Liverpool Rumours And General Discussion 2008/2009

jesus_thats_gre

Can't believe that everyone is still harping on about Barry being a step backwards. In out and out ability, he is a small step backwards. In actual performances and consistency, he is a massive step forwards and will complement out midfield perfectly.

Incidently, just came across this team of the season on skysports.com:

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11662_3508029,00.html

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James

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Richards

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Ferdinand

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Laursen

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Lescott

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Fabregas

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Barry

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Ronaldo

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Young

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Torres

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Santa Cruz

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Now, any selection like this is far from gospel but it is a good indicator of things..

Karmafaerie

tonc76 wrote: »

What I meant was that Alonso's deal seems to be going ahead now

Everyone is being linked everywhere

Torres has been linked to Chelsea afterall

Well it is very, very, early.
Utd and Arsenal have bought nobody afterall.

All of the above would go if offered, and Liverpool were interested.

King John V

Barry would be a solid buy, not nessecarily much better or worse than Alonso imo. He would provide consistency and maturity in the lineup. But with a decent amount of depth in CM already would people not see a winger, attacking winger or another top rate striker as greater priority to share the goal scoring burden?

mayordenis

In fairness Gareth Barry is well able to share a bit of the goal scoring burden like I absolutely LOVE Alonso but the one thing is he doesn't get anywhere near enough goals.

Karmafaerie

King John V wrote: »

Barry would be a solid buy, not nessecarily much better or worse than Alonso imo. He would provide consistency and maturity in the lineup. But with a decent amount of depth in CM already would people not see a winger, attacking winger or another top rate striker as greater priority to share the goal scoring burden?

Of course they're important, and I'm sure that they'll be coming.

Rafa did say that it's going to be a very, very, busy summer.
He has to clear out a lot of deadwood before he kows how much he has to spend.
Also, a lot of big name players will be concentrating on the Euros now, so won't be available for contract talks.
A lot of possible signings will have to wait.

Chardee MacDennis

joe123 wrote: »

Selling alonso is a step back. Barry will cost the best part of 15 million.It seems alonso is going for around that price....what is the point? Why arent we spending that money towards an attacking winger?

On a side note Van der varrt would be an excellent signing I think but if he is a free agent (which i dont think he is) hell cost a bomb. Probably go to chelsea wholl just offer crazy wages.

It really looks like this year we have no money. Especially when it looks like were selling one of our best midfielders in alonso just so we can get barry. Its disapointing.

i dont really want Barry but he has been by far the better player over the last two seasons, but Alonso has more potential - but its pointless having potential if he doesnt ever live up to it.

imho he has been playing on the back of his first season for last two seasons.

Karmafaerie

Call_me_al wrote: »

i dont really want Barry but he has been by far the better player over the last two seasons, but Alonso has more potential - but its pointless having potential if he doesnt ever live up to it.

Exactly.

Alonso has more flair and potential, but lots of players have great potential.
Barry is consistent day in, day out.

He's as good as Alonso defensively.
He covers as much ground.
Gets forward as much.
An wears his heart on his sleeve.

He's not as good a passer as Alonso, but is that not what Lucas is supposed to be developing into anyway?!

mormank

Tusky wrote: »

Gerrard, Barry, Alonso, Mascherano, Lucas, Plessis would be retarded. Even if you dont count Gerrard as a CM.

whats wrong with that....plessis isnt gonna be a starter at all. masch and alonso to start with lucas as cover and barry can play elsewhere..its certainly not retarded

IrishMike

Karmafaerie wrote: »

He's not as good a passer as Alonso, but is that not what Lucas is supposed to be developing into anyway?!

No Lucas is a box to box midfielder in the vein of Gerrard who likes to get forward and score goals.
Liverpools current system doesnt suit it as it asks him to be a playmaker which he is not up to.

Tusky

mormank wrote: »

whats wrong with that....plessis isnt gonna be a starter at all. masch and alonso to start with lucas as cover and barry can play elsewhere..its certainly not retarded

play elsewhere ? I wouldnt like to think that Barry is being bought to play in the left wing. Kuyt on one wing, Barry on the other, we would never concede, but we would be bloody boring. Its looking like we are about to sign Dossena at LB and even if he was being signed to LB, 15m is very pricey for that position.

The only way signing Barry makes sense, is if Alonso is going. OR if we secretly have buckets of cash and can afford to spend 15m on backup for our strongest position.

King John V

Tusky wrote: »

The only way signing Barry makes sense, is if Alonso is going.

That's true. But as good and all as Barry is I can't see how his signing is been given priority over a winger or attacking midfielder. Is he really likely to be anything more than a bit-part player below Mascerano and Gerrard in the pecking order? I'd much prefer to see Silva or Van der Vaart coming and beef up the weaker parts of the team. For a club likely to have relatively limited funds this summer and a team in need of more goal scorers that makes the most sense to me.

hunter164

The only thing is Lucas and Masch are going to the Olympics. So he may sign Barry and keep Alonso to cover. Then he can sell Alonso in January if he wants to.

IrishMike

Just having a think about Dossena and Degan signings.
They are extremely attacking full backs while we have potentially 2 very defensive wingers in Kuyt and Barry.
Overlapping full backs or even wing backs in an adjusted 4-3-3 could be on the cards
Then the signing of Barry would make sense even if we kept Alonso.

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Reina
Dossena-Agger-Sktrel-Degan

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Mascherano
----Kuyt--Alonso--Barry

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Gerrard

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Torres

Might be a good idea if Degan and Dossena are really maurauding full backs which is what
the reports seem to say they are.
Plenty of pace in the CB positions and Mascherano should sort out any problems arising
from players out of position.
Still much prefer to see a big transfer of someone like Aguero or Van Der Vaart.
A signing with proven quality

Daemonic

Barry passes to Gerrard, Stevie scores....a sign of things to come for next season???:D

Tusky

IrishMike wrote: »

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Reina
Dossena-Agger-Sktrel-Degan

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Mascherano
----Kuyt--Alonso--Barry

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Gerrard

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Torres

IrishMike. I often agree with you but I have to say, that is a woeful formation! Also, Degen is a right back and Dossena is a left back.

Bounty Hunter

Daemonic wrote: »

Barry passes to Gerrard, Stevie scores....a sign of things to come for next season???:D

Randy Lerner is a billionaire but i doubt you lot would sell Gerrard tbh:D

Mr Alan

you Villa fans crack me up

Bounty Hunter

Mr Alan wrote: »

you Villa fans crack me up

try our best!

really not liking how much Barry copliments Gerrard though. The more i see them play together, the more i expect them to be England and Liverpools CM partnership next season. or to be more exact 2 of 3 mids with Stevie as AM behind Torres/Rooney.

i.e England/Pool

......Heargreaves/Masch......Barry........

Kuyt/Bentley?....Gerrard.......Babel/J.Cole

..................Rooney/Torres

hope not though

IrishMike

Tusky wrote: »

IrishMike. I often agree with you but I have to say, that is a woeful formation! Also, Degen is a right back and Dossena is a left back.

Woeful is a bit harsh
Typo regarding the full backs but dont really see it as woeful.
All it is doing is replacing babel with barry.
Granted Barry is going to play a lot narrower but with a full back behind him
willing to push forward i can see it working.
Similiar story on the right.
Attacking full backs have almost become wingers in the modern game.
Why wouldnt it work for Liverpool who play very narrow in midfield anyway?

By the way im not for a second saying it will work, just looking to hear a few points of view.

Tusky

IrishMike wrote: »

Woeful is a bit harsh
Typo regarding the full backs but dont really see it as woeful.
All it is doing is replacing babel with barry.
Granted Barry is going to play a lot narrower but with a full back behind him
willing to push forward i can see it working.
Similiar story on the right.
Attacking full backs have almost become wingers in the modern game.
Why wouldnt it work for Liverpool who play very narrow in midfield anyway?

By the way im not for a second saying it will work, just looking to hear a few points of view.

Most teams play with 4-5 attacking options. 2 strikers, 2 wingers and a central midfielder that will get forward. We currently play with 4.

Torres, Gerrard, Barry & Kuyt just sounds like a fairly timid combination to me. Also, we play with the wide attackers much further forward than on your formation. You have them in line with Alonso, who plays very deep. They should be in line with Gerrard. I just think something like this would be much better.

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Reina

Arbeloa---Skrtel--Carragher--Dossena

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Masch---Barry

<new>

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Gerrard

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Babel

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Torres

With Arbeloa, Dossena & Barry given a license to go forward to support the front 4.

Chardee MacDennis

Well Bentley certainly didnt impress with his performance tonight. Gerrard played brilliantly out the left all night and Barry did well when he came in. His passing was quite effective, not just for the goal. Crouch i thought did alright for the opportunity he got.

mike65

Barry/Gerrard is the future in both white and red!

Mike.

dc69

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Randy Lerner is a billionaire but i doubt you lot would sell Gerrard tbh:D

Randy learner is worth about the same as hicks,we have 2 billionaires.Paper billionaires,the same as Villa,except villa cost less than 100m for learner,where as Liverpool cost 4X that much.If Learner could have afforded a better club he would have bought them,its not feasable to pump serious money into villa.

Just face facts,Barry is coming to Liverpool and if we want a Villa player we will have him.Villa are a small club,im sorry for being harsh but thats how it is.

The news reports saying Alonso is gone,just confirms that Barry will be coming.

DSB

dc69 wrote: »

Just face facts,Barry is coming to Liverpool and if we want a Villa player we will have him.Villa are a small club,im sorry for being harsh but thats how it is.

You aren't actually serious are you? If Arsenal, Man United or Chelsea decided they wanted Barry, they would all have him ahead of Liverpool. Thats IF he even decides to go. You haven't got a clue, as usual.

Time Magazine

dc69 wrote: »

Just face facts,Barry is coming to Liverpool and if we want a Villa player we will have him.Villa are a small club,im sorry for being harsh but thats how it is.

Lol, exactly how many of those statements are facts?

Jazzy

so are we resigned to the fact alonso is leaving ?
i wouldnt like to see him go, i think hes a classy player when hes on form

Jazzy

dc69 wrote: »

Randy learner is worth about the same as hicks,we have 2 billionaires.Paper billionaires,the same as Villa,except villa cost less than 100m for learner,where as Liverpool cost 4X that much.If Learner could have afforded a better club he would have bought them,its not feasable to pump serious money into villa.

Just face facts,Barry is coming to Liverpool and if we want a Villa player we will have him.Villa are a small club,im sorry for being harsh but thats how it is.

The news reports saying Alonso is gone,just confirms that Barry will be coming.

on behalf of everyone on this board - shut the f**k up. villa came 6th last season and seem to be on the way up, whereas liverpool should be higher but are struggling to keep up with the other top 3.
u sound so pompus in that post its unbelievable. gives all us other pool fans a bad name

mayordenis

dc69 wrote: »

Randy learner is worth about the same as hicks,we have 2 billionaires.Paper billionaires,the same as Villa,except villa cost less than 100m for learner,where as Liverpool cost 4X that much.If Learner could have afforded a better club he would have bought them,its not feasable to pump serious money into villa.

Really don't know anything - I do
Randy lerner went to uni in england when he was younger became a big villa fan - even has a villa tattoo

Jesus Wept

Hicks should get a Liverpool tattoo, no?

Time Magazine

The-Rigger wrote: »

Hicks should get a Liverpool tattoo, no?

Couldn't afford it tbh.

Dont be at yourself

I'll probably be shot down for saying this but... if we sell Alonso and we buy Barry, we're still a midfielder down. We need to pick up another central midfielder.

Gerrard is not suited to playing in Alonso/Macherano's role in the current system. Indeed, it is crucial that he plays off Torres. As such, we'd be left with Macherano, Barry, Lucas and Plessis.

Macherano and Barry are the obvious starters, and hopefully Lucas can step up and push for a place. Plessis is not ready for first-team action. Ideally, he should be sent on loan to one of the promoted teams, or another team lower down the table. Look at the players than Man Utd have competing for similar roles: Hargreaves, Carrick, Scholes, Anderson and Fletcher. Worlds apart from Lucas and Plessis.

We should also bear in mind that Macherano and Lucas will be playing in Beijing at the start of next season. Is Barry and Plessis going to see us through our opening fixtures?

If we sell Alonso, we need a solid replacement - at least to offer competition and backup to Barry and Mach. Somebody like Sunny at Valencia would be an option - he's young, probably available for a reasonable fee and wouldn't neccessarily expect a starting position every week.

mormank

skysports just reported the wages payed out by the clubs in the premier league.

Chelsea payed a whopping £132 million on wages for the 2007/2008 season.
Liverpool only spent £72 million!!

I think this shows exactly why we are finding it so difficult to compete!

FWIW UTD spent £92 million

mormank

Tusky wrote: »

play elsewhere ? I wouldnt like to think that Barry is being bought to play in the left wing. Kuyt on one wing, Barry on the other, we would never concede, but we would be bloody boring. Its looking like we are about to sign Dossena at LB and even if he was being signed to LB, 15m is very pricey for that position.

The only way signing Barry makes sense, is if Alonso is going. OR if we secretly have buckets of cash and can afford to spend 15m on backup for our strongest position.

well ive gotta say, barry only recently moved into the centre of midfield. he was pretty good on the wing for villa when he played there. he can also fill in at left back..rafa loves these kind of players

Malice

Jazzy wrote: »

on behalf of everyone on this board - shut the f**k up. villa came 6th last season and seem to be on the way up, whereas liverpool should be higher but are struggling to keep up with the other top 3.
u sound so pompus in that post its unbelievable. gives all us other pool fans a bad name

Harsh but probably fairly accurate.

As others have said, I thought Barry and Gerrard linked up quite well in the match last night. I would still be sad to see Alonso leave but if he can't maintain the high standards that we know he's capable of then for the good of the club he has to go. There's no point being sentimental towards players if they aren't delivering on the pitch.

IrishMike

Liverpool midfielder Xabi Alonso is on the verge of joining Juventus for £16m. (Various)

Reported on the BBC website.
Probably a good price considering his form over the past 18 months.
Will be really sad to see him go though.

BBC reporting that Diego Capel is goin to spurs for £12m
Is it just me or is that dirt cheap for a quality player like him?

Malice

IrishMike wrote: »

Liverpool midfielder Xabi Alonso is on the verge of joining Juventus for £16m.

I wonder is the prospect of linking up with Sissoko again enticing him to Italy?

Mitch Connor

IrishMike wrote: »

Liverpool midfielder Xabi Alonso is on the verge of joining Juventus for £16m. (Various)

Reported on the BBC website.
Probably a good price considering his form over the past 18 months.
Will be really sad to see him go though.

BBC reporting that Diego Capel is goin to spurs for £12m
Is it just me or is that dirt cheap for a quality player like him?

That is Capel's release fee - Seville must have not renegotiated his contract recently.

IrishMike

Lots of quality attacking players seem to be up for grabs this summer
Capel
Van Der Vaart
Aguero
Robinho
Ronaldinho
Silva
Villa
Aimar
Dos Santos

Would be happy to see any of them in a Liverpool shirt

Dont be at yourself

I never heard anything about Aguerro being on the move. I'd imagine the promise of Champions League football with Athletico will keep him at the club for another year!

Mr Alan

cant see Aguero or Roninho (with the exception of being some part of the Ronaldo deal) going anywhere this summer

IrishMike

Barry seeks O'Neill talks

Villa skipper eager to discuss future next week

Last updated: 29th May 2008

Gareth Barry is set to seek further discussions about his future at Aston Villa next week.

The Villa skipper is a £12million-rated target of Liverpool as manager Rafa Benitez attempts to strengthen his squad for a Premier League title tilt next season.

Villa boss Martin O'Neill has been angered by Benitez's approach for Barry and, accompanied by club chairman Randy Lerner, has already held one meeting with the 27-year-old in an attempt to convince him to stay in the Midlands.

However, Barry - who was a second half substitute in England's 2-0 victory over USA at Wembley on Wednesday - is eager for further discussions with O'Neill after Sunday's international friendly against Trinidad & Tobago in Port of Spain.

Big club

"Will I be at Villa next season? That is something I've been speaking to the manager and chairman about. We've already had one meeting," said Barry.

"My idea was to get these two games (USA and Trinidad & Tobago) out of the way and I am sure we will be speaking again soon.

"Any sort of interest by a big club is flattering but I am still an Aston Villa player, I've got two years left of my contract and until some sort of bid is accepted, or the manager tells me otherwise, there is no decision to make.

"No decision has been made because no bid has been accepted."

Disappointment

Meanwhile, Barry insists he was not overly disappointed to miss out on a spot in England manager Fabio Capello's first XI against USA after coming off the bench to set up Steven Gerrard for the second goal.

"You want to start every game," Barry added. "We all know the manager is trying and looking at different things so I am not too upset.

"Hopefully I can go across to Trinidad and play some more minutes over there.

"It was nice to get involved straight away, get involved with the goal, so overall I was not too disappointed with not starting the game."

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11669_3623785,00.html

From my reading of that he is far from committing himself to Villa.

zing

IrishMike wrote: »

From my reading of that he is far from committing himself to Villa.

Not exactly saying he's buggering off either though but then you wouldn't expect him to say much atm.

One of the more reliable posters over on RAWK has indicated that we were/are in discussions with Valencia for Villa but the deal is at an impasse as Valencia want too much up front whereas we (like most clubs) want to do stage payments with incentives, etc.. - probably because Rafa wouldn't have any other option. If that rumor is true then hopefully the impasse can be worked around.

Whatever about the dross we've been linked with of late Villa is one player I wouldn't half mind seeing in red

Dont be at yourself

I wouldn't spend silly money on Villa though. He's no spring chicken, and his scoring record for the past couple of seasons hasn't been that great. It the fee approaches 20 million, I think there are better options.

Still, it looks like Valencia's finances are very poor, and they're on the back of a terrible season. They're going to have to offload some of their big-names this summer, and they wont be able to hold clubs to ransom.

hunter164

Where will Villa fit in if we stick with last year's formation? I'd prefer to see Silva here.

King John V

Rafa Benitez the Liverpool manager is on the verge of making a full bid for Kenwyne Jones the impressive Trinidad and Tobago striker currently plying his trade under Roy Keane at Sunderland.

Jones has had a great season at Sunderland and his club and manager in particular will fight tooth and nail to hold on to their star asset, however the lure of Anfield may prove too much for the 23 year old and Sunderland may have to accept defeat if the player is adamant that he wants the move to happen.

Sunderland will expect nothing less than £12 million for the player that joined them for £6 million from Southampton only a year ago and are aware that it is unlikely in the long run that the player will remain at the stadium of light.

Jones has been attracting some good reviews and only recently England captain John Terry said "Jones was fantastic and I have played against him twice now. He is a very good player, very hard working and probably the best in the air in the entire Premier League, he really is that good"
Very high praise indeed.

Liverpool will try a swap deal initially with Peter Crouch, however Crouch will not entertain this idea and if anything is prepared to sit out his contract if he cannot get the move he desires and so it is likely that if Benitez hopes to get the player that Liverpool will have to pay big.

Any views?

Karmafaerie

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

Look at the players than Man Utd have competing for similar roles: Hargreaves, Carrick, Scholes, Anderson and Fletcher. Worlds apart from Lucas and Plessis.

I fail to see how Andersson is worlds apart from his National (underage) captain!

Anderson adapted to the premiership better in his first season, as he's physically bigger, and was playing in his acustomed role.
Lucas was playing differently than he's used to, and as a naturally smaller player, has to bulk up a bit to fit in with the physicality of the premiership.

To say that they're "worlds apart" is very misleading.

King John V

hunter164 wrote: »

Where will Villa fit in if we stick with last year's formation? I'd prefer to see Silva here.

Silva would be the wise buy. Under the 4-2-3-1 surely Villa would be nothing more than a bench warmer to Torres.

hunter164

Ye but Crouch is a handy benchwarmer, how much is Rafa paying for this benchwarmer?

Malice

King John V wrote: »

Any views?

I haven't seen too much of Jones but he does seem to be highly rated. If he was available for a decent fee he might be worth a look.

hunter164 wrote: »

Where will Villa fit in if we stick with last year's formation?

He would probably be shoe-horned into the right-side position currently occupied by Kuyt .

hunter164

Ye but Silva can play there...........