Should I appeal?

FledNanders

I've just completed 3rd year arts and my degree hangs in the balance as I was given an NG on a sociology paper because I missed all the seminars, which are worth 10%.
I got a B in the essay and did fairly well on my exam I think.
This seems very unfair to me, is it normal to get an NG for this reason? SHould I appeal it?

Cannibal Ox

Which module was it?

FledNanders

health illness and society

Stepherunie

It does seem a tad unfair when the module outline doesn't even mention the fact the seminars are worth marks.

However many courses have min. attendance and if you don't make that they wont' pass you. Still, it'd be worth talking to the module coordinator.

FledNanders

but courses that have a minimum attendance clearly state it in the course outline. For this module there was no mention of it, just the fact that the seminars were worth 10%

Vorsprung

Try to get your hands on a copy of "Marks and Standards" for your course (should be on the net), and if the minimum attendence is definitely not mentioned in it, slap them on the face with it until you win your case.

We had a problem with how marks were awarded a few years ago, we did the above and when they saw they hadn't included it in it, they kicked up a bit of a hissy fit but we got our way in the end. Had one of the other profs on our side too!

Ernie Ball

bigjimthefirst wrote: »

Try to get your hands on a copy of "Marks and Standards" for your course (should be on the net), and if the minimum attendence is definitely not mentioned in it, slap them on the face with it until you win your case.

We had a problem with how marks were awarded a few years ago, we did the above and when they saw they hadn't included it in it, they kicked up a bit of a hissy fit but we got our way in the end. Had one of the other profs on our side too!

Or, you could stop trying to game the system and start trying to actually learn something (which necessarily includes attending class).

If students spent half as much time actually studying as they spend on the sort of legalistic hairsplitting suggested here, UCD might actually start to resemble a university.

Riamfada

dear Mr Ball

I can waste webspace too and +1 postcount !
G

FledNanders

Ernie Ball wrote: »

Or, you could stop trying to game the system and start trying to actually learn something (which necessarily includes attending class).

If students spent half as much time actually studying as they spend on the sort of legalistic hairsplitting suggested here, UCD might actually start to resemble a university.

Does the fact that I have done well in the essay and exam for the course not show that I DID learn what was required? It shouldnt matter if I attended the classes or not as long as I have learned the actual material

Ernie Ball

Grimes wrote: »

dear Mr Ball

I can waste webspace too and +1 postcount !
G

Better to waste webspace than to waste a place in university that could be taken up by someone interested in doing the work.

Ernie Ball

FledNanders wrote: »

Does the fact that I have done well in the essay and exam for the course not show that I DID learn what was required? It shouldnt matter if I attended the classes or not as long as I have learned the actual material

That speaks volumes about your utterly flawed educational philosophy. You think it's about absorbing information by rote and regurgitating it.

Information is the cheapest commodity there is, available everywhere. What a university education is about is knowledge and that can only be derived from participation in dialogue, in the centuries-long conversation that is the university. If all you've done is take in what you've been told and then repeat it back on an exam, you are no more participating in the dialogue by which all true learning takes place than a parrot would be. You've cheated nobody but yourself, which is why you deserved to fail.

dajaffa

I doubt the attendance affected the end grade too much. I did that module too and a couple of people I know weren't the best at the old attendance and did fine. Especially as it's an NG, like you'd know if that exam had gone really badly cause you'd have to not have a bog's at all about 6 different things so I'd say it could be an error that the end exam wasn't put into gradebook or something.

tywy

I think you should appeal... I did an elective in Economics last year and the guy giving the tutorial couldn't even factorise 'x^2 + 2x + 1' and he was giving a tutorial in quantitative economics, so I can understand why people don't attend these things. Probably better off putting in the work elsewhere in some cases.

(I'm an engineer so this is my only experience of Arts)

Best of luck with your appeal, let us know how you get on!

Raphael

Children, play nice or you'll be bed to bed without any supper.*

On a more relevant note, according to this document form the sociology webby, on page 4 is states:

Attendance at lectures and seminars is not optional. You are expected to attend all sessions and staff should be informed if you are absent due to illness etc.

so they might have their bases covered about failing people for not showing up to the seminars. And since you got a B+ on the essay, that should have been enough to push you to at least an F or an E, so it's probably not just that they left the exam out. Unless it's one of those awkward-ass modules where you need to pass the exam to pass the module.

*by put to bed without supper i mean banned. Just so's that's clear.

the evil lime

Raphael wrote: »

*by put to bed without summer i mean banned. Just so's that's clear.

I'll trade you autumn instead?

Stercus Accidit

I've appealed before and won.

Put forward a well composed case, and liaise with a student advisor before hand.

Get the appropriate student advisor to be on your side, and explain to you what point it is you need to emphasise, and take it from there.
They will know better than us whether you have a legitimate case.

I made a successful appeal like this before.

Edit: I'd imply if I were you, that you missed the seminars for some proper reason, a job to pay bills etc.
Whether this will be a lie or an exageration, you need to not look like a lazy bollox.

the evil lime

Or, ya know, there could have been a legit reason.

Stercus Accidit

If there is a legit reason, emphasise it as much as possible.

Now tbh I did have a legitimate reason myself, a death in the family at exam time, and I was at a funeral, wake etc. back home and missed some submission time.

my point is that ucd wont budge on policy, but they will take into account external circumstances, especially ones you cant control, including working to pay for college.

Cannibal Ox

FledNanders wrote:

health illness and society

Hmm...never went to a seminar either and I passed it. Check the mark you got for the exam, if you failed that it could be the reason you got the NG.