Scotland's Shame

gucci

I'm not trying to insult or incite anyone here, but I'm heading down to Cardiff for the Heineken Cup Final, and I will be interested to see how Munster/Toulouse fans will interact and behave, no doubt the Munster guys will be drinking lots too!

therecklessone

gucci wrote: »

I'm not trying to insult or incite anyone here, but I'm heading down to Cardiff for the Heineken Cup Final, and I will be interested to see how Munster/Toulouse fans will interact and behave, no doubt the Munster guys will be drinking lots too!

Speaking of Cardiff, they had a right old tear up the weekend of their FA Cup semi-final and I'd expect a bit of bother this weekend vs Pompey.

dc69

gucci wrote: »

I'm not trying to insult or incite anyone here, but I'm heading down to Cardiff for the Heineken Cup Final, and I will be interested to see how Munster/Toulouse fans will interact and behave, no doubt the Munster guys will be drinking lots too!

Not too good after tolouse cut them to bits:)

LuckyLloyd

The attempt at an alternative narrative of the events of Wednesday night as linked from the Daily Record or posted by FRM - that:

- it wasn't THAT bad;
- it wasn't the Rangers fans fault;
- all of the blame lies with the police;

just confirms to me that UEFA need to hand out the banstick so that a clear message is sent and Rangers FC and their majority of decent supporters go out of their way to alienate the cretins who rioted on Wednesday night. Otherwise the apologists will fuzz the issue and those that acted the bollix on Wednesday will do it again after the next losing away trip.

big b

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

The attempt at an alternative narrative of the events of Wednesday night as linked from the Daily Record or posted by FRM - that:

- it wasn't THAT bad;
- it wasn't the Rangers fans fault;
- all of the blame lies with the police;

just confirms to me that UEFA need to hand out the banstick so that a clear message is sent and Rangers FC and their majority of decent supporters go out of their way to alienate the cretins who rioted on Wednesday night. Otherwise the apologists will fuzz the issue and those that acted the bollix on Wednesday will do it again after the next losing away trip.

What a load of mince this post is, tbh.
Unless of course you can post links to show otherwise. With specifics, not your interpretation of what posts/links are alluding to.

LuckyLloyd

big b wrote: »

What a load of mince this post is, tbh.
Unless of course you can post links to show otherwise. With specifics, not your interpretation of what posts/links are alluding to.

lol

Killme00

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/r/rangers/7404660.stm

Uefa powerless to act!!

Mr. Presentable

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

The attempt at an alternative narrative of the events of Wednesday night as linked from the Daily Record or posted by FRM - that:

- it wasn't THAT bad;
- it wasn't the Rangers fans fault;
- all of the blame lies with the police;

just confirms to me that UEFA need to hand out the banstick so that a clear message is sent and Rangers FC and their majority of decent supporters go out of their way to alienate the cretins who rioted on Wednesday night. Otherwise the apologists will fuzz the issue and those that acted the bollix on Wednesday will do it again after the next losing away trip.

The irony is that because it was in Manchester it must be the clubs (Rangers) fault, yet when there was trouble in Italy/France etc it was the police fault.

Until people become sufficiently civilised to behave themselves there will always be the potential for trouble.

jimmyboy

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article1166626.ece

here's the other side of the story.
Just watch the whole thing.

Eirebear

I was with my 14 year old brother in Glasgow city centre today.

He was wearing his Rangers jersey.

He was called a "scumbag" by a man who looked in his 30's.

If the kicking me and my mate took on wednesday eening didnt, then i reckon this may prove its society's problem....not just Rangers.

Otacon

Eirebear wrote: »

I was with my 14 year old brother in Glasgow city centre today.

He was wearing his Rangers jersey.

He was called a "scumbag" by a man who looked in his 30's.

If the kicking me and my mate took on wednesday eening didnt, then i reckon this may prove its society's problem....not just Rangers.

No, it proves some 30-something is an a**hole!

Eirebear

Otacon wrote: »

No, it proves some 30-something is an a**hole!

Mate, i am not condoning what happened on Wednesday. It is embarrasing as a Rangers fan to see these kind of things connected with our club.

Otacon

Eirebear wrote: »

Mate, i am not condoning what happened on Wednesday. It is embarrasing as a Rangers fan to see these kind of things connected with our club.

There's bad eggs everywhere, in the Rangers contingant of fans, society in general; what I am going to leave you with is unfortunately, they are the ones noticed most. Its not right, but its the way of the world.

OPENROAD

therecklessone wrote: »

, because there was no signs to suggest what block or row we were near, and the match stewards were on strike that week so only had about 15 Spurs stewards to advise us on what to do. Like all of our away games in Europe, we were told to sit in an empty seat we could find, as they weren't made aware of the seating arrangements either.

This is common for European matches, absolutely mad imo,I have heard similar stories from Arsenal fans, clubs hosting matches should be forced to organize things better.

guinnessdrinker

I have just watched the video of the lone policeman being attacked by a mob of Rangers fans, it was truely sickening. I can only imagine what was not caught on camera.

I feel sorry for the genuine Rangers fans but I believe that Rangers Football Club should be punished severely. By banning or at least having them play European matches behind closed doors, or whatever way UEFA see fit. But the fact is they should be punished. This will send out a message to the fans that disgrace themselfs and the club that this type of behaviour will not be tolerated.

Unfortunately for the genuine Rangers fans they will be punished in the process but a strong singal must by UEFA of not tolerating this type of behaviour.

Eirebear

Murray Statement

RANGERS chairman Sir David Murray has insisted that the club supports the severest action being taken against those involved in trouble in Manchester on Wednesday.

He said: "Since Wednesday night the Club has worked non-stop analysing the disturbances which occurred in Manchester.

"On behalf of the club I am grateful for the recognition from Manchester City Council, Greater Manchester Police and many Mancunians that the overwhelming majority of our supporters behaved well during their visit to the city and were a credit to the Club.

"We deplore the actions of a small minority who were involved in the disturbances and support the severest action taken against them.

"We are continuing to liaise with the police and city councils in Manchester and Glasgow and will be assessing all relevant information over the coming days, including numerous reports given to us by our supporters, before making any further statement."

The Club can confirm today that we are already taking steps to deal with the people who have appeared in court and have been convicted of involvement in the disturbances on Wednesday, and they can consider themselves banned from any further recognised involvement with the Club.

The Club will process bans with immediate effect.

Unfortunately there is nothing else he can say TBH, but this will still not be good enough for certain parties.

OPENROAD

Eirebear wrote: »

These would be the same English Police who regularly handed out beatings to people in the 70's and 80's for having an Irish accent yes?

And what does this to do with 2008. Come on mate, I know you are getting a hard time from some people and you are defending your team but come on, my experience with the police from going to matches has been excellent in particular the Met.

KdjaCL

Eirebear wrote: »

Unfortunately there is nothing else he can say TBH, but this will still not be good enough for certain parties.

irrelevant you put 100,000 people into any city and let them drink all day and there will be problems.


English police at games are brilliant easily the best in the world at containing a crowd. But due to money influx the stadiums are designed with safety in mind, cant say that about any other country i have been in.


kdjac

OhNoYouDidn't

Eirebear wrote: »

Murray Statement



Unfortunately there is nothing else he can say TBH, but this will still not be good enough for certain parties.

Its not what Murrays says that is the problem, he appears at least to be putting the blame where it should be. Its FRM's attitude, which is reflected through cyber space and sections of the Scotch media that Rangers fans rioting is everyone elses fault. The cops, the council, UEFA, Chelsea fans, Burgerking - anyone but those who kicked the shít out of policemen, fought amongst themselves, threw bottles, stabbed opposition fans etc.

It is the exact same sort of 'wasnae our fault' stuff that you were coming out with when Rangers fans caused mayhem in Barcelona.....

What a few of us have been slaughtered for saying on here recently, that Rangers are the worst behaved British fans, is now undeniable.

Its up to guys like you to reclaim your club EB.

OhNoYouDidn't

KdjaCL wrote: »

irrelevant you put 100,000 people into any city and let them drink all day and there will be problems.

Please dont make me say the word 'Seville'.....

Eirebear

Scottish or Scots

Scotch is and egg or a whiskey!

OhNoYouDidn't

Eirebear wrote: »

Scottish or Scots

Scotch is and egg or a whiskey!

I think whiskey is quite appropriate when discussing the Scots football press corps....

Eirebear

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I think whiskey is quite appropriate when discussing the Scots football press corps....

is that some sort of yolk?

OhNoYouDidn't

Eirebear wrote: »

is that some sort of yolk?

they should be beaten....

we could do this all night! lol

Eirebear

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

they should be beaten....

we could do this all night! lol

We could, but im sure the Mods would soon whisk us off to another forum....

OhNoYouDidn't

Eirebear wrote: »

We could, but im sure the Mods would soon whisk us off to another forum....

and since my last ban I have been walking on eggshells.... :eek:

justfortherecor

eggs.

Eirebear

This could turn into a cracking thread now......

OhNoYouDidn't

Eirebear wrote: »

This could turn into a cracking thread now......

lets hope the Celtic fans don't scramble it.

I do hope Ceuellar gets poached by an English side during the summer.

KdjaCL

kdjac

OhNoYouDidn't

KdjaCL wrote: »

Thank you for your eggsellent contribution!!

Eirebear

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

lets hope the Celtic fans don't scramble it.

I do hope Ceuellar gets poached by an English side during the summer.

Cuellar aint going nowhere, im sure he will Soldier on for us next year.

Time to put uncle davie into retirement though, he is looking particularly fried.

OhNoYouDidn't

Eirebear wrote: »

Cuellar aint going nowhere, im sure he will Soldier on for us next year.

Time to put uncle davie into retirement though, he is looking particularly fried.

Either way, its an eggciting end to the season.

Eirebear

Have we ever went this many posts withou an argument?
Eggstraordinary!

OhNoYouDidn't

Eirebear wrote: »

Have we ever went this many posts withou an argument?
Eggstraordinary!

So long as no-one mentions Benedict.....

Got to go the battery on my laptop is running low

Pal

Rangers should voluntarily withdraw from European competion next season before they are banned. Alternatively they should voluntarily play their home European games next year behind closed doors and accept no away tickets from opponents.

This would go some way towards restoring some self respect to a club that is widely reviled.

What these so called 'people' did in Manchester was atrocious. There must be accountability and they should hold themselves to account.

I won't hold my breath.

leninbenjamin

Pal wrote: »

Rangers should voluntarily withdraw from European competion next season before they are banned. Alternatively they should voluntarily play their home European games next year behind closed doors and accept no away tickets from opponents.

This would go some way towards restoring some self respect to a club that is widely reviled.

What these so called 'people' did in Manchester was atrocious. There must be accountability and they should hold themselves to account.

I won't hold my breath.

tis all very easy to say that, but excessive measures could easily turn a minority into a majority. imagine not letting fans into see their own team? add a bit of alcohol and i'd say there would be a disturbance 99% of the time for any club.

scruff321

thats rangers filth for ya!

SantryRed

scruff321 wrote: »

thats rangers filth for ya!

Very well constructed point:rolleyes:

Eirebear

scruff321 wrote: »

thats rangers filth for ya!

13 pages of discussion and debate. and all we needed was you.
Thanks for that! (Insert old rolls eyes smiley here)

KdjaCL

scruff321 banned.



kdjac

Eirebear

Did that leave him with egg on his face?!:p

lordgoat

Eirebear wrote: »

Did that leave him with egg on his face?!:p

Just wondering Eire, do you think the football team (rangers) deserve some form of punishment? If so what would you think fair.

It truly was a horrible night for football and i was really sorry to hear about the treatment you and your wife received. This bigotry and pseudo-nationalism/patriotism pisses me off. In all fairness what satisfaction does anyone get out of calling someone protestant or catholic? (Prob the wrong place to deal with this question!)

Eirebear

lordgoat wrote: »

Just wondering Eire, do you think the football team (rangers) deserve some form of punishment? If so what would you think fair.

It truly was a horrible night for football and i was really sorry to hear about the treatment you and your wife received. This bigotry and pseudo-nationalism/patriotism pisses me off. In all fairness what satisfaction does anyone get out of calling someone protestant or catholic? (Prob the wrong place to deal with this question!)

I'll tackle the easy part of that first, Myself and the Mrs are fine, i dont have a number for the other fella (hes a mate of a mate) so i need to try and get hold of him before i figure out how i feel about it. Thanks for the sympathy though.

For me the problem that happened to us, was carried out by the EXACT same sort of people as the scum who caused the trouble in Manchester, utter louts who's only reason for attaching themselves to a team is that they are an excuse for hatred and violence.

As for Rangers being punished, i really dont know.
On one hand, if it was any other team I wouldnt be as sympathetic, I wouldnt have heard as many stories from friends and family who went down there and had a great time, i would only believe the sensationalism and scandalization from the media.

On the other hand, this was reportedly the biggest movement of people for a football match in Britain, with some reports suggesting as high as 250,000.
I would suggest it was around 150-175,000.
GMC and the GMP must take some blame in this, as they had prepared for no more than 90,000.

I also dont see what UEFA could hold the club culpable for, its not a breakdown in club security or even in the vicinity of the game, so i would say they are powerless.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

BaZmO*

ziggy wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Really?

allybhoy

IMO I personally dont think it will be up to Rangers to provide their own punishment as I believe UEFA will hand out some sort of ban.

Also as a Celtic fan who's been to Seville, Liverpool, Blackburn, Milan last year and Barca this year I have to say that our fans behave impeccably away from home. In milan when we were walking out of the San Siro (after we lost :mad:) we got a guard of honour from milan supporters and stewards. In Barca there was a huge police presence throughout the city as Rangers had caused a lot of damage when they were there a couple of months before and the square at the top of Las Ramblas was completely closed off to the public. The police soon learned however that Celtic fans were just there for a party and after a couple of days were more than happy to pose with supporters for pix etc.

I also believe that because Rangers have caused trouble away from home, it spurs celtic supporters to not cause any trouble as "we dont want to be like them uns" At the fanzone in barca there were green t-shirts being handed out with with like a no litter symbol on it. With "Celtic Fans keeping barca tidy, whoever wins on the pitch we cant lose off it" written on them.

I do feel genuinely sorry for proper Rangers supporters like Eirebear etc, as I personally believe that the kind of scenes that were witnessed on Weds are not instigated by true Scottish Rangers Supporters. I believe that some of the trouble is started by English football hooligans who just attach themselves to Rangers for whatever reason. Not sure if anyone has ever seen that documentary where Donal Macintyre went undercover with some london hooligans and they also supported Rangers, simply for the trouble.

A Dub in Glasgo

UEFA cannot hand out a ban based on the riots in Manchester as they have no jurisdiction outside the stadium. Even in the stadium, UEFA have said they will not take any action following the Rangers fans stabbing the Zenit fan. I do not belive Bain & Co who claim that the rioters were not Rangers fans.

Dion Fanny in todays Independent explains away the behaviour by claiming it is not surprising considering the big screen failed and the chaps were drinking!

OPENROAD

allybhoy wrote: »

. I believe that some of the trouble is started by English football hooligans who just attach themselves to Rangers for whatever reason. Not sure if anyone has ever seen that documentary where Donal Macintyre went undercover with some london hooligans and they also supported Rangers, simply for the trouble.

No evidence to suggest that. I did see the doucumenary though some years ago that you refer to

allybhoy

OPENROAD wrote: »

No evidence to suggest that. I did see the doucumenary though some years ago that you refer to

Well is that documentary not evidence in itself?