Best & Worse Commentators

nhughes100

Since there's a bit of discussion going on in another thread about commentators I thought it would be a good idea to get views on the best and worst commentators/commentary teams. Please cite a few examples.

For me Gorilla Monsoon & Bobby Heenan could not be beaten. Particularly Wrestlemania 8 and the Rumble where Ric Flair won his first WWF title. Notable mentions go to Jesse Ventura. I'm not mad on JR and the King, seems a bit forced sometimes. Joey Styles when ecw was really ecw.

I can't stand Mike Tenay or any of the TNA crew, like I said in a different post - Gordon Solie - Simply can't understand how he inspired so many. Schiovanie, Kevin Kelly, not mad on Tazz or JBL, Cole. but Coachman aint too bad. Wcw/nwa seemed to always have inferior commentary teams.

Vince wasn't a bad commentator either except he pretended he didn't own the company.

rovert

nhughes100 wrote: »

Joey Styles when ecw was really ecw.

And Joey Styles was really Paul Heyman in his headset. Paul was so great in WCW too.

nhughes100 wrote: »

I can't stand Mike Tenay or any of the TNA crew.

I liked Tenay in his Professor role in WCW.

nhughes100 wrote: »

Gordon Solie - Simply can't understand how he inspired so many.

Apparently he made some great calls but all the tapes of them were burnt in a fire or something.

Tazz and Cole were good when motived

Im a fan of Jim Cornette too.

Vince135792003

The best play by play announcer I've listened to over a long time is Jim Ross. No one comes close for me especially in the way he's been able to adapt and keep going from one wrestling period to another.

I like alot of others too like Tenay (in WCW), Gordon Solie (from the bits on dvd I've heard) and even Schiavone had his moments. I liked Gorilla Monsoon too. I think he was perfect for the era of the WWF he commentated on but I can see why others may not have been a fan of his.

The best color guy is a bit more tricky for me. I probably couldn't pick one but it would be a toss up between Heenan, Ventura and Piper. I liked Taz alot too when he and Micheal Cole had a good Smackdown show to call a few years ago.

Bubs101

I agree with Vince that the best play by play guy is definitely J.R. but ATM, I probably prefer Micheal Cole.

As for the best color commentator, without a doubt it is JBL. He was so so good last year

Charlie

J.R is wrestling, period. He is the voice who we associate with so many of the great wwf/wwe moments. The passion the man has for the business comes through on the big occasions, and it is testament that all the top stars want J.R commentating on their main event. In the last 2-3 years I feel he has been a little off, but I put that down to the crap he has to try and hype.

Alot of people seem to hate Schivone, and whilst there was times he was too OTT, I thought he had a great broadcast voice, possibly even better than J.R's. For me, he will always be the 'voice' of WCW.

As far as colour guys go, I thought King's work from 1996-2002 was brilliant. So witty, and he really knew how to take a pot shot at someone. His ass kissing of McMahon and corporate Rock, complimented J.R's face love of Austin.

Honourable mentions to Monson and Heenan, and Shane O Mac on Heat was pretty day-cent.

Could never stand Tazz, Joey Styles, or the three man Raw team when Coach was a part of it. Foley is a little too formulaic at the moment, and I think his natural face quality hurts him. TBH I think the colour guy should always have at least a twitch of heel to them. JBL is a good example.

chopperbyrne

A few years ago at Royal Rumble (I think?) both the Raw and SD commentators were commentating on the match itself and they were being quite competetive with each other. Tazz & Cole destroyed JR and King.

I enjoyed Schiavone, Heenan and Zbysko in WCW, especially when they were pro WCW and anti nWo.

Heyman has always been good as a colour commentator and Ventura was gold.

Heenan and Monsoon were easily the best commentary team of all time though.

Otis Driftwood

For me,Monsoon and Heenan are unbeatable as a double act.

More recently,I really liked Heyman when he commentated,the man just made you hate whoever he was biased towards.

King was funny as hell when he was a heel supporter but he is just kinda annoying now.

Always hated Mitchell Cole.

JR is also a top,top play by play announcer.

As Mick Foley said,his commentary could make a bad match good and a good match great.

ShawnRaven

#1: Monsoon & Heenan were good on Challenge, but Prime Time was when they were at their best. I always say they were too late getting Heenan to do the PPV's. He was at his funniest around 88-89.

#2: Ventura & McMahon, although McMahon was bloody awful, his reactions to Ventura's Hogan bashing were always priceless. Ventura actually convinced you that the heel was in the right. No commentator can do that anymore really.

#3: Jim Ross & Paul Heyman in 2001. This was only meant to be a once off while they found a replacement for Lawler, from what i've read. But because Ross & Heyman had so much legitimate heat dating back to WCW days, they were able to play off each other so well that they kept Heyman on until November, by which point, Lawler was back in.

A mention goes to Cole and Tazz for one event only, that's the Global Warning Tour in Australia. Their commentary during that entire event is just comical, ESPECIALLY during the Edge/Jericho match.

I actually like Tenay, but Westy doesn't compliment him at all. If you want to hear Tenay at his best, check his WCW stuff, especially during the cruiserweight matches, he put Ross to shame.

Ross now is senile and just doesn't have what it takes to cut the mustard, I never liked Joey "wait for it... OH MY GOD!" Styles, one man commentary teams don't do it for me.

King needed to pack it in years ago. Although if every Diva was fired, he probably wouldn't be so annoying.

VR!

Vince135792003

validreasoning! wrote: »

Ross now is senile and just doesn't have what it takes to cut the mustard

Senile? He's 56 not 86.

Commentators are at the mercy of the product they have to put over. When wrestling is hot, commentators often look great. When wrestling is so so, it can make the commentary look the same.

I thought he was great at Mania and it was only days later on his blog he talked about how really unwell he was for the passed few weeks and how he spent a day in hospital having some sort of a surgery related to his colon (can't remember the whole thing). He missed no time and his commentary was still consistently good.

brick tamland

although he's not as good as a face now, I loved Lawlor a few years back. always loved his rumble commentary, picking "new favorites" everytime a big lad came to the ring

thought JBL was great last year but it probably had rub its course by the time he came back to Raw

Reganio 2

I will be honest and say I never seen much of him but my favourite has to be Bobby Heenan, he was just so witty and charismatic it was brilliant, I have only seen a few matches from the era but anyone he commentated on was brilliant. Usually if I am watching a match on the computer I will have my ipod on or something playing in the background and the commentary down but with The Brain I had it as I high as I could hanging on his every word.

Jim Ross a few years ago was amazing (back when the wrestling was amazing) he would just keep you gripped and him and Jerry Lawler complimented each other perfectly at the time.

Tazz isn't bad and usually looks bad as he has Micheal Cole and now that muppet Adamle or something like that, which drags Tazz down. Micheal Cole is never awfully bad....well ok he is but usually he is ok. Joey Styles I kind of liked but it gets boring hearing him say "OH MY GOD" after something happens in every match, he needs to learn to pick his moments like J.R. with his "OH MY GAWD"

Bounty Hunter

Reganio 2 wrote: »

Tazz isn't bad and usually looks bad as he has Micheal Cole and now that muppet Adamle or something like that, which drags Tazz down.

really made me laugh when the other day i walked into the room and my brother was watching some really old Gladiators and who was hosting but Adamle...he hasnt changed a bit even how he delivers his lines.

Reganio 2

Yeah I know he used to host the American Gladiators and you can see how bad he is even then. Saying that though they got a vast improvement, who is their new host? The Hulkster.

ShawnRaven

Vince135792003 wrote: »

Senile? He's 56 not 86.

But he's often botched his commentary, especially when it comes to years and stats. Which is to be expected as one gets older, but if it keeps happening, then stop doing it. We really don't need to know if Edge was in the front Row for a Hogan match at Wrestlemania or whatever, just call the match.

Thank you, come again.
VR!

Ham'nd'egger

When you consider that Bobby Heenan got a **** hot feud going between himself (A then commentator) and Bossman (Mid carder at best) about an imaginary human (Bossman's mother) and made it stick for months, that shows you just how good the man was.

On the blow by blow side, Solie is worth his position; he knew it all and made the game in a time when it had to be kayfabe. Mike Tenay was better than people make of him (I agree with you, VR; he was hurt with bad backers) and JR late 90's was at his best.

One other most honourable mention has to go to Kent Walton, stick on the World of Sport shows on TWC Fight for evidence.

Vince135792003

I'll put up with Jim Ross occassionally making statistical or even factual errors because he brings so much more to the table. There's a passion and a genuineness in the way he calls wrestling that hits home with the viewer I think. He reminds of Mícháel ó' Muircheartaigh.

ShawnRaven

Yeah, scalded dogs, government mules and BOOMER SOONER!, are examples of his passion. Another reason i hate him, especially when he brings up former college football history, that always used to bug me.

VR!

Vince135792003

For me, he'll always be the iconic voice of wrestling like Peter Aliss is to golf, Murray Waler is to racing, Bill McClarean is to rugby and Ó Muircheartaigh is to GAA. I'd put him up there with all of them.

ShawnRaven

Oh don't get me wrong, his NWA/WCW announcing was the sh*t. And when he was on, he was on. But his WWE work never really impressed me that much with the exception of the stuff he did with Heyman.

But i was always a fan of old school announce teams, so Jim Ross was destined to bore me by the time he joined WWE in 1993.

VR!

rovert

validreasoning! wrote: »

Oh don't get me wrong, his NWA/WCW announcing was the sh*t.

He was at his very best in Mid South

ShawnRaven

rovert wrote: »

He was at his very best in Mid South

So i've heard, i never really got the interest to get any tapes from that era though. Probably never will as i have about 100 dvd's i still haven't gotten around to watching yet.

Time - between that and human unreliability, it's mans worst enemy.
VR!

nhughes100

Agreed with the JR cliches and stat attacks. The king was much better when he was an out and out heal and corperate a$$ kisser. Schiavone did have a good tv voice but he was far too worried about plugging the next ppv instead of calling the match.

rovert

validreasoning! wrote: »

So i've heard, i never really got the interest to get any tapes from that era though. Probably never will as i have about 100 dvd's i still haven't gotten around to watching yet.

Time - between that and human unreliability, it's mans worst enemy.
VR!

What DVDs generally speaking (not looking for a tape list) if you dont mind me asking?

ShawnRaven

nhughes100 wrote: »

Agreed with the JR cliches and stat attacks. The king was much better when he was an out and out heal and corperate a$$ kisser. Schiavone did have a good tv voice but he was far too worried about plugging the next ppv instead of calling the match.

Schiavone was a complete ass according to Heenan's shoot interview from 2001 i believe it was. If ever he was told anything about match details, he wouldn't inform anyone (the likes of Heenan or Tenay). Heenan always felt that Schiavone was a powermonger of sorts. Definitely a brown noser.

VR!

nacho libre

"Jim Ross & Paul Heyman in 2001. This was only meant to be a once off while they found a replacement for Lawler, from what i've read. But because Ross & Heyman had so much legitimate heat dating back to WCW days, they were able to play off each other so well that they kept Heyman on until November, by which point, Lawler was back in."

There was one very funny moment between them where Heyman really got under J.R.'s skin by accusing him of being blinkered because a wrestler he was talking about happened to be from Oklahoma.

ShawnRaven

rovert wrote: »

What DVDs generally speaking (not looking for a tape list) if you dont mind me asking?

Various televised wrestling from different promotions from 1995-2001.
VR!

ShawnRaven

nacho libre wrote: »

There was one very funny moment between them where Heyman really got under J.R.'s skin by accusing him of being blinkered because a wrestler he was talking about happened to be from Oklahoma.

You sure you're not talking about Wrestlemania X-7, where Heyman yells to Ross "How can you show such favourites for a Texan, being from Oklahoma?!", where Ross mumbles "It's a respect thing!" or words to that effect?

Priceless commentary from those two for that entire PPV.

During Test v Guerrero, Saturn is at ringside wearing the goofiest hat ever
PH: "You of all people can't comment on hats!"
JR: "Nice Ponytail!"
PH: "Thank you!"

Yup... priceless
VR!

D-FENS

I agree that JR has gone quite stale in recent times, but there's still no play by play man that comes close to his career on a whole. Not just his vast knowledge of the industry, but his ability to be the complete straight man amidst all the craziness was at times an art in itself, plus of course, the memorable shows of emotion from time to time (Granted, a lot of this was for guys he was a actual fan of or was friends with outside of the ring like Austin or Foley) . Lawler was always muck in my view, just a pantomime heel as far as his WWF days go, both wrestling and commentating (I don’t know about his career before that so won’t comment), he got away with being a poor colour guy because of his obvious chemistry with Ross, but even that can't hind how bad the King is now and he is even tarnishing JR a bit (Remember the time when JR wouldn’t even acknowledge the King perving on a diva? now he nearly joins in).

Colour wise, I’d struggle to pick between Heenan and Ventura. Jesse was hilarious n the late 80’s, and a lot of the heels of the time have him to thank for bigging them up (Half of them got feck all interview time to do it properly for themselves!) and his constant berating of Hogan even helped him get over more I think, until people realised he was right all along of course.
Heenan is one of the most quick-witted people I’ve ever heard, in wrestling or otherwise, I have a friend who despises wrestling but can’t deny how funny the Brian was. Plus, he would have the edge on Jesse in terms of wrestling knowledge (Not always a priority for a colour guy, or at least not in WWF it seems, but it helps!), and his knowledge of the industry on a whole was possibly better than Monsoon’s as well really.
Heenan was such a good manager that it’s easy to forget how good he was on commentary as well.

I guess the dream team for me was JR and the Brain, although I admit neither was really at their best when they did commentate together in ‘93
I would also give an honourable mention to Paul Heyman, who was brilliant when commentating for WWF along with Ross.

ShawnRaven

D-FENS wrote: »

II guess the dream team for me was JR and the Brain, although I admit neither was really at their best when they did commentate together in ‘93

Heenan still has it, Heenan is still hilarious. But Ross is too much of a dry-arse. In order to be able to work with Heenan, you needed to be shocked, in the sense of "I can't believe you just said that, are you on crack?". Ross is not that kind of guy, he's the kind who just bows his head down and mumbles "yeah well..."

So Heenan and Ross were never gonna be a great announce team, sadly. It's like Shawn Michaels and Curt Hennig. Two outstanding workers, but together, something just didn't click.

VR!

rovert

validreasoning! wrote: »

Heenan still has it, Heenan is still hilarious.

You know Heenan isnt able to speak after surgery he had two months ago?

nacho libre

validreasoning! wrote: »

You sure you're not talking about Wrestlemania X-7, where Heyman yells to Ross "How can you show such favourites for a Texan, being from Oklahoma?!", where Ross mumbles "It's a respect thing!" or words to that effect?

Priceless commentary from those two for that entire PPV.

During Test v Guerrero, Saturn is at ringside wearing the goofiest hat ever
PH: "You of all people can't comment on hats!"
JR: "Nice Ponytail!"
PH: "Thank you!"

Yup... priceless
VR!

Yes that must be it! The ponytail comment was hilarious too.
It was also funny when Heyman would try to undermine JR by staring blankly at the camera while Jim Ross was speaking. I was actually disappointed when Lawler came back. Perhaps it might have eventually got tiresome between the two of them but the genuine personal dislike between the two of them made for great viewing at the time.. I used to imagine Jim Ross losing his temper with Heyman when they went off-air.

ShawnRaven

rovert wrote: »

You know Heenan isnt able to speak after surgery he had two months ago?

I actually hadn't heard much on that surgery, i know he was in a coma post surgery, but that was the last i had heard.

VR!

ShawnRaven

nacho libre wrote: »

Yes that must be it! The ponytail comment was hilarious too.
It was also funny when Heyman would try to undermine JR by staring blankly at the camera while Jim Ross was speaking. I was actually disappointed when Lawler came back. Perhaps it might have eventually got tiresome between the two of them but the genuine personal dislike between the two of them made for great viewing at the time.. I used to imagine Jim Ross losing his temper with Heyman when they went off-air.

Ross, to his credit was a total professional around Heyman, towards the end of the ECW DVD, they show a bit of the RAW (i think it was after No Way Out 2001) where they're about to go on the air and Ross bascially says to him "you'll do fine, kid, don't worry". I'm not sure Ross is the kinda guy to lose his temper, he strikes me as the guy who'd shuffle away disgusted, then post it on his blog.

Oh wait, don't we all do that sh*t here?
VR!

D-FENS

validreasoning! wrote: »

Heenan still has it, Heenan is still hilarious. But Ross is too much of a dry-arse. In order to be able to work with Heenan, you needed to be shocked, in the sense of "I can't believe you just said that, are you on crack?". Ross is not that kind of guy, he's the kind who just bows his head down and mumbles "yeah well..."

So Heenan and Ross were never gonna be a great announce team, sadly. It's like Shawn Michaels and Curt Hennig. Two outstanding workers, but together, something just didn't click.

VR!

Oh I don't think Heenan was past it by '93, far from it, just that it probably was'nt his best year, maybe because he knew it was going to be his last with WWF, I don't know. Plus JR had just started and was really only finding his feet, as far as Vince McMahon’s required style of commentary goes anyway (Selective memory, ignore the fans' real reaction, pretend the leg drop is an awesome finisher etc.)
You're probably right about the chemistry never making it work, but I still would have loved to see Heenan in the King's place during, say, the attitude era. His full heel comments on the likes of Austin or the Rock would have been quite memorable I’d say.
And yeah, Mr. Perfect’s feud with HBK was disappointing, but I bet he was just glad to get out of the one with the Narcissist

grames_bond

good ol JR is the real king of commentary! he gave us expressions like "this is a slobberknocker" and "hes runnin like a scaulded dog with a case of the liver tail"

ShawnRaven

grames_bond wrote: »

good ol JR is the real king of commentary! he gave us expressions like "this is a slobberknocker" and "hes runnin like a scaulded dog with a case of the liver tail"

Actually, i think it would be hilarious if JR and King traded places, could you imagine Lawler gacking on about Government mules and JR gasping, wanting to see the puppies?

That would be "absolutely priceless!"
VR!

grames_bond

validreasoning! wrote: »

Actually, i think it would be hilarious if JR and King traded places, could you imagine Lawler gacking on about Government mules and JR gasping, wanting to see the puppies?

That would be "absolutely priceless!"
VR!

haha u know that would be something else allright!

jr: puppies, puppies, puppies!!