Manchester United Transfer Rumours/Discussion 2008/2009

davyjose

Little-Devil wrote: »

I'm not here for an argument, just my opnion like the rest.

Fair enough

Little-Devil

Deleted User wrote: »

Please stop calling United Manu!!

Why?

Deleted User wrote: »

Game goers know better than anyone how much work Carrick, Hargreaves, Anderson, Tevez, Park and Rooney will put into a shift.

Since when have i criticised Hargreaves, Tevez, Park or Ronneys work effort?
NEVER.

LegacyUser

eZe^ wrote: »

Jaysus lads, I posted that about 30 seconds ago and theres been about 6 replies ahead of it.

Hey man,

Ronaldo and Van Nistelrooy were arguing continuously and Ruud was starting to act more important than the club with his petulant behavior in training especially towards Ronaldo.

Beckham and Ferguson had a love hate relationship mainly due to Beckhams extravagant lifestyle and more particularly that of his wife...wearing the skirt, painting the nails etc...this really angered Ferguson and during the Arsenal game (I think) when they were losing, he kicked a boot and it clipped Beckhams eye...

As for Heinze, Heinze was not getting his game...wanted to go to Liverpool, Ferguson said no chance...remained stubborn and shipped him off to Real instead of Liverpool. Heinze still remains bitter over this.

Boggles

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

and having two PL winners medals and a CL winners medal in the past two years is all well and good but it shouuldnt be a way to judge how good someone is. doesent John O'Shea have the same.

Well how do you judge him them? Carrick has been constant, comparing him to O'Shea is nonsense.

Little-Devil

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

um think hes saying other CM are playing such as G Barry (or united own Heargreaves) who is keeping Lampard out of Englands first 11 despite supposidly having to put in zidane esque performances due to the english presses love affair with Laps (and Stevie G). Carrick is good, but if most people are honest better could have been got for the money spent on as along with Darren Bent, he is probably one of the best example of a players price being far to much because of his nationality.

and having two PL winners medals and a CL winners medal in the past two years is all well and good but it shouuldnt be a way to judge how good someone is. doesent John O'Shea have the same.

Thank you Bounty Hunter . I couldn't have put it better myself.

Denis Irwin

Little-Devil wrote: »

Why?

Liverpool fans use it as

Man U Never Intended Coming Home

LegacyUser

I do believe Carrick was at fault for the Chelsea goal because he didn't track back, he had his hands on his knees bent over...and I thought that for a player who has no problem doing the cross bar challenge and putting a ball pretty much anywhere...he should really have placed his shot a bit better than he did...considering he was only 18 yards out and there was nobody near him to put him off.

eZe^

eZe^ wrote: »

Lads, Im having an argument with my Madridista friend, and Im saying that this Ronaldo situation is completely different to when people likes Ruud, Beckham, Neville and Roy left the club...

Because most of those had caused a sense of disharmony in the dressing room, and thats why SAF sold them. And that even though the initial selling of those players hurt them in the short term, you have become a better team in the long term because of it...

My problem is, I dont fully know the background stories of the controversy that each player caused... Like for example Ruud had a bad relationship with Ronaldo right? Could you give me just a brief overview as to why those players were causing tension in the team?

P.s- sorry to be raining on your little debate... =P

Before I satrt I still like Becks and Ruud despite them playing for I team I despise in Madrid.

But these are the generally accepted reasons:


Beckham became a billy big balls figure, thought he was better than the club in SAFs eyes. The fame and celebrity changed him and there was too much carnival baggage with him that it turned United into a bit of a circus.

Keane tried to undermine Queiroz in front of the players and his public bashing of half the squad was the final straw. I personally think the controversy surrounding his book (whish has led to United banning players from, releasing books while there....all who had already signed deals a la Rooney were allowed to publish cos theyd signed but nobody is allowed to now) didnt help his cause either. remember Stams book...he called Neville a "busy c*nt"!!

Heinze was Judas and fergie wouldnt sell him to Liverpool. Proof that Fergie is no pushover, despite Benitez' use of the media to unsettle Heinze. (I know Fergie has done it too before an argument starts)

Phil Neville left to play more regularly. There was no falling out, he just coulnt be guaranteed regular gametime.

Ruud hated Ronaldo by all accounts. He made a remark about his relationship with Queiroz along the lines of "Go back to your Daddy" not long after Ronaldos Dad had died. He also sulked after being benched for the League Cup Final and was apparently a general bad influence on the dressing room morale.



The Ronaldo situation is different. He hasnt fallen out with anyone. he's the apple of managements eye. He isnt dating a spice girl and phoning papparazzi in advance telling them where he'll be. he hasnt published a book or undermined management or publicly insulted players or anything else. He's just enjoying his football trying to be the best and is putting up with having to answer the same questions every day about his future thanks to madrid.

Bounty Hunter

Keane went on MUTV and blasted the performances and quality of several players add to that his Knee problems and Fergie seemed to think it was time to move on and in doing so let Keane have his dream of playing with Celtic before retireing.

Ruud clashed with Ronaldo and Carlos Quirez iirc insinuation that Quirez babied Ronaldo kinda and he did this at the wrong time, just as Fergie was changing uniteds style to one which didnt really suit Ruud. Although, im sure he would have been kept as an alternative option.

Think Neville just wasnt good enough and he got a good offer to allow a guy we he had brought through the ranks get regular football at a good standard.

Beckham was turning into a prima-dona and getting far too much media attension for fergies liking. He was being accused of thinking he was bigger than the club and his wife, the first wag also did not get along with Fergie... so he got rid

you can add Jaap Stam to that list also, he brought ut a book that got him transfered.


(i may not be 110% on everything as im not a United fan)

eZe^

cheesedude wrote: »

Hey man,

Ronaldo and Van Nistelrooy were arguing continuously and Ruud was starting to act more important than the club with his petulant behavior in training especially towards Ronaldo.

Beckham and Ferguson had a love hate relationship mainly due to Beckhams extravagant lifestyle and more particularly that of his wife...wearing the skirt, painting the nails etc...this really angered Ferguson and during the Arsenal game (I think) when they were losing, he kicked a boot and it clipped Beckhams eye...

As for Heinze, Heinze was not getting his game...wanted to go to Liverpool, Ferguson said no chance...remained stubborn and shipped him off to Real instead of Liverpool. Heinze still remains bitter over this.

Gracias sir.


Same to Neil and Bounty Hunter...


Appreciated lads!

Bounty Hunter

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

um think hes saying other CM are playing such as G Barry (or united own Heargreaves) who is keeping Lampard out of Englands first 11 despite supposidly having to put in zidane esque performances due to the english presses love affair with Laps (and Stevie G). Carrick is good, but if most people are honest better could have been got for the money spent on as along with Darren Bent, he is probably one of the best example of a players price being far to much because of his nationality.

and having two PL winners medals and a CL winners medal in the past two years is all well and good but it shouuldnt be a way to judge how good someone is. doesent John O'Shea have the same.

Id have carrick in my team ahead of Barry or Jenas no problem. I think carricks problem is how good he is depends on who's beside him.

O Shea wasnt an ever present. Carrick is.

Little-Devil

eZe^ wrote: »

Jaysus lads, I posted that about 30 seconds ago and theres been about 6 replies ahead of it.

I think the one of the Reason Ruud was sold because apart scoring buckets of Goals his over all play was quite poor at times. Roy Keane had to go after what he stupidly said about his so called team-mates, but i am sure he was right about some. I think the reason Heinze was sold was because ferguson couldnt guarantee he was first choice, plus Evra was young and quick.

Little-Devil

Deleted User wrote: »

Id have carrick in my team ahead of Barry or Jenas no problem. I think carricks problem is how good he is depends on who's beside him.

O Shea wasnt an ever present. Carrick is.

O Shea isnt good enough to start ahead of Ferdinand,Vidic, Brown or even Pique, he is in the squad becuase he can cover at LB/RB or Center half, he's only a squad player nothing more.

Little-Devil

Little-Devil wrote: »

Since when have i criticised Hargreaves, Tevez, Park or Ronneys work effort?
NEVER.

Never suggested u did but what Im saying is if u go to games and actually watch them u would see how much work carrick does. He's a clever tackler rather than an aggressive one. He waits and sticks the foot in and is regularly the one who breaks up the opposition attack.

davyjose

Deleted User wrote: »

The Ronaldo situation is different. He hasnt fallen out with anyone. he's the apple of managements eye. He isnt dating a spice girl and phoning papparazzi in advance telling them where he'll be. he hasnt published a book or undermined management or publicly insulted players or anything else.....

And he still plays for United.

Bounty Hunter

Boggles wrote: »

Well how do you judge him them? Carrick has been constant, comparing him to O'Shea is nonsense.

well if thats how you judge them then O'Shea is on his level, actually hes far better cos he has more medals due to being at United longer. However that isnt how you should judge them.

Simply judge by how well they play and how uch they can add to a team. Carrick is good dont get me wrong but others are better IMO and add more to a team hense others get chosen for England ahead of him.

eZe^

Deleted User wrote: »

The Ronaldo situation is different. He hasnt fallen out with anyone. he's the apple of managements eye. He isnt dating a spice girl and phoning papparazzi in advance telling them where he'll be. he hasnt published a book or undermined management or publicly insulted players or anything else. He's just enjoying his football trying to be the best and is putting up with having to answer the same questions every day about his future thanks to madrid.

Yup, thats my exact argument, cheers bud.

Little-Devil

Little-Devil wrote: »

O Shea isnt good enough to start ahead of Ferdinand,Vidic, Brown or even Pique, he is in the squad becuase he can cover at LB/RB or Center half, he's only a squad player nothing more.

Exactly?? thats pretty much what i was saying. You said "well Carrick winning things doesnt matter cos OShea did too"


Since carrick came in, United have 100% league champions record, an FA Cup Final, a Champions League semi and a champions League win....considering he was our only major signing in 2006 in a season where we sold guys like RVN and got rid of Keane...i think he;s made an impact.

Little-Devil

Sir Alex Ferguson concedes he will use Manchester United veterans Ryan Giggs and Paul Scholes more sparingly next season.

While other managers would perhaps bask over what has been a glorious campaign, Ferguson is refusing to rest on his laurels and is already plotting Manchester United's dominance of next season.

Key to United's success over the past decade has been the seamless transitional periods that have seen older players phased out in favour of a new generation.

Giggs added Sir Bobby Charlton's appearance record to an illustrious CV that already has him as the club's most decorated player, while Scholes' appearance in Wednesday night's UEFA Champions League final finally banished the disappointment of missing out against Bayern Munich in 1999.

That said, while the pair are revered at Old Trafford, Ferguson is nothing if not ruthless and has warned the veteran duo that they will only appear regularly next season if their performance levels merit selection.

"Yes, we have some age issues with Giggs (34) and Scholes (33) obviously," said Ferguson.

"My hopes is in the next few years they will play around 25-30 games apiece, but that depends on performance levels.

"I wouldn't put barriers against them continuing in the way they have done because they both conduct their lives in the right fashion.

"Injury-wise Paul has had injuries of a more serious nature than Ryan.

"I think Ryan because of his physique - he's different from Paul in the sense that he's such a slim lad - could really play until he is 38, and it would be here."

As i thought, maybe we night see more of Anderson next season starting games. I still expect Scholes to play alot more games then Giggs will.

SantryRed

Can see O'Shea going this summer. Probably to Sunderireland:rolleyes:

With seven subs from the start of next season, I don't really see a point in Ferguson keeping him.

SantryRed

SantryRed wrote: »

Can see O'Shea going this summer. Probably to Sunderireland:rolleyes:

With seven subs from the start of next season, I don't really see a point in Ferguson keeping him.

I do.

Theres now the Super Cup and FIFA World Club Cup to consider. Thats an extra 3 games on top of an already busy schedule and when u consider those games involve travelling to Monaco and Japan, we'll need a big squad. And if BocaJuniors make the CWC it wont be a friendly type game at all (not that it would be - Ive no doube SAF wants to win these games)

JOS will definitely be at OT next year. I dont see anyone leaving after Pique.

Bounty Hunter

Deleted User wrote: »

Exactly?? thats pretty much what i was saying. You said "well Carrick winning things doesnt matter cos OShea did too"


Since carrick came in, United have 100% league champions record, an FA Cup Final, a Champions League semi and a champions League win....considering he was our only major signing in 2006 in a season where we sold guys like RVN and got rid of Keane...i think he;s made an impact.

it was actually me that mentioned O'Shea and that was to counter an arguement like the above, saying players shouldent just be jusdged on medals after all JOS has more etc. Carrick didnt win those PL's and CL for united. Only United should be jusdged on how many medals they have gotten recently as who is to say that if Mascherano or Barry were signed instead of carrick united wouldent have won them too.

dont really want to keep argueing about this, as ive said Carrick is a good player (although there arent many CM that cost as much as him that arent or wouldent be better imo) but that isnt how you should judge a player.

Attractive Nun

eZe^,

Basically...

Roy Keane had been United's main man, captain, highest paid player etc, for a long time. Obviously as he got older his legs went a bit and he wasn't really the player he used to be, so SAF was going to have to replace him eventually. When he actually left, he had been injured for a while and there had been growing tensions between him and SAF. His contract was running out, and he had been typically outspoken about things - giving out about the quality of preparations, going on MUTV and giving out about certain players. Then a deal was made allowing him to leave. Basically, IMO what happened was that Keane was too old to maintain his place on the team, and his character didn't really allow him to become a squad player so he was shipped out.

Beckham pretty much just became too big for the club. Ferguson saw he was getting caught up in his celebrity lifestyle/didn't like the influence of his wife/etc. Moreover, despite having some great seasons with us and IMO being a brilliant player at his peak, he wasn't the irreplaceable midfielder that some people assume. He found it hard to get in the team after coming back from injury sometimes. Eventually his relationship with SAF just deteriorated mainly because he didn't perceive Beckham as being 100% committed to football on the pitch, and that was that.

Van Nistelrooy's exit was tactical more than anything else. With the departure of Beckham and the emergence of Ronaldo the shape of the team had to change, and didn't really suit the poacher that is RVN. Ferguson found that playing Saha up front with Rooney made the team play better overall, so he gambled on that and cashed in on RVN - who's not really a player that would be willing to sit on the bench anyway.

LegacyUser

With all due respect Neil 1984, he is being unclear over his future...he is provoking Real to keep probing...I don't buy this...I suggest every Man Utd fan take off their glasses and realise that he is provoking this behaviour...All this "I want to stay but I can't promise anything"...it's provoking Real.

davyjose

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

who is to say that if Mascherano or Barry were signed instead of carrick united wouldent have won them too.

dont really want to keep argueing about this, as ive said Carrick is a good player (although there arent many CM that cost as much as him that arent or wouldent be better imo) but that isnt how you should judge a player.

How much are those two players valued at? If anyone is riding the hype-machine right now, it's Gareth Barry. A player who has played quite well for two average teams. I would choose Carrick before Barry ANY day - and I said that long before he came to OT

Little-Devil

cheesedude wrote: »

With all due respect Neil 1984, he is being unclear over his future...he is provoking Real to keep probing...I don't buy this...I suggest every Man Utd fan take off their glasses and realise that he is provoking this behaviour...All this "I want to stay but I can't promise anything"...it's provoking Real.

I honestly believe he will be here for start of next season, but when the summer of 2009 comes around, i wont be suprised if he goes to Spain, but who says its going to be Real.

Little-Devil

davyjose wrote: »

I would choose Carrick before Barry ANY day - and I said that long before he came to OT

I think id also Carrick ahead Barry if i had to make a decision. I really wish we had of signed Mascherano, he is a class player who would have fitted in at Manutd perfectly.

davyjose

Little-Devil wrote: »

I honestly believe he will be here for start of next season, but when the summer of 2009 comes around, i wont be suprised if he goes to Spain, but who says its going to be Real.

His Ma

Seriously, I think there's some serious pressure from his family to join Madrid, which disgusts me a bit - coming out and saying that her dreams will come true when he plays for Madrid etc.
I don't think he'll stick around too much longer either. I think after the world Cup he'll go to Spain. But not this season.

Bounty Hunter

they are valued about the same as Carrick cost tbh 18m. and Barry in general has been underated for years. Perhaps Barry is slightly over rated atm but he is incredibly consistant and almost never has a bad game even if he isnt setting the world alight with his performances.

Barry aside (im a Villa fan and will be biast im sure) would many United fans really prefer Carrick over Mascherano?

iirc correctly Masch eventually (if everything is actually done at this stage) signed for Pool for 18.5m and according to Wiki (i know not 100% reliable) Carricks fee has risen to 18.6m

davyjose

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Barry aside (im a Villa fan and will be biast im sure) would many United fans really prefer Carrick over Mascherano?

I would now, yeah. That's not to say I'm unbiased. But for United, yeah. Mascherano is class though. I will say that, but Carricks style, his passing ability, suit united.

Attractive Nun

cheesedude wrote:

With all due respect Neil 1984, he is being unclear over his future...he is provoking Real to keep probing...I don't buy this...I suggest every Man Utd fan take off their glasses and realise that he is provoking this behaviour...All this "I want to stay but I can't promise anything"...it's provoking Real.

I have to agree, he's fuelling the speculation himself which is rather annoying. I think it's pretty clear that he's going to be here next season, because he has said a number of times that he will be and I don't see why he'd leave really. But this whole "only god knows the future...we will see after the CL final" stuff is obviously going to tempt Madrid. I can only assume he's trying to get a better contract (which I suppose is fair enough considering I don't think he's anywhere near the highest paid player in the world, and perhaps deserves to be - don't like how he's using the media though). Either that or it's to do with the crapness of his English (surely he should be better after 5 years!).

I expect a concrete statement to come out before the euros though.

Mikeyt086

JOS is going nowhere.

The boss loves him (so do i) its been a good few years before his last bad mistake and he does a job without complaining.

No defenders will leave this year, unless Silvestre demands first team football and goes to Sunderland.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSMFjBClt88

delija_sever029

Fix link

KevIRL

not sure if its been posted already.

Its my new desktop back tho




http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f310/sin65/Eurocelebrations.jpg

kmart6

Yeah it has,think it was Mr. Nice Guy wo posted it eithere here or the CL final thread!

Little-Devil

Anyone else agree?

I watched the Championship play off this afternoon and was somewhat impressed with how Frazier Campbell did. I'm not say that he was amazing but i think through the season from what i have read has probably given SAF something to think about next season. I would be happy enough to see in him the first team squad next season and play a few games and see what happens after. If anything him training with the first team and also the coaching at Manutd would improve more as a player.

Its one thing that does disappoint me in general about Manutd that we dont have that many young players who get a chance in the first team. I know we have a few young players at the moment who can and hopefully will go into the first team squad in about 4yrs time.

davyjose

Little-Devil wrote: »

Its one thing that does disappoint me in general about Manutd that we dont have that many young players who get a chance in the first team.

You spent half the morning giving out hell about Anderson cos you hadn't heard of him before.

In fairness I think Danny Wellbeck <sp> will make it, and was in the squad at Moscow.

Little-Devil

davyjose wrote: »

You spent half the morning giving out hell about Anderson cos you hadn't heard of him before.

I fully expect this kind of response. My point about Anderson was that i was unsure if he was suited to english football in general and i have heard that he has being out partying in Manchester in the last few months and we know SAF has his spies.

davyjose wrote: »

In fairness I think Danny Wellbeck <sp> will make it, and was in the squad at Moscow.

This i have heard of, but will he get the chance that he needs to force his way into the first team?

ITT-Pat

wow its jus been announced that Avram Grant got sacked!

LegacyUser

KevIRL wrote: »

not sure if its been posted already.

Its my new desktop back tho




http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f310/sin65/Eurocelebrations.jpg

Any chance on one in colour!?

ITT-Pat

cheesedude wrote: »

Any chance on one in colour!?

wouldnt say so cos the picture of the busby babes is originally in B&W

LegacyUser

how about colour with the busby babes in b&w? Think that would slick...

lordgoat

Little-Devil wrote: »

I fully expect this kind of response. My point about Anderson was that i was unsure if he was suited to english football in general and i have heard that he has being out partying in Manchester in the last few months and we know SAF has his spies.



This i have heard of, but will he get the chance that he needs to force his way into the first team?

If a player is good enough for man u, they'll get there chance. Simple as.

The fact that alot of young players are sold on for 4-6m is in my mind a good thing. The debt is not getting smaller.


And that story about Anderson was out at christmas if i remember correctly. There's been a bit of speculation, all unconfirmed about why he hasn't played the last week weeks of the season which could and prob was down to tiredness. He's been playing pretty much for almost 2 seasons with no long break.

Also if you saw any of Anderson matches this season you would know exactly of how well suited he is for any league.
Pay attention.

wowy

KevIRL wrote: »

not sure if its been posted already.

Its my new desktop back tho




http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f310/sin65/Eurocelebrations.jpg

That's a great picture.

I dunno who it is, but the guy to the right of Saha-it looks as if he's looking up towards the Busby Babes. It also looks as if Ferguson is looking down towards Sir Matt Busby. Just a pretty cool coincidence.

evad_lhorg

my god Danny Wellbeck has the sixth sense :eek: that's a great photo

Mikeyt086

Wellbeck, Ferguson and the physio make that pic great.

Pitty about the poor colour-fill though. I might have a go at making one thats easier on the eyes later.

davyjose

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

Wellbeck, Ferguson and the physio make that pic great.

Pitty about the poor colour-fill though. I might have a go at making one thats easier on the eyes later.

Ferguson is AWESOME in that :):)

LegacyUser

How do players like Saha and Fletcher and Park get to enjoy themselves when they don't even get a medal!?

LegacyUser

Sorry to ruin everyones buzz lads, but this is not my fault...it's Ronaldo once again being a cock to be honest:

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11667_3606367,00.html

"What the press speculate about goes over my head," Ronaldo said. "I have already been used to it for the past two years.

"I am calm. Everything's clear and I will repeat it once again so that the whole world understands, there will be news in two or three weeks.

"At the moment I am here, I am going to give my best and do the best possible in the European Championship."