Barry Transfer Saga, will he go to Liverpool

Savman

quarryman wrote: »

so, Barry eh?

Meh. Villa bashing is the new craze,

invincibleirish

Savman wrote: »

Meh. Villa bashing is the new craze,

Means Villa are doing something right.

Jesus Wept

Yes. That's it.

Bounty Hunter

Benitez on collision course with Americans again over Barry deal

By JOHN EDWARDS
Last updated at 8:09 PM on 08th August 2008

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Rafa Benitez is heading for another conflict with the American owners of Liverpool after they appeared to question his judgment in the transfer market.

In a stance that has angered and embarrassed the Liverpool manager, Tom Hicks
and George Gillett have stalled over funding an £18million move for Gareth Barry, amid suggestions they feel it would not represent value for money.

Benitez believed a deal was on the verge of completion last week after his Aston Villa counterpart Martin O’Neill finally conceded defeat over keeping Barry and admitted he was ready, reluctantly, to cash in on the England midfielder.

Rafa's target: And Benitez will not be happy if Gareth Barry's Liverpool move falls through

To his dismay, Benitez now fears the transfer is about to collapse, following a week-long silence from Hicks and Gillett about meeting the asking price.


Losing out on his prime summer target would be galling enough, particularly after he led Barry to believe the move would go through and even turned down the chance to sign other candidates for the midfield anchor role, notably Portsmouth’s Sulley Muntari.

Frustration for Rafa as credit crunch means Barry likely to stay at Villa... Nugent deal frees up Harry... Everton have to wait for Mbia... Stoke chase Zigic...

The implication that his bosses no longer have faith in his judgment is potentially far more serious and could cause another damaging split that would lead inevitably to fresh misgivings over his future.


Benitez, who was perilously close to being sacked last season after complaining about a perceived lack of urgency in the transfer market, does not take kindly to boardroom interference over signings.


Angry: Benitez
He stormed out of Valencia four years ago, following a confrontation with sporting director Jesus Garcia Pitarch over transfer targets that culminated in his colourful claim that: ‘I asked for a sofa, but they bought me a lampshade.’


Anfield officials were convinced they had captured Barry last week, only for Villa to insist on a last-minute restructuring that would have meant paying the fee in two instalments, rather than three.

Benitez still sensed the owners were behind his efforts to pair Barry with his England teammate Steven Gerrard but will now demand answers after an apparent retreat that reinforces the view they may have encountered more financial difficulties.


If they are trying to camouflage a cash crisis, they could hardly have chosen a more provocative course than evidently expressing reservations about the sell-on value of a player who would be 31 by the end of an initial four-year contract.

Benitez was prepared to offload Xabi Alonso, whose £16m price tag scared off Juventus and Arsenal, to accommodate Barry and help fund the deal. He is sure
to go on the warpath if, as he fears, the summer’s longest-running saga ends in bitter frustration.

.

invincibleirish

The Guardian wrote: »

Liverpool's owners, George Gillett and Tom Hicks, have risked sparking another internal feud at Anfield by refusing to back Rafael Benítez's judgment on the £18m transfer of Gareth Barry. The farcical transfer saga was close to collapse last night, with the England international considering re-committing his future to Aston Villa and the Liverpool manager admitting the deal was in doubt but claiming: "It is not a question of money."

The American co-owners have refused to sanction a short-term loan for Benítez to complete the Barry deal despite previously meeting the £18m asking price but missing a deadline set by the Midlanders by minutes. Gillett's and Hicks' stance will raise doubts over their ability to finance a new stadium for Liverpool but it is reservations over Barry's transfer, not a lack of resources, that has threatened the move and their relationship with Benítez.

Benítez expected the Barry deal to go through earlier this week after the player and his agent, Alex Black, demanded the move and O'Neill gave Liverpool "all the time in the world" to return with the £18m Hicks and Gillett pledged last month. Since then, however, the Americans have expressed doubts over Barry's valuation, the low resale value of a player who will be 31 at the end of his proposed four-year contract and particularly the need to sign the central midfielder with Xabi Alonso still at the club.

Those doubts were aired by Liverpool supporters during last night's 1-0 friendly win over Lazio, as they chanted Alonso's name throughout and barracked Barry's proposed arrival, but Benítez refused to concede defeat in his summer-long pursuit after the game. "We have not been able to bring in Barry but it is not a question of money, I don't know what it is," the Liverpool manager said.

"We need to improve if we can and I think we need another player, because clearly we have problems on the left. I have sold [John Arne] Riise, [Harry] Kewell has gone, [Fabio] Aurelio is injured and [Sebastián] Leto didn't get a work permit, so we need another left-sided player. I cannot say now who that will be but Barry can fill that position and play in others, too. The rules will say we need four English and four associated players and Barry is English, who can play in three different positions, but I cannot say any more. All I can say is I will try my best but I don't know too much why we haven't signed Barry."

While Benítez could yet raise the money to sign Barry by selling Alonso or off-loading both Jermaine Pennant and Andriy Voronin, the Villa captain is losing patience and wants his future clarified before the start of the new season. Having provoked the wrath of O'Neill and Villa supporters by publicly pressing for the move, Barry has since been left in limbo by Liverpool and is prepared to stay put if the saga drags into next week.

Oh Nos!:cool:

wynters

The Times have an interesting slant on it...

From The Times
August 9, 2008

by Tony Evans

Rafael Benitez on warpath as Gareth Barry deal falls through.

Fresh crisis looms over Anfield after Liverpool's owners veto transfer despite offer of £12 million interest-free loan.

Rafael BenÍtez’s relationship with Liverpool’s owners reached crisis point last night when it emerged that not only had Tom Hicks and George Gillett Jr vetoed the manager’s bid to buy Gareth Barry but that the American duo had turned down an offer of a £12 million interest-free loan to help to buy the Aston Villa midfield player.

The loan - which The Times understands was proposed by a millionaire Liverpool fan concerned about the ramifications for the club if the deal fell through - was offered this week and rejected by the owners. The £12 million would have financed the initial instalments demanded by Villa.

Hicks and Gillett agreed to provide the £18 million to buy Barry a week ago after Martin O’Neill, the Villa manager, conceded defeat in his battle to keep his captain. However, the owners have made a U-turn and told BenÍtez on Thursday that Barry is too expensive and, at 27, lacks resale value. The club last month paid Tottenham Hotspur £20.3 million for Robbie Keane, who is 28.

The owners had failed to express their reservations about Barry during the protracted transfer saga and their misgivings this week drew suspicions that they could not find the cash to pay for him.

Either way, the news that money was available will infuriate BenÍtez, because it appears that Hicks and Gillett are questioning his judgment. The Americans have also raised questions about the number of central midfield players in the squad and suggested that Benitez has enough talent to work with in that area.

Spokesmen for both Gillett and Hicks refused to comment last night.

... Alonso was man-of-the-match in last nights game at Anfield according to reports. Fans regularly chanting his name. Can't see the American owners backing down on this one as long as they have some concensus with the fans.

wynters

RAFA IN A RAGE

By Dave Lyons
August 9th 2008

Furious Rafa Benitez is on collision course again with Liverpool’s owners after they pulled the plug on his £18m bid for Gareth Barry.

The Spaniard is seething once more after George Gillett and Tom Hicks failed to back his plans to bring the Aston Villa ace to Anfield.

A fragile peace has held at the club for the past few months after civil war in the boardroom threatened to rip the club apart last season.

Benitez was at loggerheads with both of his bosses last term, before Gillett and Hicks eventually turned on one another.

The ceasefire is now set to go up in smoke with Benitez viewing their U-turn on Barry as a direct challenge to his authority.

Benitez was understood to be livid upon hearing of their decision ahead of last night’s friendly with Lazio.

England midfielder Barry will now be forced to eat humble pie and stay at Villa Park after missing out on his dream move to Anfield.

The Barry transfer saga has run all summer long, but now looks set to end in embarrassment for the player and Liverpool.

Gillett and Hicks had been prepared to sanction the deal up until last week when Villa upped the ante by calling off the talks.

Since then they have had serious misgivings about resurrecting the deal, especially after signing off the recent £20m capture of Robbie Keane from Tottenham.

And with fans favourite Xabi Alonso staying put after no club matched their £16m valuation, the Americans were unwilling to splash out on a player they deemed unnecessary and unlikely to capture the imagination of fans.

Even the sale of fringe players such as Jermaine Pennant and Andriy Voronin is unlikely to alter their thinking, making a showdown with Benitez inevitable.

Savman

If AVFC made a boo boo last week with the contradicting statements, then this from LFC would equal it IMHO.

Still tho, nobody comes out better off. Barry has alienated himself from the Villa fans completely. Would be bizarre if he should end up staying thru no choice of his own, let alone made captain again :eek::mad:

Dear god let it end one way or another.

Savman

the sun wrote:

• RAFA BENITEZ was given a clear message by the Kop last night: Don’t sacrifice Xabi Alonso to sign Gareth Barry.

The Spanish midfielder’s name was chanted throughout the evening by the majority of a 43,000 crowd at Anfield.
And some Liverpool fans made it clear the Aston Villa man was not wanted by singing: “You can stick your Gareth Barry up your a**e.”

ROFL :D

copacetic

Savman wrote: »

If AVFC made a boo boo last week with the contradicting statements, then this from LFC would equal it IMHO.

Still tho, nobody comes out better off. Barry has alienated himself from the Villa fans completely. Would be bizarre if he should end up staying thru no choice of his own, let alone made captain again :eek::mad:

Dear god let it end one way or another.

emmm, what statements from LFC? is there anything on the wesbite or a press release?

not happy with this whole farce either but really don't think anything liverpool has done compares with the farcical nature of villas handling of it. not that it really matters I guess.

Villain

I really wish this was over especially as Villa can't lose now if the widely reported stories today are true, i.e. Rafa is willing to pay over the odds hugely and pay £18 million for Barry, because if he stays I think he will settle back down and he goes we have got a huge fee for him.

I actually personally think Rafa hasn't helped his chances of signing Barry with his statments yesterday, which basically show that Rafa wants Barry to fill a void on the left, Barry's best position and his favourite is in the Centre of Midfield talking about him playing on the left won't help things imo. I have always said this would be a bad move for Barry because I believed he would played out on the left and Pool fans have always shot that idea down but Rafa stated it last night.

invincibleirish

If the London Times reports are accurate, and seeing as they were one of papers reporting the story when it originally broke(and are the home of Guim Balleige (wrong spelling i know) who has the ear of Fat Rafa) then i have no reason to doubt its accuracy. So then we can give kudos to Mr Randy Lerner for being such an awkward customer in those infamous deadline negotiations by demanding a more strict payment schedule, a demand which seemingly broke the camels back as far as H&G are concerned.

Up the Villa!

*edit* what Villain said, the situation now for Villa is seemingly a win-win one. Thank you H&G, dont you just love rich American owners:D

copacetic

win-win for everyone as no-one at liverpool really wants him if alonso is staying!
Personally I think Alonsos performances pre-season would be the real reason behind any transfer not going through.

Villain

Yes but Rafa's latest comments seem to show he wants him to play on the left of midfield and cover left back and Centre Mid!

invincibleirish

Yep thats true, its truly excellent Pool fans dont want GB to join Pool either, is the only one at Anfield who wants GB actually Chubby Rafa? either way given the nature of this protracted transfer there has to be a few more twists yet.

copacetic

nothing wrong with Barry as a player, but how he fits in with alonso still there and at an extremely expensive value is hard to see for any liverpool fan.

invincibleirish

Alonso might win Pool the CL with a wonder goal or two but Barry is the type who'll win Pool the league. He does the simple things well for 90 minutes week in and week out for 38 games a season, he is Mr consistency.

wynters

copacetic wrote: »

emmm, what statements from LFC? is there anything on the wesbite or a press release?

Try this...

Rafa - Alonso may still leave
Reds midfielder will be sold for the right price
By Chris Burton Last updated: 9th August 2008

Liverpool boss Rafa Benitez has refused to rule out the possibility of selling Xabi Alonso.

The Spain international has become the victim of the Reds' continued pursuit of Aston Villa midfielder Gareth Barry.

He has the full support of the Anfield faithful, though, who backed him throughout Friday's friendly against Lazio, while also displaying their opposition towards any move for Barry.

However, Benitez appears to have turned a deaf ear to the views from the terraces, admitting that a suitable offer could yet see him part with a popular member of his squad.

"We all knew Alonso was a very good player and as a result he had a good price (on his head). We had offers, but they were not enough so we decided he needed to stay with us," said the Spanish coach.

"It could be that he does stay with us.

"For me it is not a problem if he stays or not. He can stay, we always have felt he is a good player.

"We are only talking about a very, very good price. He is a good player, if he is not going to bring a good price then it is very simple, easy to understand.

"I heard the crowd, obviously. We know now, as we knew before, that he could stay with us."

Benitez needs to sell in order to fund any potential bid for Barry and admits that there are likely to be changes within the Reds camp before the new season gets underway.

"It is not positive that we may not have the players we want here before the Champions League game," he said.

"But the transfer window closes at the end of August, we will try to do our best to bring in the players to improve us by then.

"I try to do the best for my club with the possibilities that you have, I have done this every year since I have been here. And I am trying to do the same for this coming season.

"I do not feel any more pressure, every season is the same. We have a good squad, better than before, but we can improve a little bit more."

... what ON EARTH is Benitez playing at??? What must Alonso think of statements like that???

Alonso wants to stay. The fans obviously prefer him to Barry and want him to stay, and the owners seem to be very satisified with Alonso if they don't see the need to replace him and are refusing to sanction further 'unecessary' spending in that position. Yet despite all this Benitez is still trying to push him out the door?

Benitez has made a dogs dinner of this whole thing from day one in every single aspect of the approach. Firstly with Villa, and now with his own club. He's a clown, who's singled handedly annoyed, if not infuriated O'Neill and Villa fans with the arrogance and manner of his original approach / Barry is now widely reported to be becoming increasingly disillusioned by the lack of urgency by Liverpool, that's now dragged on for 3 months / and now Benitez is alienating his own player and going against the wishes of the Liverpool fans and board by publically trying to flog Alonso.

If nothing happens and Alonso doesn't move on, what will his mindset be going into the season knowing he's not really wanted by the manager??? Dreadful management by Benitez yet again...

Remember O'Neill saying recently "Gareth's head is all over the place at the moment"? I don't think any Liverpool OR Villa fan was in any doubt whatsoever about what was in Gareth's head at the time he did that NOTW interview. So what's changed since then if his 'head is all over the place' now...? And what must Barry make of Benitez banging on about needing a left-side midfielder, when Barry's only recently broken into the England side at centre-mid??? Talk about a c0ck-up!

Without a shadow of a doubt, this is THE worst transfer approach in history. Benitez is dragging LFC's former good name through the dirt with all this. If I was a Liverpool fan, I'd just be embarrassed by the whole thing at this stage...

wynters

Savman wrote: »

If AVFC made a boo boo last week with the contradicting statements, then this from LFC would equal it IMHO.

When I heard O'Neill's U-turn with the "Liverpool have all the time in the world to sign Gareth" statement I thought it was a bit of a climbdown aswell, but the more this is panning out, the more that position is beginning to look like a masterstroke by O'Neill...

It puts all the responsibility for a conclusion to this onto Liverpool. If the move was not to go through because Villa just refused to sell, then we wouldn't have a 100% Barry if he stays. However, O'Neill whilst publically made a big deal of his desire to keep Barry, has now said he'll facilitate the move if Liverpool come across with the cash. The 'deadline' basically made Liverpool admit they have the money, if they were crying about missing the deadline by 15 minutes? So if Barry stays, it's no-ones fault but Liverpools for the deal not going through.

O'Neill has played a blinder throughout all this. Stern with Liverpool throughout, sticking to his valuation, firm with Barry initially, then diplomatic, then delicate when trying to keep him, and then showing empathy with the player by reluctantly 'allowing' him to leave.

Barry is being treated like sh/t by Liverpool, and now by their fans aswell if they're chanting "you can stick Gareth Barry up your ar$e"??? Wonder how that new Villa contract sounds now...?

Bounty Hunter

Pool fans might want to keep Alonso but I wonder what Gareth Barry thought about those chants... bit different from the "Barry for England" chants of the past few seasons

Tusky

Official statement from Liverpool on Barry.

Liverpool Football Club have today released the following press statement.
Liverpool FC Chief Executive Rick Parry said: "There has been a lot of comment today regarding our position with regards to Gareth Barry.

"This is not about questioning the Manager's judgement or the ability of a particular player. The owners have clearly demonstrated throughout the year they are willing to back Rafa in the transfer market and will continue to do so.

"It is obviously the selling club's prerogative to put whatever price they want on the player, but on this occasion Liverpool think the price quoted is too high."

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N160851080809-2245.htm

JPA

Is it over?

LuckyLloyd

Tusky wrote: »

Official statement from Liverpool on Barry.

Liverpool Football Club have today released the following press statement.
Liverpool FC Chief Executive Rick Parry said: "There has been a lot of comment today regarding our position with regards to Gareth Barry.

"This is not about questioning the Manager's judgement or the ability of a particular player. The owners have clearly demonstrated throughout the year they are willing to back Rafa in the transfer market and will continue to do so.

"It is obviously the selling club's prerogative to put whatever price they want on the player, but on this occasion Liverpool think the price quoted is too high."

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N160851080809-2245.htm

Fair enough. Everyone has known from the beginning that 18m is an over valuation - even though he would have been a welcome addition to the squad. The price will drop in January / next summer (particularly when Villa are struggling in mid - table making Barry even more eager to leave). So that should be it until then I guess...

JPA

If Barry stays he will sign a new contract.

zAbbo

It won't be over until 1st September, and even then only for 5 months...

invincibleirish

I dont get it, LFC had 18m last week for him, now they dont. if Villa had agreed to extending their original deadline would they still be pulling out? and shouldnt have Liverpool had an agreed maximum budget on GB before they started this escapade or were they simply making it up as they go along?

Either way Villas policy in holding firm on the players valuation seems to have worked out.

Tusky

invincibleirish wrote: »

Either way Villas policy in holding firm on the players valuation seems to have worked out.

Hmm kind of. They now have a seriously unhappy captain (will he still be captain?) who would rather be elsewhere and isnt on good terms with the manager. Maybe they should have accepted 16m or whatever the last offer was...

Anyway, Im just glad its over.

invincibleirish

Tusky wrote: »

Hmm kind of. They now have a seriously unhappy captain (will he still be captain?) who would rather be elsewhere and isnt on good terms with the manager. Maybe they should have accepted 16m or whatever the last offer was...

Anyway, Im just glad its over.

Indeed, the situation is Villa have an unhappy player who wants to leave, but the harder part was fending off LFCs interest, now MON & RL can turn their attention to actually placating the player if possible.

Thats to assume the saga is over, until the 31st of August its surely still salvagable if Rafa really wants his way, but with Fans & Board seemingly opposed what can happen next?

Over to you Gareth.

Villain

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Fair enough. Everyone has known from the beginning that 18m is an over valuation - even though he would have been a welcome addition to the squad. The price will drop in January / next summer (particularly when Villa are struggling in mid - table making Barry even more eager to leave). So that should be it until then I guess...

Nice crystal ball you have there,mid table? Is that not spurs place?

Parry's statment is obviously a last ditch effort to try and push Barry to get Villa to lower the asking price. Funny Rafa said yesterday that money wasn't a problem, must be tough trying to build a team to challenge for the league without a board's support

therecklessone

I like the way Spurs have got dragged into a lovers tiff between Liverpool and Villa fans.

Get a room fellas.

Savman

therecklessone wrote: »

I like the way Spurs have got dragged into a lovers tiff between Liverpool and Villa fans.

Get a room fellas.

Unintentionally it has to be said. There's some twits using Spurs to try and insult Villa despite the fact it's impossible to prove which is a "better" :rolleyes:

Anyways, on with the side show that is the Barry transfer. Liverpool now saying they wont pay £18m. I really cannot see MON or Villa budging on the price at this late stage so what happens next for the player is anyone's guess.

wynters

Well if Liverpool have taken the step of making an official statement on it I think that could well be the end of it... The Liverpool board won't pay the money, and Liverpool fans have shown that they clearly do not want Barry if it's at the expense of Alonso. I can't see O'Neill 'helping Liverpool out' by reducing the value so hopefully this is a conclusion. Maybe O'Neill had some idea that Liverpool might not be able to do the deal when he put the ball in their corner with the 'Liverpool now have all the time in the world'...???? Roper-Doper. Genius move.

From The Times
August 9, 2008
by Peter Lansey

Martin O'Neill gets his wish on Gareth Barry, but what next?

Gareth Barry's career now stands at the crossroads. At least he knows he will be backed by a prevailing wind should he take the road straight ahead. Booed by his own supporters at Walsall a fortnight ago, he was then afforded a standing reception during the Intertoto win over OB Odense four nights later by those who had dared to start believing that he might stay.

Remaining at Aston Villa might seem like a massive anticlimax for the 27-year-old but at least he has seen it coming. Liverpool have dragged their heels over Rafael Benítez's desire to take him to Anfield all summer even though Martin O'Neill, the Villa manager, let it be known that he would allow his star player to leave once the going rate for an England midfield player was met.

Arsenal have acknowledged a tentative interest but it is hardly Arsène Wenger's style to splash out £18million on a well-established English player. Although Barry's pass-and-move game would fit like a glove into the Arsenal system, it is hard to see Wenger matching the salary that Barry can now command.

O'Neill has consistently urged that Barry would slot into a top-four side without a problem. None of them appear to need him, so how will he resettle at Villa Park? If the supporters have signalled their intention to embrace his return, his relationship with the manager and his team-mates will be key. O'Neill will not cut his nose off to spite his face. Stubborn but intelligent, and having kept Barry as his No6 when the squad numbering could have been an excuse to snub the player, he knew that he would struggle to replace Barry with someone of similar calibre.

It will now be down to Barry's ability to regain his appetite for the challenge at Villa and to win his team-mates back over but, despite the maze through which he has allowed himself to be led, he has the ability and the character to achieve this. His international career also depends upon it.

Villain

the going rate for an England midfield player was met.

That is a very important point, 18 million is over the top but it is the going rate for a England Midfielder, however Liverpool just don't seem to want to pay the going rate.

Poor Rafa must be feeling awful he comes out on says Money isn't a problem then Parry comes out and says they won't pay 18 million? Whatever you might say about MON, he is in charge of the club he manage's.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Shame that the club he manages won't be competing for anything for quite some time to come.

If it makes villa fans feel better to think that they can have a manager who can hang on to players who want to leave and have a run at the intertoto every season then fair enough.

Villain

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

Shame that the club he manages won't be competing for anything for quite some time to come.

If it makes villa fans feel better to think that they can have a manager who can hang on to players who want to leave and have a run at the intertoto every season then fair enough.

LOL yea because we should all just be glory hunters and support a top 4 team FFS do you wish there was only 4 teams in a new league?:rolleyes:

Thanx 4 The Fish

Not at all villain. Why so touchy ?? Perhaps there should be an award for the manager that has the most control at their club.

Barry is not a brilliant player, he is good and the only reason that I can see him being worth that money is that he can play in a number of positions and would fulfill the CL criteria. The fact that he wants to leave and that MON wants to hang on to him is fair enough but how motivated do you think Gb will be to win for Villa now after all of the acrimony during this season?

Maybe it is a good thing to have control over your club but it is a very different thing being in charge at a small-medium sized club who have not really spent than it is to be in charge at a top club where a fair auld whack has already gone out the door.

And Glory hunters, do you realise how long it is since the pool have won the league ???:rolleyes:

~Rebel~

Villain wrote: »

Poor Rafa must be feeling awful he comes out on says Money isn't a problem then Parry comes out and says they won't pay 18 million? Whatever you might say about MON, he is in charge of the club he manage's.

There's a difference between not having money and refusing to pay a price deemed far too much over the odds. I've a fiver in my pocket and fancy a can of coke, but if the shop tries to charge me 4quid he can fuk right off.

Villain

~Rebel~ wrote: »

There's a difference between not having money and refusing to pay a price deemed far too much over the odds. I've a fiver in my pocket and fancy a can of coke, but if the shop tries to charge me 4quid he can fuk right off.

Yes but Rafa knew the price when he said Money wasn't a problem, why didn't he say the same as Parry i.e. the price is too high?

Villain

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

Not at all villain. Why so touchy ?? Perhaps there should be an award for the manager that has the most control at their club.

Barry is not a brilliant player, he is good and the only reason that I can see him being worth that money is that he can play in a number of positions and would fulfill the CL criteria. The fact that he wants to leave and that MON wants to hang on to him is fair enough but how motivated do you think Gb will be to win for Villa now after all of the acrimony during this season?

Maybe it is a good thing to have control over your club but it is a very different thing being in charge at a small-medium sized club who have not really spent than it is to be in charge at a top club where a fair auld whack has already gone out the door.

And Glory hunters, do you realise how long it is since the pool have won the league ???:rolleyes:

I think this post showed my opinion quite well :http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56212227&postcount=79

Boggles

Have Villa names a new club captain?

Villain

Boggles wrote: »

Have Villa names a new club captain?

No a Few players have been wearing the band during pre-season, no-one has been given it on a full time basis and Barry was given the number 6 shirt in the squad list too, but if Liverpool pay the money all that won't make any difference.

Tusky

Villain wrote: »

That is a very important point, 18 million is over the top but it is the going rate for a England Midfielder, however Liverpool just don't seem to want to pay the going rate.

Poor Rafa must be feeling awful he comes out on says Money isn't a problem then Parry comes out and says they won't pay 18 million? Whatever you might say about MON, he is in charge of the club he manage's.

If you are talking about Hargreaves & Carrick - Hargreaves was younger and arguably better when United signed him. He had also won a lot more in his career. Carrick was a good bit younger.

Villain

But Barry kept both of them out of the English team last year and has an excellent fitness record, I'm not saying he is better than them but he is worth the same money using any logic, Carrick was 25 when he signed and Hargreaves 26, Barry is 27 not a huge difference although I'm not 100% on those ages.

copacetic

Villain wrote: »

Yes but Rafa knew the price when he said Money wasn't a problem, why didn't he say the same as Parry i.e. the price is too high?

isn't it implied? Money isn't the problem, implies it was available that he wasn't willing to pay the price and add finnan to the deal which apparently was also part of the delay.

Anyway, shouldn't we all be agreeing that we are happy for our own reasons and move along?

Villain

Well if it was finished one way or another we could be happy, but this isn't over yet.

wynters

Villain wrote: »

Well if it was finished one way or another we could be happy, but this isn't over yet.

Indeed. It'll carry-on right up until that game on the 31st unless Barry signs a new contract or something. Press will keep it bubbling...

Did anyone catch 'The Sunday Supplement' on Sky Sports 1 this morning?? The journo's are taking our side in all this and had nothing but positive things to say regarding MON, Randy and Villa in general. Henry Winter in particular was scathing about Liverpool's approach to the transfer and the other 3 guys were in complete agreement. Words used to describe LFC and Benitez included 'shambles' and 'embarrassment'.

Steve Sidwell was just on SSN saying the entire Villa team want Barry to stay.

Tusky

Villain wrote: »

But Barry kept both of them out of the English team last year and has an excellent fitness record, I'm not saying he is better than them but he is worth the same money using any logic, Carrick was 25 when he signed and Hargreaves 26, Barry is 27 not a huge difference although I'm not 100% on those ages.

Hmm - I just dont buy this idea of a 'set price' for English medfielders. It doesnt work like that.

wynters

Tusky wrote: »

Hmm - I just dont buy this idea of a 'set price' for English medfielders. It doesnt work like that.

I'm afraid it does. If Carrick and Hargreaves were both sold for £18+, and Barry is keeping them out of the England side, he's worth at least as much.

Liverpool already spent £18m on Mascherano, so they've set THEMSELVES a precedent.

Benitez says he wants £15m/£16m for Alonso, yet the player he wants to replace/imrove on Alonso is not even worth that??? Plus Benitez quoted us £10m for Carson, then sold him to a different club for £3.5m????

"Rafa... this is called 'a calculator'".

~Rebel~

Villain wrote: »

No a Few players have been wearing the band during pre-season, no-one has been given it on a full time basis and Barry was given the number 6 shirt in the squad list too, but if Liverpool pay the money all that won't make any difference.

I hope laursen gets it. I like him. Strikes me as a leader too.

PHB

Villain wrote: »

But Barry kept both of them out of the English team last year and has an excellent fitness record, I'm not saying he is better than them but he is worth the same money using any logic, Carrick was 25 when he signed and Hargreaves 26, Barry is 27 not a huge difference although I'm not 100% on those ages.

But unfortunately Carrick and Hargreaves are just better players than he is. That said, they are also very different players to what he is. Hargreaves is one of the best defensive midfielders in the world, and Carrick is a natural passer of the ball. United paid the money because they thought he was worth it. If Liverpool really though he was worth it, they'd be willing to pay the money. People say its cause Liverpool can't afford it or whatever, but ultimately it's because Rafa doesn't rate him that much. He'd be a good signing, would improve the team, but not massively. Carrick was a key part of Uniteds change in play in the last 2 years and Hargreaves came to fill in a specific role in the squad that was needed to win the CL. Barry is unlikely to do that much.