Chelsea Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours

eZe^

JPA wrote: »

It looks good when you put it like that but what bout the potential for Ancelotti to take some time to get accustomed to the league?
You are assuming only positivity from him.

Maybe, but he is a manager who is a shrewd tactician, so I wouldnt read into that too much, Avram Grant brought ye's to a CL final and nearly won a league title, this Chelsea team if picked correctly can manage itself.

JPA

eZe^ wrote: »

Maybe, but he is a manager who is a shrewd tactician, so I wouldnt read into that too much, Avram Grant brought ye's to a CL final and nearly won a league title, this Chelsea team if picked correctly can manage itself.

Pah, I'm no chelsea fan.

ShoulderChip

JPA wrote: »

It looks good when you put it like that but what bout the potential for Ancelotti to take some time to get accustomed to the league?
You are assuming only positivity from him.

That is true, to be honest most of my positivity has come from being genuinely impressed by his/their performances during the pre-season.

And I know that the pre-season has a rep for being a joke, but we have played strong teams with both sides taking it seriously (judging by team selection at least) and what I have seen has made me excited.

This coupled with the fact that for a long time I have been dreaming of playing 4-4-2 and I think Ancelottis 4-diamond-2 model will suit us.

I also believe that United will struggle next year especially in midfield and I do not see liverpool improving too much. I would be more worried about arsenal.

ShoulderChip

JPA wrote: »

Pah, I'm no chelsea fan.

Well cheers for posting here anyway,

we could do with more debate from non fans, I find myself getting blinkered very easily anyway.

Kirby

Chelsea are going to do well this year. Champions league or premierleague in my opinion. One or the other. The team is too good not to win something. Something bigger than the carling cup .

Arsenal play one up top.
Liverpool play one up top
Chelsea play one up top....have done for years.
Man Utd play two up top.

Simplistic? perhaps. But the lone striker doesn't do a team any favours when their goal is to WIN games.... which is what you need to do when you wanna win a title. Is it a coincidence that Barca play with three strikers?

Ancelotti is a guy with a plan, and the conviction to stick with it. I'm betting he is going to stick with the diamond with two up front. And drogba and anelka will prosper. Gonna be the team to beat this year me thinks.

Bubs101

eZe^ wrote: »

Maybe, but he is a manager who is a shrewd tactician, so I wouldnt read into that too much, Avram Grant brought ye's to a CL final and nearly won a league title, this Chelsea team if picked correctly can manage itself.

Grant was a phenomenal manager though who only ever made one mistake (carling cup). Lost us very few games, had a better record than Mourinho in terms of points per games, had us in contention for everything in the final hour and had he been in charge from the start we would have won the league.

eddiehead

ShoulderChip wrote: »

I also believe that United will struggle next year especially in midfield and I do not see liverpool improving too much. I would be more worried about arsenal.

I wouldn't be worried about Arsenal in the slightest. I think any of United, Liverpool or ourselves could claim to have the strongest team in the league, Arsenal are a good bit away imo.
I won't go jumping to any conclusions like last year but I am more confident going into the start of the season this time round, a fully fit Michael Essien and the addition of Zhirkov being the main reasons, also our biggest rivals selling their best player.

Kirby

Bubs101 wrote: »

Grant was a phenomenal manager though who only ever made one mistake (carling cup). Lost us very few games, had a better record than Mourinho in terms of points per games, had us in contention for everything in the final hour and had he been in charge from the start we would have won the league.

Hmm.

Ill say the same thing here that I said in the Liverpool thread a few days back. Its the players that play. The manager can set up a system, and a game plan, but once the whistle goes, everything the manager does is largely irrelevant and its down to the 11 guys on the pitch.

Chelsea did amazingly well when Grant came in. But the training didn't change....he picked the same team......they played the same formation. It was the players that held it down for the season really. Not that grant is a bad manager, but he was using Mourinho's players, with Mourinho's system. The only difference with Grant was that the infighting stopped. An important difference, but that was it really. Lampard and Terry led the team as much as Grant did.

Bubs101

Kirby wrote: »

The only difference with Grant was that the infighting stopped. An important difference, but that was it really. Lampard and Terry led the team as much as Grant did.

So he used his man management skills:pac:

Kirby

Well you could look at it that way. Which is why I said "he wasnt a bad manager".

Or, you could look at like this.

Mourinho had caused rifts and a bit of an intangible poison had settled in with players bickering. Replacing him, with anyone, would have stopped the fighting. What they needed was stability. Nobody had heard of Grant before he got the job. He was abramovich's man through and through.....he did what abramovich wanted. Which is why he brought in. Hence, stability and no fighting. The players knew that Grants words were also abramovich's words. The guys telling you your tactics, is basically the same guy that's paying you. Players don't argue with that.

Stability.

smuckers

Kirby wrote: »

Hmm.

Ill say the same thing here that I said in the Liverpool thread a few days back. Its the players that play. The manager can set up a system, and a game plan, but once the whistle goes, everything the manager does is largely irrelevant and its down to the 11 guys on the pitch.

Chelsea did amazingly well when Grant came in. But the training didn't change....he picked the same team......they played the same formation. It was the players that held it down for the season really. Not that grant is a bad manager, but he was using Mourinho's players, with Mourinho's system. The only difference with Grant was that the infighting stopped. An important difference, but that was it really. Lampard and Terry led the team as much as Grant did.

also Grant had no input into the training, that was the words from Makelele.

Terry finally makes a statement he's staying!

blue-army

http://www.justin.tv/vip_euro_1/old


link to the game...

30mins gone. 0-0.

CHD

Di Santo finally showing what he can do.

blue-army

CHD wrote: »

Di Santo finally showing what he can do.

What a ball by Malouda for the first goal!!!

Di Santo did brilliantly too to set up the 2nd.

Sheva was very lively too. Looks like he might be staying.

The_Hustler

Scoring 2 goals in every single match, not bad at all.

We've won all I wanted now this season, I can't believe we're The World Soccer Tournament Challenge Champions!

CHD

Yep the new World Soccer Football World Series Challenge Tournament Champions Of The World USA 4 Team Competition Champs, Delighted.

JP Liz

Terry staying

Panthro

only seen the last 20mins or so of the match last night. have to say, once di santo got a goal he was all over the pitch.he upped his game completely. he and malouda were providing each other with neat passes.
pizzaro and shevvy looked interested in making an impression too.
the back four looked solid,this diamond formation could work really well for us this season.

MementoMori

Decent article on the current state of Chelsea after the US tour.

Nothing earth shattering but a nice summary of where things are.

Anyone have any idea when Sturridge's tribunal will be? I could see that being very interesting.

Also not having seen the diamond formation being talked about would it be accurate to describe it as 4-3-1-2 or 4-1-2-1-2 or 4-1-3-2? Basically how forward would Lampard be playing as the front of the diamond and how wide/narrow would the two of the diamond be?

What have we learned from Chelsea's American tale?
A new tactical approach, a squad meshing nicely and a warm US reception – Chelsea's pre-season has been something to write home about

Chelsea's players departed the stunning new Cowboys stadium last night for London having secured the first trophy of what they hope will prove a glittering first campaign under Carlo Ancelotti. There are bigger priorities than the inaugural 2009 World Football Challenge yet, in defeating the Mexican side Club America in Dallas to maintain momentum from impressive wins over Internazionale and Milan, they will have drawn encouragement aplenty.

The zigzagging across the United States may have sapped energy, but Chelsea return home today far fitter than they left, with their captain's commitment to the club reaffirmed and the squad overseen by a manager who will have gleaned much over two weeks away with his players. Ancelotti will crave evidence of how his team fares under pressure in competitive fixtures, but this tour – marked by a wholeheartedly contested game against his former club, Milan, in Baltimore last Friday – has offered real glimpses of what Chelsea will offer in the campaign proper. So what, then, have we learned?

1) Tactically, Ancelotti intends to play a diamond in midfield, capped initially by Frank Lampard as the marauding playmaker with Deco and Salomon Kalou offered outings in the role against Club America last night. John Mikel Obi and Michael Essien are his first-choice midfield shields, though Michael Ballack may have had an opportunity to stake his claim for the role had he retained his fitness, and Deco had two outings in the position. There will be a pair of strikers – gone, apparently, are the days of 4-3-3 with Didier Drogba barging passage forward with only wide men for company – with the full-backs asked to supply the team's natural width. Luiz Felipe Scolari tried something similar a year ago but never really struck a balance between rip-roaring attack and defensive industry. The Italian in Ancelotti will not put up with frailties if the full-backs are caught too often up-field and the channels left exposed.

2) The team's play may prove far less direct than in recent seasons, with Ancelotti placing the onus on retaining possession in midfield, all neat triangles and overlaps, rather than seeking out Drogba's brawn and muscle through the middle. Inter and, at times, Milan seemed off the pace in coping with the slick approach, with Clarence Seedorf admitting he could already spy evidence of the Ancelotti effect taking hold of Chelsea. Whether Premier League opponents, starting with Manchester United in the Community Shield in under two weeks, find it quite so irresistible remains to be seen.

3) Manchester City could regret letting Daniel Sturridge slip away. The teenager actually stands more chance of making a mark at first-team level with Chelsea than he did at Eastlands given City's recent outlay on forwards. He impressed against Seattle Sounders with a debut goal and assist, unnerved Inter at times in California and should have added to his tally on tour against the Mexicans. Sturridge remains raw but, with his transfer fee still to be decided by a tribunal, he should prove a bargain.

4) Despite the lack of a marquee signing to date, Chelsea's squad retains its depth and quality, even with Joe Cole and Ballack back in Cobham undergoing rehabilitation from injury. Sturridge and Ross Turnbull are useful additions, the latter as a back-up goalkeeper, while Yuri Zhirkov – on the basis of his excellent debut against Milan – will offer balance, defensive surety and spring up-field whether he is employed at full-back or, more likely, in midfield. Deco, for now, and Ricardo Carvalho remain at the club, with the centre-half impressive and eager to put last season's toils behind him. The management had craved more flair, hence their interest in Franck Ribery, though Lampard – albeit in a different way – already appears a natural source of creativity and goals in the hole behind the forwards.

5) Andriy Shevchenko and Claudio Pizarro's days at the club are numbered. That is hardly a revelation given that each spent last season on loan away from Stamford Bridge. Yet the Peruvian's impact was negligible and the Ukrainian, despite a new haircut and a public insistence that he would like to stay, appears to be on the fringes. Ancelotti confirmed he did not anticipate the man he rated so highly at Milan remaining beyond the 31 August transfer cut-off. Others, most probably the youngsters Michael Mancienne, Sam Hutchinson, Franco di Santo and Scott Sinclair, are expected to move elsewhere on loan in search of first-team experience.

6) Ancelotti's English is improving though it remains a work in progress. He appeared exhausted and frustrated at times at his inability to explain himself fully, which is utterly understandable, though good humour generally shone through and his assistant Bruno Demichelis is providing invaluable assistance as a makeshift interpreter. There appears to be a real determination about Ancelotti to expand his vocabulary, however, and first impressions suggest he will not fall into the same trap as Scolari, whose English rather stagnated once competitive games came thick and fast.

7) The United States appears to have taken to Chelsea. This was the Premier League club's fourth visit to the country in five years for pre-season and, at last, they have made their mark. Chelsea shirts littered the considerable crowds in Seattle, Pasadena, Baltimore and Arlington where the team played. The gates were magnificent. Some 81,224 people attended the 2–0 victory over Inter, and 71,203 the tight 2–1 win over Milan in Baltimore. The Cowboys stadium was heaving last night with just over 57,000 watching on despite Mexico having played the United States a few hours earlier in the final of the Gold Cup. When the Chelsea players appeared on the astonishing 160ft by 72ft high-definition LED television screen suspended above the playing surface of this arena – the largest screen of its type with 30,000,000 light bulbs and built at a cost of £25m – prior to kick-off, even the Hispanics in the crowd bellowed their appreciation. This club is making an impression in these parts.

Given the crammed schedule and draining west-east-west travelling, that represents a fine use of two weeks away. Chelsea will be buoyed that John Terry has committed his future to the club despite Manchester City's attempts to lure him away, and that has added gloss to their pre-season, but they gleaned far more from the brief spell in the US. The players expect to be back next summer, most likely to defend the trophy won courtesy of Di Santo and Florent Malouda's late goals. They should receive a hospitable welcome.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2009/jul/27/chelsea-us-tour-lessons

ShoulderChip

Ha, was just about to post that,

a pity he thinks sheva and Pizarro will move on.

CHD

Don't think both of them will unless we get someone else in. Both are perfect for 3rd choice strikers.

ShoulderChip

yeah if that's the case I am happy.

CHD

ShoulderChip wrote: »

yeah if that's the case I am happy.

What was that strikers name who plays in Germany who we have been linked with? Can't remember.

ShoulderChip

hmm,
I can't remember exactly, I was just checking Wolfsburg's team as I want it to be dzeko and saw that they just signed obafemi martins today.

Pizarro seems to want to stay anyway http://www.clubcall.com/chelsea/striker-plans-chelsea-stay-925659.html

a google news result showed no articles suggesting sheva would.

ShoulderChip

Wait it must have been dzeko was it?

I was thinking of Arnautovic but he plays in holland and is austrian.

Dzeko would be pretty damn fly.

CHD

Thats him i think, Croat or something, love to sign him.

EDIT: Yup its him, 23 yr old Bosnian who hit 25 goals last season. Links with him seemed to stop a month ago so unlikely he will come in.

Bubs101

Dzeko (bosnian) was meant to be amazing last year. Gambling wise Wolfsburg came from nowhere and he drove them

Number Nine

All in all a good US tour. Good to see so many new Chelsea fans .

LanceStorm

any word on how sheva has performed in pre-season?

none of the highlights of the games have shown him much, so i guess that might speak volumes!!

to be honest I really really want to see him finish on a decent season with us, he dosent deserve the reputation he has got now as a rubbish over the hill striker!!

i think with his new hair he's ready to bang in about 10-15 goals for us in all comps, with his crowning achievement being the winner in the champs league final in extra time!!

CHD

Sheva did alright, didn't get too much game time though. He is worth keeping imo.

The_Hustler

And now that we're offering Pizarro (and maybe Mancienne on loan) to AC Milan in exchange for Pirlo, we need to hold on to him.

ShoulderChip

The_Hustler wrote: »

And now that we're offering Pizarro (and maybe Mancienne on loan) to AC Milan in exchange for Pirlo, we need to hold on to him.

Where did you hear that?

It sounds ludicrous.

say it not so.

Edit: nevermind, one google news result for Pirlo and its this morning's Daily Mail, moving on...

Vokes

Here's roughly how they lined up on Sunday in Arlington in the 1st / 2nd half respectively iirc:

---

Hilario

---

Mancienne -- Alex -- Carvalho -- Hutchinson

---

Essien

---

---

Sinclair

---

Malouda

---

---

Deco

---

---

Sturridge --- Kalou

---

---

Turnbull

---

Mancienne / Ivanovic -- Alex -- Carvalho --- Hutchison / Cole

---

Deco

---

---

Essien

---

Malouda

---

---

Kalou / Sheva

---

---

Di Santo ---- Pizarro

---

It was a game of contrasts for Deco and Essien. Deco was non-existent at the head of the diamond in the 1st half. But he was pretty good at the base in the 2nd half and was dictating all the play. Essien was decent at the base in the 1st, but pretty much confirmed in the 2nd half that he's a monster driving forward from the CM role. I

Elsewhere Kalou, Malouda, Mancienne and Di Santo also impressed. And Sheva has lovely hair.

Super stadium btw with its jumbatron screen. Very impressed with it.

The_Hustler

ShoulderChip wrote: »

Where did you hear that?

It sounds ludicrous.

say it not so.

Edit: nevermind, one google news result for Pirlo and its this morning's Daily Mail, moving on...

Don't insult me by saying my info is from the Daily Mail

I'll give multiple web sources, not much but better than that tripe

http://www.tribalfootball.com/ac-milan-ask-after-chelsea-defender-mancienne-259816
http://www.tribalfootball.com/chelsea-include-pizarro-new-offer-ac-milans-pirlo-259820
http://www.eatsleepsport.com/chelsea/carlo-prepares-pirlo-bid-925863.html
http://www.clubcall.com/chelsea/pirlo-swap-mooted-925863.html

CHD

The_Hustler wrote: »

Don't insult me by saying my info is from the Daily Mail

I'll give multiple web sources, not much but better than that tripe

http://www.tribalfootball.com/ac-milan-ask-after-chelsea-defender-mancienne-259816
http://www.tribalfootball.com/chelsea-include-pizarro-new-offer-ac-milans-pirlo-259820
http://www.eatsleepsport.com/chelsea/carlo-prepares-pirlo-bid-925863.html
http://www.clubcall.com/chelsea/pirlo-swap-mooted-925863.html

Hmm relax, but all those links are poxy too tbh.

blue-army

The_Hustler wrote: »

http://www.tribalfootball.com/ac-milan-ask-after-chelsea-defender-mancienne-259816
http://www.tribalfootball.com/chelsea-include-pizarro-new-offer-ac-milans-pirlo-259820
http://www.eatsleepsport.com/chelsea/carlo-prepares-pirlo-bid-925863.html
http://www.clubcall.com/chelsea/pirlo-swap-mooted-925863.html

haha..
They're even worse than the Daily Mail!

Wouldn't be surprised it Ancelotti goes for Pirlo though.

eddiehead

Do we really need Pirlo?

Surely its money that could be better spent on some much needed youth.

CHD

eddiehead wrote: »

Do we really need Pirlo?

Surely its money that could be better spent on some much needed youth.

Unless he's a class chef or a quality waterboy then no.

LanceStorm

just one insane big bid for aguero, thats all i want!!

30-50million, I dont care, football is going that way, lets not be caught out in a year or two's time when all the top top talent plays for madrid or city and all our players start retiring with noone and no time to replace them with!!

The_Hustler

blue-army wrote: »

haha..
They're even worse than the Daily Mail!

Wouldn't be surprised it Ancelotti goes for Pirlo though.

The Daily Mail sometimes comes out with absolute ****e that doesn't have a hope of being true while I often look at those sites and the stories seem valid.

Though, it seems the offer of Pizarro has been rejected (http://www.tribalfootball.com/ac-milan-keen-do-pirlo-business-chelsea-260053) and some of the same sites (and the Daily Mail!) are now saying Bremen are still after Pizarro.


You'll be happy to know Carvalho seems to want to stay
http://www.tribalfootball.com/carvalho-now-looking-forward-staying-chelsea-260081

Or if you don't trust such sites:
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2561075/Carvalho-looks-to-the-future.html?OTC-RSS&ATTR=Football

ShoulderChip

The_Hustler wrote: »

Or if you don't trust such sites:
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2561075/Carvalho-looks-to-the-future.html?OTC-RSS&ATTR=Football

what a mental thing to say!

If you don't trust Tribal Football (A website which employs ZERO journalists, just reposts football gossip from other sources)

then check here: to see The exact story in its original form from the Sun (it only took 5 hours for tribal football to get wind of the story with the identical quote. I love the way there is no mention of WHEN Carvalho made that quote WHO it was too,if it was a question or a statement etc.

The sun has a history of printing quotes like that from players who may have made them several years previously and using them out of context.

I am just trying to make a point here, I am not trying to suggest that Carvalho still wants to leave.

ShoulderChip

Ancelottit Came out today to confirm that J.Cole is firmly in his plans, he appears to be the obvious sub for Lampard at the tip of the diamon (too bad lamps never gets injured) but also said he can be used on the left or right.

He will probably be second choice on the right behind Essien ahead of Beltti in my opinion.

Bubs101

ShoulderChip wrote: »

Ancelottit Came out today to confirm that J.Cole is firmly in his plans, he appears to be the obvious sub for Lampard at the tip of the diamon (too bad lamps never gets injured) but also said he can be used on the left or right.

He will probably be second choice on the right behind Essien ahead of Beltti in my opinion.

Cole is going to take Lamps' position by the end of the year, mark my words. Man is a perfect number 10 forced to play on the wings because English football doesn't use that role. Italian manager will notice this. Richardson wrote a great article about it a few years ago

The_Hustler

ShoulderChip wrote: »

what a mental thing to say!

If you don't trust Tribal Football (A website which employs ZERO journalists, just reposts football gossip from other sources)

then check here: to see The exact story in its original form from the Sun (it only took 5 hours for tribal football to get wind of the story with the identical quote. I love the way there is no mention of WHEN Carvalho made that quote WHO it was too,if it was a question or a statement etc.

The sun has a history of printing quotes like that from players who may have made them several years previously and using them out of context.

I am just trying to make a point here, I am not trying to suggest that Carvalho still wants to leave.

If tribal football just reposts gossip, I do not see how is it mental to suggest that you may not trust it compared to a newspaper. I just thought I was posting a more reliable source (one that I saw afterwards), didn't see how that could be picked on.

I happened to see your story about Joe Cole in the Sun also. Even if the stories are incorrect, at least rumours can generate discussion about Chelsea, so can we move on please?


EDIT: The Sun today also reported that Chelsea have failed in their bid for Pirlo in exchange for Pizarro and £12.5 mil which is a fair bit more than was reported before.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2560054/Blues-forced-to-Pirlo-ver.html

ShoulderChip

The_Hustler wrote: »

If tribal football just reposts gossip, I do not see how is it mental to suggest that you may not trust it compared to a newspaper. I just thought I was posting a more reliable source (one that I saw afterwards), didn't see how that could be picked on.

I happened to see your story about Joe Cole in the Sun also. Even if the stories are incorrect, at least rumours can generate discussion about Chelsea, so can we move on please?

right so. it was more just that it came across as if you were proving your news held weight by revealing that it was in the Sun also.

Most people on here have a hang up about tabloid papers, insisting they would not wipe their asses with them.

[most people would have made your point something like
I saw some bullshit in the Sun about the Pirlo move, what do ye guys think, is he worth it, would he help us?]

but that is just an evasion tactic to get away from admitting that they went weak at the knees while reading the bit of tittle tattle.

I feel like I am diggin a hole for myself now, seriously I am going to stop now.

I was just trying to pick up on a small quirk,

wasn't meant to be a biggie.

Move on to where?
there isn't much going on now rumour wise is there?

CHD

Bubs101 wrote: »

Cole is going to take Lamps' position by the end of the year, mark my words. Man is a perfect number 10 forced to play on the wings because English football doesn't use that role. Italian manager will notice this. Richardson wrote a great article about it a few years ago

Not a hope, Lampard is better than Cole at anything in life from football to making a cup of tea. J.Cole is over rated.

JPA

Bubs101 wrote: »

Cole is going to take Lamps' position by the end of the year, mark my words. Man is a perfect number 10 forced to play on the wings because English football doesn't use that role. Italian manager will notice this. Richardson wrote a great article about it a few years ago

There is zero chance that Cole will take Lampards place.
That's insanity.

ShoulderChip

feel-good nonsense from goal.com
http://goal.com/en/news/9/england/2009/07/29/1410279/michael-essien-alludes-to-a-further-midfield-signing-at

maybe I have been thinking of Pirlo all wrong, if he is to come in as competition for the base of the diamond with Mikel/Ballack it can only lead to good things for Essien who would be needed less in that role and therefore be free to play in the right cm position


Diamond - do you agree with these players in order of choice?
Its kind of hard to do.

Base (1) Mikel, (2) Ballack, (3) Essien, (4) Deco, (5) Belletti

Left (1) Zhirkov , (2) Malouda (may start as 1st choice) (3) J.Cole, (4) Kalou, (5/6) Lamps/Ballack (7) Deco

Right (1) Essien, (2) J.Cole, (3) Belletti (4/5) Lamps/Ballack (6) Deco, (7) Schevchenko

Top (1) Lampard, (2) J.Cole, (3) Deco (4) Kalou (5) Ballack (6) Shevchenko

JPA

Pirlo would go the way of Veron IMO if he signed.
Don't attack me for that!

smuckers

There is no need for Pirlo especially with Mikel signing a 5 year deal. Ancellotti seems to want him though, he doesn't really add anything extra.