average to high marks in English, Irish and History and never learned off any notes on poetry or essays someone else wrote. Have faith in your competancy to express your own opinion (something which I think many students are afraid of, and which isn't actively encouraged by teachers) and you'll probably find yourself doing quite well.0 -
Well yeah, but you could equally say that calmness and composure is something that should be rewarded.PurpleFistMixer wrote: »Three hours are given too much importance and it makes people too inclined to freak out over it.
If the exams were regular, maybe the ridiculous amount of importance they're given would be somewhat diminished.
Changing the system won't really do much IMO. The LC will still be as soulless as before, it'll just cater slightly more to a different type of person.
Well, most schools have sports teams and getting into art college generally is heavily based on a portfolio you submit beforehand.PurpleFistMixer wrote: »Academics are useful, yes, but we need artists and sportspeople (if that is a word) and carers and other things, surely such things have as important a role as anything else, if they're contributing to society.
I'm very in favour of the idea of producing more well rounded individuals rather than saying that some people are good at some things, others are good at other things and that we should let them concentrate on that area which they are good at. I think everyone should play a sport, everyone should study a broad range of academic subjects and everyone should have some outlet for creativity like music or poetry.
I don't think the LC should be changed, but students should be made be involved in more extra curricular activities.
But you can stare into space or draw cartoons.PurpleFistMixer wrote: »I can't just walk out of class.
(Or God forbid, study...)0 -
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True that. If people could just learn to be calm and confident going into exams, it'd help their grades much more than trying to learn all the tricks and hints in the book.Well yeah, but you could equally say that calmness and composure is something that should be rewarded.
I can dream...Changing the system won't really do much IMO. The LC will still be as soulless as before, it'll just cater slightly more to a different type of person.
Yeah, this is true, this is how I disagree with earlier essay I linked. Just because a person is good at one thing, it doesn't mean they can't be good at others, and having various disciplines can be beneficial. I still think it's important to find something to excel at, though, if only for personal fulfillment.I'm very in favour of the idea of producing more well rounded individuals rather than saying that some people are good at some things, others are good at other things and that we should let them concentrate on that area which they are good at. I think everyone should play a sport, everyone should study a broad range of academic subjects and everyone should have some outlet for creativity like music or poetry.
The problem is when you're in sixth year, so much emphasis is put on study etc., that anything extra curricular is dropped. One teacher commented the other day that sixth years shouldn't be allowed to attent school sports matches because they're too busy. If those activities (well, not attending matches, but things which aren't necessarily related to studying) were incorporated more into our curriculum, maybe we'd have to do them. (Though, as far as I know the English course has many books as required reading, but as they're not examined as it were, they're completely ignored.)I don't think the LC should be changed, but students should be made be involved in more extra curricular activities.
You should see my french pages. French has helped me with art more than any other class...But you can stare into space or draw cartoons.0 -
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I don't think students should be foced to do these at leaving cert level because some people simply cant get their head around these subjects.
Do you really think people being allowed to drop subjects purely because they're crap at them is a good idea? Seems counter-productive to me.
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