Provisional license holders...

corktina

anyone want to hazard a guess whether or not there will be a big crackdown by the Gards?

I read on the 'net today there are reckoned to be 20,000 drivers on their 6 th or subsequent prov license

My guess as to what will happen?...many people will take down their L plates and drive on...and many many people already have long since done that....and next to nothing will be done.I think it needs the Insurance Industry to come off the fence and state unequivalically that any Provisional holder driving unaccompanied is not insured....

AugustusMaximus

Gardai will prob do nothing. As I understand it, you'll get a massive fine if caught.

Of course, what the Gardai need to do is to setup check points over the next month or so to check driving licences to ensure compliance with people displaying L plates.

Give em a month of that and people will start to comply.

murphaph

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

Gardai will prob do nothing. As I understand it, you'll get a massive fine if caught.

Of course, what the Gardai need to do is to setup check points over the next month or so to check driving licences to ensure compliance with people displaying L plates.

Give em a month of that and people will start to comply.

Wrong. Remember how everyne was extra observant of the speed limit for all of 5 minutes after penalty points were introduced and almost immediately returned to their previous style of driving when they realised the Gardai were still not all that bothered enforcing the road traffic act.

AugustusMaximus

Oh yeah. If the Gardai do their job there will be compliance.

But as I suspect, the Gardai won't do anything, then people won't care.

jhegarty

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

As I understand it, you'll get a massive fine if caught.
.

Thats the maximum fine , judges don't go anywhere near the maximum on anything else , so I don't see why they would on this...

Alanstrainor

jhegarty wrote: »

Thats the maximum fine , judges don't go anywhere near the maximum on anything else , so I don't see why they would on this...

There is a minimum fine of €1000 for being caught unaccompanied on a Learner Permit, and i would have to disagree with people here saying this wont be enforced. I've already heard stories of people being caught and fined.

jhegarty

Alanstrainor wrote: »

a minimum fine of €1000.

Woopse , so it is...

corktina

jhegarty wrote: »

Thats the maximum fine , judges don't go anywhere near the maximum on anything else , so I don't see why they would on this...

haha...you didnt hear of Judge Patwell then....last week fined a guy €6000 + for two counts of dumping rubbish.....i bet he woukld have a field day with license infringements....IF the Gardai do their job....:rolleyes:

L1011

Last check I went through (few days ago) the Garda saw the outside of my licence was pink and let me go, if thats the level of crackdown they're going to do I'd advise everyone to go get some paper dye

Didn't even ask to see if it was my licence (I hadn't taken it out of the plastic cover).

Chris_533976

Galway police have already said they're going to go to no special effort to enforce it.

I guarantee more effort will be put into enforcing the new law that forbids dogs on Galway beaches....

HonalD

Do I suspect a degree of smugness on this thread? Those who are without sin cast the first stone? :rolleyes:

corktina

smugness? no, in my case I desire to be surrounded by drivers who have demonstrated their ability to drive or who are under the supervision of such a person....its too serious a business to treat in such a cavalier manner as has become the norm....

Wishbone Ash

corktina wrote: »

My guess as to what will happen?...many people will take down their L plates and drive on

I'm not so sure that will happen. It would automatically double the minimum fine of €1,000 and, in my experience, 'L' plates are suddenly appearing everywhere. Many people that I had always assumed had a Driving Licence are actually on Provisionals.

I've also noticed a lot of 'L' platers driving sheepishly along the left lane of motorways and it's been a while since I was passed by one.

AugustusMaximus

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I'm not so sure that will happen. It would automatically double the minimum fine of €1,000 and, in my experience, 'L' plates are suddenly appearing everywhere. Many people that I had always assumed had a Driving Licence are actually on Provisionals.

I've also noticed a lot of 'L' platers driving sheepishly along the left lane of motorways and it's been a while since I was passed by one.

The last two weeks I've noticed a monumental increase in the number of L plates for some reason.

Yakult

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

The last two weeks I've noticed a monumental increase in the number of L plates for some reason.

Likewise. Out of nowhere I was seen alot more L plates.


Also a boycott should be put in place. Ever L car stop Go on the m-fiddy and stop. They cant arrest us all


Im joking before someone bitches. But you know, I wouldnt be surprised if something similar did happen. Would be pretty interesting.

Wishbone Ash

....of course it has to be remembered that a vehicle displaying an 'L' plate doesn't necessarily mean that the driver is on a Provisional Licence/Learner Permit.

It's perfectly legal here for a person with a Driving Licence to drive a vehicle with 'L' plates displayed (unlike in the UK).

Yakult

Guards were stopping today for tax etc. but asking most drivers for licences, so I suspect it will be the same case from tuesday on just more strict?

greatgoal

listen,its here and it will be enforced to the full,more easy targets for our heroes the gardai,i see youre on a provisional,1000euro please,but ive got 2 kilos of coke in the boot...well you should have done your test then shouldnt you

Sqaull20

R_H_C_P wrote: »

Guards were stopping today for tax etc. but asking most drivers for licences, so I suspect it will be the same case from tuesday on just more strict?

You would think in this day age they wouldnt even need to pull you over, camera hidden from sight scans your number plate, quickly goes through car registration database, driver is a provisional in car by self.Bang

Plenty of money in it.

Our man in Havana

How would a camera prove that the driver is a L driver on the basis of a number plate? It could be someone on a full licence.

Wishbone Ash

Sqaull20 wrote: »

camera hidden from sight scans your number plate, quickly goes through car registration database

That would only provide the registered owner of the vehicle!

And why should the camera be hidden? Wouldn't it be much more effective if the camera wasn't hidden?

Back to the drawing board!

AlekSmart

Deary me does nobody realize that we joined the EEC in the early 1970`s ?

We sat and watched as Paddy Hillery signed with a flourish and in an instant transformed us from being able to rely on the "Ignorant Irish" excuse to having to accept that far out concept of Responsibility !!

I`ll bet many would happily wring Paddys neck right now

It`s taken a while,far longer than many thought,but finally the penny(cent) has dropped...we have nowhere left to hide....:eek:

Don`t get too worried about the actions of An Garda Siochana in the short term,they will revert to the status quo and merely "Observe"
Senior Garda management have a far more pressing problem with the numbers of their members driving under "Super`s Authorization", a somewhat unique Irish answer to an Irish problem.

Up until very recently this little piece of Administrative Largesse was fully availed of by Senior Garda Management,however this may well soon be quite rapidly short circuited by a new found belief within certain EU administrative circles that it`s rules need to be FULLY appreciated by ALL member states,even those who are a wee bit uncertain....:)

Capt'n Midnight

there was an article in the sindo that suggested the status quo would continue as no word came from above to enforce it

then again the sindo is not a paper of record

AugustusMaximus

Passed an extremely nervous young learner driver hogging the fast lane on the Cork South Ring Road this morning. No accompanying driver at all.

Cathmandooo

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

Passed an extremely nervous young learner driver hogging the fast lane on the Cork South Ring Road this morning. No accompanying driver at all.

Could have been on his/her 2nd provisional, aint illegal until tomorrow.

BrianD

Either way, judging by their standard of driving they shouldn't be on the road!

penexpers

corktina wrote: »

smugness? no, in my case I desire to be surrounded by drivers who have demonstrated their ability to drive or who are under the supervision of such a person....its too serious a business to treat in such a cavalier manner as has become the norm....

Having a license is in no way an indication that you are a good driver. All it demonstrates is you can do a preset series of maneuvers over a preset course.

mickos

penexpers wrote: »

Having a license is in no way an indication that you are a good driver. All it demonstrates is you can do a preset series of maneuvers over a preset course.

Surely it at least demonstrates that you have the ability to drive correctly.
As for from 2moro on. I'd say if you can prove tat you have applied for a test you should be fine.
provo's who haven't at least put in that much effort deserve to be put off the road.

Our man in Havana

I'd say if you can prove tat you have applied for a test you should be fine.

I don't think a letter from the Pope will save you after midnight.

ga2re2t

MYOB wrote: »

Last check I went through (few days ago) the Garda saw the outside of my licence was pink and let me go, if thats the level of crackdown they're going to do I'd advise everyone to go get some paper dye
.

But haven't green provisional licences almost disappeared? Aren't they almost all replaced by learner permits at this stage?

I haven't actually seen a learner permit yet. I've done a quick Internet search but to no avail. Has anyone got one that they can scan in (erasing personal details of course!)?

I agree with the comment made earlier that the new law will only really work if insurance companies cannot insure learner permit holders driving alone.

Moonbeam

They look the exact same except say learner permit on them.

Everyone on their 2nd prov licence had the opportunity to apply for a test and do it before the law changes tonight so it is hard to have sympathy for them.

As for full licence holders it just means you can drive the way they want you to for 40 minutes,which means everything:)

maclad

ga2re2t wrote: »

But haven't green provisional licences almost disappeared? Aren't they almost all replaced by learner permits at this stage?

I haven't actually seen a learner permit yet. I've done a quick Internet search but to no avail. Has anyone got one that they can scan in (erasing personal details of course!)?

I agree with the comment made earlier that the new law will only really work if insurance companies cannot insure learner permit holders driving alone.

I have a learner permit. Looks exactly the same as the provisional, its even still green ,all that looks different is that it says learner permit rather than provisional license.

stewiegriffin08

Yea. I have a lerner permit... I might scan it in later. It is the Very same, instead of saying Provisional license Its says learner permit... Virtually no difference at all.. :rolleyes:

maclad

Moonbeam wrote: »

They look the exact same except say learner permit on them.

Everyone on their 2nd prov licence had the opportunity to apply for a test and do it before the law changes tonight so it is hard to have sympathy for them.

As for full licence holders it just means you can drive the way they want you to for 40 minutes,which means everything:)

Good point anyone can behave themselves for 40 minutes:rolleyes:
But i know several people with full licenses who should never be let on the road. My father for example never uses his indicators i mean never,not on roundabouts, not when taking a turn in heavy traffic. The other day i saw a van roll over when they tried to avoid an old woman driving on the wrong side of the road and i mean this was a national primary road not a country boreen and young people are the problem?
What about all the people in the 80's who got a license without a test???? surely they should be recalled or something:rolleyes:

Oh and that old woman never stopped at the accident the gardai picked her up a few miles up the road.....still driving on the wrong side!!!

L1011

maclad wrote: »

What about all the people in the 80's who got a license without a test???? surely they should be recalled or something:rolleyes:

Preferably everyone who got a license without a test should be made do that test - would even encompass Uncle Gaybo at the RSA I believe. But I doubt its going to happen...

Our man in Havana

MYOB wrote: »

Preferably everyone who got a license without a test should be made do that test - would even encompass Uncle Gaybo at the RSA I believe. But I doubt its going to happen...

They would be civil war if that ever came to pass.

ian_m

Does anyone think there will be less traffic on the roads in the morning as a result of the provisional ban? ie will I get where I want to go, quicker!

Our man in Havana

ian_m wrote: »

Does anyone think there will be less traffic on the roads in the morning as a result of the provisional ban? ie will I get where I want to go, quicker!

Here's hoping.

Fighting Irish

Sqaull20 wrote: »

You would think in this day age they wouldnt even need to pull you over, camera hidden from sight scans your number plate, quickly goes through car registration database, driver is a provisional in car by self.Bang

Plenty of money in it.

what if a few people drive the same car, what if the camera doesn't catch the full license driver sitting in the car with the provisional driver?

Fighting Irish

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

Passed an extremely nervous young learner driver hogging the fast lane on the Cork South Ring Road this morning. No accompanying driver at all.

glad you had time to chat with him and find out he was nervous or did he just shout it out the window? :eek:

Fighting Irish

penexpers wrote: »

Having a license is in no way an indication that you are a good driver. All it demonstrates is you can do a preset series of maneuvers over a preset course.

werd

my ma failed her first test then passed the 2nd one, that doesn't mean she improved. once you know the basics its just down to not ****ing something up on the day

Chris_533976

I'd be surprised if anyone wasnt slightly nervous on that road.

For a learner, its a terrible experience. Tho he shouldnt have been there on his own.

Fighting Irish

mickos wrote: »

Surely it at least demonstrates that you have the ability to drive correctly.
As for from 2moro on. I'd say if you can prove tat you have applied for a test you should be fine.
provo's who haven't at least put in that much effort deserve to be put off the road.

:rolleyes:

its ok this guy can drive, he has applied for his license

Fighting Irish

Moonbeam wrote: »

They look the exact same except say learner permit on them.

Everyone on their 2nd prov licence had the opportunity to apply for a test and do it before the law changes tonight so it is hard to have sympathy for them.

As for full licence holders it just means you can drive the way they want you to for 40 minutes,which means everything:)

Yes but many didn't have the opportunity to sit it, my girlfriend was put down fir the 13th or 14th of july

murphaph

Fighting Irish wrote: »

werd

my ma failed her first test then passed the 2nd one, that doesn't mean she improved. once you know the basics its just down to not ****ing something up on the day

She obviously improved. The test is very basic.....which makes one worry that so many people manage to fail it.

Nuttzz

I know a chap who failed his test with 12 grade 2 and resat it 4 weeks later and got no faults. i think it all depends on how you cope with nerves, the tester and the traffic conditions, the test is far to subjective to say its easy imo

stewiegriffin08

ga2re2t wrote: »

I haven't actually seen a learner permit yet. I've done a quick Internet search but to no avail. Has anyone got one that they can scan in (erasing personal details of course!)?

Here, These are viewed under UV Light, Main differences... The only thing is the Learner Permit, That used to say provisional license... The Ultra violet marks are changed however, Its pretty different, There is alot more lines and physical marks, also at the four Courner there is a LP, (I assume thats what i think it means ) and also the text has a nice new plesant luxious font :rolleyes:

Sorry about the Link... Firefox was playing up on me

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10759738@N06/

Wishbone Ash

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

Passed an extremely nervous young learner driver hogging the fast lane on the Cork South Ring Road this morning. No accompanying driver at all.

If he was on the "fast lane",( i.e. the overtaking lane), and you passed him Augustus, then it would appear that you executed an illegal manoeuvre! :eek:


...and he may have been on a 2nd Provisional /Learner Permit and wouldn't be legally required to be accompanied.

AugustusMaximus

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

If he was on the "fast lane",( i.e. the overtaking lane), and you passed him Augustus, then it would appear that you executed an illegal manoeuvre! :eek:


...and he may have been on a 2nd Provisional /Learner Permit and wouldn't be legally required to be accompanied.

No ****, I flashed him several times to move over. When he didn't, I went.

Illegal to be driving in the "overtaking lane" too. The line of traffic behind thought similar as did those ahead of me who undertook him. Do you think it's fair to other drivers to have the SRR backup in 3 lanes by a person hogging the overtaking lane doing 80kph ?

And hasn't it been illegal to drive unaccompanied on a 2nd provisional since last year when these proposals were first announced. Its only that its being enforced by the Gardai from today ? (BTW, you're required to be suervised on all Learner Permits)

L1011

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

And hasn't it been illegal to drive unaccompanied on a 2nd provisional since last year when these proposals were first announced. Its only that its being enforced by the Gardai from today ? (BTW, you're required to be suervised on all Learner Permits)

No, it was held off till today - was still legal for 2nd provisional holders to drive unaccompanied till last night.

faceman

its funny when things like this come up there are always people who say its just Monet making racket. I dont really know what other punishment you can put on it other than a fine, maybe the begrudgers would prefer a jail term enforced instead??