New L/Provisonal Drivers Rule/ Law

Anan1

E92 wrote: »

People need to remember that when you are on L plate you are LEARNING to drive.

We're always learning to drive. People on L-plates are still learning the basics of how to drive. Automotive Kindergarten, if you will.

ninty9er

Ciaran500 wrote: »

Ehh, source?

http://www.transport.ie/viewitem.asp?id=9904&lang=ENG&loc=2126#_ftn1

how else are you going to prove "supervised practice"

mondeo

I'm so happy that finally I wont have to see micras etc jumping all over the place at the traffic lights anymore. Anyone who complains at this point that they should still be alowed on their own in their car are foolish, selfish and an extreme danger to other properly licensed drivers.

I have seen the Gardai in clondalkin village actively waving in L plate cars which appeared unaccompanied. I'm sure there will be many cars up for sale and insurance policy cancelations as of July 1st unless you have a member in your household willing to hold your hand everytime you need to drive down to get a litre of milk in tescos. Best bet it to raid your shed and get the cobwebs off your pushbike, a new pump and rain coat and stop complaining!

ninty9er

AudiChris wrote: »

I never drove a car alone before passing my test. I never got put on my dad's insurance or bought a car until I passed.

I did 4/5 months of lessons before my test and passed first time.

I think this is the best way to learn to drive.

I think that it's important to make the driving test more practical and more like real driving, too many people say "well, I failed, but the test isn't realistic. I'm a deadly driver and very safe, but the test doesn't test that, it's not like real driving."

WALOB!

Make the test stricter
Make it more detailed
Make it happen in a greater variety of situations
Make it harder to be a driving instructor
Make it more likely for people to be dropped from a full licence back to a provisional licence - once you pass, it doesn't excuse you from improving or maintaining your standards

All of the above here too.

eringobragh

ninty9er wrote: »

All of the above here too.

X3

L1011

ninty9er wrote: »

http://www.transport.ie/viewitem.asp?id=9904&lang=ENG&loc=2126#_ftn1

how else are you going to prove "supervised practice"

"supervised practice" there refers to the 6 months waiting period. It does *not* refer to compulsary lessons. Can just be a two-years qualified mate or relation or whatever sitting in the car while you figure it out for yourself...

Gregor Samsa

ninty9er wrote: »

http://www.transport.ie/viewitem.asp?id=9904&lang=ENG&loc=2126#_ftn1

how else are you going to prove "supervised practice"

Despite the ambiguous language in the Minister's statement a that you linked to, the new regulations make no reference to compulsory lessons at all. The "supervised practice" can be with any a fully licenced driver of at least two years experience. There's no requirement to log or prove that you've partaken in it - just if you are going to be driving, you need to have such a person with you.

E92

eringobragh wrote: »

X3

X4

-Chris-

AudiChris wrote: »

I think the single biggest, black-and-white example of the way the test needs to be revamped is that you're not allowed to drive on motorways while you're a learner, you're not tested on motorway driving, and then once you pass, you're magically able to travel at 120kmph in 2 tons of metal, knowing exactly what to do when someone ahead of you brakes heavily in the dark and the rain.

Climate Expert wrote: »

I would hazard a guess that every single driver in Ireland would know what to do in that situation.

I'd hazard not all would!

What's the answer?
Brake too?
Quickly switch lanes?
Don't brake but check your mirrors so you know if you have an escape route?
An alert driver will know WHY the brakes are coming on on the car infront as they're watching the road rather than the back of the car they're following.

My point is that that kind of proactive thinking should be covered by the training/test as well as the basics of the 3-point turn.
The fact that a learner driver who plays by the rules will go from never being on a motorway before to being: on any motorway, in every condition, surrounded by (possibly) equally untrained drivers - that's the bit that concerns me...

Alanstrainor

ninty9er wrote: »

Compulsory lessons are here as of next Tuesday my friend!

That is not true. There is nothing to do with compulsory lessons in the new learner permit system.

ninty9er

Alanstrainor wrote: »

That is not true. There is nothing to do with compulsory lessons in the new learner permit system.

My bad. That's how I read it though. They are coming AFAIK. I recall something about having a log being mentioned in September but can't find anything now.

Alanstrainor

ninty9er wrote: »

My bad. That's how I read it though. They are coming AFAIK. I recall something about having a log being mentioned in September but can't find anything now.

There are lots of proposals to update the dated driving test. But as of yet there is no set date or official "next step forward" as such.

craichoe

DarkJager wrote: »

I'll happily summarise it and maybe you can all tell me where the problem lies. To start with, the grading sheet had no marks, except 1 Grade 3 fail which caused me not to pass the test. Now this grade 3 was suspiciously enough for "Observation" during the 3 point turn. This is exactly what happened:

I come to a cul de sac which has no houses and an 8ft brick wall cordoning it off from the next street. Tester asks me to perform a 3 point turn. I check all mirrors, check the back window, and complete the first part. Check the mirrors, check the back window and perform the reverse manuever. Check the mirrors, quick glance through back window and position the car in the final part of the turn. All ok, I'm asked to drive on.

When I get back to the test centre, I'm quite happy, mainly that I managed to do the reverse around the corner without any problems (it was one area I had difficulty getting right during the lessons). I then get told that I have failed the test due to an observation fault. I ask him where this fault occured, and he says the 3 point turn. His explanation is that during the final section of the turn, I did not look out the back window enough and there could have been kids or cars coming from behind me.

Now I've never heard about this amazing ability children and cars have gained, to appear or travel through an 8 foot brick wall into an empty cul de sac. Have you? Doesn't seem very fair to waste my 40 euros because of an out of touch with reality tester does it?

Ohhhh. .... the old "Watch where your going" one.

Yup .. fraid this is a common one, you can't glance in the direction and travel while looking the opposite way. Like, you wouldn't drive forward after glancing out your front window and then look out the back while moving forward.... at least i hope not anyway !

hot2def

While I agree with the new measures, applaud the cut in waiting times and hold a full license myself, I can't help but notice the smug attitude in this thread which has nothing to do with making the roads safer.

I don't know about you - but most of the time when I see some eejit dangerously overtaking, blowing red lights and changing lanes without due observation or indicating - its a middle aged person in an 05 or better saloon or SUV, and I don't doubt they have a license.

Lets not sh1t ourselves about how safe the roads will be now....

Zube

hot2def wrote: »

Lets not sh1t ourselves about how safe the roads will be now....

Of course, getting tens of thousands of unqualified drivers off the road is only a start, but it is a start.

Plus, they are funny when they get angry!

rhapsody

I'm not sure if this has been covered here or in another thread, but what will the Gardai do if they catch an unaccompanied provisional driver like myself driving along? is it a fine or points on my license or both?
What exactly should one write on a letter accompanying a driving test application- which will speed up the process I wonder?

peasant

rhapsody wrote: »

I'm not sure if this has been covered here or in another thread...

you will find answers to your questions on the Learning to drive forum

Spud83

rhapsody wrote: »

I'm not sure if this has been covered here or in another thread, but what will the Gardai do if they catch an unaccompanied provisional driver like myself driving along? is it a fine or points on my license or both?
What exactly should one write on a letter accompanying a driving test application- which will speed up the process I wonder?

Driving unaccompanied = €1000 fine minimum
Driving unaccompanied and failing to display L plates is a possible €2000 fine.

You cant write anything on your driving test letter to get it speeded up. Send the applciation then you will receive a confirmation letter that your application has been recevied this will include a confirmation number/case number. Not sure about points.

You can then ring the RSA and tell them that you are willing to take a cancellation and be tested at short notice. You can also try get a letter from your job stating why you need it for your work (getting to and from work doesn't count) and send this in along with a letter referencing your confirmation number.

rorymagory

Hey,

I'm trying to get through to the 1890... RSA number all morning and can't get thru so maybe someone here will know..

Only got my provisional in March so cannot sit my test for at least 6 months after (September3rd at earliest)

You think they'ed waive this for the sake of letting me have a test quick before next week? I realise that the 6 month rule is there for a very good reason and i'm being cheeky by asking them but could be worth a shot. Plus i'm hardly the first person to have this problem.

Rory

Spud83

rorymagory wrote: »

Hey,

I'm trying to get through to the 1890... RSA number all morning and can't get thru so maybe someone here will know..

Only got my provisional in March so cannot sit my test for at least 6 months after (September3rd at earliest)

You think they'ed waive this for the sake of letting me have a test quick before next week? I realise that the 6 month rule is there for a very good reason and i'm being cheeky by asking them but could be worth a shot. Plus i'm hardly the first person to have this problem.

Rory

I would seriously doubt they will let you sit a test before Sep 3rd. Lots of reports that the RSA number has been hard to get through for a while prob with so many people calling due to leaving it till the last min on these new laws.

Why would they waive it? Besides the law doesn't change for you next week only for people on second provisonals. As for the six month thing a year ago it was impossible to get a test within six months anyway.

DarkJager

craichoe wrote: »

Ohhhh. .... the old "Watch where your going" one.

Yup .. fraid this is a common one, you can't glance in the direction and travel while looking the opposite way. Like, you wouldn't drive forward after glancing out your front window and then look out the back while moving forward.... at least i hope not anyway !

Well thats the thing you see, you don't keep staring out the back window when you're driving forward do you?? The part I failed for observation on was the final part of the 3 point turn where you are positioning the car to move off (i.e not in reverse). So if you can explain how its fair to fail someone because they "didn't look out the back window long enough" when it is not the reverse stage of the 3 point turn, then I'd love to hear it.

baldbear

"Just 1.6% of fatal accidents were blamed on learner drivers, according to the National Roads Authority figures. To add to the embarrassment, a Department of Transport road safety document says enforcing provisional licence regulations does not significantly reduce accidents."

Young people 17-25 seem to takes risks in every aspect of ther lives from sleeping around to messing around in cars smoking the weed.. etc.

The government is full of <SNIP>.

MODEDIT: unprovable accusations and pointless ranting removed

Spud83

DarkJager wrote: »

Well thats the thing you see, you don't keep staring out the back window when you're driving forward do you?? The part I failed for observation on was the final part of the 3 point turn where you are positioning the car to move off (i.e not in reverse). So if you can explain how its fair to fail someone because they "didn't look out the back window long enough" when it is not the reverse stage of the 3 point turn, then I'd love to hear it.

I'm glad your back.
Can you explain how you perform the reverse around the corner manoeuvre.

I have sneaking suspicison that the tester got confused between the two when talkin to you as I believe you said somewhere it was a emm "heated" exchange.

DarkJager

alanmurphy83 wrote: »

I'm glad your back.
Can you explain how you perform the reverse around the corner manoeuvre.

I have sneaking suspicison that the tester got confused between the two when talkin to you as I believe you said somewhere it was a emm "heated" exchange.

Why would I need to explain how I reverse around a corner? That part of the test went without any marks against me.

The grade 3 fault I recieved is under the "Turnabout" section in Observation.

Spud83

DarkJager wrote: »

Why would I need to explain how I reverse around a corner? That part of the test went without any marks against me.

The grade 3 fault I recieved is under the "Turnabout" section in Observation.

Fair enough. Sorry I was goin on the bases of what your instructor told you not what was on your sheet. Thought he/she might have got mixed up during the converstaion. I can't work out your fail

craichoe

DarkJager wrote: »

Well thats the thing you see, you don't keep staring out the back window when you're driving forward do you?? The part I failed for observation on was the final part of the 3 point turn where you are positioning the car to move off (i.e not in reverse). So if you can explain how its fair to fail someone because they "didn't look out the back window long enough" when it is not the reverse stage of the 3 point turn, then I'd love to hear it.

LOL .. you look in the Direction of travel .. you do the same when cycling a bike

Look in front when going forward, look back when going back .. showing general observation for oncoming traffic in front and left/right, but your primary focus should be the direction the car is moving in.
All i'm saying is its a common mistake that someone looks out the front when they start they start reversing and then look behind them AFTER they've moved.

Anyways .. you failed .. i didnt so .. work that one out.

Its either that or the other one is people just move their head all over the place without knowing where to look.

tomred1

I would not not take failing to heart, i believe they fail alot of people just to make up numbers by giving you a ****ty grade 3. When you fail a exam in school its explianed to you were you went wrong but the driving test is not, they just say go back to your instrutor.

DarkJager

craichoe wrote: »

LOL .. you look in the Direction of travel .. you do the same when cycling a bike

Look in front when going forward, look back when going back .. showing general observation for oncoming traffic in front and left/right, but your primary focus should be the direction the car is moving in.
All i'm saying is its a common mistake that someone looks out the front when they start they start reversing and then look behind them AFTER they've moved.

Anyways .. you failed .. i didnt so .. work that one out.

Its either that or the other one is people just move their head all over the place without knowing where to look.

Your ego is hurting my eyes...

You've really just proved my point that I failed for absolutely nothing. I was failed for not looking out the back window enough during the final part of the 3 point turn (which is NOT the reversing part). So is that fair that I didn't pay enough attention to the direction the car was NOT travelling in?? Didn't think so...

rorymagory

alanmurphy83 wrote: »

I would seriously doubt they will let you sit a test before Sep 3rd. Lots of reports that the RSA number has been hard to get through for a while prob with so many people calling due to leaving it till the last min on these new laws.

Why would they waive it? Besides the law doesn't change for you next week only for people on second provisonals. As for the six month thing a year ago it was impossible to get a test within six months anyway.

I'd say you're right.
Cheers for the reply

craichoe

DarkJager wrote: »

Your ego is hurting my eyes...

Whatever :rolleyes:

DarkJager wrote: »

You've really just proved my point that I failed for absolutely nothing.

Well obviously you did, you didnt pass .. I don't think you pass for nothing.

DarkJager wrote: »

I was failed for not looking out the back window enough during the final part of the 3 point turn (which is NOT the reversing part). So is that fair that I didn't pay enough attention to the direction the car was NOT travelling in?? Didn't think so...

How do you know ? You failed on observation ..

I'd say just get a refresher lesson and apply again, dont get so annoyed over it.