Purposely defacing your C/C for extra security

ruprect

In the thread on getting US dollars people mentioned putting money in your CC a/c to avoid extra fees (which I already do). Then a warning came about it being stolen and the CC company not covering it.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56376504&postcount=6

But they could only really buy online with the card, or go to an old style type in the number and sign for it shop.

In which case is there any reason I could not simply deface my CC. e.g. get sandpaper and sand off the indented numbers on it, I would know my number myself. I have a dual account, visa & mastercard with only one gov charge per year. So I would take my filed down card on risky trips, and use the other one if I really did need a proper one.

These days most are pin & chip, so it should still be fine for that. And if stolen the person will not know my pin so it would be useless.

Even if I did go to a shop without pin & chip I might be able to just list off the numbers to them. I have paid for items on the phone simply listing out my number with no signature needed so I guess they could do this in a shop too.

Any downsides to this? If you cannot remember all the digits you could just file down 4 of them, equivalent to a pin.

inforfun

I honestly doubt a shop would accept a card that had a sandpaper treatment...

JohnC.

And apart from shops probably not accepting it, you can'tget rid of it that easily. Even if you get rid of the raised numbers on the front, it is still indented on the rear.

Sam Vimes

if you filed the indents down, you'd be left with holes in the shape of the numbers. You'd have to fill them in or something. More difficult than it seems tbh

mumhaabu

Also there is no chip and pin in america it is all signing mostly a digital signature, where you sign your name on a tablet screen. Some places still make you sign on paper, it is the bigger chains etc. that use tablet screens. My recommendation is don't sandpaper the credit card as it could wipe the magnetic strip, (the important part state side not the chip).

Carry a Money belt and a use Hotel safety deposity boxes, relax America is hardly a crime haven, there is certain areas to avoid, also make sure you get decent travel insurance.

Guy:Incognito

Would they not be better off sending you the 3 digit security number be post rather than printing it on the card? That way, even if someone has your card they cant use it online.

jor el

I think the idea behind the CVV code is to prove that you actually have the card, and not just the number, which would be on statements or maybe a receipt. Posting it separately would probably just end in people loosing it.

ruprect

inforfun wrote: »

I honestly doubt a shop would accept a card that had a sandpaper treatment...

I cannot remember the last time a store looked at my card, they hand you the device and I stick in and remove the card myself these days. The numbers are pretty much obosolete with the new system, if the chip works and the pin is right and the message comes up saying BOI verified it then I expect the shop will not care, even if they do see it.

Sam Vimes wrote: »

if you filed the indents down, you'd be left with holes in the shape of the numbers. You'd have to fill them in or something. More difficult than it seems tbh

Kahless wrote: »

And apart from shops probably not accepting it, you can'tget rid of it that easily. Even if you get rid of the raised numbers on the front, it is still indented on the rear.

The indents are less than the depth of the card, but you are right about the rear ones, never thought of that. All I need to get rid of is around 4 of them, so it is equivalent to guessing a PIN, I could melt them with a soldering iron. I have some old broken ones to practice on.

mumhaabu wrote: »

Also there is no chip and pin in america it is all signing mostly a digital signature, where you sign your name on a tablet screen. Some places still make you sign on paper, it is the bigger chains etc. that use tablet screens.

So do they still need numbers? or is it all on the strip?
My problem is I have a dual account, if I had 2 then I could just top up the defaced one with money for cash withdrawl, And leave the empty C/C for shop purchases

mumhaabu wrote: »

My recommendation is don't sandpaper the credit card as it could wipe the magnetic strip,

They are actually quite hard to damage, I know exactly how to do it, I have all sorts of equipment at hand. I also have an ATM card which is over 14years old and still working fine, and it has been through the wars over the years

mumhaabu wrote: »

Carry a Money belt and a use Hotel safety deposity boxes, relax America is hardly a crime haven, there is certain areas to avoid, also make sure you get decent travel insurance.

.
It is not just america, that was only referencing the thread. It is just in general a simple "why not do it?".

Stekelly wrote: »

Would they not be better off sending you the 3 digit security number be post rather than printing it on the card? That way, even if someone has your card they cant use it online.

Mine are gone anyway, wiped off through wear. Some online stores do not need them. My fathers card was charged by Mcafee with the incorrect expiration date too.

Del2005

Since most people who are stealing CC's will also have access to a card reader, or know someone who has one, there is no point in filling off the numbers they are all on the magnetic tape.

ruprect

Del2005 wrote: »

Since most people who are stealing CC's will also have access to a card reader, or know someone who has one, there is no point in filling off the numbers they are all on the magnetic tape.

At least it would delay them going straight into a shop and using it. Maybe enough time for you to have it cancelled. The CVV2 code is not contained on the magnetic strip, so I guess there is no reason not to rub that one off, as I said mine is gone already. Should stop the majority of attempts of online orders.

mumhaabu

ruprect wrote: »

So do they still need numbers? or is it all on the strip?
My problem is I have a dual account, if I had 2 then I could just top up the defaced one with money for cash withdrawl, And leave the empty C/C for shop purchases

The data is stored on both the Magnetic strip and chip, The chip is used in both UK & Ireland and parts of Europe, the magnetic strip is used in the US and elsewhere. They don't need to see the numbers unless, say for instance their machine was broke, or some hotels sometimes write them down as a pre-auth (dodgy IMO). The only time they need to see your number would be if they were using a very old system wherby they make a carbon copy imprint of the Credit Card, and I haven't seen these in donkeys years.

ruprect wrote: »

They are actually quite hard to damage, I know exactly how to do it, I have all sorts of equipment at hand. I also have an ATM card which is over 14years old and still working fine, and it has been through the wars over the years

I have wiped several magnetic strip cards including a Credit Card, whenever I wear linen clothes or whenever I am in the desert, I am sparking like crazy (static electricity). I wiped out three hotel pass cards in Egypt with sparks from my hands and did a similar thing to my Credit Card, in New Mexico a few years back, they were able to use the numbers off it then to charge with the "customer not present" feature.

Del2005

ruprect wrote: »

At least it would delay them going straight into a shop and using it. Maybe enough time for you to have it cancelled. The CVV2 code is not contained on the magnetic strip, so I guess there is no reason not to rub that one off, as I said mine is gone already. Should stop the majority of attempts of online orders.

But if they'll let you use it in a shop with all the numbers scrapped off then they'll let the sumbag you stole it.

jahalpin

There are a few problems with the OP's suggestion;

1. The card actually belongs to the bank that issued it
2. Most shops wouldn't accept a defaced card
3. A defaced card might damage the shops equipment

craichoe

Well for one you'd be screwed when the merchant rings Visa.

http://www.merchantaccountblog.com/archives/174

Fake cards are the reason, magentic strips are easily copied and alot of countries in europe do not use pin.

Blisterman

In my old card,the CCV number got wiped off over time, to the point where you couldn't read it anymore.
Of course, I remembered it myself, so it was a pretty good anti theft measure.
You could try filing that off or something. A lot more inconspicious than the main numbers.

axer

OP: have you checked with your credit card company to see if you are covered in the event of theft. I know I am as long as I report the card stolen within 24 hours of it going missing.

ruprect

Del2005 wrote: »

But if they'll let you use it in a shop with all the numbers scrapped off then they'll let the sumbag you stole it.

The scumbag will not know my pin. In the likes of tesco, they never look at my card, I put it in and take it out myself.

jahalpin wrote: »

There are a few problems with the OP's suggestion;

1. The card actually belongs to the bank that issued it
2. Most shops wouldn't accept a defaced card
3. A defaced card might damage the shops equipment

1. I do not see the problem there, unless you mean some legal thing about not defacing cards. Mine already is defaced, so is Blistermans.
2. That is part of the point of doing it.
3. Probably not if done correctly. I have card with a tiny crack that is probably more likely to cause damage.

craichoe wrote: »

Well for one you'd be screwed when the merchant rings Visa. .

How I am screwed? Do you mean prosecuted, or just not served like the thief wouldn't be.

axer wrote: »

OP: have you checked with your credit card company to see if you are covered in the event of theft. I know I am as long as I report the card stolen within 24 hours of it going missing.

Will do. It was more the point of them not covering a balance of money I put in the card. I would try not use the card in a shop, it would only be in pin/chip places, I would just use hole in the wall machines to get cash out on holidays.

Like I said I have a dual account, so can keep one good card at home and one defaced.

craichoe

How I am screwed? Do you mean prosecuted, or just not served like the thief wouldn't be.

Becuase as soon as they explain to Visa Authorisation Center that all the numbers have been filed off they'll de-activate the card.

I still dont get the point of filing off numbers and crap when you can just get the number off the strip with a card reader anyway.

Creating a cloned card with just the Strip is easy, duplicating all of the visible security features on the card is not.

Besides, if you use a Visa card in most places in the US / Europe they look for Photographic ID anyway.