N22 - Macroom to Ballyvourney (Macroom Bypass) [open to traffic]

road_high

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Fermoy needs a second bridge though and it’s shocking how the M8 has no access to the N72. It would have been very easy to have N72 to M8 south access but they thought against it.

With no access to the M8, all N72 traffic has to go through the town centre.

I’ve always wondered this was. Presume it was down to costs and effort. Quite a height down from the M8 to the N72 in the valley below which probably was expensive to include

Hibernicis

road_high wrote: »

I’ve always wondered this was. Presume it was down to costs and effort. Quite a height down from the M8 to the N72 in the valley below which probably was expensive to include

Wasn't it more to do with the risk of toll dodging, it was either risk that or toll the Fermoy exits which would not have been popular.....

marno21

Cork Trucker wrote: »

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/County-Engineer-Cork-to-Kerry-N22-most-dangerous-road-in-the-country-c07ad069-7619-48f1-a4ce-df0ed66697c7-ds

Indeed. Flagged in TII’s pre NDP analysis also. The four roads flagged as the worst were the N2, N4, N20 and N22. The only bad stretch from those not included in the NDP was Macroom-Ovens.

partyguinness

Cork Trucker wrote: »

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/County-Engineer-Cork-to-Kerry-N22-most-dangerous-road-in-the-country-c07ad069-7619-48f1-a4ce-df0ed66697c7-ds

"The bypass has been awaited in the area for more than 20 years."


That's an understatement. I distinctly recall engineers walking the area and pegging out potential routes with different coloured markers back in the first half of the 80's. By the late 80's they had settled on the route past Ballyvourney (out of 3 options).

hans aus dtschl

Hibernicis wrote: »

Wasn't it more to do with the risk of toll dodging, it was either risk that or toll the Fermoy exits which would not have been popular.....

Yep, I think you're right.
I remember quite a lot of local objection to tolling in Fermoy at the time.

Cork Trucker

partyguinness wrote: »

"The bypass has been awaited in the area for more than 20 years."


That's an understatement. I distinctly recall engineers walking the area and pegging out potential routes with different coloured markers back in the first half of the 80's. By the late 80's they had settled on the route past Ballyvourney (out of 3 options).

Someone here told me in the not too distant past this all began around 1986 which would roughly tie in with what you're saying.

partyguinness

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Someone here told me in the not too distant past this all began around 1986 which would roughly tie in with what you're saying.

Oh it was defo even a bit earlier- 83/84.


A friend of mine (and I've seen this at the planning office) applied for PP on a site in '85 and it was refused on the basis that they were still deciding the route (but that was not mentioned as an official reason). One of the options had the road running a few hundred yards away so they kept having to reapply. Eventually they went for the another route (the current) well away from the site and PP granted in '88. So at that stage that Cork CC were settled on that aspect of the route.

Now I will say that it was all a little secretive at that time with lads from the Council having to deny rumours- it was rumours for a while. So perhaps it was 'official' in 86 but there was definitely preliminary work being prepped going back a few years. I saw it myself personally.

Cork Trucker

partyguinness wrote: »

Oh it was defo even a bit earlier- 83/84.


A friend of mine (and I've seen this at the planning office) applied for PP on a site in '85 and it was refused on the basis that they were still deciding the route. One of the options had the road running a few hundred yards away so they kept having to reapply. Eventually they went for the another route (the current) well away from the site and PP granted in '88. So at that stage that Cork CC were settled on that aspect of the route.

Now I will say that it was all a little secretive at that time with lads from the Council having to deny rumours. So perhaps it was 'official' in 86 but there was definitely preliminary work being prepped going back a few years. I saw it myself personally.

Which would make it worse again if you think that from when talk first emerged in 83/84 as you say, to final completion is worst case scenario 40 years it is a bad reflection on government attitudes over the decades be it national or local level.

What you are saying about your friend reminds me of a similar issue in the leemount cross area and parcels of land which were sought for planning permission for Travellers, it was refused on the basis that is where the Northern Ring Road will run.

partyguinness

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Which would make it worse again if you think that from when talk first emerged in 83/84 as you say, to final completion is worst case scenario 40 years it is a bad reflection on government attitudes over the decades be it national or local level.

What you are saying about your friend reminds me of a similar issue in the leemount cross area and parcels of land which were sought for planning permission for Travellers, it was refused on the basis that is where the Northern Ring Road will run.

Do you know what...it's all coming back to me now.

Engineers from the Council were walking aspects of the awkward wooded areas but not saying a word to anyone about what there were doing. As mentioned earlier, they were putting markings on trees. It became a bit of a local source of mystry- strange cars and 4x4 parked up in strange hard to reach places, lads with hard hats and measuring equipment. Places where lads had no business walking through. Sworn to secrecy it seemed.

Rumours started swirling around quick enough about a bypass but officially nobody was saying anything. As I saw it myself I can confidently pin it down to 83/84.

Back then you are only in wooded areas like that for 2 reasons: making Poitin or storing IRA arms.

But you are right, the best part of 40 years!

yerwanthere123

I've heard that the Macroom bypass had actually been given the go-ahead in the 80's but was scrapped after complaints from local business people, any truth in that?

And on an off topic post, anyone got any idea about how it might affect the town bus routes? The #40 Tralee-Cork is a big asset to the town, I wonder how often will it still serve the town with the bypass?

Truckermal

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

I've heard that the Macroom bypass had actually been given the go-ahead in the 80's but was scrapped after complaints from local business people, any truth in that?

Yes it's true and one of the senior protestors was Mr. Creed..

087brain21

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

I've heard that the Macroom bypass had actually been given the go-ahead in the 80's but was scrapped after complaints from local business people, any truth in that?

And on an off topic post, anyone got any idea about how it might affect the town bus routes? The #40 Tralee-Cork is a big asset to the town, I wonder how often will it still serve the town with the bypass?

Yes this is nearly always the reason why so many bypasses fail

Shop and business owners just have it in their heads that loads of cars passing their doors means the town is doing well for itself but the majority of people are just driving through the town to another place as apart of their journey

I say overtime there will be 2 bus routes just like the cork to dublin route one for the motorway and one that goes through the bypass towns

BelfastVanMan

Truckermal wrote: »

Yes it's true and one of the senior protestors was Mr. Creed..

Makes you sick, doesn't it? :-/

serfboard

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

anyone got any idea about how it might affect the town bus routes? The #40 Tralee-Cork is a big asset to the town, I wonder how often will it still serve the town with the bypass?

I'll give you some examples.

The #64 Galway-Derry bus used to serve Tuam. Tuam was bypassed. The #64 bus still serves Tuam.

Or, for an even older example, the #13 bus used to serve Patrickswell and Rathkeale. Both have been bypassed and the bus still serves those towns.

The only change that might happen is that the bus might follow the new alignment around Baile Mhic Ire to bypass those dangerous bends.

yerwanthere123

serfboard wrote: »

I'll give you some examples.

The #64 Galway-Derry bus used to serve Tuam. Tuam was bypassed. The #64 bus still serves Tuam.

Or, for an even older example, the #13 bus used to serve Patrickswell and Rathkeale. Both have been bypassed and the bus still serves those towns.

The only change that might happen is that the bus might follow the new alignment around Baile Mhic Ire to bypass those dangerous bends.

Thanks for the info, I had no idea. So looks like we'll still have the bus route. I had initially assumed it might do a reduced service, maybe half the buses might use the bypass and the other half stick to the original route.

Water John

Yes in the late 1980s many of the businesses in Macroom would have been strongly anti by pass. Some of them still of that POV.

marno21

serfboard wrote: »

I'll give you some examples.

The #64 Galway-Derry bus used to serve Tuam. Tuam was bypassed. The #64 bus still serves Tuam.

Or, for an even older example, the #13 bus used to serve Patrickswell and Rathkeale. Both have been bypassed and the bus still serves those towns.

The only change that might happen is that the bus might follow the new alignment around Baile Mhic Ire to bypass those dangerous bends.

Major advantage will be the removal of traffic from the towns so the bus won’t be held up in the towns

hans aus dtschl

marno21 wrote: »

Major advantage will be the removal of traffic from the towns so the bus won’t be held up in the towns

You might see a new licence issued for an end-to-end operator though, if demand was there. That could still be BÉ too, obviously.

yerwanthere123

It'll be fascinating to see the effect it has on local businesses in town, I'm thinking particularly the bigger ones like say the Castle Hotel. Initially I'd have thought it wouldn't be good for them, but would a place like the Castle really get much passing trade? I mean if you're stuck in traffic and looking for a place to eat you'd probably just say "f*ck it let's just keep going and eat in Mai Fitz/Cork instead"? The bypass may even help a place like the Castle, it might become more attractive for people staying and hiring out rental cars for a few days, town'll become much more accessible and easy to pass through. Might be completely wrong, just thinking out loud

serfboard

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

You might see a new licence issued for an end-to-end operator though, if demand was there.

I doubt it. DublinCoach run a Tralee-Limerick service which still stops in the towns along the way.

I can't forsee a Tralee-Cork (or Killarney-Cork) non-stop service in the next couple of decades.

marno21

serfboard wrote: »

I doubt it. DublinCoach run a Tralee-Limerick service which still stops in the towns along the way.

I can't forsee a Tralee-Cork (or Killarney-Cork) non-stop service in the next couple of decades.

In fairness, that Dublin Coach service stops in the non bypassed towns. It doesn’t stop in Rathkeale or Castleisland

The circuitous nature of the rail service may make a direct bus service attractive.

serfboard

marno21 wrote: »

In fairness, that Dublin Coach service stops in the non bypassed towns. It doesn’t stop in Rathkeale or Castleisland

Ah, good point.

However, I'll counter that by saying that the Dublin Coach Ennis-Limerick service stops in Bunratty, which very definitely has been bypassed, so I remain to be convinced that a non-stop Tralee-Cork service is on the cards. Not that there shouldn't be one, but I don't see it happening for a long time yet.

Anyway, this was all by way of assuring the Macroom person that their existing service is not threatened!

Cork Trucker

Can someone clarify for me how far from here will this roundabout be or am i well off?

https://www.google.com/maps/uv?hl=en&pb=!1s0x4844e50bd43aa3a9:0xb72f4865c478b44b!3m1!7e115!4s/maps/place/circle%2Bk%2Bmacroom/@51.8914081,-8.9372933,3a,75y,249.43h,90t/data%3D*213m4*211e1*213m2*211slYRhQr4589DPYRkgH-c2aw*212e0*214m2*213m1*211s0x4844e50bd43aa3a9:0xb72f4865c478b44b?sa%3DX!5scircle+k+macroom+-+Google+Search&imagekey=!1e2!2slYRhQr4589DPYRkgH-c2aw&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiP9cHq4bLlAhV4QxUIHWO4DgYQpx8wEnoECA8QCw

Truckermal

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Can someone clarify for me how far from here will this roundabout be or am i well off?

https://www.google.com/maps/uv?hl=en&pb=!1s0x4844e50bd43aa3a9:0xb72f4865c478b44b!3m1!7e115!4s/maps/place/circle%2Bk%2Bmacroom/@51.8914081,-8.9372933,3a,75y,249.43h,90t/data%3D*213m4*211e1*213m2*211slYRhQr4589DPYRkgH-c2aw*212e0*214m2*213m1*211s0x4844e50bd43aa3a9:0xb72f4865c478b44b?sa%3DX!5scircle+k+macroom+-+Google+Search&imagekey=!1e2!2slYRhQr4589DPYRkgH-c2aw&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiP9cHq4bLlAhV4QxUIHWO4DgYQpx8wEnoECA8QCw

Just beyond the gate of Coolcower house on the Cork side, all I seen first was the deli counter..

yerwanthere123

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Can someone clarify for me how far from here will this roundabout be or am i well off?

https://www.google.com/maps/uv?hl=en&pb=!1s0x4844e50bd43aa3a9:0xb72f4865c478b44b!3m1!7e115!4s/maps/place/circle%2Bk%2Bmacroom/@51.8914081,-8.9372933,3a,75y,249.43h,90t/data%3D*213m4*211e1*213m2*211slYRhQr4589DPYRkgH-c2aw*212e0*214m2*213m1*211s0x4844e50bd43aa3a9:0xb72f4865c478b44b?sa%3DX!5scircle+k+macroom+-+Google+Search&imagekey=!1e2!2slYRhQr4589DPYRkgH-c2aw&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiP9cHq4bLlAhV4QxUIHWO4DgYQpx8wEnoECA8QCw

I think that's exactly where it'll be, the starting point of the new bypass.

Cork Trucker

Truckermal wrote: »

Just beyond the gate of Coolcower house on the Cork side, all I seen first was the deli counter..

Deli counter :pac: bit early for food

Cork Trucker

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

I think that's exactly where it'll be, the starting point of the new bypass.

Just around that petrol station so? Feck it they'd wanna hurry on with the rest of it so.

marno21

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Just around that petrol station so? Feck it they'd wanna hurry on with the rest of it so.

Coming from Cork, just before that petrol station, if you look to your left you can see the shape of the roundabout that’s going there fenced off. That’s where it’ll be starting.

The petrol station is ideally placed for bypass traffic when the bypass is complete. It’ll be within seconds of the bypass and the only place to stop between Glenflesk and Lissarda

KOR101

marno21 wrote: »

The petrol station is ideally placed for bypass traffic when the bypass is complete. It’ll be within seconds of the bypass and the only place to stop between Glenflesk and Lissarda

Would there be a new exit for Ballyvourney? Hate to see the Abbey Hotel lose out. Always a favourite of mine.

Cork Trucker

marno21 wrote: »

Coming from Cork, just before that petrol station, if you look to your left you can see the shape of the roundabout that’s going there fenced off. That’s where it’ll be starting.

The petrol station is ideally placed for bypass traffic when the bypass is complete. It’ll be within seconds of the bypass and the only place to stop between Glenflesk and Lissarda

I'll have to keep an eye out for that next time i pass if construction hasn't begun. That petrol station conveniently expanded in the last 2 years, possibly in preparation with all of this in mind.