How much use is an Advanced Open Water PADI

steelbar

I am just wondering how much use an Advanced OW from PADI is in Ireland.

As any expierence I have had it seems to be laughed at.

Scuba G

steelbar wrote: »

I am just wondering how much use an Advanced OW from PADI is in Ireland.

As any expierence I have had it seems to be laughed at.

Anywhere from €375 to €425, depends on where and who you do the course with. Just out of interest, what experience do you have that was found so amusing:D

testicle

It's advanced skills course, it doesn't make you an advanced diver. You can have an AOWD with a total of 9 dives in your logbook...

Benny-c

Personally speaking it isn't a much use except in (i've found) Dive Centres abroad where they are more comfortable with a Diver that has an 'advanced' card.

Otherwise its just a PADI marketing stunt.

Benny

rahtkennades

Benny-c wrote: »

Personally speaking it isn't a much use ...
Otherwise its just a PADI marketing stunt.

Benny

I think that's a bit harsh tbh. Fair enough, some of the courses are a bit weak, but some are quite useful.
The underwater navigation is very useful. The number of divers i've seen that get completely lost above water, never mind below, makes having some basic knowledge of compass work very useful.
The deep dive is worthwhile, it would give a rookie diver a bit more comfort about what they will experience at greater depth.
Personally I think the bouyancy course is useful, I'm diving for over 15 years and I still practice my fin-pivots when I haven't been diving for a while.

Other than that, I guess the dry-suit course is useful for anybody diving in these waters.

I guess the point really is that anybody could strap on some gear and jump in the water and hope for the best, but the whole point of progressive training is to gradually get people familiar with the concepts.

Fratton Fred

I only have an OW cert, but most dive centres I have been to are happy taking me down to 30m, once they see 24 -26m dives in your log book they are ok.

However, in Sharm, the dive centre would not let me dive any sites where they knew they would go over 18m, they are very strict. Whether or not this is to persuade me to do the AOW or not I'm not sure, but it was a pain.

Scuba.ie

Benny-c wrote: »

Personally speaking it isn't a much use except in (i've found) Dive Centres abroad where they are more comfortable with a Diver that has an 'advanced' card.

Otherwise its just a PADI marketing stunt.

Benny

More agency bashing? Have we not outgrown that yet?

steelbar

Scuba G wrote: »

Anywhere from €375 to €425, depends on where and who you do the course with. Just out of interest, what experience do you have that was found so amusing:D

No I just got the impression that when you have a PADI cert people look down on it.

Fratton Fred

steelbar wrote: »

No I just got the impression that when you have a PADI cert people look down on it.

Not really, it is only a qualification and as in everyday life, experience means as much if not more. Just think of a graduate turning up on their first day at work, they have the knowledge to do the job, but they won't get any respect from their peers until they have the experience to go with it.

Borzoi

steelbar wrote: »

No I just got the impression that when you have a PADI cert people look down on it.

Only here, when small minded people can't see beyond the paperwork to the quality of the diver

Pawwed Rig

I found it pretty good as I did the Basic one in a resort where they weren't too bothered with perfecting skills so I did the adv course with the lads in DunLaoighre. I got to work on buoyancy and navigation and also got my weights right. Just doing normal dives I mightn't of ever got the tuition to get them right. Plus it introduces you to Irish divers.

ponybottle

Hi All

Having done OW and AOW I'd say you are much better off joining a CFT affiliated club and getting trained by people who know that they will be putting their lives in your hands on a regular basis.

You will get to dive yourself silly for a whole season for about the same price, at multiple sites where you will get expert advice on conditions etc.

And how many PADI instructors will be there at the end of each dive, to discuss technique and impart the wisdom of ages, over a pint ?

Chris:rolleyes:

Scuba G

ponybottle wrote: »

Hi All

Having done OW and AOW I'd say you are much better off joining a CFT affiliated club and getting trained by people who know that they will be putting their lives in your hands on a regular basis.
Is it not the other way around?
You will get to dive yourself silly for a whole season for about the same price, at multiple sites where you will get expert advice on conditions etc.
Bull, the cost of koining a CFT club is not as cheap as its said, Ive no problem with CFT, its a very good agency and some excellent instructors.

And how many PADI instructors will be there at the end of each dive, to discuss technique and impart the wisdom of ages, over a pint ?
Depends on what diving you are doing, bit of a cop out as not all instructors are able to impart wisom of ages, alot of divers who are not instructors will have information just as good.

Chris:rolleyes:

Yet again agency bashing, Im trained with PADI and alot of my dive buddies were too and we would be confident and safe divers, forget the politics and just go diving

ponybottle

Having done OW and AOW I'd say you are much better off joining a CFT affiliated club and getting trained by people who know that they will be putting their lives in your hands on a regular basis.
Is it not the other way around?
Nope, People who train you but then have to continually dive with you as a buddy have more incentive to ensure your training is thorough.

You will get to dive yourself silly for a whole season for about the same price, at multiple sites where you will get expert advice on conditions etc.
Bull, the cost of koining a CFT club is not as cheap as its said, Ive no problem with CFT, its a very good agency and some excellent instructors.
5oo euro a year isn't dear for pool use, lectures, boat dives etc ( although always dear if you don't have it ! )
Ditto on instructors, I havn't met a bad PADI one either.

And how many PADI instructors will be there at the end of each dive, to discuss technique and impart the wisdom of ages, over a pint ?
Depends on what diving you are doing, bit of a cop out as not all instructors are able to impart wisom of ages, alot of divers who are not instructors will have information just as good.
Agreed, but isn't it harder to meet other divers and make connections outside of a club structure ?

Yet again agency bashing, Im trained with PADI and alot of my dive buddies were too and we would be confident and safe divers, forget the politics and just go diving PADI train you and leave you to your own devices, that' s a fact, not 'agency bashing' as you put it.
A club involves you in continuous training, also a fact.
I have nothing against PADI personel, any of them have met are all excellent folk. If PADI supported some form of post-qualification club system they'd have cracked it for me.

Chris

whosedaddy?

I'm tempted to add another color to that post :-)

getting trained by people who know that they will be putting their lives in your hands on a regular basis.
Is it not the other way around?

ScubaG meant " getting trained by people who know that they will be putting their lives in your hands on a regular basis

you put your live into their hands as a beginner.

On the club / non-club side. You can meet all sorts of divers by not being in a club, it just takes a bit more initiative to talk to them and find the nice ones. Being in a club makes you dive with people, but is makes it as hard to avoid the ones you don't get on with... and as you are in your club, there is all that club rivalry... i'm not in one, so don't really know.
I did try ones and was appalled by the "wisdom" the instructors where passing on. Which has NOTHING to do with agencies, but with individuals.

Fact is I have chosen not to be in a club, before diving in ireland that was not so much an issue as shore dives/lake dives don't require a boat.
The one thing I was surprised about is that there are no open to everyone non-Padi dive centres. Something that is very common in Germany.

Driving is training, you have to practice, with a club or with a dive centre - who cares. Its about having fun and enjoying the sport.

If CFT would support some non-club system as CMAS does on the continent, I'd be sold on that too... giving more options for everyone.

And back to the OPs question. It all depends on you and what you make of it. Go diving, gain experience, get better at what you do and most of all - enjoy. Don't mind anyone that tells you otherwise - they have all started as beginners!

Daz

ponybottle

Daz

Can't find anything to disagree with in your post.

There are pros and cons to both the PADI and CFT routes of course so no point in bad mouthing the other side. The best approach would be to try to incorporate best practice in whatever route you take therby improving the system overall.

I have done PADI OW and AOW and CFT 2 Star. From the point of view of bang-for buck I would advise anyone getting started to go to a CFT Club, OK a bit more expensive but you get all the training PADI gives with a years use of facilities and boat use thrown in. In year 2 then go whichever way suits your pocket and preference.

I know many club divers who dive with PADI folk and vice versa, no problems and ultimately enriching as both learn from the other.

Safe diving yaaal !

Chris

Pawwed Rig

ponybottle wrote: »

5oo euro a year isn't dear for pool use, lectures, boat dives etc ( although always dear if you don't have it ! )

That surely depends on the ammount of diving you do? 500euro a year will give you a good number of boat dives in a year independently of a club.

robertpatterson

Most places are at least 30 euros at the moment and some even going as high as 49 euros so at the cheapest its less than 17 boat dives with a dive shop

Pawwed Rig

Yeah thats about right. Personally I only get 3 or 4 weekends away in a year to dive so 17 for the 500euro sounds reasonable

ponybottle

Hi all

Did I say 500 ? Viking SAC will do it for 450 ( if you pay on time ).

However even 450 is a lot to shell out in one go but then we were talking about the difference between and AOW course and a club so you have to take the AOW fee away and you are left with what ? 150 eur for all the diving, air and boats you can use for the rest of the year ?

I would recommend anyone in training to get as much experience as possible and then, after the skills have been well bedded in, you can afford to dive less often and still be reasonably happy you won't forget too much. On this basis a club route is better value.
(having said that the more you dive the safer you are, for both yourself and your buddy - God help anyone who get's buddied with the guy on a 30mtr dive whose last dive was in 2004 etc )

Chris

colinmcbride

Hi All,
I don't really want to get into the whole PADI Vrs CMAS issue but for all you new comers out there you should note the following:

1) Some PADI Shops also run successfull clubs and don't charge huge membership
2) In order to join most CFT Clubs you must own a full set of equipment - this is quite expensive for new divers who don't know if they will still be in the sport this time next year.

As was said before there are good and bad things about both setups but I often read that CFT is the only way to go for a club structure - this is simply not the case.

On the original topic of this thread we do an open water course for €50/dive + €100 for manuals, fees and admin (€350). Or if you are coming on one of our weekend trips and are already paying for your dives we do it for only €20 a dive (€200). These prices also cover all gear hire.

Regards
Colin McBride
www.First4Scuba.com