Reserves overseas

timmywex

Lets remember that its only going to be specialist fields sent out more than likely, medics engineers etc etc, so these people wont be on the front line!

Hence, not as much training with the pdf required imo.

arybvtcw0eolkf

cherrypicker555 wrote: »

Its highly unlikely female PDF infantry would be capable of constantly operating at such a high tempo, ie carrying heavy loads over many hours in extreme heat/dust in constant contacts etc, either physically or psychologically.

Damn right, I couldn't agree more.

arybvtcw0eolkf

timmywex wrote: »

Lets remember that its only going to be specialist fields sent out more than likely, medics engineers etc etc, so these people wont be on the front line!

Hence, not as much training with the pdf required imo.

We travel as an infantry battalion, which means personel are drawn from the various branches in all the various commands (including the Air Corp & Naval Service).

We form up together and train as one.

Something almost unique to the Irish soldier is that each and every member is first and foremost trained as an infantry rifleman, and thats including medics (as recruits & on NCO courses).

One doesn't necessarily get more training than the other when the form up period begins.

Evd-Burner

It'd be pretty cool that as a reservist ye had the option as going away for training for an entire summer paid, would benefit most reservists as most are students etc etc.

What would yez all think of doing something like that?

In my opinion

Evd-Burner wrote: »

It'd be pretty cool that as a reservist ye had the option as going away for training for an entire summer paid, would benefit most reservists as most are students etc etc.

What would yez all think of doing something like that?

The question is would it benefit Ireland?

The thread is about reservists going overseas. I for one would love to however the rank I hold in the reserve makes it unlikely that I will get the opportunity to serve in an Infantry Bn overseas, that said I am told by my Bn commander that I would fit the bill for all other Irish overseas missions. KFOR (Kosovo) he claims has lots of jobs that are not soldier jobs but are done by soldiers none the less. I will wait and see:)

dahamster

In my opinion wrote: »

The question is would it benefit Ireland?

The thread is about reservists going overseas. I for one would love to however the rank I hold in the reserve makes it unlikely that I will get the opportunity to serve in an Infantry Bn overseas,

why what rank are you?

that said I am told by my Bn commander that I would fit the bill for all other Irish overseas missions. KFOR (Kosovo) he claims has lots of jobs that are not soldier jobs but are done by soldiers none the less. I will wait and see:)

examples?? what you are saying makes no sense

Hard Larry

In my opinion wrote: »

The question is would it benefit Ireland?

The thread is about reservists going overseas. I for one would love to however the rank I hold in the reserve makes it unlikely that I will get the opportunity to serve in an Infantry Bn overseas, that said I am told by my Bn commander that I would fit the bill for all other Irish overseas missions. KFOR (Kosovo) he claims has lots of jobs that are not soldier jobs but are done by soldiers none the less. I will wait and see:)

These "not soldier jobs" in Kosovo...are you talking about the 2 Aul Ones who work in the laundry? or the lads that clean the jacks?

They don't get paid much for todays credit crunch standard mate...you'd want to be careful applying for them positions.

Evd-Burner

It would be fairly handy to have it so that reservists know that at any moment they could be called, even if it is only a very small percentage that actually go abroad.

Would keep most reservists on there toes fitness wise etc etc.

What do yez tink of that???

Nuravictus

I'm in the RDF & I would love if it was overhauled & we got some serious training. We do get trained atm but the RDF has issues with people not showing up enough because there is no real commitment to show up.

Maybe a few PDF guys will disagree with me but I have played Enemy for the PDF & we have sent up positions that PDF 3 Stars couldnt find or locate our position which was less than 3 feet from their position. After 2 attempts the PDF Cpl asked us to revive our in-dept when he waved his hand. So we had to stand up & look like retards to keep PDF 3 Stars from getting depressed because they were been whacked by sandbaggers.

I for one look forward to things getting better in the reserve. the RDF is nowhere near as good as the PDF in my opinion, I joined the RDF for fittness & to be pushed. I havn't found that there but it is changing & getting more serious.

I think the PDF lads forget the RDF is a 500/1000 Euro Investment for most RDF Private's since we have to buy all our own equipment. We got very little for free.

Hard Larry

Nuravictus wrote: »

I think the PDF lads forget the RDF is a 500/1000 Euro Investment for most RDF Private's since we have to buy all our own equipment. We got very little for free.

Don't go there mate. I've spent that amount on Meal-Tickets alone.

I spent more money than that travelling home on leave from a mission area this year.

As for kit God knows how much I've spent on gear I needed over the years.

Get yourself a copy of the Connect magazine pull-out of the new army Battle Vest layout and actually count how many items are on issue and how many aren't.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Nuravictus wrote: »

I think the PDF lads forget the RDF is a 500/1000 Euro Investment for most RDF Private's since we have to buy all our own equipment. We got very little for free.

I don't think we do forget it actually. But you have to remember that the majority of PDF members have very little dealings with the RDF and its easy to think your all plain sailing your way through your service.

Alot of this is to do with the RDF lads themselves, why?.

I've posted about this before, lads - WE DON'T BITE!.

FFs, typical case. The other day, can't remember which exactly, I was on duty and went over to the dining hall for grub (usually I get a curry, but decided to slum it this evening). There was a good few RDF lads there, so I decided to take my meal to one of the tables occupied by them - jesus do I smell bad or something?.

The convo died, and try as I might to strike up a little chat I was wasting my time.

RDF lads have to relax a little around the PDF guys, we're all on the same team after all.

As for going oversea's, no I can't see it happening. Even if the training standards were on a par, but there's rarely a shortage of volunteers from the PDF for vacancies oversea's and if a PDF member was denied a trip in favour of someone from the RDF there would be hell to pay.

Were as the RDF want the experience and adventure of oversea's, the PDF want it for that plus it pays our wages and is in many circumstances its preferential when applying for promotion to have held certain vacancies oversea's.

There would be so many grounds for re-dressing the decision that it just wouldn't be worth it IMO.

Poccington

Nuravictus wrote: »

I think the PDF lads forget the RDF is a 500/1000 Euro Investment for most RDF Private's since we have to buy all our own equipment. We got very little for free.

We pay just the same for all our kit. I don't know why people think we get fully kitted out for jobs, as Larry said have a look at the new layout for the Battle Vest..... There's quite a lot that we have to buy ourselves. At the moment the only thing in my Battle Vest that was issued to me is a boonie hat.

PDF and RDF are in the same boat when it comes to purchasing kit.

Manic Moran

It happens everywhere. I've bought a few bits and bobs myself, from my holosight through mag pouches, to spare uniforms, and I'm in the US. Something the US does do, though, is that they take a survey of things that soldiers buy on their own to bring over, and if enough people do it, then the Army just buys it for everyone and gives it on issue during the pre-deployment spinup. It's called RFI (Rapid Fielding Initiative). The theory is that the whole selection process can be bypassed because if it didn't work and get good reviews in the field, the soldiers wouldn't be buying them with their own money in the first place.

(Some particularly enthusiastic people even bring their own rifle components like a new upper body/barrel)

NTM

Hard Larry

Manic Moran wrote: »

It happens everywhere. I've bought a few bits and bobs myself, from my holosight through mag pouches, to spare uniforms, and I'm in the US. Something the US does do, though, is that they take a survey of things that soldiers buy on their own to bring over, and if enough people do it, then the Army just buys it for everyone and gives it on issue during the pre-deployment spinup. It's called RFI (Rapid Fielding Initiative). The theory is that the whole selection process can be bypassed because if it didn't work and get good reviews in the field, the soldiers wouldn't be buying them with their own money in the first place.

(Some particularly enthusiastic people even bring their own rifle components like a new upper body/barrel)

NTM

Damn Superpowers showing off with your initiatves.

This wouldn't work with the Irish as the first thing on the list would be John Player Blue

Evd-Burner

The reason why i was saying that the RDF should have a small percentage going is that it would basically keep us all on our toes training and fitness wise...

That alone would probably considerably improve the rdf. So that people are ready if they ever did have to be deployed.

Nuravictus

Thats a bit stupid that you don't get issued all the gear you need.How do you lads get Irish DPM Equipment or do you have to use Generic Equipment.

I also wanta your lads views on when RDF play enemy for PDF been told to walk into ambushs & give away positions when the PDF 3 Stars can't find them. Does that give you a bad view of the RDF. The PDF has its fair share of Rambo's as well who do stupid ****, The best one I seen was a PDF 3 Star who put long grass on his Helmet & gave his whole squad away because we seen a big clup off long grass running down the stream on our left flank. Some of you lads forget the RDF lads respect the PDF a lot coz we realise your the real deal something we want to be but we want to do our civilian jobs as well. I think the intergrated is the future of the Reserve now. Whats the PDF lads feelings on the Intergrated ?

Hard Larry

Nuravictus wrote: »

Thats a bit stupid that you don't get issued all the gear you need.How do you lads get Irish DPM Equipment or do you have to use Generic Equipment.

I also wanta your lads views on when RDF play enemy for PDF been told to walk into ambushs & give away positions when the PDF 3 Stars can't find them. Does that give you a bad view of the RDF. The PDF has its fair share of Rambo's as well who do stupid ****, The best one I seen was a PDF 3 Star who put long grass on his Helmet & gave his whole squad away because we seen a big clup off long grass running down the stream on our left flank. Some of you lads forget the RDF lads respect the PDF a lot coz we realise your the real deal something we want to be but we want to do our civilian jobs as well. I think the intergrated is the future of the Reserve now. Whats the PDF lads feelings on the Intergrated ?

First thing you have to realise is the Irish army is not full of gung-ho, 7ft tall bullet spitting killing machines. And just like in any job in the world we have our fair share of dumb sh1ts, selfish fooks and general lazy buggers.

Just because a guy uses top of the range personnally bought kit in front of you to look great doesn't mean he is great. Just because you got 4 extra pouches squashed on to your fighting order just means you got more money to spend on crap than the guy standing beside you with no extra pouches...but on the inside he's laughing his ass off cause the more space you got in your kit means more ammo is gonna get stuffed in there for you to carry and crawl around in.

Put yourself in the frame of mind of an Irish army 3 star Private when you do enemy for them on on an exercise...

1) You're cold, wet and hungry (and a good chance 1 in 3 is hungover)
2) you've been up since the crack of dawn and have had NCOs barking orders at you all morning.
3) This is your 100th time doing *insert tactical manouver here* this month
4) You're more than likely not getting a day off for this crap
5) If you do get a day off you're more than likely gonna be on duty on that day and your CS is a bollox and won't give you a day in lieu
6) You know this is all for show so some Officer/NCO can look great in front of a superior Officer/NCO

in other words the lads out there on any given day could care less what happens as long as he gets home when he was promised he could get home. Its not a hobby or pasttime for these lads its a job. Now I'm obviously not tarring everyone with the same brush but thats a pretty accurate description of whats going through the average Infantry Privates head.

On an exercise or Tactical Demonstration lesson you've got realise its just a lesson so play along when you're told to give away positions and the like. I know it sounds crappy but if you're doing enemy for the Army well then the exercise is more than likely for their benefit than yours...hence why you get told to give your positions away or play dead.

From an NCOs point of view the intergrated training is a joy to do because you get given command of a Platoon (in some cases a Company) of troops who actually want to do everything you say and won't crib about it!

As for Overseas service I honestly can't see it happening unless you have a civvie job with skills that are short in the Army. (eg EMT, Engineer etc etc) But all I can say is (especially in the case of Chad) be careful what you wish for lads you could end up in the asrehole of the planet somewhere and you too will get to ask yourself the question every soldier asks themselves when they realise where they are....

"What the f**k am I doing here?"

Nuravictus

Hard Larry wrote: »

On an exercise or Tactical Demonstration lesson you've got realise its just a lesson so play along when you're told to give away positions and the like. I know it sounds crappy but if you're doing enemy for the Army well then the exercise is more than likely for their benefit than yours...hence why you get told to give your positions away or play dead.

What I was refering too was a attack which failed 2 twice. So on the 3rd Attempt we gave away our position. I just feel sometimes doing these retarded things like walking into some of the worst ambushs I've ever seen where we found the cut off group but we just walk to our death & dont take any form of cover when we get hit up & stand in the middle of the road looking like terrible retards can give a lot of PDF 3 Stars a image of the RDF as morans who dont know any contact drills or anything. Do you lads in the PDF form your views on the RDF from them playing enemy for you or from older lads. I would love to see where there views on the RDF come from.

the PDF are way better than the reserve but there is a lot of things we are asked to do that we would never really if it was the real deal. I just look forward to the day when the Reserve arent sandbagger but are buds :P

arybvtcw0eolkf

Great post Larry.

Saying it how it is.

Hard Larry

Nuravictus wrote: »

What I was refering too was a attack which failed 2 twice. So on the 3rd Attempt we gave away our position. I just feel sometimes doing these retarded things like walking into some of the worst ambushs I've ever seen where we found the cut off group but we just walk to our death & dont take any form of cover when we get hit up & stand in the middle of the road looking like terrible retards can give a lot of PDF 3 Stars a image of the RDF as morans who dont know any contact drills or anything. Do you lads in the PDF form your views on the RDF from them playing enemy for you or from older lads. I would love to see where there views on the RDF come from.

the PDF are way better than the reserve but there is a lot of things we are asked to do that we would never really if it was the real deal. I just look forward to the day when the Reserve arent sandbagger but are buds :P

Ok mate you could throw these examples at me forever and I could go on answering them forever. I'll say this I view Tactical training in the form of ambushes (with the exception of contact drills) as the very basic training that hopefully we'll never put into practice. Obviously it has to be done to make sure everyone knows the basics and has general idea of whats going on but IMO you won't learn much unless you're actually doing it for real and the ambushed are shooting back.

I'm getting a "why the hell do all hate me?" vibe from your posts. Not everyone hates you in the Army...but the vast majority do Why is there a negative image toward Reservist by the Army? because the average soldier puts up with more crap in one week than you would in an entire year.

You're recruit training consists of you showing up one night a week and heading off the odd weekend and maybe 2 week long stints in the year.

The DF recruit training is a non-stop flogging session where you are expected to know everything you've been instructed when asked or face the wrath of a screaming madman.

And at the end of it all the 2 of you are awarded the same rank. What makes it worse for the Army Private is that you have NCOs that haven't gone through half the crap that they have and they are a senior rank.

I could list thousands of comparisons here between the 2 organisations but they all turn out the same....you just don't have the service to impress anyone. If it makes you feel better the average 3 star Private in an infantry battalion is viewed as a "turd on a stick" until they get a trip overseas under their belt.

My personal veiw of the RDF is not a bad one. I like working with the RDF I'd love to get back into it as the enthusiasm and willingness to learn is like nothing an NCO experiences with troops of his own unit or even recruits.
But please just because I like working with you doesn't mean we'll be Hi-5ing each other in the shower or swapping mobile numbers anytime soon.

I'll give you a rough comparison, ask yourself this do you think Premiership footballers hang around with lower division footballers?
Do 6th years in school hang around with lower classes?
If you watch "Scrubs" look at how Dr. Cox views JD

The RDF is getting better due to the Intergrated Training enjoy it while you can get it, God knows it could be given the heave-ho in the future.

PS "a turd on a stick" is a giant step up from "a turd on your shoe" which is how new Lt's are seen

arybvtcw0eolkf

Jesus Larry, your even scaring me now

Guys Larry has more or less hit the nail on the head in regards comparisions between the RDF and the PDF, some of us would have been a little more diplomatic about it, but at the same time I can't knock a word of what he says.

Manic Moran

In fairness, Larry, the man does have a point.

People do not join the reserves to be training aids for the PDF, regardless of how much PDF troopers need to continually rehearse their contact drills. It's hard enough to get the resources and people together for reserve field exercises in the first place, those precious assets need to be better spent on training the reservists up to standards, not on helping PDF practice their skills.

NTM

Hard Larry

Manic Moran wrote: »

In fairness, Larry, the man does have a point.

People do not join the reserves to be training aids for the PDF, regardless of how much PDF troopers need to continually rehearse their contact drills. It's hard enough to get the resources and people together for reserve field exercises in the first place, those precious assets need to be better spent on training the reservists up to standards, not on helping PDF practice their skills.

NTM

Totally agree. Its just the example that was used in his post seemed to me be a Army exercise that Reserve troops were supplying support for. IMO any exercise that involves the 2 organisations should be intergrated so that everyone benefits.
I'd love to see the Army giving as much support to the RDF as possible you ask any Corporal (promoted in the last 10 years) in an Infantry battalion would he be willing to train RDF personnel on his own time on a weekday night and 4 out of 5 guys would say no problem.

Nuravictus

Hard Larry wrote: »

Totally agree. Its just the example that was used in his post seemed to me be a Army exercise that Reserve troops were supplying support for. IMO any exercise that involves the 2 organisations should be intergrated so that everyone benefits.
I'd love to see the Army giving as much support to the RDF as possible you ask any Corporal (promoted in the last 10 years) in an Infantry battalion would he be willing to train RDF personnel on his own time on a weekday night and 4 out of 5 guys would say no problem.

Im refering to the fact that RDF are consistly asked not to do anything "tactical" when we play enemy for the PDF. What I think is after we get nailed in some really stupid ways to give the PDF 3 Stars a "Morale Boost" because they had a hard few nights on the hill they probally think "Jesus" them RDF lads sure are retards "why did they just stand there instead of taking cover" ?

I understand its for training purposes but i think it gives a lot of people a negative view of the RDF in a certain way.

Manic Moran

What's confusing me about your example, Naru, is the purpose of 'exposing yourselves'.

Surely if you're conducting an ambush, then your presence will be made known as soon as the first shot is fired, there is no need for 'deliberate sloppiness.'

(That said, we actually did set up deliberately sloppy ambushes in Iraq, with the intent of enticing the opposition to play)

NTM

mrDuke

the NSR often go overseas with the navy, i want to norway last year. Does this count as overseas or are you strictly speaking about war zones etc?

Hard Larry

Nuravictus wrote: »

Im refering to the fact that RDF are consistly asked not to do anything "tactical" when we play enemy for the PDF. What I think is after we get nailed in some really stupid ways to give the PDF 3 Stars a "Morale Boost" because they had a hard few nights on the hill they probally think "Jesus" them RDF lads sure are retards "why did they just stand there instead of taking cover" ?

I understand its for training purposes but i think it gives a lot of people a negative view of the RDF in a certain way.

Well when our own lads do enemy for us the same thing happens. The troops under instruction are the ones that take priority. As I already said in another post I believe this to be wrong and everyone participating in the exercise should benefit from it.

But trust me the last thing going through the minds of those lads after a dig-in /basecamp is the tactical inability of the enemy troops. Their mind state is somewhere between "i really want to change my socks" to "I would kill everyone in this forest for a single drop of beer"

I said in a previous post we could lash examples of Tac Ex's at each other all week here and I really don't want to get into that because it inevitably ends in a "my Da is bigger than your Da" argument. But usually at the end of a dig-in/basecamp exercise the last action is usually to put that little extra bit of pressure on the soldier who has just spent the last 2/3 days in a hole in the ground, i.e. to make sure that said cold, hungry, wet and tired soldier can still do his or her job.

But hold on I hear you cry! "But the made us expose our position!" I understand that but its all part of the game that is Tactical training. The Instructional staff want to see that the exercise troops can handle the situations thrown at them. IMO the DS staff obviously didn't care about target indication of your ambush but wanted to make sure that the exercise troops could carry out the "crawl through mud underfire" part of the exercise...either that or there was some nice warm trucks around the corner waiting on everyone to finish up and go home.

Poccington

Larry pretty much hit the nail on the head.

Some great posts.

jake59

Hard Larry wrote: »

.

I'm getting a "why the hell do all hate me?" vibe from your posts. Not everyone hates you in the Army...but the vast majority do Why is there a negative image toward Reservist by the Army? because the average soldier puts up with more crap in one week than you would in an entire year.

Don't forget that there are a sizeable portion of the RDF who are ex PDF and who have gone through all the bull**** of army life, have perhaps served on overseas missions and have since leaving developed further skills that enhance the time they put into the RDF. Just remember to not judge a book by its cover and that the RDF guy facing you as 'enemy' could well be vastly more experienced than yourself.... and yet he still turns up and does the job.... so a bit less of the moaning about army life Larry... it's what you signed up for bud

Evd-Burner

^^^^^^EXACTLY

We have a lad with us who is ex pdf, he served in lebannon and now is a qualified fireman. The chap really knows what he's talking bout.