How would you improve the RDF?

Poccington

concussion wrote: »

The chances of RDF PTI's are very slim -
PTL - 2 weeks
PTS - further 8 weeks
PTI - further 6 months

Becoming a PTS (supervisor) is attainable and allows those qualified to conduct circuit training, free weights sesions and battle pt as well as constructing training programmes.

Battle PT without weight though, which is why PTI's are needed.

Poccington

Rew wrote: »

Yeah but there is talk of the civvie equivelent cources becoming recognised via a short conversion course which would quickly add PTI's to the RDF.

If it happens, it's ridiculous.

People should either do the Military Course or else live with the fact they won't hold said qualification in the DF.

Rew

Poccington wrote: »

If it happens, it's ridiculous.

People should either do the Military Course or else live with the fact they won't hold said qualification in the DF.

Never heard such rubish, so all the people sent out on external cources shouldn't be allowed use the skills? All the degrees people have done in civvie land are no good in the army?

There is a massive over lap between the the courses and the rest is the very small amount of mil specfic that can be covers in a short period. The army courses arn't anything special.

eroo

Rew wrote: »

Joint exercises happen all the time and arn't disasters.

9 months to get security cleared, sure their aore no skeletons in your closet?



There are RDF PTL's already and a few CTI's. PTI's will follow but takes more time.

They never sent our clearances away!!:rolleyes:

I would love to be able to use the free weights section/room in a barracks gym,as it would save me on gym fees.But what I wouldn't like is to have a PTI following me around,acting like I was a beginner.I have been engaged in fitness training for the last 2 years or so.I'm definitely not an expert,but I'm not a novice when it comes to fitness training either.So,will we be given programmes to follow as a group/Unit or will it be a case of ''tailoring to your individual needs''?We all have different goals;fat loss,bulk up,cardio,endurance,strength,power,speed etc.So can PTI's be utilised to help each individual soldier achieve his/her goal,or will all have to follow a unit/group programme?The benefits of training in a group can be endless for some,but not all.For example,I prefer to do weight training on my own,with only my ipod accompanying me!

I believe PTI's can and will do great things for the RDF,just so long as they are approachable rather than personnel being force-fed PT/nutrition info.

concussion

Poccington wrote: »

Battle PT without weight though, which is why PTI's are needed.

Wouldn't that just be PT in boots and DPM's then?? In fairness, that can hardly be called battle pt.

Rew wrote: »

There is a massive over lap between the the courses and the rest is the very small amount of mil specfic that can be covers in a short period. The army courses arn't anything special.

Agreed, there's a huge similarity. However, at the moment if you want to be a DF PTI you have to do it through the DF.

eroo wrote: »

I would love to be able to use the free weights section/room in a barracks gym,as it would save me on gym fees.But what I wouldn't like is to have a PTI following me around,acting like I was a beginner.I have been engaged in fitness training for the last 2 years or so.I'm definitely not an expert,but I'm not a novice when it comes to fitness training either.So,will we be given programmes to follow as a group/Unit or will it be a case of ''tailoring to your individual needs''?We all have different goals;fat loss,bulk up,cardio,endurance,strength,power,speed etc.So can PTI's be utilised to help each individual soldier achieve his/her goal,or will all have to follow a unit/group programme?The benefits of training in a group can be endless for some,but not all.For example,I prefer to do weight training on my own,with only my ipod accompanying me!

I believe PTI's can and will do great things for the RDF,just so long as they are approachable rather than personnel being force-fed PT/nutrition info.

The point of a fitness program is that it is tailored to the individual/groups needs - I don't think there's much to worry about.

Poccington

eroo wrote: »

They never sent our clearances away!!:rolleyes:

I would love to be able to use the free weights section/room in a barracks gym,as it would save me on gym fees.But what I wouldn't like is to have a PTI following me around,acting like I was a beginner.I have been engaged in fitness training for the last 2 years or so.I'm definitely not an expert,but I'm not a novice when it comes to fitness training either.So,will we be given programmes to follow as a group/Unit or will it be a case of ''tailoring to your individual needs''?We all have different goals;fat loss,bulk up,cardio,endurance,strength,power,speed etc.So can PTI's be utilised to help each individual soldier achieve his/her goal,or will all have to follow a unit/group programme?The benefits of training in a group can be endless for some,but not all.For example,I prefer to do weight training on my own,with only my ipod accompanying me!

I believe PTI's can and will do great things for the RDF,just so long as they are approachable rather than personnel being force-fed PT/nutrition info.

You can already use the gym in a barracks, you don't need special permission to use it.

Poccington

concussion wrote: »

Wouldn't that just be PT in boots and DPM's then?? In fairness, that can hardly be called battle pt.

It depends on what the PT involves

There's a whole lot that can be done that would certainly not be called a bog standard PT. Until people can start training people with weight on their backs, it's feck all use.

Rew

concussion wrote: »

Agreed, there's a huge similarity. However, at the moment if you want to be a DF PTI you have to do it through the DF.

Yeah but I know something is activly being persued to change this. Some of these guys are better qualified then the equivlent Army guys, silly not to take advantage if people are willing to lend thair skills.

Poccington

Rew wrote: »

Never heard such rubish, so all the people sent out on external cources shouldn't be allowed use the skills? All the degrees people have done in civvie land are no good in the army?

There is a massive over lap between the the courses and the rest is the very small amount of mil specfic that can be covers in a short period. The army courses arn't anything special.

The Army use civvi qualifications that would benefit them.... Explain to me how allowing someone using their qualifications as a fitness instructor when there are already courses in place benefit the DF? Also, how many of said courses cover things such as load bearing exercises and military circuits?

I know of someone that came into the Army as a fully qualified Fitness Instructor who went on to do a PTI's Course.... He said he found the PTI Course quite beneficial and covered things that a normal civvi course doesn't cover.

eroo

Poccington wrote: »

You can already use the gym in a barracks, you don't need special permission to use it.

We were told otherwise!!

Would I need a PTI with me?

martinr5232

Poccington wrote: »

You can already use the gym in a barracks, you don't need special permission to use it.

Not if your a civvie you cant.

Poccington

martinr5232 wrote: »

Not if your a civvie you cant.

He could try argue that he's not a civilian if he turns up as an RDF Private though.

Poccington

eroo wrote: »

We were told otherwise!!

Would I need a PTI with me?

Let me make this much clear.... Nowhere in any gym I know of in barracks around the country does it state that a gym is for PDF use only. I've been in the gym enough times where I work to know for a fact it certainly doesn't state it in my barracks anyway.

In the gym in the job, it says ya can't do certain things unless you've a training program.... But nobody pays attention to it and nothing would be said as long as you know what you're doing with the weights and machines. In other words, as long as you're not standing there scratching your head muttering about how to work your shoulder muscles ya should be alright

martinr5232

Poccington wrote: »

He could try argue that he's not a civilian if he turns up as an RDF Private though.

If hes still waiting for security clearance hes a civvie.

Poccington

martinr5232 wrote: »

If hes still waiting for security clearance hes a civvie.

Well then as soon as his clearance comes back he can try his luck

eroo

Poccington wrote: »

Let me make this much clear.... Nowhere in any gym I know of in barracks around the country does it state that a gym is for PDF use only. I've been in the gym enough times where I work to know for a fact it certainly doesn't state it in my barracks anyway.

In the gym in the job, it says ya can't do certain things unless you've a training program.... But nobody pays attention to it and nothing would be said as long as you know what you're doing with the weights and machines. In other words, as long as you're not standing there scratching your head muttering about how to work your shoulder muscles ya should be alright

Yes,I know ALL DF personnel are allowed to use the gym but we were told that we are not allowed.Maybe it's because we are Recruits?

concussion

eroo wrote: »

Yes,I know ALL DF personnel are allowed to use the gym but we were told that we are not allowed.Maybe it's because we are Recruits?

I will be finding out exactly what the situation is in Sarsfield in the next few weeks.

Rew

Poccington wrote: »

The Army use civvi qualifications that would benefit them.... Explain to me how allowing someone using their qualifications as a fitness instructor when there are already courses in place benefit the DF? Also, how many of said courses cover things such as load bearing exercises and military circuits?

I know of someone that came into the Army as a fully qualified Fitness Instructor who went on to do a PTI's Course.... He said he found the PTI Course quite beneficial and covered things that a normal civvi course doesn't cover.

I said very clearly thet their is a major overlap between the two not that their the same hence the short conversion course. Im sure anyone would find the extras benificial because they haven't done them before but the rest of it is a repeat.

How does it benifit the Army? Simple they dont have pay for 8 months training (saleries and training costs), they dont have to tie up resources for 8 months and they end up with more trained people for minimal effort.

Look at RDF drivers. They have to have a B licence before they will start training them because they arnt going to waste time and money training people to drive from scratch (altthough I think they will in the PDF). They took an RDF sigs guy and sent him on a Europen Ex with PDF because he was better qualified then the PDF lads due to be a snr comms engineer in civvie life.

Utilising civvie skills has nothing but benifits for them esp with the RDF.

greenarrow

1. Have a mandatory fitness level for everyone who is a member. And if anyone fails to meet the minimum requirement kick them out.

This can be easily done on an annual camp on the first day. Then whoever fails it send them home, regardless of rank, age and sex.
Then if they are serious about being in the organisation give them until the following year to get back in shape. And then if they fail it the second time around, kick them out.

Doing it first thing on annual camp would be the best option. That way whoever fails and is going home doesn't have to unpack.

2. Improve the level of activity of corps units and the amount of investment put into them.

3. More weekends away, irrespective of the numbers who turn up.
You should be rewarding the members who are bothered to put in the effort and the hours because this is where the organisation is falling down. Each unit should be going away at least once every two months.

4. Stop taking a break during the summer months. There is no need for it.
I can agree with a short break in December because of the weather and people being busy with the holiday season.

5. Train more than two hours a week.
I know that units have been told they can only train/parade once a week from on high, so that's not their fault. But they do need to be putting in more than what they are. This needs to be looked at in a serious light.

6. Someone from the PDF needs to look into the whole security clearance procedure. It takes far too long for paperwork to go through for people most of the time. And that is something that needs to change, especially in the modern age when everything is computerised. Yet they are still using an outdated system. It should only take a period of 6 weeks tops to come back, but it doesn't.

7. Get people into uniform and give them what they need. And if they leave, then make sure that the uniform is returned or replaced by the person who got issued it. And enforce this too. And if it is not replaced, then get the money for it from them.

8. Some sort of job security for people who take time off work. But if enough notice was given to people then they would arrange that themselves.
But if there was some sort of a calendar of events/training posted on the DF website for the RDF then that would solve the majority of that problem I would imagine.

In my opinion

greenarrow wrote: »

1. Have a mandatory fitness level for everyone who is a member. And if anyone fails to meet the minimum requirement kick them out. Rubbish, train people first. Those who joined prior to a change should not be kicked out because the posts have changed. Introduce fitness training before you test people. You learn rifle before TEOT same applies I hope for all military activities.

This can be easily done on an annual camp on the first day. Then whoever fails it send them home, regardless of rank, age and sex.
Then if they are serious about being in the organisation give them until the following year to get back in shape. And then if they fail it the second time around, kick them out.

Doing it first thing on annual camp would be the best option. That way whoever fails and is going home doesn't have to unpack.

2. Improve the level of activity of corps units and the amount of investment put into them.Broad statement, define!

3. More weekends away, irrespective of the numbers who turn up.
You should be rewarding the members who are bothered to put in the effort and the hours because this is where the organisation is falling down. Each unit should be going away at least once every two months. Rewarding?? Its not a social organisation.

4. Stop taking a break during the summer months. There is no need for it.
I can agree with a short break in December because of the weather and people being busy with the holiday season. Annual Training

5. Train more than two hours a week.
I know that units have been told they can only train/parade once a week from on high, so that's not their fault. But they do need to be putting in more than what they are. This needs to be looked at in a serious light. Why?

6. Someone from the PDF needs to look into the whole security clearance procedure. It takes far too long for paperwork to go through for people most of the time. And that is something that needs to change, especially in the modern age when everything is computerised. Yet they are still using an outdated system. It should only take a period of 6 weeks tops to come back, but it doesn't. PDF? Kop on!! Garda vetting unit under massive pressure sort out priorities first.

7. Get people into uniform and give them what they need. And if they leave, then make sure that the uniform is returned or replaced by the person who got issued it. And enforce this too. And if it is not replaced, then get the money for it from them. In Place

8. Some sort of job security for people who take time off work. But if enough notice was given to people then they would arrange that themselves. Get Real look at state of economy no need unless you are talking about long term deployment
But if there was some sort of a calendar of events/training posted on the DF website for the RDF then that would solve the majority of that problem I would imagine. Unit training Plan

You are not in this outit very long I take it.

greenarrow

In my opinion wrote: »

You are not in this outit very long I take it.

F.A.O. In my opinion

1. To the first point, they can still get their fitness levels up during the time they are doing their training. There is no reason that both can't be done at the same time.
And its entirely up to the individual to get themselves fit. And they are joining a military organisation so they should be fit, and they should be working on their individual fitness.

A PTI would gladly design a training programme for you if you asked them.
The only exceptions to the rule could be to make an allowance for people who are recovering from an injury/illness or have had a baby. Test them the following year on their annual camp. Which is giving them a year to get in shape, which is an adequate period to get in shape.

And its too bad that the goalposts were moved. The whole point of doing this was to make the organisation more professional.

2. There is not enough of an annual budget being allocated to corps units, compared to an infantry unit. But the PDF are short specialists like engineers, medics, etc. And they could find suitable candidates in corps units to fill said vacancies.

3. I never said it was a social club. What I meant was those members who are there, and putting in the hours, should be getting more opportunities to put their training into use.

4. Annual training is a necessity. But why should your weekly training go on hold for 6-8 weeks after annual camp?
You should be building on from your annual training at the earliest opportunity.

5. Yes...the more you train, the better you will become.

6. I never meant that it should be someone from the PDF doing the job, nor did I say it. I meant someone should look into it, and come up with a solution for this because this is one of the main reasons that people in the RDF leave.
It is not unusual for people to be waiting 9 months for clearance. While all their friends are in uniform, going away etc. and they are left behind. This is a big thing for the RDF.

7. That doesn't happen all the time.

8. In relation to long term deployment, the plan is to send reservists overseas but there is no legislation in place to protect their employment. That's a fact.
I am not getting into the debate over whether they should go or not...I am pointing out that there is no legislation in place to protect their jobs. That's all.

And I can't find any unit training plans on the DF website either.

Oh, and your response to points 1 and 3 kinda contradict each other by the way!!!!