Liverpool Rumours And General Discussion 2008/2009

MementoMori

Very Interesting article in the Echo from Tony Barrett

Looks like a bid from Newcastle for Guthrie has been accepted, if he's discussing personal terms. Really want to know how much we got for him. I also think it points to the fact that Rafa must be confident the Barry deal will be done or the Alonso deal won't be, to be letting him go. A lot likelier Rafa is confident about Barry arriving than Alonso definately staying. On a related note - still no offical word from Juventus that they have signed Poulsen - why am I not surprised :rolleyes:

Also Carson to leave non-shocker :eek: Two PL clubs have made offers - cool - fingers crossed we'll get a tasty price for him - havent done too bad out of him so far. Bought for 750k, loan deal of £2m last year.

Tbh I would have said Spurs would be looking for £20m for Robbie - don't know how their supposed purchase of the imitation Luis Garcia will effect things - Imitation Luis Garcia sounds more of a Robbie type player than an out-and-out striker a la Bebatov or Bent.

I wonder who the players who fall into under the "not necessarily the names that everybody knows" bit - wonder if Crespo is one of these.:rolleyes:

Wonder if there will be any more news today - seems unlikely there will be an offical announcement given that Cavalieri has been formally announced and all.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-f...00252-21325245/

Scott Carson heads for Liverpool exit

Jul 11 2008 EXCLUSIVE by Tony Barrett, Liverpool Echo

SCOTT CARSON is set to depart Anfield as Rafa Benitez attempts to raise the funds he needs to make an offer for top target Robbie Keane.

The England international keeper is likely to follow Danny Guthrie through the exit door after Liverpool accepted an offer from Kevin Keegan’s Newcastle for the midfielder, who spent last season on loan at Bolton.

Guthrie will now hold talks with Keegan and if personal terms can be agreed the deal will give the 21-year-old the first team football he craves but was unable to secure at Anfield.

Liverpool have two offers on the table from rival Premiership clubs for Carson, who is keen to quit the Reds after spending last season on loan at Aston Villa, and Benitez is happy to do business.

New £3m signing Diego Cavalieri will provide back- up to Pepe Reina in the coming season, making Carson surplus to requirements.

Carson joined Liverpool from Leeds for £750,000 in January 2005 after being earmarked as a potential England keeper of the future.
He has since gone on to win international honours for his country but has found his progress at Anfield thwarted by the presence of Reina, who has developed into one of Europe’s most highly rated keepers.

Villa paid a fee in the region of £2m to loan Carson last season, but Martin O’Neill has not followed up his initial interest in making the deal permanent and the 22-year-old will now move elsewhere.

Without having a substantial transfer kitty at his disposal, Benitez knows he must sell a number of fringe players if he is to be able to come up with the kind of offer which would tempt Spurs to do business for Keane.

Spurs boss Juande Ramos is not looking to sell his captain, who is a hero to the White Hart Lane fans, but with Keane looking to make a move to the club he supported as a boy he may have no option but to do a deal if Benitez makes a sizeable offer.

Benitez, though, is not willing to offer the £20m Ramos is believed to be holding out for and has other targets in mind should Keane’s price tag prove prohibitive.

The Reds boss is looking for a traditional “number seven” to provide a link between his midfield and front man Fernando Torres and believes Keane has the game intelligence to fill such a role.

“Keane is clearly a player that has game intelligence,” said Benitez. “We're looking for players with the right quality and I think we'll find some in the next few days, although not necessarily the names that everybody knows.”

Peter Crouch, who partnered Torres on occasion last season, will today complete his £11m move to Portsmouth.

Meanwhile, Liverpool’s reserve team ranks have been supplemented by the signing of another youngster from abroad.

Vincent Lucas Weijl, a 17-year-old forward who came through the academy at AZ Alkmaar, has signed a three year contract.

jesus_thats_gre

rosboy wrote: »

1. Rafa see's us using 2-3 formations next year:

a. 4-4-2
b. 4-3-3
c. 4-2-3-1

2. Rafa mentions Insua as one of the options for left back. We could see more of him that we may have thought this season.

Considering those points, I personally feel that Rafa sees system 2 as being the same a system 3. As such, I see it being:

a. 4-4-2
b. 4-3-3
c. 3-5-2

Option b will be the one that used the most though.

jesus_thats_gre

--amadeus-- wrote: »

If there is only 20 million to spend (excluding sales) then it seems a bit mad to spend 3 of it on a reserve keeper. Either Rafa is very confident of the sales going through and raising more cash or we have more money than we thought

Well he sold our second choice keeper and is intent on selling Carson. A new backup keeper needed to be broought in..

--amadeus--

MementoMori wrote: »

Given it seems like Itandje is on the verge of joining Galatasary for £2m and the continued interest in Carson (loan deal at very worst) it looks pretty certain that neither of them will be at the club next season.

£3m for a dependable younish keeper with potential seems like a very sensible investment to me.

Imagine Pepe picks up an injury that keeps him out for a month or two.
What would we have done then?

We've hopefully upgraded out Number 2 position and depending on what we eventually get for Carson look to have made a tasty bit of profit. If we had gone out and spent £10m on a backup keeper that might have been a bit mad but £3m is nothing for a top-flight keeper these days.

I agree to an extent, the #2 did need to be upgraded and Carson was never going to sit on the bench. But 25 isn't that young (even for a keeper), that's about the same age as Pepe so he's never going to relace him in the team in the way that a red hot 18 or 19 year old might possibly have done.

And if you want quality cover rather than genuine competition or potential why not an older, experienced keeper on a free?

I suppose my point is that if money was really that tight then that 3 million could have been replaced with a free / low cost #2 and the cash put towards a higher profile outfield player.

Chardee MacDennis

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Considering those points, I personally feel that Rafa sees system 2 as being the same a system 3. As such, I see it being:

a. 4-4-2
b. 4-3-3
c. 3-5-2

i doubt we will see 3 at the back unless we are stuck...

jesus_thats_gre

BastardPrince wrote: »

i doubt we will see 3 at the back unless we are stuck...

I am not suggesting that it will be employed regularly but I think he will employ it in the odd match throughout the season if needed.

Tusky

--amadeus-- wrote: »

If there is only 20 million to spend (excluding sales) then it seems a bit mad to spend 3 of it on a reserve keeper. Either Rafa is very confident of the sales going through and raising more cash or we have more money than we thought

I dont see why ? We should be able to sell Carson for 5m and Itandje for 2m.

This guy is very very highly rated. Hes the future Brazil number 1. A guy on RAWK who knows him very well was saying that in time he may even challenge Reina as first choice keeper.

oobydooby

BastardPrince wrote: »

i doubt we will see 3 at the back unless we are stuck...

Whether we ever see it or not (more likely a 5-3-2 with fullbacks overlapping IMHO), I think Rafa is very enterprising with his systems and tactics. His vision of football is not 'total football' like Ajax 1970s but 'organic football'.

Rather than extraordinarily versatile players who can play anywhere he has specialised players but who are intelligent and can adapt to different formations. It takes a lot of training to get a whole team (or a whole squad) to be able to adapt to a new formation. It's not just like lumping a big CF up front for the last 10 minutes. Rafa seems to love his percentage plays and if he pushes players forwards for the last 15 minutes chasing a game, he would want the whole team to change shape and know how to adapt to the new formation. The team is like an intelligent organism.

His choice of leaders, a fluid front 4, fullbacks who overlap forwards and defensive midfielders who can break up play or link up play anywhere between the boxes all suggest this to me. I'd expect him to practice 3-5-2 but I can't see where we'd ever need to use it.

The Rooster

BastardPrince wrote: »

i doubt we will see 3 at the back unless we are stuck...

Indeed playing 3 centre backs is very different to the formations with 4 at the back, which I think are easier to be "fluid".

3 centre backs would prolong Carra's career by a season or two, as while many fans are blind to the amount of mistakes he made last year, I'm sure Rafa isnt. Although it does depend on Agger comng back as good as new and Skrtel continuing to develop.

Boom_Bap

I recall a few games where he experimented with 3 at the back and it seemed to work out well. He would start off the match with 4, Carragher on the right, Hyypia and Skyrtl/Agger in the middle and Risse on the left.
During the match he'd push Risse up the left and have a back 3.

Cant recall which games they where though

Gelio

Who is going to replace gerard as captain.
He can't have to long left as captain . . .

The team is so diferent to 2-3 years ago

MementoMori

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Considering those points, I personally feel that Rafa sees system 2 as being the same a system 3. As such, I see it being:

a. 4-4-2
b. 4-3-3
c. 3-5-2

Option b will be the one that used the most though.

Even though in Dossena's interview yesterday he was talking about Rafa discussing the importance of a defensive back four and balance when going forward

Honestly given our squad I just cant see us ever going out and lining up as a recognisble 3-5-2 next season.

I'm pretty certain we will line up with two CBs and a recognisble RB and a LB in pretty much every single game. When Rafa was talking about differences in formation I think it was a case of 4-3-3, 4-2-3-1, 4-3-2-1 and 4-4-2 and maybe a 4-2-2-2. Any variations in formation are going to be up-front depending on the oppostion and what players we have available in an attacking sense.

Could possibly see a case where we would play a 4-1-3-2 formation ie. two centre backs (Skrtle, Agger, Carra, Sami) with Mascherano playing a holding/covering midfield role and the RB and LB getting forward but again I doubt this would be emplyed from the start of many matches. I don't think this could be interpreted as a 3-5-2 because while the fullbacks will be getting forward, I think it will be the case where they will be told "get forward if it's reasonably safe" to do so an opposed to the traditional 3-5-2 where full backs are told "get forward at all and every possible opportunity."
In the 4-1-3-2 the defenders will be told "your main priority will be to defend -getting forward and helping out the attack is a bonus but your priority on the pitch is so stop the opposition scoring"

But most importantly as I've argued before - getting stuck up on formation is a bit pointless [even though I've just done it] - a lot of the game ia about movement with players running 8kms to 10kms in a match. The initial formation is just a general guide as opposed to be something to be stuck to rigidly. Witness the variety in Utd's formation last season particullarly up-front.

Having a formation is always handy in the general sense of okay "Pepe you're in goals. Marty and Dagger you play CB. Andrea you're on the left. Al you're on the right. Gaz and Javier in the centre of the park - Gaz on the left. In front of those two Ryan you're on the left, Stevie in the centre supporting Nando up front with Dirk on the right" [All said in a strange Spanish-Scouse accent.]:):p Means me dont end up with Fernando in goals, Babel CB, Stevie LB and Masch up-front.

As for the future captain - Pepe could well be a contender. Witness the Spanish celebrations - Nando though I think he'd prefer not. Masch maybe?

Given Rafa's love of accumulating captains I don't think it's ever going to be a major issue. I wonder if one day we might end up with a starting eleven of players who were at one stage or another captains of clubs/country.

The Rooster

There is no chance of the captaincy being taken off Gerrard.

Mr Alan

I'm presuming he is talking about when Carra and Gerrard are no longer playing.

Mascherano would be my choice.

jesus_thats_gre

The Rooster wrote: »

Ias while many fans are blind to the amount of mistakes he made last year, I'm sure Rafa isnt. Although it does depend on Agger comng back as good as new and Skrtel continuing to develop.

I don't think that any fan will deny that he had a poor enough season last season. Saying that, you have to account for the fact that it was blatantly obvious that he was not happy playing next to Sami for a fairly long period and seemed to have changed his game a bit while Sami got up to speed.

IrishMike

ajeffares wrote: »

Who is going to replace gerard as captain.
He can't have to long left as captain . . .

The team is so diferent to 2-3 years ago

?
Where on earth did that come from?
Even more so than a 3 years ago Gerrard is the heartbeat of the team.
His form has just been excellent for close to 5 years straight.
Why on earth would you take the captancy off of him?

Liverpool have accepted an offer for midfielder Danny Guthrie from Newcastle, while the Reds have two offers on the table from top-flight clubs for keeper Scott Carson. (Liverpool Echo, 1215 BST)

£2m for Guthrie and a bit of a biddin war for Carson would be brilliant.

GBX

£2 Million would be good for him. He did well during his spell at Bolton.

Id like to see the board use there heads and possibly lower there valuation of Carson - it was something along the lines of £8-10 Million right? - if a bidding war starts, we may actually get closer to that price if he is in demand.

MementoMori

IrishMike wrote: »

?
Where on earth did that come from?
Even more so than a 3 years ago Gerrard is the heartbeat of the team.
His form has just been excellent for close to 5 years straight.
Why on earth would you take the captancy off of him?

£2m for Guthrie and a bit of a biddin war for Carson would be brilliant.

On the captaincy thing Gerrard only turned 28 on the 30th of May. Very early days to be talking about future captain when you think about it.

Given the rumoured rejected bid for Guthrie from Bolton was £1.5m, I would be expecting £2m would be the minimum we would let Guthrie go for and would be expecting a more than that tbh.

Not beyond the bounds of possibility that it could be around the £3m-£5m mark given his age, potential, the fact that he's English, his experience (almost 30 games in the league for Bolton), his utility (played LM, RM and CM for Bolton) and the fact that it's Keegan doing the buying;)

monkey9

oobydooby wrote: »

Whether we ever see it or not (more likely a 5-3-2 with fullbacks overlapping IMHO), I think Rafa is very enterprising with his systems and tactics. His vision of football is not 'total football' like Ajax 1970s but 'organic football'.

Rather than extraordinarily versatile players who can play anywhere he has specialised players but who are intelligent and can adapt to different formations. It takes a lot of training to get a whole team (or a whole squad) to be able to adapt to a new formation. It's not just like lumping a big CF up front for the last 10 minutes. Rafa seems to love his percentage plays and if he pushes players forwards for the last 15 minutes chasing a game, he would want the whole team to change shape and know how to adapt to the new formation. The team is like an intelligent organism.

His choice of leaders, a fluid front 4, fullbacks who overlap forwards and defensive midfielders who can break up play or link up play anywhere between the boxes all suggest this to me. I'd expect him to practice 3-5-2 but I can't see where we'd ever need to use it.

Kuyt's a perfect example of this. Probably why Rafa appreciates him. He's adapted so well to the right side.
Also, another reason he'd be after Keane who can play in a number of positions within the formation that Liverpool would play.

MementoMori

Looks like a deal is done for Guthrie.
Be surprised if he can't agree terms with Newcastle.
Tis all action at the moment.

REDS AGREE FEE FOR GUTHRIE MOVE

Steve Hunter 11 July 2008

Liverpool have agreed a fee with Newcastle United for the transfer of Danny Guthrie to the North East.
The former Academy player, who spent last season on loan at Bolton Wanderers, will now discuss personal terms with Newcastle boss Kevin Keegan before finalising the deal.

Liverpool FC Head of Press Ian Cotton said: "We have agreed a transfer fee with Newcastle United for the transfer of Danny Guthrie.

"We have now given Newcastle permission to speak directly with the player."

From liverpoolfc.tv

MementoMori

Current Transfer Activity

Arrived : £9.8m
Degen free
Dossena £6.8m
Cavalieri £3m

Departed : £18m
Riise £4m
Crouch £11m
Le Tallec £1m
Guthrie £2m (minimum would expect more)
Kewell £0m

Ahead: £8.2m

Possible Departures £27.5m - even being pretty conservative with what we might get
Xabi £16m
Finnan £1.5m
Carson £4m
Itandje £2m
Pennant £4m

Possible Net Gain (After all possible departures and all confirmed arrivals) £35.7m

Barry: £18m

Net remaining £17.7m

So even assuming conservative sales valuations for the possible departures and paying Villa £18m for Barry we could potentially have £17.7m for other purchases even if the transfer kitty was nil, which I can see it being. My own opinion is that it would be something around the £20m range=> Potential remaining transfer budget £37.7m

MementoMori

The mail quoting a £2m price tag (don't know how reliable this is)- there better be well tasty sell on clauses in this deal because if we only got £2m.:(

Saw somewhere that Arsenal have a 30% sell-on clause in Bentley's contract which could work out quite nicely for them - just like Guthrie came through our youth system Bentley came through theirs, so I think it would be only fair.

Definately the potential to be a bargain for Newcastle - have the feeling we could have done better out of this deal than £2m, but looking to free up cash.

Danny Guthrie, Liverpool to Newcastle - Insider says: 4/5

The midfielder impressed on loan at Bolton and Liverpool were hoping he would command a fee of £3million but Newcastle appear to have secured a bargain with a £2m move for the 21-year-old.

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/sport/football/article-1034324/THE-INSIDER-Its-jeepers-keepers-Spurs-sell-Robbo-Rovers-release-Friedel--Guthrie-goes-Toon--Sunderland-close-Goian--Plus-inside-news.html?ITO=1490

Karmafaerie

I've been saying for months that we'll spend money this year.
I even have friends who I bet with about it.

I've always said that we'll make at least £40,000,000 in sales, and get £15,000,000 - £20,000,000 as a budget.

That's £60,000,000 hopefully, which is almost as much as last year when we bought Torres, Skretel, Babel, and Masch (among the others).

We don't need anywhere near as much of an improvement this year, so I'm still happy.

Charlie

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I've been saying for months that we'll spend money this year.
I even have friends who I bet with about it.

I've always said that we'll make at least £40,000,000 in sales, and get £15,000,000 - £20,000,000 as a budget.

That's £60,000,000 hopefully, which is almost as much as last year when we bought Torres, Skretel, Babel, and Masch (among the others).

We don't need anywhere near as much of an improvement this year, so I'm still happy.

Where are you getting this £40 mil in sales. Couchie will net 11 and Alonso another 15 if that goes through, and you'll get 2 from us for Guthrie, but after that you'll only pick up a mil here and a mil there on players like Finnan.

Mr Alan

charlie mchugh wrote: »

Where are you getting this £40 mil in sales. Couchie will net 11 and Alonso another 15 if that goes through, and you'll get 2 from us for Guthrie, but after that you'll only pick up a mil here and a mil there on players like Finnan.

Riise £4m
Crouch £11m
Le Tallec £1m
Guthrie £2m
Xabi £16m
Finnan £1.5m
Carson £4m
Itandje £2m
Pennant £4

---

45.5

thats conservative valuations as well. one or two mightnt leave but to say the total going out will be around 40 is fair enough.

Karmafaerie

charlie mchugh wrote: »

Where are you getting this £40 mil in sales. Couchie will net 11 and Alonso another 15 if that goes through, and you'll get 2 from us for Guthrie, but after that you'll only pick up a mil here and a mil there on players like Finnan.

I'm only putting down those completed and probable but...

£11 - Crouch
£15 - Alonso
£4 - Riise
£2 - Itange
£2 - Guthrie
£5 - Carson
£4 - Pennant
£2 - Finnan
£1 - Le Tallec


That's £46,000,000 right there.
And doesn't include others who could be moved on.
(ie: possible but unlikely such as Yossi and HHH, and the kids and failures such as El Zhar)

PHB

Which equals two top quality attackers if the deals are done right. One very good striker and a world class winger would be the goals surely.

Charlie

Mr Alan wrote: »

Riise £4m
Crouch £11m
Le Tallec £1m
Guthrie £2m
Xabi £16m
Finnan £1.5m
Carson £4m
Itandje £2m
Pennant £4

---

45.5

thats conservative valuations as well. one or two mightnt leave but to say the total going out will be around 40 is fair enough.

There's a fair few ifs in that list though.

Karmafaerie

PHB wrote: »

Which equals two top quality attackers if the deals are done right. One very good striker and a world class winger would be the goals surely.

Rafa doesn't want a traditional winger as he said yesterday.
He wants to get his width from the back with a fluid front three from what I can see.

I agree with what you're saying, but I think that rafa wants a wing-forward, rather than a winger.

Mr Alan

charlie mchugh wrote: »

There's a fair few ifs in that list though.

Riise £4m
Crouch £11m
Le Tallec £1m
Guthrie £2m
Xabi £16m
Finnan £1.5m
Carson £4m
Itandje £2m
Pennant £4

The ones in bold are vurtually for sure!?! that leaves one that theres a good chance wont leave, valued at 4m, leaving out total at over 40m.

Charlie, there comes a time in everyones life when they have to admit they are wrong

Karmafaerie

charlie mchugh wrote: »

There's a fair few ifs in that list though.

No there really isn't man.

The only players not really strongly linked in that list are pennant and Finnan, and take them both away, and you still have £40,000,000!

MementoMori

Riise £4m - Deal done - price confirmed on Roma website
Crouch £11m - Deal done
Le Tallec £1m - Deal done
Guthrie £2m - Deal done

Xabi £16m - Obviously the big one - seems to be a bit of brinksmanship between Juve and Pool atm imo. My belief is that Juve's last offer of £15m was turned down and that Liverpool are holding out for £16.5m. Can see a deal being eventually completed, possibly next week.
Carson £4m - A lot of interest (WBA, Stoke, Boro and Blackburn) and currently surples to requirements - I think if someone offered around the £5m to £6m a deal would be done
Itandje £2m - According to reports in Turkey working out personal details currently
Finnan £1.5m - Part of the Villa valuation he signed a three year contract last year - only major negative against him is his age - I'd have said around the £3m mark myself. Think he could do a good job for a mid-table team.
Pennant £4m - Saw a rumour in the last few days that we were looking for £6m off Newcastle but they were only offering £4m plus lucrative add-ons

---

45.5

Karmafaerie

I think we're speaking in stereo Alan!:p

Nalz

I honestly think if pool were to get Barry, Keane and a winger in the mould of what Pennant was supposed to be then they will finally be a force for the league, and would be worth a bet. Alot of ifs and buts I know but strong everywhere else.

Charlie

MementoMori wrote: »

Riise £4m - Deal done - price confirmed on Roma website
Crouch £11m - Deal done
Le Tallec £1m - Deal done
Guthrie £2m - Deal done

Xabi £16m - Obviously the big one - seems to be a bit of brinksmanship between Juve and Pool atm imo. My belief is that Juve's last offer of £15m was turned down and that Liverpool are holding out for £16.5m. Can see a deal being eventually completed, possibly next week. £16 million is a big if
Carson £4m - A lot of interest (WBA, Stoke, Boro and Blackburn) and currently surples to requirements - I think if someone offered around the £5m to £6m a deal would be done Why would Blackburn want him with Friedal? Not a chance WBA or Stoke would shell out that money on a keeper, and tbh, I think few EPL teams would after his displays last season considering what you'd get on the continent for that money
Itandje £2m - According to reports in Turkey working out personal details currently According to reports in Turkey, Arda Turan should hav signed for Newcastle 3 times over
Finnan £1.5m - Part of the Villa valuation he signed a three year contract last year - only major negative against him is his age - I'd have said around the £3m mark myself. Think he could do a good job for a mid-table team. Can see him moving for tha, fair enough.
Pennant £4m - Saw a rumour in the last few days that we were looking for £6m off Newcastle but they were only offering £4m plus lucrative add-ons Not a hope we'd spend that on him. With Duff, Milner, Spiderman, and Zog, what would spending that money on Pennant give us that we don't already have?

---

45.5

.

Charlie

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I think we're speaking sh/te Alan!:p

+1 to that :pac:

jesus_thats_gre

lol ^^

EDIT: not at the above comment. At the post analysing the prices. Tis some petty ****..

MementoMori

Friedel is 37 and apparently Ince wants to move him on. Here's a link for the Friedel to Villa rumour

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1034324/THE-INSIDER-Its-jeepers-keepers-Spurs-sell-Robbo-Rovers-release-Friedel--Guthrie-goes-Toon--Sunderland-close-Goian--Plus-inside-news.html

Brad Friedel, Blackburn to Aston Villa - The Insider says: 4/5

The American goalkeeper's relationship with Villa owner Randy Lerner should sway the £2.5million deal the Midlanders' way despite interest in the 37-year-old veteran from Manchester City and Arsenal.

Spending money on an international keeper with Premiership experience such as Carson who is only just 22 seems to me emminently sensible for clubs such as Stoke and WBA. If you want to see why Boro need a keeper just ask one of their fans how they rate Brad Jones (current number one since Schwarzer went to Fulham) You can say all you want about potential unnamed keepers being available for sale from the continent but I doubt Stoke and WBA have a massive world-wide scouting system. Particullarly with regard to the rather specialist goal-keeper position. Also Carson is quite clearly for sale and has potential for the future as regards improving his performance and increasing in value. Also his performances in the EPL were mainly affected after his mis-adventure on England duty. This would be something that you would expect him to improve on as he matures.

The reports that Itandje is in Turkey are coming from the fact that he isn't at pre-season training at Melwood, so I would give them some creedence.

The big one is Xabi and you probably havent been following this as closer a s Liverpool fans so fair enough. I honestly don't think £16m is a big if for Juventus since according to recent reports they have just had an offer of £15m rejected. It's not as if the £16m is for a being talked about in relation to a club who havent even expressed an intererst. Imho this is currently at the end-game stage of negotiations and is complicated by the fact that Rafa doesnt want to end up with both Barry and Xabi in the squad.

The Pennant to Newcastle one is probably the least reliable in my eyes but I have seen reports that N'Zogbia was possibly on his way out. I'd have thought Pennant would only go to Newcastle in part-exchange for Milner but the £9m valuation makes me doubt a deal will be done on this.

Still it is only £4m so you can take that out and still have the £40m in sale.

Sorry but there is definately a distinct possibility that Liverpool will realise £40m in sales this summer. Thank you for you contribution though.

The Rooster

MementoMori wrote: »

So even assuming conservative sales valuations for the possible departures and paying Villa £18m for Barry we could potentially have £17.7m for other purchases even if the transfer kitty was nil, which I can see it being. My own opinion is that it would be something around the £20m range=> Potential remaining transfer budget £37.7m

I think most or all of the Mascherano and Skrtel transfers have to be deducted from the £37m. I'd say there's a pretty high chance that was from the 2008 budget rather than the 2007 budget (which was well used up).

MementoMori

ShanksLegend (previously reliable source) on rawk.com has said Carson is going to Middlesborough - no indication of price.

I wonder if Carson does end up at Boro and its not in a part-swap deal with Downing, can we discount the possibility of signing Downing. Would be strange to do a straight deal with Boro and then turn around and try and buy Downing off them, no?

MementoMori

The Rooster wrote: »

I think most or all of the Mascherano and Skrtel transfers have to be deducted from the £37m. I'd say there's a pretty high chance that was from the 2008 budget rather than the 2007 budget (which was well used up).

Yeah - that's maybe true enough but I was kind of hoping that after all the shenanigans that went on the yanks might have agreed to a transfer kitty of £20m for the summer since then - kinda on the basis of Rafa going - give me £20m for the summer plus whatever I can raise from sales and I won't mouth of. Even if a transfer budger for 2008 had been agreed months back, there is also the case of the additional revenue earned from prize money and TV for progressing to the last four of the Champions League, which couldnt have been planned for back then unless in the sense that Rafa was told - whatever we make past the group stages in the CL you can use in yout summer transfer budget.

The £37m transfer budget is pretty optimistic especially considering the arrival of a keeper and the two defenders already. Still I live in hope.

Karmafaerie

The Rooster wrote: »

I think most or all of the Mascherano and Skrtel transfers have to be deducted from the £37m. I'd say there's a pretty high chance that was from the 2008 budget rather than the 2007 budget (which was well used up).

I went through all this earlier in the thread, so I'm just gonna say this on tha matter.

There isn't a club in the world that operates on a calender year budget.
All clubs operate on a season-season budget, with the EPL fiscal year being 01 July-30 June AFAIK.

Simple as.

Masch and Skretel were part of the budget for last year, and this is simply fact.

Last year Liverpool had a net outlay of roughly £35,000,000 through both transfer windows,
£20,000,000 doesn't seem like a massive stretch for me this year, never mind the £15,000,000 that I suggested.

But who knows, Rafa could have been given anything from $200,000,000 to a few tesco club card vouchers for all any of us know.

All we can say is that Rafa is talking about spending, so he obviously has something.

Chardee MacDennis

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I went through all this earlier in the thread, so I'm just gonna say this on tha matter.

There isn't a club in the world that operates on a calender year budget.
All clubs operate on a season-season budget, with the EPL fiscal year being 01 July-30 June AFAIK.

.

it is a well known fact that in the last refiniancing the americans also took a loan for last jans and this summers transfer budget. the two are one in the same....

DeadSkin

Good luck Crouchy, one of the funniest photos I've seen in a long time.

Karmafaerie

BastardPrince wrote: »

it is a well known fact that in the last refiniancing the americans also took a loan for last jans and this summers transfer budget. the two are one in the same....

Yes, and it's also a "well known fact" that the amount was for £48,000,000.

£48,000,000
-£6,000,000 : Skertl
-£16,000,000 : Masch
+£8,000,000 : Momo
= £34,000,000


So your point is what exactly?
That we don't have £15,000,000-£20,000,000 cause we have £34,000,000?!!

It's a void point man.
Anything spent last season, was spent last season.
Clubs ballance their books in the closed season, and then start again at the start of the transfer window.

I'm not saying that Rafa has loads, I'm saying that he has something, that'll be suplimented with £40,000,000(ish) in sales, making our spending around £55,000,000-£60,000,000 for the year at least.

And that's more than enough to get what we need.

£60,000,000
-£6,000,000 : Dossena
-£0 : Degen
-£3,000,000 : Cavalieri
-£18,000,000 : Barry
=£27,000,000

Leaving £33,000,000 (hypotethicaly)

Keane for £20,000,000
And who knows, Uranga, VDV, Downing, Riera, etc, etc, etc...

That would be a team I was very happy with.:D

IrishMike

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Yes, and it's also a "well known fact" that the amount was for £48,000,000.

£48,000,000
-£6,000,000 : Skertl
-£16,000,000 : Masch
+£8,000,000 : Momo
= £34,000,000


So your point is what exactly?
That we don't have £15,000,000-£20,000,000 cause we have £34,000,000?!!

It's a void point man.
Anything spent last season, was spent last season.
Clubs ballance their books in the closed season, and then start again at the start of the transfer window.

I'm not saying that Rafa has loads, I'm saying that he has something, that'll be suplimented with £40,000,000(ish) in sales, making our spending around £55,000,000-£60,000,000 for the year at least.

And that's more than enough to get what we need.

£60,000,000
-£6,000,000 : Dossena
-£0 : Degen
-£3,000,000 : Cavalieri
-£18,000,000 : Barry
=£27,000,000

Leaving £33,000,000 (hypotethicaly)

Keane for £20,000,000
And who knows, Uranga, VDV, Downing, Riera, etc, etc, etc...

That would be a team I was very happy with.:D

Nicely put mate.
Heard on the radio that the fee for Crouch was £12m.
If thats the case its a fantastic piece of business for a man out of contract in 12 months.

gixerfixer

Think no matter which way you look at it besides the signings already made Keane and unfortunatly Barry are on the way also.Would love to see Keane in the Liverpool shirt but am hoping that the Barry deal falls through and we get to keep Alonso.Doesnt seem likely mind:(

Mr Alan

I would say Keane is very very far from a done deal tbh.

and maybe give Barry a break until he actually kicks a ball for us yea?

joe123

If we buy robbie keane I would say its a good buy....if we spend 20 million on getting him I will get sick. No way is he worth 20 million. Hes worth about 10-12. Barry isnt worth 18 hes worth about 12 also.

Liverpool are bad in the transfer market...

If i see villa in an english jersey (taking it liverpool arent getting him) i will also get sick unless chelsea have spent crazy money say over 30. But if hes bought below that and we buy keane for 20 and barry for 18 its bad business.

Keep alonso and buy villa. Alonso is better than barry. And Cheaper it looks like.

I dont feel like posting but blah il be off and see how the summer dealings pan out.

GBX

Interesting quote out of Athletico about Silva ...

http://www.teamtalk.com/football/story/0,16368,2483_3806695,00.html