Is PC gaming dying?

silvine

Crysis' developers have said they won't make another PC exclusive game due to piracy while Epic's boss recently said that PC gaming is in "disarray".


http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/a95046/crytek-ditches-pc-exclusives-over-piracy.html

And we are seeing less and less titles released that are exclusive to the PC, while the ones that are released are usually months after a console release.

Apart from MMORPG games like World of Warcrarft, PC gaming seems to be in serious trouble.

Genghiz Cohen

I don't mind having non exclusive titles released to PC, that way consolers can buy it write reviews months before I have to fork out my hard earned cash, I get lots of time to mull over the story, game play and level design problems.

Gears of War for example, I played it on a friends X-Box and loved it, last Christmas I bought it for the PC and loved it even more.

As long as I don't have to wait too long for my games and they are coming to PC at all, I'm not too bothered.

Kiith

No

Hercule

kiith beat me to it

NO

Blazer

Add up the money made by WoW and it outperforms the top ten selling consoles games put together. So PC gaming is not dead..in fact they reckon in 10 years time consoles will be dead and PC gaming having a huge revival. Plus also Steam etc are not included in game sales.
Still console ports suck. Although I did like GoW on the Xbox but hated the pc version. Loved R6:Las Vegas though. Assasin's creed is a load of pants.
Basically I only use my xbox for sports/car games while FPS I play on my pc...the keyboard/mouse will be still around for a long time yet.

uglyjohn

dont forget strategy games, i cant imagine anyone playing supreme commander or company of heroes on a console.

MikeHoncho

uglyjohn wrote: »

dont forget strategy games, i cant imagine anyone playing supreme commander or company of heroes on a console.

Yes but these are niche minority games. They always have been but now that gaming is such a mass medium if a developer can make more money churning out console games accessible to the masses this is what they will do.

PC gaming is a very niche market. Anyone that says otherwise is talking out there swiss roll.

Sabre0001

The way that games for PC get to consumers needs to be changed really - STEAM has been very successful (and seems to have sorted any problems that first occurred) and some games are being developed for free and work off advertising revenues - Trackmania Nations (v. successful) and the upcoming QuakeLive.

There are certain games that work better on PC (FPS, Strategy) and others on Consoles (Beat-em-up, Sports) imo. Driving is 50/50.

However, consoles will always be more popular because a) they get exclusive releases (even exclusive to PC is eventually shipped over), b) no need to upgrade, c) related to b, it's cheaper., d) no complications - stick disc in & play (rather than check system specs & space, install, look for patches, etc).

bizmark

silvine wrote: »

Crysis' developers have said they won't make another PC exclusive game due to piracy while Epic's boss recently said that PC gaming is in "disarray".


http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/a95046/crytek-ditches-pc-exclusives-over-piracy.html

And we are seeing less and less titles released that are exclusive to the PC, while the ones that are released are usually months after a console release.

Apart from MMORPG games like World of Warcrarft, PC gaming seems to be in serious trouble.

Yep its piracy and not the retarded pc needed for a glorified tech demo which all in all didn't look that uber.

Stardock is where you should look to see how a proper company makes a successful pc game not these over hyper graphic's pimps whos idea of a good pc game is messured in their ability to forcing you to buy a new graphics card

d) no complications - stick disc in & play (rather than check system specs & space, install, look for patches, etc).

Not really true any more is it?

witnessmenow

If consoles start supporting M/KB pcs could start to be in trouble allright.

Also we are early enough in the life cycle of the next gen consoles, give it 2- 3 years and pcs will be far superior to them

seraphimvc

is it just me that still obsess my strategy and FPS games on pc?:(mouse and keyboard ftw!

Cuddlesworth

silvine wrote: »

Crysis' developers have said they won't make another PC exclusive game due to piracy while Epic's boss recently said that PC gaming is in "disarray".

Great, Crysis's was a glorified excuse to pimp out graphics and leave gameplay out. TBH, I bought and played maybe 2 to 3 hours tops. I got bored and went to COD4.

Epics games have made more money off of selling their engine then releasing any games. The reason, same as above their games are average and lazy. I wasn't even aware U3 tournament came out till I saw it in the shops a month or two later. They can leave the making and selling of games to people who care about the pc market as well as consoles. (Bio-shock, GOW etc).

silvine wrote: »

And we are seeing less and less titles released that are exclusive to the PC, while the ones that are released are usually months after a console release.

The fact that the new consoles are matched closely in hardware and were designed specifically with development kits to make ports from pc games easy has nothing to do with that fact. In the next 4 years you will see, better gfx cards, cpus, memory speeds and lastly huge increases in Access times with SSD drives. None of which you will see on the consoles.

And when a company wants to pimp their latest gfx engine to broaden revenues, you will see games coming back exclusively to pc's because consoles can't play them.

silvine wrote: »

Apart from MMORPG games like World of Warcrarft, PC gaming seems to be in serious trouble.

Steams doing quite well, as is any game which fully utilizes the sheer conectivity and versatility of pc's.

Maximilian

God not this argument again.

All the guy said if I recall is that like just about every other developer, they are not going to just do PC game exclusives and develop for consoles too. Hardly the end of the world nor a worrying precedent.

L31mr0d

Well, no it isn't dying.

Is it being crippled by Piracy? Yes.

If piracy didn't exist the PC as a gaming platform would be a lot more developed and I think we'd see a lot more console exclusives getting released on PC.

Piracy has gotten to the point where all you need is one person with a DSL connection to download the game and then he can share it with his friends. Heck if you lived in a place with only 56k speeds you could split up a download amongst your friends as they are split into rar archives, then combine them, unpack and burn as many copies of the game as you want.

What I think has made piracy explode is the easiness of it and its efficiency. If it took even a week to crack a game you'd get all the impatient gamers not waiting for a crack and just buying it. But as it stands literally hours after release the game can be downloaded with a crack included, and as patchs are released so are cracks of those patchs. The piracy machine has become finely tuned over the years to the point where if its software and can run on a pc you can download it.

The plus side to piracy though is open source games. There are a lot of fine free games out there. Also, companies are resorting to giving games away for free and bundling advertisements in game. Also piracy is pushing the evolution of online gaming. If game developers want people to buy a game they know they have to get them to validate their serial in their online database. If the game has a good SP campaign and MP tacked on as an afterthought gamers will pirate it. If the game revolves around great MP coop campaigns and versus matchs it will sell.

uglyjohn

MikeHoncho wrote: »

Yes but these are niche minority games. They always have been but now that gaming is such a mass medium if a developer can make more money churning out console games accessible to the masses this is what they will do.

PC gaming is a very niche market. Anyone that says otherwise is talking out there swiss roll.

true,but people can still make a lot of money supplying that niche. just because developers can sell more to a console doesnt mean they are going to ignore pcs.
as long as people have pcs in their homes, someone is going to try and sell them games to play on them.niche market or not.


anyway. he didnt say he wasnt going to develop for the pc anymore, just not exclusively.

Maximilian

L31mr0d wrote: »

The plus side to piracy though is open source games. There are a lot of fine free games out there. Also, companies are resorting to giving games away for free and bundling advertisements in game. Also piracy is pushing the evolution of online gaming. If game developers want people to buy a game they know they have to get them to validate their serial in their online database. If the game has a good SP campaign and MP tacked on as an afterthought gamers will pirate it. If the game revolves around great MP coop campaigns and versus matchs it will sell.

Its obviously pushing publishers to look at a different business models but that may not necessarily be a good thing for gamers. When I think of that stupid Airwaves chewing gum ad that was in one of the Splinter Cell games, I shudder at the thought of how such things may develop.

Of all the brilliant games developers that have gone out of business over the years, I wonder how great a part piracy played in that (I'm thinking of Looking Glass in particular).

We all hate copy protection when its intrusive and cumbersome but I'm all for copy protection if its seemless - something like Steam. I hope thats the way things progress.

Kiith

L31mr0d wrote: »

Well, no it isn't dying.

Is it being crippled by Piracy? Yes.

If piracy didn't exist the PC as a gaming platform would be a lot more developed and I think we'd see a lot more console exclusives getting released on PC.

Piracy has gotten to the point where all you need is one person with a DSL connection to download the game and then he can share it with his friends. Heck if you lived in a place with only 56k speeds you could split up a download amongst your friends as they are split into rar archives, then combine them, unpack and burn as many copies of the game as you want.

What I think has made piracy explode is the easiness of it and its efficiency. If it took even a week to crack a game you'd get all the impatient gamers not waiting for a crack and just buying it. But as it stands literally hours after release the game can be downloaded with a crack included, and as patchs are released so are cracks of those patchs. The piracy machine has become finely tuned over the years to the point where if its software and can run on a pc you can download it.

The plus side to piracy though is open source games. There are a lot of fine free games out there. Also, companies are resorting to giving games away for free and bundling advertisements in game. Also piracy is pushing the evolution of online gaming. If game developers want people to buy a game they know they have to get them to validate their serial in their online database. If the game has a good SP campaign and MP tacked on as an afterthought gamers will pirate it. If the game revolves around great MP coop campaigns and versus matchs it will sell.

Some of what you say i definatly agree with, but unfortunatly, the piracy sector is so strong that they can even run perfect multiplayer. COD4 has suffered quite a bit from piracy, as you can play the game, perfectly, on cracked servers. I hope that companies (and governments) start to take a much harder approach to piracy. Unfortunatly, its very hard to stop piracy. The one piece of software in recent years that really did its job well, was Starforce. This seriously limited the ability of cracking, but it was way too intrusive and installed software without our consent.

thelordofcheese

L31mr0d wrote: »

Also piracy is pushing the evolution of online gaming. If game developers want people to buy a game they know they have to get them to validate their serial in their online database.

Or in otherwords, publishers and developers are punishing the average consumer for the actions of pirates.

Case in point: The stupidity of having to validate my singleplayer, offline game via an online service after i've paid for the thing.
Half-life 2 & Steam, i'm looking at you two.

Maximilian

thelordofcheese wrote: »

Or in otherwords, publishers and developers are punishing the average consumer for the actions of pirates.

Case in point: The stupidity of having to validate my singleplayer, offline game via an online service after i've paid for the thing.
Half-life 2 & Steam, i'm looking at you two.

I have to say. That doesn't bother me in the slightest. In fact I see an inordinate amount of complaints from people about this Steam validation. Virtually everyone these days has a serviceable internet connection, so I really fail to see the problem.

Of course, if someone has no internet access I can understand why they would be upset. Although how they manage to get online and complain about it is a mystery.

Whats more of a pain in my opinion is having to type in stupid serial codes or having to put the DVD in the drive to play it.

L31mr0d

I personally love Valves business model. Modern PC gamers SHOULD have an internet connection tbh. If you don't want one, then buy a console (even then there's firmware updates and online play to be missed out on)

Came across this article on their business model which was released yesterday.

http://www.megagames.com/news/html/pc/valvedistributionmodelluresgamersintopiracy.shtml

Of my friends that are pirates, the only games actually bought in their collection are games they downloaded through steam.

Maximilian

L31mr0d wrote: »

I personally love Valves business model. Modern PC gamers SHOULD have an internet connection tbh. If you don't want one, then buy a console (even then there's firmware updates and online play to be missed out on)

Came across this article on their business model which was released yesterday.

http://www.megagames.com/news/html/pc/valvedistributionmodelluresgamersintopiracy.shtml

Of my friends that are pirates, the only games actually bought in their collection are games they downloaded through steam.

I think that "temptation" factor he talks about is a really big factor. AFAIK Doom3 was pirated to death in particular.

Stev_o

Tbh if PC Gaming is in anyway dying its the fact that technology and complicated game structures are getting more more more time demanding. We are seeing games in development for 2/3 years and never ending delays then when they do get realised there is a mixed argument as to whether 2/3 or more years of development really shows the quality of the game. So we have a series of games in a pile if disappointment, a massive pile of games under the cheap as tie in's, the growing easy to make money but risky MMO's and then occasionally the hidden gem by developers that now how to make games the community wants.


As someone pointed out PC Gaming is a niche market and at the moment there isnt a huge amount of quality titles out on the market. Sadly most companies wont risk making a unique game and then loosing money on it for what ever reason most will go the safe root and make games that will make them easy money.

thelordofcheese

Maximilian wrote: »

I have to say. That doesn't bother me in the slightest. In fact I see an inordinate amount of complaints from people about this Steam validation. Virtually everyone these days has a serviceable internet connection, so I really fail to see the problem.

Of course, if someone has no internet access I can understand why they would be upset. Although how they manage to get online and complain about it is a mystery.

'net cafes and University connections, off the top of my head.
Another mystery solved.....

Maximilian wrote: »

Whats more of a pain in my opinion is having to type in stupid serial codes or having to put the DVD in the drive to play it.

The flip side being that serial codes will always work and aren't relying on your internet connection being active so that you can validate your purchase against valves servers.
And unless you hands have fallen off you should be able to master the basic task of putting the CD/DVD in the drive.

It's bull****, plain and simple, I could understand if it were a multiplayer game, that'd make sense. But for a game with no online components whatsoever? Valve can go climb a wall of dicks.

Dcully

No its far from dying.
If we are to believe Valve i read somewhere there are 14 million steam users.
wow has 11 million paying subscribers,other mmo games like lotro,eve,eq2 to name a few have many more million paying subscribers.
Many many more genres and games on pc are purchased and downloaded online too.
When digital distribution is taken into account the pc is far from dead and is infact thriving.

Mantel

Steam and HL2 is a pretty crappy example of validation, I mean, how long ago was that? late 2004/2005. That's how long ago. It's gotten a bit better over the last few years, the real example you should be pointing at is BioShock. It validated itself with a server and in some cases if you formated your machine you couldn't play it again. Alot of people learned from the HL2/Steam thing.

As for Crysis, it's not sales that's pushing the developers to consoles, it's the bad feedback they got about the game. Crysis went platinum, how many recent games can you say that about? Sure it took 3 or 4 months to do that....

Cuddlesworth

Kiith wrote: »

The one piece of software in recent years that really did its job well, was Starforce. This seriously limited the ability of cracking, but it was way too intrusive and installed software without our consent.

Oh sweet Jebus, you are joking right? Starforce stopped nothing and introduced problems only for those who weren't bothered circumventing it.

satchmo

Piracy and digital distribution doesn't change the fact that the PC is inherently more difficult to develop for - the broad diversity in hardware and software configurations makes it a real headache to test reliably.

Couple that with the fact that developers expect the PC version of a big budget title to only sell something like a tenth of a console version (regardless of the reason), it's not surprising that many developers are turning away from the PC in order to favour the more developer-friendly consoles. Without some sort of PC hardware and software standardization (which is pretty much the opposite of the PC gamer's ideology), things aren't going to change any time soon.

_CreeD_

Whatever about the rest of the arguments please do not quote anyone from Epic on PC gaming.
UT3 Sucked gameplay wise, fell way short of it's promised feature set and was at best an Alpha version at release so Epic blamed the PC games market globally for sales failure. The same way they had Sweeney recently bashing PC hardware and the need to constantly upgrade (Which is pretty funny considering they had just made one of the most resource intensive game engines) and also stating that hardware accelerated audio was useless, which had nothing to do with the fact that using EAX in UT2004 broke voice comms and outright crashed UT3. CliffyB has been on their console dev. team since GoW and doesn't care about the PC anymore (at least he's honest about it). In short EPIC majorly fk'd up their franchise and blame it all on the market and hardware, not their own lazy asses.
Their UT3 forums are devoid of PC players as they are now pariahs on this platform.

(rant over...carry on )

Cunny-Funt

Sabre0001 wrote: »

no complications - stick disc in & play (rather than check system specs & space, install, look for patches, etc).

This is true during the last generation. Iread the "whos got GTA4" thread and I couldnt believe my eyes when most of the posts where "got it now, just installing" and "waiting for it to finishs up installing the game" WTF? I thought they were on consoles?

witnessmenow wrote: »

If consoles start supporting M/KB pcs could start to be in trouble allright.

Also we are early enough in the life cycle of the next gen consoles, give it 2- 3 years and pcs will be far superior to them

2 VERY good points. The consoles are starting to get the negative issues of the PC but if they started incorporation the positive aspects, hell I could see A LOT of PC users buying consoles.

Think about it, full, and I mean FULL on mouse and keyboards functionality and a proper internet browser? I could just plug in my mouse and keyboard and my wide screen monitor like I do with my laptop and have the best of both worlds. Just use the console like I would a gaming pc.


& on your 2nd point, yeah currently the consoles caught up with the pc but it would be long before the consoles are left behind as always and it'll be just like it was with the ps2 and PC.

Bad thing about that though is, of course most games will still be made on the consoles.

I remember GTA3 looked decent, but by the time vice city came out it was really annoying playing a game with such bad GFX compared to what my PC was able to do and the PC exclusive games I was playing. PS2 was years behind at the PC at that stage.

AlmightyCushion

I think the consoles are already being left behind. A 9600gt or a 8800gt would probably outperform the graphics chip in a ps3 (wasn't that meant to be the equivalent of 2 6800 ultras?) or a 360. They can be had fairly cheaply and will work in any computer with a half decent power supply.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

and if you had two 9800's you wouldn't need central heating, the PC is just so much more economical