Is Israel preparing to attack Iran ?

irish_bob

marcsignal wrote: »

This was certainly true in the past, until very recently. The reason there are more Americans willing to listen to them now, is because of the blooper the Pro-Israel lobby made by calling "Jimmy Carter" an Anti-Semite.

Any time anyone criticized Israel in the US in the past, the Pro-Israel lobbiests' immediate reaction was to resort to 'name calling' and to label them an Anti-Semite, to the point that it almost became a reflex action.

They have been doing this with Professor Finkelstein for years, and they have suceeded in running him out of most of the universities he lectured in. His support grew on campus, and Finkelstein himself admits that it was easy to label him an Anti-Semite because he was relatively unknown.
The fact he is Jewish, and that both his parents endured, and survived the Holocaust first hand, didn't stop them from doing this, and they even accused him of being some kind of warped 'self hating Jew'.

In the case of Professor Finkelstein, his exposure of prominent figures in the ADL, WJC and AIPAC began, when he tried to put in his parents rightful claim for compensation from the Swiss and German Banks as Holocaust victims. This compensation process was engineered by the WJC and ADL, and both organisations raked in Billions in compensation monies from these banks. Finkelstiens parents were awarded $1240 each for their trouble, and he set about exposing where the rest of the money had gone. They have been orchestrating a witch hunt on him since, so it doesn't surprise me at all the Pro-Israel lobbiests label him a Left Wing Radical too.

When "Jimmy Carter" spoke out, they did the same thing, and then suddenly slapped their hand over their collective mouth and said to themselves: "Oh Sh*t! What have we done?" because they realised that you can't just label, possibly one of the most popular former presidents of the United States, an Anti-Semite, without very strong hard evidence to support it. It did not wash well with the average American, and raised a lot of eyebrows in political and academic circles worldwide.

However you are absolutely right, the majority of Americans do support Israel. Whether the average American, or indeed the average American Army/Navy/Air Force Officer, has the stomach to be dragged into another war, this time with Iran, on Israels' behalf, remains to be seen.

jimmy carter is not welll regarded in the usa , he is seen as having been a weak president
i do not agree with this and think hes a very decent man but he wasnt gung ho enough for americans

The Wicker Man

If a guy lived in my street and he was saving up to buy a gun, and he had also told people that I should be wiped off the map,well then I would be damn sure that MY gun was oiled, working and knew where HIS house was.

marcsignal

irish_bob wrote: »

jimmy carter is not welll regarded in the usa , he is seen as having been a weak president
i do not agree with this and think hes a very decent man but he wasnt gung ho enough for americans

I can only partially agree with you on this. At the time he left office Carter's presidency was certainly viewed by some as a failure, however his activities since leaving office, especially his many peacekeeping and humanitarian efforts, have led him to be widely hailed as one of the most successful ex-presidents in U.S. history. I'd also argue that that attempts to villify him have not suceeded, and his popularity as a statesman has actually risen since he has left office.

Riddle101

I think Isreal will find it hard to destroy Iran giving it's disadavantage. I mean Isreal is close to Syria and Iran, two anti-Isreali states. Let's not forget that Hamas and Hezbollah could use an opportunity of war to attack Isreal and help Iran, technically Isreal is in a danger zone and one attack on Iran could trigger a domineos effect which will lead to there downfall. However if America and Britain come in on their side they may stand a chance, but if Obama gets elected he might not help Isreal out.

I think quick decisive action should be taken and a huge UN summit should be held to deal with the problem before a huge war breaks out again

Agent Smith

The Wicker Man wrote: »

If a guy lived in my street and he was saving up to buy a gun, and he had also told people that I should be wiped off the map,well then I would be damn sure that MY gun was oiled, working and knew where HIS house was.

i just love this breakdown!

marcsignal

The Wicker Man wrote: »

If a guy lived in my street and he was saving up to buy a gun, and he had also told people that I should be wiped off the map,well then I would be damn sure that MY gun was oiled, working and knew where HIS house was.

Agent Smith wrote: »

i just love this breakdown!

I agree, it is a damn funny analagy

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

The Wicker Man wrote: »

If a guy lived in my street and he was saving up to buy a gun, and he had also told people that I should be wiped off the map,well then I would be damn sure that MY gun was oiled, working and knew where HIS house was.

you forgot to mention the fact that you have blockades on all the doors and windows of your neighbours house, completely rule his life within his own home and routinely bomb the **** out of it because he fired a few rocks at you.

The Wicker Man

Princess Innocent Knickers wrote: »

you forgot to mention the fact that you have blockades on all the doors and windows of your neighbours house, completely rule his life within his own home and routinely bomb the **** out of it because he fired a few rocks at you.

In my posting,the 'neighbour' is Iran,please read carefully before you jump on the old Palestine bandwagon.:)

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

it's a big street

The Wicker Man

Princess Innocent Knickers wrote: »

it's a big street

Thelma E

if Israel does do anything, it will be very quick, well orchestrated, and no one will see it coming. by the time Iran figures out whats going on, Israeli forces will either be gone, or dug in and being reinforced. they don't mess around, and though some people may call them aggressive, they are surrounded by people who hate them and do what must be done to survive. they do whats in their best interest, which might seem selfish, but i can't condemn them for it. the rest of the Arab world might try and help, but they will most likely squabble amongst themselves and muck things up like they have done in the past.

wes

Thelma E wrote: »

if Israel does do anything, it will be very quick, well orchestrated, and no one will see it coming. by the time Iran figures out whats going on, Israeli forces will either be gone, or dug in and being reinforced. they don't mess around, and though some people may call them aggressive, they are surrounded by people who hate them and do what must be done to survive. they do whats in their best interest, which might seem selfish, but i can't condemn them for it. the rest of the Arab world might try and help, but they will most likely squabble amongst themselves and muck things up like they have done in the past.

They have made peace deals with both Jordan and Egypt, and they are talking to Syria. So there hardly surrounded anymore. A lot of people repeat that to excuse Israel actions, but its simply untrue at this point.

Seems to me that making peace has been better for Israel, than its various acts of aggression. The shoot first attitude has not helped there situation and all it will get them is never ending war.

Cpt.Blackadder

Israel did bomb Iraqs Osirak reactor back in the early 1980,s and stopped Saddam Hussein ever gaining nuclear strike capabilites. They also launched an air strike on a suspicious instillation inside Syria a few months ago.

My gut feeling is if Iran is on the verge of gaining a nuke Israel will take any measures to stop them. Most Arab nations aren't keen on Iran gaining a nuclear arsenal anyway, as Irans Islamic theocracy is viewed by most Arab governments as a threat to their own stability.

gixerfixer

Cpt.Blackadder wrote: »

Israel did bomb Iraqs Osirak reactor back in the early 1980,s and stopped Saddam Hussein ever gaining nuclear strike capabilites. They also launched an air strike on a suspicious instillation inside Syria a few months ago.

My gut feeling is if Iran is on the verge of gaining a nuke Israel will take any measures to stop them. Most Arab nations aren't keen on Iran gaining a nuclear arsenal anyway, as Irans Islamic theocracy is viewed by most Arab governments as a threat to their own stability.

True but Iraq's defences against the attack from Isreal at that time where pathetic,this is a totally different kettle of fish.Iran has spent Billions on defence of it's nuclear programme including some of the most advanced surface to air missiles ever built.Also one of the reasons Israel have not attacked yet is plentyful rumours about the possible use of dirty bombs in some of their long range missiles including the shahab-3 which could reach Israel with ease.My gut feeling is this will come to a head sometime soon (next 3-4 months) and will not be pretty for either side.:(

ejmaztec

Here we go.



http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article4301278.ece

First three paragraphs:


Iran test-fired a missile capable of reaching Israel early this morning, as part of war games that escalate the sabre-rattling between the Islamic Republic and the West.

The new version of the Shahab-3 missile was one of nine medium and long-range missiles launched from the desert during wider war gaming in the Strait of Hormuz, a vital waterway off the south of the country through which passes about 40 per cent of the world's oil.

The aim of the test was to "to demonstrate our resolve and might against enemies who in recent weeks have threatened Iran with harsh language," said the air force commander of Iran's elite Revolutionary Guard, General Hoseyn Salami.

LordSutch

ejmaztec wrote: »

Here we go.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article4301278.ece

First three paragraphs:

Iran test-fired a missile capable of reaching Israel early this morning, as part of war games that escalate the sabre-rattling between the Islamic Republic and the West.

The new version of the Shahab-3 missile was one of nine medium and long-range missiles launched from the desert during wider war gaming in the Strait of Hormuz, a vital waterway off the south of the country through which passes about 40 per cent of the world's oil.

The aim of the test was to "to demonstrate our resolve and might against enemies who in recent weeks have threatened Iran with harsh language," said the air force commander of Iran's elite Revolutionary Guard, General Hoseyn Salami.

Methinks General Hoseyn & his Salami should reconsider their "Nuclear War Games" before they go too far!

dlofnep

ArthurF wrote: »

Methinks General Hoseyn & his Salami should reconsider their "Nuclear War Games" before they go too far!

Me thinks ArthurF should stop quoting words like "Nuclear" when Iran has no nuclear weapons, and did not demonstrate nuclear offensive capabilities.

Iran should test as much as they can. Israel is the one who threatened Iran with an attack and has been practicing military tactics for weeks. It makes sense that Iran would do whatever is needed to warn of an attack.

In summary.

Israel has 150 nuclear weapons and is threatening Iran, and has been for some time now.

Iran has no nuclear weapons and has not at any point threatened Israel. Iranian officials have stated time and time again that they have no plans of attacking Israel, yet Israel have publically stated that they will attack Iran.

Hardly rocket science. How on Earth the world can sit back and let terrorist states like Israel (who hide their nuclear weapons from the world sanctioning bodies and try to push their weight around) threaten counties like Iran, but then criticise Iran for demonstrating the will to defend itself?

Riddle101

dlofnep wrote: »

Me thinks ArthurF should stop quoting words like "Nuclear" when Iran has no nuclear weapons, and did not demonstrate nuclear offensive capabilities.

Iran should test as much as they can. Israel is the one who threatened Iran with an attack and has been practicing military tactics for weeks. It makes sense that Iran would do whatever is needed to warn of an attack.

In summary.

Israel has 150 nuclear weapons and is threatening Iran, and has been for some time now.

Iran has no nuclear weapons and has not at any point threatened Israel. Iranian officials have stated time and time again that they have no plans of attacking Israel, yet Israel have publically stated that they will attack Iran.

Hardly rocket science. How on Earth the world can sit back and let terrorist states like Israel (who hide their nuclear weapons from the world sanctioning bodies and try to push their weight around) threaten counties like Iran, but then criticise Iran for demonstrating the will to defend itself?

It's because of the United States that no one wants to do anything. Everyone knows that the US backs Isreal and even more so has be getting on Iran's back for the last year or so. I'm pretty sure the US would diapprove of another country getting involved in the mix and since no one in their right mind is going to go up against the United States, Isreal and Iran are left to their squabble. The US are the only ones that can do anything to stop it but they won't get off their bumbs, hopefully the next president will have a better sense of mind then George Bush and try to do something, otherwise i think the whole world could be in trouble no just Iran and Isreal

dlofnep

Doubt it. Obama has already stated that he considers Iran a threat. He's just George Bush in black skin. He yelps on about change, but sure - that's all fine and well to say when he's trying to become president. Does anyone really expect the US's role in the world to change?

Mr.Micro

Does anyone really expect the US's role in the world to change?

We can always hope, the US needs to earn back its respect and maybe Obama, if elected will start to do that.

ejmaztec

The Israelis will be dusting off the Patriot anti-missile defence system lent/sold to them the last time a few missiles headed in their direction. No doubt Manic Moran will let us know later how effective the system is these days.:)

humberklog

ejmaztec wrote: »

The Israelis will be dusting off the Patriot anti-missile defence system lent/sold to them the last time a few missiles headed in their direction. No doubt Manic Moran will let us know later how effective the system is these days.:)

1st batch of patriots ok. The rest not so hot. Well and truely slam dunked into the bin of military defense history. (1st gulf war was 17 year ago(the last time missiles headed that way it was large-ish yet scary enough crackerbarrells from the leb last year)).

nacho libre

dlofnep wrote: »

Doubt it. Obama has already stated that he considers Iran a threat. He's just George Bush in black skin. He yelps on about change, but sure - that's all fine and well to say when he's trying to become president. Does anyone really expect the US's role in the world to change?

Perhaps knowing that McCain and the republicans will attack him on his perceived weakness on foreign policy issues, by mentioning McCain's years as a pow and because of this experience he therefore has the ability to make the tough decisions on matters of national security and foreign policy, Obama feels he has to talk tough in order to keep his election hopes alive


meanwhile on Iran,
According to a recent article by Seymour Hersh America is engaging in and supporting terrorism inside Iran currently.
So, it's okay for America to meddle inside Iran but Iran doing so in Iraq is unacceptable.

dlofnep

The same McCain who joked about killing Iranians. God bless the world if he ever sits in the white house.

heyjude

An important consideration in considering whether Israel is planning to attack Iran, is Iran's response to any attack.

Now while Israel may have Patriot missiles that may offer some protection to their cities, the Iranians have said that if attacked they will using missile attacks on tankers, effectively closing the Straits of Hormuz, thereby significantly reducing oil shipments out of the Middle East.

Defending the Straits of Hormuz could be very difficult as missiles could be fired from a long distance away and oil tankers are big, slow moving targets. Once one or two tankers were damaged, other tankers wouldn't be insured to travel through the Straits.

With oil prices hovering around an all time high and with the US and many other major economies on the brink of a recession, how would the average American react to Israeli action that pushes oil prices to $200 a barrel, even if only for a short time ?

An Israeli preemptive strike could be portrayed as having triggered this oil price rise and make it hard for some US politicians to support the action enthusiastically, especially in an election year and with the winter approaching.

dlofnep

The US would support Israel in their attack 100%.

purple'n'gold

dlofnep wrote: »

The same McCain who joked about killing Iranians. God bless the world if he ever sits in the white house.

It’s tweedle dum and tweedle dee. McCain or Obama doesn’t matter, as far as Israel / Iran is concerned both will carry on where Bush left off. People are going all starry eyed about Obama, the only difference between him and the rest is his skin is slightly darker, no difference at all really.

dlofnep

Totally agree.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

Bob barr 08!

rosboy

dlofnep wrote: »

Iran has no nuclear weapons and has not at any point threatened Israel. Iranian officials have stated time and time again that they have no plans of attacking Israel, yet Israel have publically stated that they will attack Iran.

Hasn't Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said on numerous occasions that he would like to "wipe Israel off the map"

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/10/26/ahmadinejad/index.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4384264.stm

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull&cid=1164881801325

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1209627040670&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/03/AR2006080300629.html

Don't get me wrong guys....I'm not a war monger. I don't condone Israels behaviour in certain matters. Neither do I support Iran.

But black and white statements like "has not at any point threatened Israel" annoy me when they are obviously wrong.