Non-VRT'd cars seizure N11

Steve

SomeDose wrote: »

Ergo, a car (be it racing, sporting or otherwise) is not liable for registration if it is not for use on a public road. And as far as I can tell, their definition of "register" or "registration" is not extrapolated to mean putting an actual registration plate on the vehicle.

I'll wager this aspect of the Act has never actually been challenged or brought up in court. If it ever was (i.e. if Revenue seized an unreg'd "road" vehicle from private property), I'd put my house on it being struck out of court in short order.

Race cars are exempt but not for the reason you quoted.
Any vehicle being temporarily imported for an 'event' or 'exhibition' is exempt as long as it's not intended to be sold.

Read this:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55982074&postcount=32

Followed by this:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56005054&postcount=27

ambro25

This

GTC wrote: »

Why would you be granted exemption?

is symptomatic of the current "presumed guilty on sight".

Forgive me for stating the obvious, but aren't you supposed to know why that poster should be granted exemption (on the basis of ownership information per his post)? There's no question (or need) of sympathy, simply of knowing & applying the law. Needless to say, I can well imagine the poor guy trying to explain it all at a roadblock - especially if he's not carrying duplicates of all of his exemption application file, including the appeal! There ya go, seized there and then, ya can walk home - even though he is fully within his rights!

By the sound of it, we were lucky to get VRT exemption 3 years ago. With the GVT tax situation being what it is is these days (not enough in the coffers by a country mile, after 10+ years of keeping their sieve under a waterfall!), I'm not surprised one bit fewer and fewer people are getting their legitimate application rejected, nor surprised one bit more and more of an effort is being done on enforcing VRT: THAT's why they'd be well right to call it a Banana Republic. Mind you, setting up and maintaining the VRT in the face of EU pressure makes quite the case for the denomination in the first place!

And don't posters bother jumping on their high horses : we're f*cking off right back to the UK quick as we can by this Summer. And putting the car back on yellows quick as we can too: can't wait to divide our motoring costs by at least three! Indeed, thank f*ck we were exempted, as I very much doubt we'd be getting our money back 3 years on! My only consolation will have been to get away with Irish road tax, Irish insurance and that farce the NCT for the last year (stored & insured the car overseas, find another mug ye f*ckers!)

Hanley

To all the guys who are giving the finger to the "subservient" masses by not paying VRT and acting like it's some show of political defiance... Yeah bloody right.

If it was a nominal sum like €100 people would be quick enough to fork it over. The reason people are dodging VRT is because they're too cheap to pay it. It's not being done as a show of righteous indignation.

GTC

ambro25 wrote: »

This



is symptomatic of the current "presumed guilty on sight".

That's odd, I said "why" not "how dare you". Strange typo on my part.

Steve

ambro25 wrote: »

manure...

It's not the Guards' fault, they don't make the law... ring your TD.

unkel

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Because we are EU citizens transfering residence, which entitles us to an exemption from VRT if we have owned the cars for more then 6 months

Absolutely!

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Proving this has been a nightmare, we have had to provide bank statements, gas bills all sorts

Surely you have all those?

And payslips, records of ATM withdrawals (proof you were physically there), credit card payments (again proof you were physically there), MOT test details, car servicing bills, all household bills, repair bills, voters register details, even addressed junk mail, etc. etc.

I'd have thought proving you lived in a country for a stated period of time would be very easy indeed?

galwaytt

GTC wrote: »

........Transporter vehicles can tap the rear brakes to force them off and the car is dragged off..

....indeed, no more than the clip on the news the other evening towing away those roadside 'for sale' cars.

I just hope the corps/agents/etc have good insurance. Tapping the brakes does not release disc brakes - maybe the drums on a 1981 Cortina MkIV - ..........so, damage the vehicle, resultant use by owner (after paying fine etc and reclaiming it.....), and brake failure results in - god forbid - injuries and fatalities to either the driver, passsengers or.........bystanders waiting for the 46A bus.......

Think it can't happen........??

Say you do release the brakes - and it's in gear - and you drag it onto a flat bed - stripped timing belt and resultant mechanical mayhem...........

Ah yes, this is going to be interesting............when the recovery people get sued enough, and won't risk touching someone's car..........will the Gardai have to buy their own fleet of 'lift' recovery units?

SomeDose

stevec wrote: »

Race cars are exempt but not for the reason you quoted.
Any vehicle being temporarily imported for an 'event' or 'exhibition' is exempt as long as it's not intended to be sold.

Read this:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55982074&postcount=32

Followed by this:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56005054&postcount=27

I think we're in agreement then? As you say yourself:

"It's exempt.

If you wanted to use it on the road or sell it then you'd have to VRT it."

...Which is the point I'm making. For an unreg'd car on private property, Revenue cannot prove or assume any intent to use it on the road. Or if they do, I imagine it'd be fairly easy to make a case that you were planning on tracking or competing it. Hence, there is no requirement to register it until the time comes to put it on the road.

Steve

SomeDose wrote: »

I think we're in agreement then? As you say yourself:

"It's exempt.

If you wanted to use it on the road or sell it then you'd have to VRT it."

...Which is the point I'm making. For an unreg'd car on private property, Revenue cannot prove or assume any intent to use it on the road. Or if they do, I imagine it'd be fairly easy to make a case that you were planning on tracking or competing it. Hence, there is no requirement to register it until the time comes to put it on the road.

Good try.:D

What I meant in that post was you'd have to VRT it when you imported it, not afterwards.

I think the problem is that when you came to putting on the road, you'd have to explain why you declared that you'd no intention of doing so when you imported it.
I'd guess they'd then hit you with the 20%* late payment penalty at that point.
I'm no expert on this BTW, I just have an interest in looking up motoring law - I'm open to correction if I have misinterpreted anything.:)



*can anyone confirm what the penalty is?

Beta Ray Bill

kmart6 wrote: »

It's not illegal,and if you don't know that you shouldn't be even talking about it!

Double Taxes are illegal in the EU. VRT is a double Tax.

murphaph

daRobot wrote: »

The self righteous attitudes of some of the people on this thread are just disgusting.

You can see how customs get tipped off about uk reg cars when you have these types of people taking it so very personally that someone hasn't paid their Vrt.

It's the whole embittered attitude of "Well I had to pay it, so i'll make sure that you do" that stinks. The gloating and taking pleasure about people having their cars impounded by customs is bizarre to me on a section of a forum that's supposed to be for car lovers.

Personally, anyone who can get away with not paying Vrt, I say fair f*cks to them. While the tax itself is technically legal, it's certainly not fair.

It'd would be easier to stomach the tax if the billions of revenue collected by this tax over the past few years went toward creating a fantastic road network, but it ain't so. Motorists are getting taxed heavily but getting nothing back, but the pleasure of driving on some of the worst roads in Europe.

And what if I feel my income tax is unfair, afterall in Dubai etc. they don't have to pay any, should I attempt to evade paying that as well? There's no VAT in Jersey-I'm being robbed paying 21% on almost everything! Maybe we should try to evade that one as well. Where do you stop? Without taxes our country would descend into anarchy. Everyone has their own ideas on what constitutes 'fair' taation and to be honest, I prefer some fat cat paying tonnes of VRT than me paying the difference in increased income tax thanks all the same. I believe the VRT system (as is happening soon) needs tweaking to make smaller, more efficient cars more attractive and I believe Vehicle Road Tax needs scrapping to be replaced by a tax on fuel but the present system is LAW and WE as a SOCIETY elect lawmakers (flawed as they often are) to change these laws. If enough people wanted VRT scrapped to be replaced by higher income tax or whatever, it would happen. It's not politically important because it's not important to most people. Democracy in action.

Seth Brundle

grahambo wrote: »

Double Taxes are illegal in the EU. VRT is a double Tax.

Under which law is it illegal?

ambro25

GTC wrote: »

That's odd, I said "why" not "how dare you". Strange typo on my part.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I pplied for exemption from VRT in October, once we had decided to stay permanently in Ireland. Our application was, eventually, rejected despite the fact we had my car four years and my wifes 9 months prior to moving to Ireland.
15:11

GTC wrote: »

Why would you be granted exemption?
15:13

Strange indeed. I'm not being facetious, just sarcasting you back if you don't mind So, do you want to try that one again?

stevec wrote: »

It's not the Guards' fault, they don't make the law... ring your TD.

Where have I said it was the Guard's fault? :rolleyes:

Sizzler

More checkpoints on the way!

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/thousands-of-foreignregistered-cars-checked-in-roadside-tax-blitz-1407975.html

The breakers yards are going to be busy crushing all those dirtbox LHD's

Esel

Sizzler wrote: »

The breakers yards are going to be busy crushing all those dirtbox LHD's

Why are they dirtboxes?

peasant

Sizzler wrote: »

More checkpoints on the way!

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/thousands-of-foreignregistered-cars-checked-in-roadside-tax-blitz-1407975.html

The breakers yards are going to be busy crushing all those dirtbox LHD's

Quoted from the article:

Revenue sources say that while court action is always possible -- and taken in many cases -- they tend to impose fines on offenders more often than not with what is known as a "compromise penalty".

Penalties

It saves times, recoups the money due in the first place as well as additional late-payment penalties. These are often calculated on a rising percentage of the car's value -- depending on the length of avoidance -- and can come to a considerable amount.

The apparent proliferation of foreign -registered cars has been a serious source of complaint by the motor industry here. They claim both individuals and private importers are gaining a huge advantage over legitimate businesses by not paying VRT or by avoiding payment for months or, in extreme cases, years.

They claim this has most recently been exacerbated by the confusion caused by the changeover to the new emissions-based taxation system which kicks in from July 1 as some owners hold off on registering where a lower VRT rate will apply from next month.

But last night, the motor industry's representative group, SIMI, welcomed the higher level of visible checking. Its chief executive Alan Nolan said he hoped it would continue, as far too many had escaped for too long. He claimed it had been too easy in the past to avoid paying taxes. He also claimed that gardai needed to step up their tracking of foreign-registered cars

Anybody mention the minor matter of insurance?

Or perhaps the other minor matter of roadworthyness?


NOO ...it's all about money again ...no surprise there, then

Sizzler

esel wrote: »

Why are they dirtboxes?

I'm basing it on what I see locally mate, e.g. parked down the road, a lad thats lived here for 2 years with an LV LHD DIRTBOX 1990(ish) VW Transporter.

Property prices dropping as we speak as hes parked it up for the last month in a communal area and looks to have fcuked off home :mad:

Sizzler

peasant wrote: »

Quoted from the article:



Anybody mention the minor matter of insurance?

Or perhaps the other minor matter of roadworthyness?


NOO ...it's all about money again ...no surprise there, then

Yeah, poorly written article in fairness. Agree 100% with you. Its always made out its about tax enforcement and only flag the road safety element when it goes t*ts up :mad:

Steve

So the motor industry now control the government who control the guards. SIMI losing money = clampdown on VRT evasion. SIMI wins, gov't wins, motorist loses again.

hmmmm.....


/runs off to post in conspiricy theories.

peasant

Sizzler wrote: »

I'm basing it on what I see locally mate, e.g. parked down the road, a lad thats lived here for 2 years with an LV LHD DIRTBOX 1990(ish) VW Transporter.

ahemm ...you ARE aware that this here benevolent moderator does drive a LHD 1990 VW Transporter, yes ?

Man ..you just lost brownie points, biiiig time :D:D

Sizzler

peasant wrote: »

ahemm ...you ARE aware that this here benevolent moderator does drive a LHD 1990 VW Transporter, yes ?

Man ..you just lost brownie points, biiiig time :D:D

So this one is yours then

http://www.autobanka.com/images2/3956n1.jpg

peasant

nope ...engine at the wrong end

now ...back on topic ...