Why Ireland will qualify for the World Cup?

gosplan

Don't forget that second in the group isn't automatic qualifaction.

Worst second place gets booted out, then the other 8 play two legs against each other.

Based on the draw, that's Sweden, England, Turkey, Russia, Scotland etc

estebancambias

The thing is I won't have a problem if Ireland don't qualify. A poor national league with bad attendances refutes the notion that 'we deserve a succesful national side' as Eamo said when Stan was sacked. A small population and the GAA(a lad I know rejected Bolton to play for Dublin) and Hurling being other sports played widely really limits our chances.

But I don't want us being beaten 5-2 by Cyprus. I don't want us conceding last minute goals all the time.

I have a problem with people who say we have no chance. Of course we have a chance. A squad who play predominantly in the top tier of English football should be able to dominate against teams like Wales made up of league one no hopers. We should be on the same level as the Bulgars(are they still called that, I know this is what Bismarck called them) we should be able to beat cyprus, georgia and Montonegro.

joker77

Indeed.

My heart thinks that it's possible to us to qualify, my head just thinks we're 3 or 4 players short

shane86

PHB wrote: »

But the most important thing, first and foremost, is beating the **** teams.
Cyprus, Georgia and Monenegro.
There is no reason, none at all, why we should not be able to get 12 points there.
.

In fairness Georgia are far from sh1t and Montenegro is the toughest 6th seeder out there most likely.

People are also working off the assumption we will always have a fully fit squad. Stan made errors but he had to contend with alot of injuries. Given, Finnan, S Reid, their absences hurt us badly.

Anyone who thinks Ireland won't lose twice to Italy, is, imo, suffering from delusions and needs to have their gren tinted spectacled surgically removed.

Arguably the worst team at this years Euros. They only played decent for the first time last night.

_blank_

shane86 wrote: »

Arguably the worst team at this years Euros. They only played decent for the first time last night.

Worst team? They lost in the quarter finals on Penalties to arguable the BEST team in the competition.

A competition, might I add, that Ireland didn't even qualify for.

shane86

DesF wrote: »

Worst team? They lost in the quarter finals on Penalties to arguable the BEST team in the competition.

A competition, might I add, that Ireland didn't even qualify for.

They fumbled their way to the quarters due to being out crapped by France and getting two lucky goals against them. Italy would not have got out of any other group. Last nights match was the only one they deserved to get something from.


But anyways....

Also worth remembering we have two games in E Europe, and we havent won competitively for 20 years there. A fully fit squad and yes we have a great chance. However Given seems to become more injury prone with every passing year (although Kiely is certainly a better replacement than Kenny, Colgan and the rest). Not forgetting the absence of S Ireland and Finnan. At least four of our better younger players have just got demoted.

I hope to god we can do it, but my mind keeps telling me that there will be some injury nightmare that will cost us.

Frisbee

Wouldnt be overly worried about beating Italy myself.
It's Bulgaria who we really have to beat to have a chance of qualifying. If we take six form them Im sure we can cement second place as otherwise I predict Bulgaria and Italy progressing...

estebancambias

We don't need 6 from them.

Georgia vs ROI 0-1

Montenegro vs ROI 1-1

ROI vs Cyprus 2-0

ROI vs Georgia 2-1

ROI vs Bulgaria 1-1

Italy vs ROI 2-0

Bulgaria vs ROI 2-1

Cyprus vs ROI 0-1

ROI vs Italy 0-0

ROI vs Montonegro 1-0

That is 18 points. I don't know if this will be good enough, and most likely won't be. I think we need 20 points to ensure a playoff spot. This however includes a draw and a loss to Bulgaria. While the defeat is likely, I think we most certainly can beat them at home.

I don't think my predictions are too optimistic either.

_blank_

Mr Alan

^^^^^^^^
i would :cool:

_blank_

Scratch everything I've said in this thread.

Ireland are definitely going to the WC in 2010, and are going to win it.

Why?

Here's the answer.

Xavi6

DesF wrote: »

More like OptiMystic Meg

Het-Field

Unfortunatly Steve Staunton's tenure has set Irish football back two years. The 2006-2007 period was to be a time for rebuilding. He didnt properly nurture players who needed it. I still would not have faith in the likes of Darren Gibson, Andy Keogh, Shane Long, Anthony Stokes and Stephan Kelly. These lads should have been given far more time in the team He also allowed for the situation involving Stephan Ireland to develop. He returned to lads like Jonathan Douglas, Liam Miller, Stephan Carr, while ignoring the likes of Clinton Morrison who proved with Crystal Palace that he still has a role to play.

Trappatoni has too much work to do. However, I think if he does it correctly he could get us to the play offs. Sadly, he requires luck to be on his side. If players like Stephan Reid, Andy Reid, Aiden McGeady, Kevin Doyle, John o Shea, Richard Dunne, Steve Finnan, and Shay Given stay fit, Stephan Hunt, Damien Duff, Robbie Keane and Clinton Morrison rediscover the form they are capable of, and Stephan Ireland, Andy O Brien, and Steve Finnan recommit to the Irish team then to blend that with some of the great young talent we have, then the future is rather bright

CHD

Het-Field wrote: »

Unfortunatly Steve Staunton's tenure has set Irish football back two years. The 2006-2007 period was to be a time for rebuilding. He didnt properly nurture players who needed it. I still would not have faith in the likes of Darren Gibson, Andy Keogh, Shane Long, Anthony Stokes and Stephan Kelly. These lads should have been given far more time in the team He also allowed for the situation involving Stephan Ireland to develop. He returned to lads like Jonathan Douglas, Liam Miller, Stephan Carr, while ignoring the likes of Clinton Morrison who proved with Crystal Palace that he still has a role to play.

Trappatoni has too much work to do. However, I think if he does it correctly he could get us to the play offs. Sadly, he requires luck to be on his side. If players like Stephan Reid, Andy Reid, Aiden McGeady, Kevin Doyle, John o Shea, Richard Dunne, Steve Finnan, and Shay Given stay fit, Stephan Hunt, Damien Duff, Robbie Keane and Clinton Morrison rediscover the form they are capable of, and Stephan Ireland, Andy O Brien, and Steve Finnan recommit to the Irish team then to blend that with some of the great young talent we have, then the future is rather bright

I have faith in Stephen Kelly.Had a great season last year in the premiership and some good performances for Ireland.

Morrison was never going to get in ahead of two Premiership strikers who were scoring for there clubs.I think Andy Keogh will be ahead of him now anyway.Otherwise i think your spot on but i do think we should qualify for the World Cup.We are more than capable of it.

Xavi6

But so are Italy, Bulgaria and Montenegro. Plus we'll drop points at home and away to the minnows of the group.

There are four teams that can qualify from our group and I'd say we're third, if not fourth, in line out of them.

CHD

i think we are second.For once i think we will be hard to take points off and wont needlessly drop them

Xavi6

Based on what? The encouraging performances of Paul McShane and the like?

We are inferior to Bulgaria imo and Montenegro are one of those emerging nations that will be keen to impress.

Fighting Irish

I'm all for Ireland doing well, but all this talk about coachs and managers in balls, Ireland just haven't got a good enough team, its as simple as that

Xavi6

Agree with that. The squad isn't very different from the one that lost 5-2 to Cyprus. What makes anyone think that we can beat them this time round?

Mr.Nice Guy

Xavi6 wrote: »

Agree with that. The squad isn't very different from the one that lost 5-2 to Cyprus. What makes anyone think that we can beat them this time round?

We're no longer managed by 'da gaffur'.

Xavi6

Stan only picked the team. He didn't go out on the pitch and embarrass the nation. The 11 + subs did.

Seriously, we have away games against Italy, Bulgaria, Montenegro, Cyprus and Georgia. I can't see us winning a single one of them. Drawing maybe, but not winning.

CHD

Stan sent a team out with no idea what he wanted from them.Trap wont.Managers do make a difference.Look at Russia.

Montenegro are a practically unknown quantity but are probably good enough to be 2nd seeds and Bulgaria are no pushovers either, But i really think we will be well organized and good enough to beat those teams if we are at full strength or close to it.

Trap will make a difference, imo i think he's actually exactly what we need to make a world cup.

Dont be at yourself

Agree with that. The squad isn't very different from the one that lost 5-2 to Cyprus. What makes anyone think that we can beat them this time round?

In fairness, the squad of players should not be losing 5-2 to Cyprus - we're much better than that. The players undoubtedly contributed to a lacklustre campaign - but was this down to poor training, preparation, tactical analysis and a lack of motivation?

Trapatoni will address all of the above, and we should see much improved performances. The manager can have a huge impact - look at the difference between the same Aston Villa squad under O' Leary and O' Neill.

Call Me Jimmy

Can anyone name a game that we have dominated in a qualifier for the last 2 competitions? I mean one where we showed composure, patience and skill. I personally don't remember a match where Ireland have strung a couple of passes together since keano finished up.

I can't remember a match where I actually enjoyed watching it because we were playing well. I watch the matches all the time but it so cringe-worthy at times, everyone seems to run around like a headless chicken, lumping optimistic balls down the wings, up to doyle and keane etc.

Watching the euros (as I've said before) is a good indicator of how not great we are.

We could fluke it though

MIN2511

DesF wrote: »

Scratch everything I've said in this thread.
Ireland are definitely going to the WC in 2010, and are going to win it.
Why?
Here's the answer.

BARRY MAGUIRE (FC UTRECHT)

The product of an Irish father and a Dutch mother, Maguire signed this summer for FC Utrecht from FC Den Bosch. With the Den Bosch side Maguire played an impressive role in the sides 3rd place finish in the second rung of Dutch football, taking part in almost every game last season.

Maguire is a dynamic player who can play centrally or as a winger in the midfield area. He has known for his hard work and his quick ideas going forward. At Utrecht the 18 year old we hope to develop under the guidance of Willem van Hanegem.

With good supervision and such a large appetite for the game Maguire could quickly progress from his current post in the Dutch U19 team through to the full team squad. Arsenal have already shown interest in Maguire with Tottenham and Liverpool also keeping an eye on him.



tbh, i don't see what difference he would make in the team. And also i think we should stop complaining about the coaches. The players are not world class so we shouldn't expect world class performance!

Xavi6

*Insert facepalm here*

Sarcasm my friend, Des was using sarcasm.

MIN2511

Xavi6 wrote: »

*Insert facepalm here*

Sarcasm my friend, Des was using sarcasm.

Obviously!
:pac:

Call Me Jimmy

Another one bites the dust!

EDIT:

MIN25511 wrote:

Obviously!

Where ye goin wit yer obviously?! Get ourra that garden!

MIN2511

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

Another one bites the dust!

EDIT:

Where ye goin wit yer obviously?! Get ourra that garden!

:rolleyes:

gixerfixer

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

Can anyone name a game that we have dominated in a qualifier for the last 2 competitions? I mean one where we showed composure, patience and skill. I personally don't remember a match where Ireland have strung a couple of passes together since keano finished up.

I can't remember a match where I actually enjoyed watching it because we were playing well. I watch the matches all the time but it so cringe-worthy at times, everyone seems to run around like a headless chicken, lumping optimistic balls down the wings, up to doyle and keane etc.

Watching the euros (as I've said before) is a good indicator of how not great we are.

We could fluke it though

Well said.cant remember us once playing a match in the last 5 years and after it having a big smile on my face for the future of Irish football.The truth is we are horrible to watch and dont have the players to even beat Cyprus away IMO.The lack of talent available to even string 5 passes together is what worries me the most.When you watch a team with the passing ability of Russia,Holland,Croatia,Spain.Germany etc.... it makes you think it's a different sport all together...Football compared to our hoffball.Me thinks it will be a long long time before we see the likes of 88,90,94,2002 again.:(

gosplan

gixerfixer wrote: »

Well said.cant remember us once playing a match in the last 5 years and after it having a big smile on my face for the future of Irish football.The truth is we are horrible to watch and dont have the players to even beat Cyprus away IMO.The lack of talent available to even string 5 passes together is what worries me the most.When you watch a team with the passing ability of Russia,Holland,Croatia,Spain.Germany etc.... it makes you think it's a different sport all together...Football compared to our hoffball.Me thinks it will be a long long time before we see the likes of 88,90,94,2002 again.:(

I agree with much of this but I think you might be a bit too negative.

We never really passed the ball that much in 88, 90 or 94.

We're never gonna look as good as Holland, Croatia, Spain or Germany.

But Russia were nowhere recently until they got a good manager. That manager also needed time to settle in and get the team playing his way - evidenced by the fact that they nearly blew qualification with a poor result against Israel.

Take Arshavin out of Russia and you have a pretty ordinary team with a good manager. They got trounced by Spain, beat Greece and I'd say would have been 50/50 against Sweden to qualify without their superstar.

I'd take that - qualifying for major tournaments and being in with a shout of progressing in the last group game.

As regards the OP, I'd say we'll finish ahead of Bulgaria but progressing to the actual finals depends on whoever we draw in the playoff.

There is the outside chance of Italy having one of their very slow starting qualifying campaigns. In true style, they generally do just enough earn qualification in the last game or two- can't remember them really running away with a group. I wouldn't be surprised if they have a few poor results early on and gift the group to another team who can put in a string of good performances against the weaker teams. Not sure if we're capable of doing that but the group might be more open than people think.

_blank_

gixerfixer wrote: »

hoffball.

Johnny Utah

gosplan wrote: »

But Russia were nowhere recently until they got a good manager. That manager also needed time to settle in and get the team playing his way - evidenced by the fact that they nearly blew qualification with a poor result against Israel.

Take Arshavin out of Russia and you have a pretty ordinary team with a good manager. They got trounced by Spain, beat Greece and I'd say would have been 50/50 against Sweden to qualify without their superstar.

They were rebuilding since not qualifying for the last WC- something which we should have been doing. The Russian team is quite young- could be the youngest in Euro 08 I think. Plus, Russia have some very talented individual players- Zhirkov has impressed me, as well as Arshavin, Pavyulchenko.

Player-for-player Russia are better than us. How many Irish players would get into the current Russian team?

CHD

International Football doesnt work like club football.Ireland have a good team.Ireland will prove themselves this campaign.Ireland have a great chance of qualifying.

ArmaniJeanss

gosplan wrote: »

As regards the OP, I'd say we'll finish ahead of Bulgaria but progressing to the actual finals depends on whoever we draw in the playoff.

There are NO Playoffs. 7 group winners and 6 best group runners-up qualify.

As regards the case for Ireland qualifying, the Bulgarian and Cypriot versions of Boards could make a similar case for their countries to qualify. Its a very open group in which we could comfortably get 2nd (and be one of the best runners up) or we equally easily make our usual messup and find ourseleves needing snookers with 2 games to go.

estebancambias

Johnny Utah wrote: »

They were rebuilding since not qualifying for the last WC- something which we should have been doing. The Russian team is quite young- could be the youngest in Euro 08 I think. Plus, Russia have some very talented individual players- Zhirkov has impressed me, as well as Arshavin, Pavyulchenko.

Player-for-player Russia are better than us. How many Irish players would get into the current Russian team?

Given is better than Akinfeev.

Keane is better than Pavlyuchenko(I don't think he's a spring chicken either, he's old enough I think)

Dunne is probably as good/better as Kolodin or Ignasevich. The thing Russia do have his strength in depth, for example the Berezutskiy brothers havn't had a game I don't think, and I'm sure they start for CSKA Moscow.

Ireland have some talented individual players. McGeady, Duff, Ireland(if he came back) Owen Garvan, Andy Reid, Robbie Keane.

They probably do have a slightly better first team than us, but like a previous poster said they were no great shakes until Hiddink took over.

Anyone who says we can't qualify is talking nonsense. Of course we can qualify.

Matches Ireland have played well in: Israel away until the last 10 minutes. Once the 80 minute mark came for some reason the players stopped passing, and began to defend deeper.

I thought we were decent against Germany considering we didn't have our full team out(I know Germany didn't either)

Wales away with our second team. John Toshack told his players thats how an International team should play. We kept the ball really well.

Dun laoire

Sep 6 v Georgia (a) 3

Sep 10 v Montenegro (a) 3

Oct 15 v Cyprus (h) 3

Feb 11 v Georgia (h) 3

Mar 28 v v Bulgaria (h) 3

Apr 1 v Italy (a) 0

Jun 6 v Bulgaria (a) 1

Sep 5 v Cyprus (a) 1

Oct 10 v Italy (h) 1

Oct 14 v Montenegro (h) 3


21 points lads

estebancambias

The first two matches will tell all. If we win them both we will have a chance.

Xavi6

Dun laoire wrote: »

Sep 6 v Georgia (a) 3

Sep 10 v Montenegro (a) 3

Oct 15 v Cyprus (h) 3

Feb 11 v Georgia (h) 3

Mar 28 v v Bulgaria (h) 3

Apr 1 v Italy (a) 0

Jun 6 v Bulgaria (a) 1

Sep 5 v Cyprus (a) 1

Oct 10 v Italy (h) 1

Oct 14 v Montenegro (h) 3


21 points lads

ROFL are you gonna stick a bet on us to get maximum points in our first 5 games? I wouldn't even waste a fiver on that.

estebancambias

I might put a bet on that. Doubt the odds are that long though.

estebancambias

Xavi to be honest I think your rating of the Irish team may be accurate but you're overrating Bulgaria and definetly Montengro.

gosplan

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

There are NO Playoffs. 7 group winners and 6 best group runners-up qualify.

Oh no, we're in group 8. :eek::eek::eek:

Trust me, 9 European groups, 9 group winners, 8 best runners-up playoff for four places. 13 European teams go to the finals.

Xavi6

estebancambias wrote: »

I might put a bet on that. Doubt the odds are that long though.

100/1 at least. Anything less I'd be very surprised.

estebancambias wrote: »

Xavi to be honest I think your rating of the Irish team may be accurate but you're overrating Bulgaria and definetly Montengro.

I'm not overrating Bulgaria, they are higher seeds than us and are a better team.

As for Montonegro, like I already said, they are a new nation with something to prove to the rest of the footballing world. If we get three points from six against them we'll have done well. Plus I think Vucinic will cause us all sorts of problems.

Dun laoire

Xavi6 wrote: »

ROFL are you gonna stick a bet on us to get maximum points in our first 5 games? I wouldn't even waste a fiver on that.

Do you have a paypal account? Maybe we can have a little wager. I fancy our chances in the first 5 games to go and win all. You do realise the 3rd 4th and 5th games are at home. If we cant beat Montenegro and Georgia away in our first two we can forget about qualifying. Plain and simple

Xavi6

I do indeed have a paypal account.

There is no way Ireland will have a maximum 15 points from the first 5 games.

_blank_

Xavi6 wrote: »

I do indeed have a paypal account.

There is no way Ireland will have a maximum 15 points from the first 5 games.

Nine, ten max.

CHD

i will probably put my money where my mouth is on getting 12 or more points.any takers!?

Dun laoire

Xavi6 wrote: »

I do indeed have a paypal account.

There is no way Ireland will have a maximum 15 points from the first 5 games.

Right this is how i would see the betting on the first 5 games

Georgia away 1/1
Montenegro away 8/11
Cyprus home 4/5
Georgia home 8/13
Bulgaria home 1/1

So that accumulates to 19/1

Give me 20/1 on the first 5 wins and i'll stick a 5euro bet with you.:pac:

Xavi6

Ha ha feck off. I'll give you evens

And 1/1 to beat Bulgaria at home? Lol. United weren't even that low against Derby!

Dun laoire

Xavi6 wrote: »

Ha ha feck off. I'll give you evens

And 1/1 to beat Bulgaria at home? Lol. United weren't even that low against Derby!

You think we'll get better than 1/1 against bulgaria at home?? Not so sure. I suppose it depends on what kind of a start they get. After all we'll have 12 points from 12 when we come up against them. Confidence high and all that


Edit: Proof that money talks :-)