HDMI Graphics Card

Funkiwi75

Hi

Can anyone recommend a graphics card with a dedicated HDMI Output, Not DVI-HDMI. I saw one a few months back that was an ATI card but can't remember the model. I'm not looking for anything too expensive it's just going into a media PC I'm wanting to build.

Thanks

AlmightyCushion

I'm pretty sure all the ati 3xxx series have a hdmi connection, might only be the higher end ones though.

Funkiwi75

I have been looking but all I see is HDTV Output, HDMI but when you look at the card it's got the round S-Video type plug that turns into RGB, but still can't see one that had a proper HDMI plug on it.

It's just that I have been told that when connecting to a HDMI TV you wont get true HDMI with a DVI-HDMI Converter.

blackgold>>

It's just that I have been told that when connecting to a HDMI TV you wont get true HDMI with a DVI-HDMI Converter.

Dvi to hdmi is only a few pins connecting to another few pins so how can the signal be different
Both signals are identical, binary uncompressed data.
As for graphics cards I'm not sure why they won't put hdmi as standard since it carries both audio and video...
Anyone know the reason behind not doing that?

AlmightyCushion

blackgold>> wrote: »

Dvi to hdmi is only a few pins connecting to another few pins so how can the signal be different
Both signals are identical, binary uncompressed data.
As for graphics cards I'm not sure why they won't put hdmi as standard since it carries both audio and video...
Anyone know the reason behind not doing that?

Because it means they would have to integrate a sound card on to the graphics card and this would raise the cost. Ati have done this on the 3000 series (like I said above not sure if it's on them all or just the high end).

blackgold>>

Doesn't the soundcard on the motherboard take care of the audio and feed that to that card?
I'm unsure of this thats why I'm asking one area i need to brush up on is this.

AlmightyCushion

Yep the sound card on the motherboard (or dedicated sound card) takes care of the audio but it doesn't pass it to the graphics card.

blackgold>>

So with the dvi connection specifically on the ati cards is audio and video passed through this because my understanding was dvi doesn't support audio or is this overrulled by ati cards now?

Funkiwi75

Also is the picture quality the same? Like i said earlier i got told that you get better quality if you had a dedicated HDMI port.

DanGerMus

IIRC some of the pins on DVI and even VGA were set aside for audio. This has up until now not been utilised. Now ATI have added a sound chip/encoder (is my terminology right here?) to their cards. They as you mentioned give you an adapter that will give audio accross the hdmi. As for resolution i can't see why you wouldnt be able to set it to what you want including 1080p or 720 these res are no problem for graphics cards.

blackgold>>

So dan your saying if one was to use a dvi to hdmi adaptor on the ati cards one can get both audio and video on a single cable?

AlmightyCushion

blackgold>> wrote: »

So dan your saying if one was to use a dvi to hdmi adaptor on the ati cards one can get both audio and video on a single cable?

Some of the 3800 series have a hdmi port as standard

DanGerMus

blackgold>> wrote: »

So dan your saying if one was to use a dvi to hdmi adaptor on the ati cards one can get both audio and video on a single cable?

Just did a quick google and seems from 2xxx series and up all cards support audio over the dvi but only via a special "ATI dvi -hdmi" adapter. Problem is whether or not to include this in the box was left to the manufacturers/resellers. Like Almighty said seems it's only the higher cards that came with it. So you could buy a lowend card and then buy the special adapter. A standard DVI-HDMI won't do. Or buy a higher card with it included.


happy 600th post to me,happy 600th post to me...bah nobody cares

AlmightyCushion

I'm pretty sure the adapter was included with all cards but I can't be certain. Ati made a fairly big deal about these cards having audio so I can't see them letting a reseller leave it out.

DanGerMus

http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=139226

This guy has the answer for us. His 2400pro didn't come with it. He got the special adapter seperately. Seems a bit cr@p that a reseller wouldn't include it though.

AlmightyCushion

That's a bit of a jip.

Rsaeire

There is an ATI card that has a native HDMI port from Diamond.

There is also a proprietary ATI DVI=>HDMI dongle that comes with the 2x00 and 3x00 series cards that enable sound. How this works is explained below.

A DVI single channel cable has the same data connections/wires as an HDMI cable. The sound goes down the same 3 pairs of wires in the form of audio data packets mixed in with the video data.
The ATi dongle appears to link 2 normally unconnected PINs in the DVI socket as a switch to tell the onboard sound chip in the graphics card to turn the audio packets on.

This information can be seen in more detail here.

Funkiwi75

Rsaeire that is exactly what I am looking for. But now with what I have read since i put this post up, Am I correct in saying that even if the card dose not have a native HDMI port like that Dimond Card but just DVI and on the specs of that card it says HDMI (eg: http://uk.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=2&l2=8&l3=637&l4=0&model=2112&modelmenu=1) It will put out the same quality picture and sound as a card that has a native port? (Hope this makes seance)

johnny_adidas

i have this for about a year or so now. no problems other than some video blurring initially which a change to the registry sorted out.

http://www.sapphiretech.com/us/products/products_overview.php?gpid=145&grp=3

Rsaeire

Funkiwi75 wrote: »

Rsaeire that is exactly what I am looking for. But now with what I have read since i put this post up, Am I correct in saying that even if the card dose not have a native HDMI port like that Dimond Card but just DVI and on the specs of that card it says HDMI (eg: http://uk.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=2&l2=8&l3=637&l4=0&model=2112&modelmenu=1) It will put out the same quality picture and sound as a card that has a native port? (Hope this makes seance)

You're making perfect sense.

You are correct. I have a Sapphire Radeon HD 3650 that has two DVI ports and comes with an ATI DVI => HDMI adaptor. With this adaptor it allows sound to be passed from the graphics card's onboard 5.1 sound decoder, through the DVI connection to the DVI=>HDMI adaptor and is then transmitted over HDMI to your display.

I have not tested this myself but I have read about countless users online who have done so successfully. The ATI DVI=>HDMI adaptor is the key here as DVI does not usually carry audio, but when using this specific adaptor can be facilitated as a result of the graphics card having onboard sound.

blackgold>>

Rsaeire thanks for that very informative link everytime i searched google i got advertisments etc your google skills are excellent at last i understand this mess.
And Funkiwi75 glad you asked that question

I've another question as regards audio on ati cards .Why is it not talked about on review sites that are so keen on talking about silly things like overclocking? Wouldn't it benefit the end users more to talk about this area?

Funkiwi75

Ok now i know ATI looks as though they have some sort of sound card/chip on them. I have put a couple of PC's togeather that have nvidia 8800GTS cards in them, they have a sdif (think that right) cable to connect from the motherboard to the video card, now is this for putting sound over the DVI-HDMI Cable/Adaptor?

Funkiwi75

Sorry the 8800gts has no HDMI output support, this one does and half way down it answers my question:

'Note: To enable HDMI audio out function, a motherboard with internal S/PDIF header and the correct
connection of S/PDIF cable with graphics card and motherboard are needed.'


http://uk.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=2&l2=6&l3=651&l4=0&model=2103&modelmenu=1

Rsaeire

blackgold>> wrote: »

Rsaeire thanks for that very informative link everytime i searched google i got advertisments etc your google skills are excellent at last i understand this mess.
And Funkiwi75 glad you asked that question

I've another question as regards audio on ati cards .Why is it not talked about on review sites that are so keen on talking about silly things like overclocking? Wouldn't it benefit the end users more to talk about this area?

It’s no problem at all as at least the answer is now available and out there on Boards.ie I attempted to find out this same answer from a member of Boards.ie on another thread, but was chastised for simply asking a similar question as to how the DVI connection could pass audio, even though its spec does not list audio pass-through as an available feature.

I for one agree, regarding the current crop of online reviews related to the aforementioned issue, especially since a lot of users are now more interested in the HTPC application of their graphics card than purely that of gaming.

Unfortunately, as most users who buy a graphics card are buying it for playing games, the dead-line, in my opinion, that reviewers have to finish their review by means that certain areas are not covered in detail and only the most relevant to the majority are. This means that those of us who are interested in the additional features a graphics card has are left with scouring the net for either an in-depth review, detailing all features available for a specific graphics card, or an in-depth review into the HTPC specific features of a graphics card.

The fact that we now have an emerging trend in which graphics cards will soon rival dedicated stand-alone HD-DVD and Blu-ray players will mean that more users will look to the reviewers of commendable and respected websites for answers. My opinion is that they have a responsibility to at least offer more information in an easier to find format than that of which is currently available.

Rsaeire

Funkiwi75 wrote: »

Sorry the 8800gts has no HDMI output support, this one does and half way down it answers my question:

'Note: To enable HDMI audio out function, a motherboard with internal S/PDIF header and the correct
connection of S/PDIF cable with graphics card and motherboard are needed.'


http://uk.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=2&l2=6&l3=651&l4=0&model=2103&modelmenu=1

I saw that too last week. It's not a perfect solution but at least Nvidia are addressing the issue and giving customers the option to have audio from their cards, indirectly or not.

Funkiwi75

Ok Thank you all very much, this is the first post i put up without someone coming in all high and mighty and slagging off my questions. I am now looking at getting the EAH3650 SILENT/HTDI/512M going to head off to Peats to see if they have one just to look at then prob buy it from IT Direct coz they are usually cheeper, (not trusting Komplett at the mo due to there situation in the UK) also i'd reather buy from a shop coz you can actually B*&CH to a person if something goes wrong.

Funkiwi75

Just got back from the shops, Peats have the Asus HD3650/HTDI/256m for €89 and IT Direct can get the Asus EAH3650 SILENT/HTDI/512M for €80 so going to order once i get paid.

Rsaeire

Funkiwi75 wrote: »

Just got back from the shops, Peats have the Asus HD3650/HTDI/256m for €89 and IT Direct can get the Asus EAH3650 SILENT/HTDI/512M for €80 so going to order once i get paid.

I'd recommend buying the card from Elara as they are cheaper than either of the places you mentioned, even with delivery.

Funkiwi75

Just checked the price on Elara and it is only €3 cheeper

blackgold>>

Yes review sites should provide more info on these things because after all every computer uses audio.
Instead of taking a whole page spent talking about how lovely the box looks or how shiny the wrapping is, maybe it is more in there interest to talk about this.
Anyway like you said atleast users can find out now about audio dvi hdmi and all that.
Nice one lads.

Funkiwi75

I agree totally, why should it be this hard to find simple information.