Sun Certified Java Programmer certification

cfitz

I'm a Java developer and I would like some opinions on the Sun Certified Java Programmer certification. If you have done this exam, or if you are an employer of Java developers, please mention it in your reply.

How difficult is the exam?
What kind of preparation is needed?
Is the certification well regarded by employers (in Ireland/abroad)?
Could you put a figure on the value of the certification (i.e. 'with this certification you could expect to command a salary of 40k')?

Thanks very much!

Hobbes

Answered a lot of this in the other forum, which I guess you found.

cfitz wrote: »

How difficult is the exam?

Depends on the person. Java5 exam is harder then Java 1.4.2 exam. You could question dump with 1.4.2. You can't do that with Java5 exam as they are code questions.

What kind of preparation is needed?

Study, real world practice and knowledge of Java. Just working with Java doesn't guarantee anything as a lot of the questions would on areas that you may never use (IDEs would handle it).

Is the certification well regarded by employers (in Ireland/abroad)?

It is recognized world wide. Java5 exam is considered better then 1.4.2 for reasons mentioned above.

Could you put a figure on the value of the certification (i.e. 'with this certification you could expect to command a salary of 40k')?

Not really. I doubt any employer is going to base a salary on a single certification. Previous experience and other education would be mitigating factors as well.

cfitz

Thanks for the response.

Hobbes wrote: »

Depends on the person. Java5 exam is harder then Java 1.4.2 exam. You could question dump with 1.4.2. You can't do that with Java5 exam as they are code questions.

I suppose asking how difficult it is was a bit of a silly question Are there sample papers I can look at anywhere?

Hobbes wrote: »

Study, real world practice and knowledge of Java. Just working with Java doesn't guarantee anything as a lot of the questions would on areas that you may never use (IDEs would handle it).

Ok, well based on your experience: you already had SCJP 1.4 didn't you? My initial guess would be that you wouldn't have had to do a huge amount of work for SCJP 5 - is this the case?

Hobbes wrote: »

It is recognized world wide. Java5 exam is considered better then 1.4.2 for reasons mentioned above.

Hobbes wrote: »

Not really. I doubt any employer is going to base a salary on a single certification. Previous experience and other education would be mitigating factors as well.

Ok, well if you were hiring a Java developer on a 1 year contract , would you prefer to see a degree in computer science or SCJP on their CV?

Thanks again for the info.

Hobbes

cfitz wrote: »

I suppose asking how difficult it is was a bit of a silly question Are there sample papers I can look at anywhere?

http://jchq.net
http://www.javaranch.com/

The point is for Java5 exam your not going to be able to answer some of the questions unless you have done some actual coding in the language. So even if you get some example code it is unlikely to match the exam.

My initial guess would be that you wouldn't have had to do a huge amount of work for SCJP 5 - is this the case?

I did the upgrade exam as I had 1.4.2. So parts that match both languages are dropped. But even with Java experience you are looking at a few months study.

Ok, well if you were hiring a Java developer on a 1 year contract , would you prefer to see a degree in computer science or SCJP on their CV?

SCJP does not qualify you as a developer. That would be the SCJD. The first one only shows you have excellent knowledge of the language. It doesn't qualify you to develop an application.

cfitz

That's brilliant, thanks.

Sounds like it's something that would be of significant benefit as Java programmer regardless of get the certification you receive at the end of it.

A few months is a reasonably big commitment though, you'd want to know you were going to be working with that language for a few years to come.

Do you think you will continue on to SCJD? Does it cover Enterprise Java?

Tobias Greeshman

I actually have to resit this exam. It is quite a tough exam and I would regard myself as a very competant java programmer. The entire exam is multiple choice and it's very easy to miss one point in some of the questions (ie. some questions you have to choose multiple answers).

Make sure you know OO concepts inside out, generics, along with threading.

Buy yourself Kathy Sierra's study guide and immerse yourself with as much mock exams as you can. If you can buy any off the net, then I'd urge you to do so.

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Tobias Greeshman wrote: »

The entire exam is multiple choice and it's very easy to miss one point in some of the questions (ie. some questions you have to choose multiple answers).

Same with Sun's Solaris Administration exams.

cfitz

Tobias Greeshman wrote: »

I actually have to resit this exam. It is quite a tough exam and I would regard myself as a very competant java programmer. The entire exam is multiple choice and it's very easy to miss one point in some of the questions (ie. some questions you have to choose multiple answers).

Make sure you know OO concepts inside out, generics, along with threading.

Buy yourself Kathy Sierra's study guide and immerse yourself with as much mock exams as you can. If you can buy any off the net, then I'd urge you to do so.

Cool, thanks for the advice. If you don't mind me asking, what is your motivation for seeking this certification?

Hobbes

Tobias Greeshman wrote: »

I actually have to resit this exam. It is quite a tough exam and I would regard myself as a very competant java programmer. The entire exam is multiple choice and it's very easy to miss one point in some of the questions (ie. some questions you have to choose multiple answers).

Java5 is part code exams as well. As for the multiple choice they changed it so now you know how many are the correct answer. It used to be for 1.4.2 that you were not told how many of the multiple answers were needed.

Tobias Greeshman

cfitz wrote: »

Cool, thanks for the advice. If you don't mind me asking, what is your motivation for seeking this certification?

Well I'm recently moving over from mainly working on C++ to working primarily on Java and thought it was a good way to get up to speed on the language, plus get a qualification for my CV as well.

Hobbes wrote: »

Java5 is part code exams as well. As for the multiple choice they changed it so now you know how many are the correct answer. It used to be for 1.4.2 that you were not told how many of the multiple answers were needed.

Actually yes you are correct there, some of the mock exams that I done must of been 1.4 ones, because they didn't specify the number of items to choose. I found that some of the code questions that can get you, you need to check if the sample will even compile firstly, then if it'll throw an exception before you decide on the output it may produce.

shamrock2004

Have my SCJP 5 exam on the 25th of June - eek!!
On the second last chapter now - page 696 of 798!
I started studying 3 months ago. There is a LOT of material to cover.
Im using the siera bates book and bought the wizlab mock exams like hobbes
mentioned.
The questions at the end of the chapters are indeed tough and I can only imagine that the real mccoy is of the same standard. Im looking to try and get myself onto a graduate program and I hope this qualification will give me a little leg up.
Best regards,
Shamrock

cfitz

shamrock2004 wrote: »

Have my SCJP 5 exam on the 25th of June - eek!!
On the second last chapter now - page 696 of 798!
I started studying 3 months ago. There is a LOT of material to cover.
Im using the siera bates book and bought the wizlab mock exams like hobbes
mentioned.
The questions at the end of the chapters are indeed tough and I can only imagine that the real mccoy is of the same standard. Im looking to try and get myself onto a graduate program and I hope this qualification will give me a little leg up.
Best regards,
Shamrock

The study people do for this certification appears to be very much exam-based. I'd like to think that I'd learn a lot while acheiving this certification - but if it's a case of cramming and learning off then I'd probably forget an awful lot of it very quickly.

shamrock2004

cfitz wrote: »

The study people do for this certification appears to be very much exam-based. I'd like to think that I'd learn a lot while acheiving this certification

I certainly have anyway.
You can forget about dumps for this one.
And even if somebody was foolish enough to use dumps, one way or another you will be exposed, whether it be an interview assessment or a job evaluation.

shamrock2004

I passed it today, first attempt, 88%
Yahoo It was tough enough.
Attention to detail is imperative.
Best of luck to anybody else who is going for it.
Shamrock

pdidit

where do you do the exam and how do you apply for it? do you need a company to apply for you?
is this web based or exam hall required

aoraki

To do this exam, you have to register with Prometric. The exam takes place at a prometric exam center, there are a few of them in this country. The exam is done on a terminal in the exam center.

I did the 1.4.2 exam a couple of years ago, and like a few posters have mentioned here it is indeed quite tough. And I had a few years of working with Java under my belt before doing it. Give yourself a few months to perpare for it, you'll need it. And don't worry, it's not a cram-it-all-in-and-forget-it-afterwards type of exam. You will need to UNDERSTAND the concepts that the exam tests you on, you won't get by on a memorize-by-rote basis. You need to have the SCJP cert before you can do any other of the java programming certs (SCJD, SCBCD, SCWCD etc)

Somebody on here asked about the SCJD exam. The SCJD exam does not cover enterprise Java development. For that particular certification you are given a spec for an application and you will have to build the entire application from scratch. It will be a client server app, and you can only use core java libraries in it's development, no enterprise or third party libraries. You won't be allowed to use a database, so in effect you will need to write your own mechanism for persisting and retrieving data from flat files. You will need to know how to use RMI or server sockets for your client server communication, you will need to have a very good understanding of threading and record locking (deadlocks are an automatic fail in the exam), and you will need to know how write a good GUI, using Swing or AWT. Your code has to be meticulously formatted, and your design and documentation comprehensive. In short, what you are delivering at the end should be production standard. They estimate that it takes 120+ hours of solid work for an experienced java bod to write these apps. Obviously that estimate varies based on the skill/experience of the developer.

pdidit

Thank for that aoraki

shamrock2004

You will have to choose which SCJP exam you want to take.
I would avise you to take the SCJP 6 exam instead of the SCJP 5 exam.
The differences between the 2 are minimal. The 6 exam only requires a couple more hours study. I think Garbage collection is removed from the 6 exam. Can't remember off the top of my head!
I got my SCJD book about a week and a half ago and will be knuckling down for that when I get back from holidays. I feel this is my best option for getting my foot in the door as a junior / graduate programmer. There doesn't seem to be much opportunity out there for entry level graduates.
Best of luck with the studies!
Puedes hacerlo.
Saludos.

aoraki

Would be interested to hear how that goes for you Shamrock2004. I've been flirting with the idea of doing the SCJD for a while, but am not sure I'll be able to put in the time to do it.

shamrock2004

Well, it's underway!
I downloaded the assignment. Pretty steep at Eur 380.
Nevertheless, worth every cent if you ask me.
The assignment itself is the B & S one.
Im currently working throught the SCJD book by monkhouse and camerlengo.
This book looks at the various steps pertaining to the successful completion of the SCJD.
What I like about the assignment is that it is comprehensive.
It seems to bring everything together - Multithreading, OO design, GUI development etc...
You also have to complete a design decisions document which allows you to justify your choices. Im currently doing a job interview and am waiting to hear back. If I take full time work, it's going to take me a lot longer to achieve this certification. So I have a dilemma! I really want this qualification. Once you get this you cannot go for the coveted SCEA until you have a couple of years experience of Java development.
I will have to think hard about this one.
Things seem to be a little cool on the ab-inition programming front at the moment!
Ill keep you informed.
Best regards & good luck
S

P.S @ aoraki, im sure you could give it a crack of the whip.
You would be devoting your after hours and weekends to it, but it would be worth it in the end.

radioactiveman

Hi Shamrock
I passed this exam there a while ago, if you need any help drop me a pm (I had the B&S assignment as well...)