Keylogger

Pauleeeeeeee

Just installed a key logger there. I'm using PC Cillin as my anti virus. How the crap do I go about telling PC Cillin that the specific key logger I have installed is not a threat?

Cabaal

why would you want to use a keylogger and not have anti-virus software detect it? What would you use this for on your own pc?

Pauleeeeeeee

Cabaal wrote: »

What would you use this for on your own pc?

Stuff.

tech

sounds interesting !! ??

Capt'n Midnight

It's a threat to any user who doesn't know it's there.

mukki

it might be an idea for parents to keep an eye on kids internet activity

if that is what the OP is trying to do, i'd suggest K9 instead

Hobbes

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

It's a threat to any user who doesn't know it's there.

They are a serious threat in general. Having a key logger is just asking for trouble.

Mukki suggestion is best.

biko

OP, if this is a school computer it's a crime.
If it's on your own PC to spy on your siblings it's bad too

Can't really see you getting advice either way, not from me anyway.

Pauleeeeeeee

Impressive display of morals there lads. Well done.

I've figured it out though.

Thanks for the 'help'

Sherifu

Pauleeeeeeee wrote: »

Impressive display of morals there lads. Well done.

I've figured it out though.

Thanks for the 'help'

:rolleyes:

ethernet

Pauleeeeeeee wrote: »

Just installed a key logger there. I'm using PC Cillin as my anti virus. How the crap do I go about telling PC Cillin that the specific key logger I have installed is not a threat?

Hehe, love the name -- you share the same name with a ganster in The Sopranos

BoB_BoT

actually speaking of keyloggers, does anyone know of the legalities of installing these on a computer that isn't your own? We constantly check for them in work just to make sure the machines are above board, but just wondering where we'd stand if we caught someone installing one.

biko

Software/Dongle is legal and you can buy it anywhere. You can install one on you PC and have a notice up saying "PC is monitored".

But - trying to collect information by interception/spying is illegal, except for law enforcement/or official spies MI5, FBI, NSA, ..., ... They use them to bypass hushmail and PGP.

Keyloggers are the reason I don't use internet cafes to buy tickets with my credit card any more. They might not be installed by a criminal, just some n00b opening the wrong mass-mail and executing some stupid thing that was sent.

Overheal

moral issues aside, depends on your AntiVirus. In norton i have the option to restore any virus that has entered quarantine etc.

Ive never heard of Cillin

Static M.e.

While on the subject does anyone know any good software to find if your PC has a keylogger running on it?

Martyr

Icesword has a an option to list all Message Hooks.
WH_KEYBOARD_LL is low level hook implemented in stand-alone program.

WH_KEYBOARD usually requires external DLL, but i've seen this used with relocatable code too - which doesn't have any hardcoded api or data.

i've also seen a way to hijack a message hook inside another process/thread for key stroke logging..for example in some keyboard software by logitech.

theres also keyboard filters, kernel hooks..lots of undocumented ways i would guess.

Lazarus2.0

I got to agree with OP on this - the cynical and/or flippant replies were hardly helpful or constructive and not one of them offered the OP any kind of solution . I've had reason in the past to instal a keylogger on my own machine and sadly I was justified in installing it . It doesnt mean I'm a snoop or want to know everything that is going on in other peoples' interwebs - frankly I dont ! That said , you cant stand over a minor (as a prime example) and observe every site they visit , every IM conversation , every forum they post on / upload to . If you have suspicions in that regard then a keylogger becomes not spyware but a tool to protect your kids . That's as high a moral in my view as is not using such a tool against adults , whether at home or in the workplace/internet cafe etc . I dont know the OP's intentions but think it's harsh to assume the worst when they're up front about what they're doing and only asking for tech advice . I suppose that's why they posted in Tech rather than PI ....

muggyog

it's harsh to assume the worst when they're up front about what they're doing and only asking for tech advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabaal
What would you use this for on your own pc?
Stuff.

Stuff is being upfront about what he is doing?

Lazarus2.0

No , Stuff means the OP's reasons are not really anyone's business . The OP is being up front in posting on a Tech forum that they have intentionally installed a keylogger and there is now an issue with telling his AV to allow the application to run .
Demanding to know the reason a user has a particular application installed on his/her PC before you'll consider helping them is wrong , especially when privacy is cited as the reason . It's really nobody's business what's installed on your PC , my PC or anyone else's PC . It should only be a moral issue if there's a stated intent that goes against your own morals or is just plain illegal .
There are plenty of threads here asking for help with torrent clients , DVD burning and copying software , wireless connectivity , etc . They are generally well subscribed to with helpful and informative replies even though they can be and often are used for illegal activities . However threads on these topics are instantly (and rightly) shot down if there is a stated intent of illegal usage . Keylogging your own machine is not illegal and so there could only be a suggestion of 'immoral' usage in this case . The only suggestions came from replies , not from the OP .
In the instance I mentioned earlier in this thread where I used a keylogger it confirmed a clandestine arrangement for a 14 year old girl (temporarily under our care) to meet up with a 40 year old male . For sex , to put it bluntly . We suspected what was going on but without the keylog wouldnt have known when/where to act .
I say this to illustrate that while keyloggers are of course open to abuse , it's not a given that they are going to be used maliciously .
Sorry for dragging this off topic but think the point is worth making .

Hobbes

nessyguin wrote: »

I got to agree with OP on this - the cynical and/or flippant replies were hardly helpful or constructive and not one of them offered the OP any kind of solution

My comment was very constructive. Key loggers in general are dangerous. You are effectively compromising your own system. It would be something someone would look for if they were planning on hacking your machine.

If you want to go ultra-paranoid just set up a proxy server and have the childs traffic route through that.

you cant stand over a minor (as a prime example) and observe every site they visit

Would you leave a minor in the heart of town at 10pm at night while paying someone to spy on them?

If your that serious about watching your childs activity then your better to get engaged with what they are doing and leave the computer in a public area of the house. Putting on key loggers is liable to cause serious trust issues from the child to parent and is liable to push them to more secrecy then if you didn't have the logger to begin with. To assume they wouldn't cop onto it is silly.

No , Stuff means the OP's reasons are not really anyone's business .

I am pretty sure if someone asked for something illegal on a public forum then it would be peoples business.

Capt'n Midnight

privacy used as a defense for a keylogger, keyloggers are the exact opposite of privacy.

I would not put a keylogger on a machine because leaving out the ethical question, there are quite a few people would get violent if they found out

biko

nessyguin wrote: »

If you have suspicions in that regard then a keylogger becomes not spyware but a tool to protect your kids .

American foreign policy personified
Rather than spying on your kids' keystrokes, use Netnanny or site filters. It's not like you can use what you learn against them, it'd blow your cover wide open and they'll not trust you again.

I've only come across keyloggers in bad situations, that is - bad for me.

Lazarus2.0

Some very strange analogies there ! American foreign policy ? Leaving a minor in town at 10pm ?

My point was and remains that there are exceptional circumstances which may call for resorting to this . I didn't and would never suggest keylogging to be an appropriate way to monitor internet activity in general . Hobbes put it best when saying "If your that serious about watching your childs activity then your better to get engaged with what they are doing and leave the computer in a public area of the house. Putting on key loggers is liable to cause serious trust issues from the child to parent and is liable to push them to more secrecy then if you didn't have the logger to begin with. To assume they wouldn't cop onto it is silly."

For what it's worth I wholeheartedly agree with that . The problem is that it assumes a permanently installed keylogger monitoring your own kids . If that were the case I'd go with the concensus that it's a dismal failure/betrayal on the parenting side . But the fact remains that nobody knows why the OP had a keylog running . Nor do they need to - I know for the three days I had to run one I certainly wasnt shouting it from the rooftop .

I just don't think it's right that the OP can ask a simple question about a permission in their AV and get slaughtered for it just because of the application they asked about . I cant vouch for their intentions as I've got no idea but it's wrong to assume the worst and certainly it's wrong to demand to know the reason why they have it installed .

I could post a question on BitTorrent port forwarding and have plenty of helpful ("this is what to do") replies within 24 hours , even though the protocol is primarily though not exclusively used for the transfer of copyrighted files . I wouldnt expect to be met with 'What are you going to download/upload ' type replies . Installing a keylogger on your own PC is not illegal so the OP wasnt asking for "something illegal on a public forum" .

Seifer

Just because someone says they're installing something on their own machine doesn't mean they are.
He was asked why he wanted it and if he had given a plausible reply e.g. kid monitoring etc., then maybe he would've gotten help. Instead he said "stuff".

mukki

i am totally against using this "keylogging malware" too, no matter what the circumstances!

we try to help people with windows problems, not help people create problems from someone else

it will give the OP full access to all the usernames, passwords and credit card numbers of anyone who uses the infected pc. if everyone used one people who get caught out doing something wrong by the keylogger will lose confidence in IT security. and will feel watched the whole time online

Internet users need to know that they can book flights, bid on auctions ect securily, every website has to make money... so if everyone loses confidence and feel they can't use a pc to buy stuff online.... then why would there be websites?

finally

asking in windows about a getting a keylogging malware to not be detected by an antivirus.
its a bit like going into motors and telling people to walk more
its a bit like going into the rock forum and telling people you hate all rock music
its a bit like going into the DIY forum and telling people to get a builder to do it

iMax

mukki wrote: »

it might be an idea for parents to keep an eye on kids internet activity

if that is what the OP is trying to do, i'd suggest K9 instead

Actually, Microsoft have a new free package called family safety from their live site. Excellent software for keeping an eye in kids including a keylogger that emails specific users keystrokes to a nominated email address & individual permissions etc. really excellent.