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Rent relief or money back

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  • 08-05-2008 11:29am
    #1
    Tim Robbins
    Registered Users Posts: 8,989 ✭✭✭


    Hi,
    Landlord says you can do the tax thing get your money back i.e. 400 Euro a year, or he'll knock 600 euro off the rent? Just to let him know.

    What should I do and why? Anything to be worried about?


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    #2
    mikemac
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,986 ✭✭✭✭mikemac


    The offer of €600 off is conditional on you not claiming rent relief. The landlord isn’t paying tax on your rent money. He can't stop you claiming rent relief but he wants you to not to apply for rent relieft and then it's in the system and it'd be part of his declared income.

    Accept the landlords offer to knock €600 off the rent.
    Then when you move out apply to the revenue for your €400 rent relief. You win! :D

    Then get the revenue to audit the landlord. Times are hard and the Revenue will be delighted if they find money due.

    Is that harsh? The landlord is claiming thousands in mortgage interest relief and wants you to forego your miserable €400 rent relief allowance? Fcuk em


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    #3
    egan007
    Registered Users Posts: 2,934 ✭✭✭egan007


    There is no obligation on you to claim tax relief or report your landlords incomes.

    In effect (to you) the 600euro is Tax relief at source.

    If you are not worried about the ehtics of your landlords tax affairs then you don't have a problem taking the 600Euro discount.

    This might cause issue if you were receiving anything other than reduced rent.


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    #4
    egan007
    Registered Users Posts: 2,934 ✭✭✭egan007


    micmclo wrote: »

    Is that harsh? The landlord is claiming thousands in mortgage interest relief and wants you to forego your miserable €400 rent relief allowance? Fcuk em


    If you take both then there is no doubt that Karma will come back and bite you in the ass......


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    #5
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Tim Robbins wrote: »
    Hi,
    Landlord says you can do the tax thing get your money back i.e. 400 Euro a year, or he'll knock 600 euro off the rent? Just to let him know.

    What should I do and why? Anything to be worried about?

    Ehhh- the only reason he/she would be mentioning things like this is if the tenancy isn't registered/tax affairs are not in order (though the fact that they seem happy enough for you to claim it is a bit confusing). Legally you are entitled to a credit for rent-relief, its nothing whatsoever to do with your landlord. Its a tax credit, not a cheque into your hand. The right course of action is to claim your relief and leave it at that. Revenue will catch up with the landlord, probably sooner rather than later- given their new computer system, if his affairs aren't in order. That however is not your concern.


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    #6
    Tim Robbins
    Registered Users Posts: 8,989 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    smccarrick wrote: »
    Ehhh- the only reason he/she would be mentioning things like this is if the tenancy isn't registered/tax affairs are not in order (though the fact that they seem happy enough for you to claim it is a bit confusing). Legally you are entitled to a credit for rent-relief, its nothing whatsoever to do with your landlord. Its a tax credit, not a cheque into your hand. The right course of action is to claim your relief and leave it at that. Revenue will catch up with the landlord, probably sooner rather than later- given their new computer system, if his affairs aren't in order. That however is not your concern.

    Thanks for replies. I think the landlord only own one place and has moved back in with his parents to save money. I would assume he'd pay more than 600 euro in tax and that is why he is offering it to me. Also I reckon if he sells it he's probably hoping he doesn't have to pay capital gains tax, but then again is this my problem?

    Bascially, just wanted to get some feedback as what most people are doing. Don't want to p*ss him off. At the sametime he said no worries if I want to do the tax thing just to let him know.

    the other option would be to haggle and get more than 600 euro, what do people think?


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    #7
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Tim Robbins wrote: »
    the other option would be to haggle and get more than 600 euro, what do people think?

    The honest and fair thing to do is to ring Revenue and claim your rent relief, and to advise him that this is what you are doing. I would not suggest anything other than this. Keep it all above board and legal. Let him handle the tax implications- its his problem not yours. By trying to exploit a possible non-compliant tax situation to your own ends, were he ever audited, you could actually be found to be complicit in the activity and treated accordingly.

    Shane


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    #8
    Tim Robbins
    Registered Users Posts: 8,989 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    smccarrick wrote: »
    The honest and fair thing to do is to ring Revenue and claim your rent relief, and to advise him that this is what you are doing. I would not suggest anything other than this. Keep it all above board and legal. Let him handle the tax implications- its his problem not yours. By trying to exploit a possible non-compliant tax situation to your own ends, were he ever audited, you could actually be found to be complicit in the activity and treated accordingly.

    Shane

    Fair enough. Thanks for your comment. What if the Landlord wants to do the rent a room thing even though he's not living there?


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    #9
    Ste.phen
    Registered Users Posts: 2,808 ✭✭✭Ste.phen


    By definition it's not a rent-a-room thing if the landlord doesn't live there.

    (obvious exceptions, people for whom it's still their PPR, but they spent a large percentage of their time travelling with work, etc)


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    #10
    Phaetonman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 284 ✭✭Phaetonman


    Take the offer. Then when leaving you can apply for rent relief for the years past.


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    #11
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Phaetonman wrote: »
    Take the offer. Then when leaving you can apply for rent relief for the years past.

    And potentially end up as a material witness in a Revenue probe, if the landlord explains the deal he made with you.......


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    #12
    niceirishfella
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭niceirishfella


    micmclo wrote: »
    The landlord is claiming thousands in mortgage interest relief and wants you to forego your miserable €400 rent relief allowance? Fcuk em


    errrrm,The landlord can only claim mortgage interest relief on his or her principal residence...ie. the house they live in themself..........not any additional properties he or she owns or has let out.


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    #13
    mikemac
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,986 ✭✭✭✭mikemac


    niceirishfella wrote: »
    errrrm,The landlord can only claim mortgage interest relief on his or her principal residence...ie. the house they live in themself..........not any additional properties he or she owns or has let out.

    Oops, I stand corrected, thanks :)


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    #14
    Phaetonman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 284 ✭✭Phaetonman


    smccarrick wrote: »
    And potentially end up as a material witness in a Revenue probe, if the landlord explains the deal he made with you.......

    'what deal your hounour, I recieved no money'

    Never scam a scammer.


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    #15
    niceirishfella
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭niceirishfella


    micmclo wrote: »
    Oops, I stand corrected, thanks :)

    And just to be clear, I'm not a LANDLORD!:D - althought with that post it sounded like i was defending them - which I'm not.

    Re; the quandry the OP has...............well, its grossly dishonst of the landlord to ask this of his tenant - its basically tax evasion.......and by entering into a deal with him, you are complicate in that.
    Just my 2 cents.


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    #16
    starky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭starky


    Tim Robbins wrote: »
    if I want to do the tax thing

    Its great the way paying tax in Ireland is optional ;-)


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    #17
    BigglesMcGee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 501 ✭✭✭BigglesMcGee


    micmclo wrote: »
    The offer of €600 off is conditional on you not claiming rent relief. The landlord isn’t paying tax on your rent money. He can't stop you claiming rent relief but he wants you to not to apply for rent relieft and then it's in the system and it'd be part of his declared income.

    Accept the landlords offer to knock €600 off the rent.
    Then when you move out apply to the revenue for your €400 rent relief. You win! :D

    Then get the revenue to audit the landlord. Times are hard and the Revenue will be delighted if they find money due.

    Is that harsh? The landlord is claiming thousands in mortgage interest relief and wants you to forego your miserable €400 rent relief allowance? Fcuk em

    I agree. Do this.
    There is no law that says you must claim the tax relief now. So take both.
    You can even claim your tax back a number of years later.


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    #18
    beeno67
    Registered Users Posts: 1,218 ✭✭✭beeno67


    niceirishfella wrote: »
    And just to be clear, I'm not a LANDLORD!:D - althought with that post it sounded like i was defending them - which I'm not.

    Re; the quandry the OP has...............well, its grossly dishonst of the landlord to ask this of his tenant - its basically tax evasion.......and by entering into a deal with him, you are complicate in that.
    Just my 2 cents.

    No he wouldn't be. If he gets landlord to reduce rent and then effectively reports him by claiming rent relief, he is just punishing landlord for being dishonest. Screw the bastard I say.


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    #19
    Afuera
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭Afuera


    The mind really boggles at how blatant this landlord is. He sounds totally clueless about what he could be setting himself up for.

    As was stated before the OP would be perfectely entitled to take the discount up front and then make a claim for the rent relief, up to 4 years after the relevant tax year.

    Taking it up a notch or two, the tenant could make the situation even more difficult by simply refusing to pay rent after the first six months. The landlord would have to go to the PRTB to get this sorted out (any other action would be illegal) so the cat would be well and truly out of the bag by the time it was resolved. If the landlord is trying to avoid paying a stamp duty clawback and/or CGT on the future sale of the property, it's quite possible that it would cost him more to pursue the unpaid rent.

    BTW, I'm not condoning or recommending any of the actions above. Simply, I find it crazy that someone would go into a business action that could leave them so open to being screwed over.


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    #20
    niceirishfella
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭niceirishfella


    beeno67 wrote: »
    No he wouldn't be. If he gets landlord to reduce rent and then effectively reports him by claiming rent relief, he is just punishing landlord for being dishonest. Screw the bastard I say.

    Hi Beeno,
    I meant he'd be "Morally" complicate in it - karma and all of that..........anyways.


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    #21
    Phaetonman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 284 ✭✭Phaetonman


    Karma and morals are pure fantasy.

    Lets deal with something real here, ie. money in the tenants back pocket and money in the exchequers purse.


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    #22
    worded
    Registered Users Posts: 4,578 ✭✭✭worded


    A deal is a deal no matter what you do.

    Some landlords can be unfair (Im not one of them), but you dont have to sink to their level and fcuk them over on a deal. Justify it whatever way you want but given the opportunity it looks like everyone wants to be as greedy / dishonest as some of them. A deal is a deal.

    Oh is it 600 x your tax rate? = FA anyway.


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