AH: Traveler Bride Vs JigSawGirl

AlmightyCushion

Dudess wrote: »

I invited any moderator who DID have time to clean up the thread and re-open it if they wanted.

I was going to go through the thread but Jigsaw said he didn't want it re-opened so I thought it would be best to leave the jigsaw thread. That's why it's still deleted. Just so you know 6th.

TequilaMockingBird

Gordon wrote:

As has been noted by Terry, this isn't entirely true. If a user requests to delete a thread that they have posted we can look into it and delete it if needs be.

If you are locked one night and make a stupid post that you end up regretting the next day, we can look into it and delete it. We all make mistakes. I've on many occasions deleted users posts on PI due to the realisation that actually someone may be able to decipher who they are.

A thread starter doesn't own a thread but they do own their words and if they f*cked up we can help them unf*ck the situation up if they need it. And if it takes deleting a very popular thread to do that then, unfortunately we may have to delete the whole thread. Not nice to do, but sometimes it's better for the user as opposed to the users.

Although it was a really funny thread, Jigsaw himself was obviously very uncomfortable about it, and more so the following morning, there was also the Bebo, and derogatory comments towards JigsawGirl, that made it fairly likely that it was going to be deleted. In my opinion.

The traveller thread shouldn't have gone as far as it did, I was amazed at some of the disgusting comments which were there for so long. I guess I should have reported it too, as it seems there weren't enough reports for it to be dealt with.

witnessmenow

Dudess wrote: »

6th, I really don't think you'd have given a flying fuk, or even noticed, if it wasn't for the fact that you're having a hissy fit about the Jigsaw thread being deleted. As I said at the time: that thread was started during the night, and by 9.30am it was on its 17th page. I was at work, there was no way I had time to go throw all 16+ pages to delete the derogatory comments about this one girl's appearance, as well as personal stuff about her (I don't care if it was Bebo, nobody joins Bebo to have it jeered at on a forum - even if their profile is set to public) and I invited any moderator who DID have time to clean up the thread and re-open it if they wanted.



Such snide comments are completely unnecessary. I was busy at work - I had a few spare seconds to read this thread early on in the day and I had time to thank Thaedydal, but I knew I wouldn't have time to give a detailed response. The reason why I thanked Thaedydal was because she said exactly what I was going to say.

I think its quite clear you need to quit your job to take up modding full time, anything short of that any your only doing it half arsed :pac:

kaimera

Although it was a really funny thread, Jigsaw himself was obviously very uncomfortable about it, and more so the following morning,

Not a good enough reason alone to delete a thread tbh. Plenty of people have stupid stuff online

TequilaMockingBird

kaimera wrote: »

Not a good enough reason alone to delete a thread tbh. Plenty of people have stupid stuff online

I agree. But, when you add in the Bebo, the comments on the girls looks etc, such a long thread, AND the OPs horror at it all, I can see why it was deleted.

Its a pity a bit of editing couldn't be done to bring it back, as it was great!

The traveller one, on the other hand, was rotton through and through and should never have been allowed go so far.

6th

I wont bother replying to everything but, Dudess, as I said earlier I was not having a go at you (I think you do a great job and have said so plenty of times in the past) - all I asked was why the 2 threads were threated so differently? It looked as if it was ok to slag off the women in the traveler wedding photos ut not JigSawGirl - I just wondered why?

Now I will ask, can you post examples of my "hissy fit" about the first thread being deleted? I know you wont be able to find any but sure I'll ask anyway.

RoundyMooney

Well, the sig doesn't exactly suggest an impartial and uninvolved opinion, does it?

Nor did what was an inadvisable previous sig, campaign, and avatar involving an unwitting outside party.

Not 6th/whoever bashing, just calling it like I see it.

Slidey

6th wrote: »

I wont bother replying to everything but, Dudess, as I said earlier I was not having a go at you (I think you do a great job and have said so plenty of times in the past) - all I asked was why the 2 threads were threated so differently? It looked as if it was ok to slag off the women in the traveler wedding photos ut not JigSawGirl - I just wondered why?

Now I will ask, can you post examples of my "hissy fit" about the first thread being deleted? I know you wont be able to find any but sure I'll ask anyway.

Everyday for the rest of my life i am gonna get down on my knees and pray to many many different Gods that i stayed on that few extra mins that morning to finish reading that thread. Twas awesome, alas it has gone and we may never see it again:(

6th

RoundyMooney wrote: »

Well, the sig doesn't exactly suggest an impartial and uninvolved opinion, does it?

Nor did what was an inadvisable previous sig, campaign, and avatar involving an unwitting outside party.

Not 6th/whoever bashing, just calling it like I see it.

I found the thread hilarious and peoples reactions to it (no law against that) but I didnt have a hissy fit when it was deleted .... but if Dudess has examples of me having one then great.

peasant

Dudess wrote: »

I didn't spot your reported post at all peasant. Honestly, I do not recall it. Secondly, I didn't have time to read that entire traveller thread, I had to meet some people with important documentation (yes, it's true) and it was only minutes before I headed out the door. I just had a look at the latest page and didn't see anything amiss. I noticed the thread starter remarking that she had seen some racist comments so I asked her what she was talking about, then I left. To be fair, sometimes a moderator only has time to go by the reported posts and there were practically zero reported posts in relation to that thread - all I saw was a post from some girl who felt Thaedydal's comments regarding Jordan were too harsh. Nothing to do with the traveller community.

1) fair enough, real life has a habit of interfering ...like football just did with my timely reply

2) if the thread starter complains about the goings on their own thread, there's usually something to it. No time? ...you could have handed it over, reported it again for further scrutiny by someone else.

3) The reported post on Jordan was a vile and disgusting post in itself and would have warranted action on its own. It being reported was the reason why I didn't report the thread a second time, because I assumed that after that one "somebody would do something" ...plus AH is not "my turf" and you guys usually have your stuff under control.

But ...now ...last but not least ...I can't see the thread anymore so therefore I can't quote you directly ...this morning, on thread you posted a real hummdinger...something along the lines that "racism doesn't apply to travellers because they arent a "race" "

That may be technically correct, but so wrong on many other fronts ...I believe on here it's called a FAIL.

Whether you were pressed for time, just lazy or actually have anti-traveller sentiments yourself is only a minor detail ...fact is that thread was not a good show for moderating.

RoundyMooney

I'm not suggesting you did (because I don't know, and cba finding out), and take you at your word.

I'm not saying you're wrong in highlighting a discrepancy either (because there was one, for a few brief hours).

However, since privacy has been bandied about here, how would you feel if that girl who was approached by a TV crew for a brief voxpop and nothing more was your sister, daughter, SO?

I know I'd be ready to crack heads. We can all have a chortle.com with our online personas when it's not on our doorstep.

The exact same thing applies (although not narrowed down to one individual) with the wedding pictures. Why should they be villified when they have not explicitly placed themselves in the public eye? Yes, they are laughable to us, but hey, it's their culture.

If you want impartiality in the way threads are treated, why not post up a few pictures of the traveller wedding in your sig?

RoundyMooney

@ peasant, I don't think travellers are a race either.

peasant

RoundyMooney wrote: »

@ peasant, I don't think travellers are a race either.

Neither do I ...but that is no reason to leave pages of nasty, derogatory remarks unmoderated.

RoundyMooney

peasant wrote: »

Neither do I ...but that is no reason to leave pages of nasty, derogatory remarks unmoderated.

You know as well as I that we fulfil a voluntary role.

Some folk to which the task falls may not have sufficient time to deal with the issue as quickly as may be warranted, and some others may not even read the thread/report.

In short, we're human, and volunteers. That role cannot be enforced (although the responsibility can be removed). At the end of the day, all that we're talking about is a discrepancy of a few hours. As to whether this thread had a bearing on the final outcome, well, I think we all know where the CT forum is.

6th

RoundyMooney wrote: »

However, since privacy has been bandied about here, how would you feel if that girl who was approached by a TV crew for a brief voxpop and nothing more was your sister, daughter, SO?

I know I'd be ready to crack heads. We can all have a chortle.com with our online personas when it's not on our doorstep.

I can only answer for me but I'm no stranger to having the piss taken with images online (dont even think about it monkeyfudge!). But Where do we stop? Those Lolcats, they are peoples pets and in some cases I'm sure they didnt plan the pics to be used as they are, same with alot of other funny pics such as FAIl pics etc.

Anyway the question is not whether these types of things should be allowed but rather that the same modding be applied in both cases mentioned. Now apart from getting a tad defensive (and I dont blame her) Dudess has addressed this and said that she didnt have time to look at the traveler thread and I'm sure had she time she would have locked/deleted as appropriate.

I am not pointt out right or wrong I am only pointing out inconsistancy!

6th

Also trhe threads are deleted so we can only discuss them based on memory and have nothing solid so no point going on any more is there?

Steve

peasant wrote: »

Neither do I ...but that is no reason to leave pages of nasty, derogatory remarks unmoderated.

OK I don't know how AH moderating is rostered out - maybe there's a duty schedule for it but the point I made at the start of this thread remains. There were other AH mods acitvely posting on boards while the wedding thread was running its course, it could have been stopped at any time and I think it's unfair to lay this at the feet of a single moderator.

I've seen threads in motors turn sour, (and in fairness you're there pretty quick when it gets reported) but you can't watch all of the posters all of the time.

Dudess

6th wrote: »

I wont bother replying to everything but, Dudess, as I said earlier I was not having a go at you (I think you do a great job and have said so plenty of times in the past)

You may have said that but what were the snide remarks about so?

all I asked was why the 2 threads were threated so differently? It looked as if it was ok to slag off the women in the traveler wedding photos ut not JigSawGirl - I just wondered why?

Now I will ask, can you post examples of my "hissy fit" about the first thread being deleted? I know you wont be able to find any but sure I'll ask anyway.

Oh come on! Never have I seen such utter mourning for a thread - it's clear its deletion caused considerable upset which, in your case, manifested in the form of this thread.

peasant wrote: »

if the thread starter complains about the goings on their own thread, there's usually something to it. No time? ...you could have handed it over, reported it again for further scrutiny by someone else.

I don't know of anyone who does that. I just assumed another moderator would be around at some stage.

The reported post on Jordan was a vile and disgusting post in itself and would have warranted action on its own.

The language was coarse yes, but if action were to be taken for every post in After Hours that contains coarse language, well there really aren't enough hours in the day... It's not like it was personal abuse.

But ...now ...last but not least ...I can't see the thread anymore so therefore I can't quote you directly ...this morning, on thread you posted a real hummdinger...something along the lines that "racism doesn't apply to travellers because they arent a "race"

Yeah, the misuse of the term is something I feel there's no harm pointing out.

peasant wrote: »

Neither do I ...but that is no reason to leave pages of nasty, derogatory remarks unmoderated.

Wo... that's a bit of an assumption peasant. The incorrect use of the term "race" is not the reason why the thread was left unmoderated - and you know it.
You've picked the wrong person to accuse of being prejudiced. Have you not SEEN how worked up I can get about ignorant comments on Roma threads? I take it you haven't.

peasant

Dudess wrote: »

The incorrect use of the term "race" is not the reason why the thread was left unmoderated - and you know it.
You've picked the wrong person to accuse of being prejudiced. Have you not SEEN how worked up I can get about ignorant comments on Roma threads? I take it you haven't.

You're getting me all wrong.

I don't care what you personally did or didn't do, did or didn't think and I don't care if you protect Roma either.

My posts were never meant to be directed at any one person, but both you and Karoma failed to notice that and painted me into a corner.

Fact of the matter is, the tread in question was let live in all its vileness for hours on end and somehow slipped through the net. Be the actual reasons for that understaffing or undercaring of individual mods doesn't really matter either.

That thread shouldn't have been there.

I have no intention of analising how it happend and how it won't happen again ..that's for you AH mods to figure out (or not as the case may be)

I simply voiced my opinion.

I shan't be doing that again ...not outside my turf anyway.

And so to bed.

Dudess

peasant wrote: »

Fact of the matter is, the tread in question was let live in all its vileness for hours on end and somehow slipped through the net. Be the actual reasons for that understaffing or undercaring of individual mods doesn't really matter either.

That thread shouldn't have been there.

I have no intention of analising how it happend and how it won't happen again ..that's for you AH mods to figure out (or not as the case may be)

You just keep on having a go at the moderating - by implying we don't care and/or are lazy.

Rb

Dudess wrote: »

Have you not SEEN how worked up I can get about ignorant comments on Roma threads? I take it you haven't.

That's because you don't get as many in Cork

Except for clubfoot, who for years freaked me out every time I passed her...

Regarding the Travellers thread, imo it started off fine. I think the comments regarding their smell crossed the line, but there's nothing wrong with poking fun about the outfits some people were wearing at a wedding, regardless of their background.

peasant

Believe me, if I was having "a go", my posts would look completely different.

Rb

peasant wrote: »

Believe me, if I was having "a go", my posts would look completely different.

Thems fightin' words

6th

Dudess wrote: »

You may have said that but what were the snide remarks about so?

I wasnt being snide. I suspected you might have ignored this thread and tbh I wouldnt have blamed you, some folk have been bitchy about you in this thread but I really dont think I am one of them. My points have been about the modding, not the mod.

Dudess wrote: »

Oh come on! Never have I seen such utter mourning for a thread - it's clear its deletion caused considerable upset which, in your case, manifested in the form of this thread.

Did I start this thread after the JigSawGirl thread was deleted or did I start it after an obvious consistancy in moderating?

Dudess

Both.

6th

Well if I was having a hissy fit about the deletion of the first thread surely i wouldnt have waited for a fcuk up that I didnt even know was coming?

Obviously I was right so I'm happy with that, I mean the 2nd thread has now gotten the same treatment as the first - consistancy .... its all we are after no matter what way the axe falls.

stovelid

6th wrote: »

Well if I was having a hissy fit about the deletion of the first thread surely i wouldnt have waited for a fcuk up that I didnt even know was coming?

If not exactly a 'hissy fit', this all just comes across as some weird vendetta because your first thread was deleted, tbh.

Xavi6

stovelid wrote: »

If not exactly a 'hissy fit', this all just comes across as some weird vendetta because your first thread was deleted, tbh.

How was it 'his' thread? I'm not even sure if he posted in it.

Bob the Builder

Xavi6 wrote: »

How was it 'his' thread? I'm not even sure if he posted in it.

He was the chief artist. Remember that picture of the jigsaw?

I only saw the thread and read through it now. As CuLT said already, I was also sick to the teeth for so many reasons, especially when previous reputations were brought into it. There was a small issue of moderating between consistency of two threads and then everyone brought in every other type of topic into it that you could possibly imagine, while dragging up references to other forums completely irrelevant.

Regarding travellers, travellers are travellers, same as farmers are farmers or gardaí are gardaí. Of course, They can be considered a race, but i dont think that would be entriely accurate. They are merely an ethnic minority. They shouldn't be treated any differently to "proper humans" (that being a quote I heard lately on the radio. No, srsly... thats what he said).

The thread in AH about travellers, I deliberately refrained from posting in because it was so vile, and it was so obvious where it was going to go. It screamed at me that it was going to become a case of knackerism, and guess what, it did. Unfortunately, the jigsaw thread I never seen.

AH is one of the most difficult forums to Mod as I can well imagine, but a certain level of responsibility must be met with by the posters as well. It's all well and good blaming moderators until someone gets hurt. I tell jokes about "knackers", "blacks", etc, etc but never do i mean it in such a harmful way as that thread was intending. A lot of posts went well over the edge.

#Nev

Xavi6

nevf wrote: »

He was the chief artist. Remember that picture of the jigsaw?

But that had nothing to do with the actual thread. He didn't start it orpost much, if at all, in it so to call it his thread is silly.