Attracted to friend and being gay...

azezil

DJ_Spider wrote: »

I have one thing to say - Labels are for tins, NOT people! Thankyou

Sounds to me like someone who is afraid to admit to them self and to others who they really are.

needhelpguy

Clanagael wrote: »

I do not believe that you should let on to be straight. That is selfish and coward like. If you are gay you are gay, big deal. Your family and friends will have to accept you for who you are. It is not wrong.. However, it is wrong if you life a life pretending to love a woman and have children and fool teh woman into thinking she has a life when in fact it is a sham. If i were to find out that my husband was gay, I would be horrified and would never forgive him for having zero respect for me. I would prefer he had an affair with a woman, i would at least know that not everything was a lie.. But in your case, if you do pretend to be straight, you are fooling all those around you and some day, in the near/long future, it will come out, and then everyone who had respect for you will not, as you didn't have the nerve to be a man about it.

Look around, there are 1000's of gay couples, men & female, and nobody actually cares. Those who have opinions let them, their opinions are NOT more important than your individual happiness.

Also, never persue a straight guy if you are gay, as you will diminish any hope of a friendship. If you get jealous of him whilst out, it may be best to avoid him until you meet someone yourself to avoid any conflicts of interest.

Best of luck

*sigh*

It's just so easy for someone not in my position to dictate what I should and shouldn't do. I have no intention of marrying or dating girls. So how can I be selfish? I really don't care if someone on the internet thinks I am somehow a coward. Some people can handle being gay and some cannot. Not everyone wants to be the "gay", and no, I do not have to accept it.

And, might I add, happiness is not dependent on a relationship which so many people think it is. I have plenty of things to keep me going in my life. Sure, like everyone else, I have no control over my emotions and I feel strongly for other boys sometimes, but I am learning ways to deal with these.

There are many other people in my situation who are going about life as normal because they don't want these desires or the life that equates them. The OP is one of them. So next time you try to plant your morals and shoulds and shouldn'ts onto people like me, keep in mind we have the right to choose how we live.

moridin

Of course you have the right to choose how to live. If you're happy to live a fulfilling life while denying yourself the happiness of a relationship then fair play to you, good luck with it.

Each to their own and all that. However, I think what the previous posters have been trying to point out is that unless you can accept yourself for who you are then you're always going to have a constant niggling annoyance which could eat into the aforementioned fulfilling life and make it less ideal than one would hope for.

DubArk

I think most of the posters here; have been more worried about the OP’s state of mind and well being. People don’t have to be in a relationship to express who they really are. Some people are lucky if the do find a partner weather Gay or Straight, IMO.


But what is required is honesty to themselves, first and foremost; Not just existing and constantly having to check their true emotions. It’s a very hard road to take and can only end in a torturous existence. Personally I wouldn’t wish that on my worst enemy.

I was under the impression that the OP had posted, so as to get advice and to be heard as they had no one to turn to or to talk to. In the light of this, people of all different views will come back with their experiences in life and part take in the debate. That’s what a forum is about. It’s unfair for you to accuse anyone of trying to push their lives down any ones throat.

LegacyUser

MessedUp99 wrote: »

Do none of you believe the whole gay thing is inherently wrong? Come on, nature created man and woman. Man reproduces with woman. Thats the way it's supposed to be.

The way whats supposed to be? some storybook 'this is your life'?
nature created you gay, it doesn't get any more natural. It's not right or wrong, it just is. Make the most of it.

david_the_great

MessedUp99 wrote: »

I know you're going to say "it's not wrong" or "you shouldn't hate being gay" but thats nonsense! It's not natural, it's not right and I just don't know what to do!

I am a little bit offended over this- it is right and yeah maybe it isn't natural but i bet you don't say jordans boobs are "not right" pft

and then secondly your-not everyone wants to be gay- YOU should know that this isn't a decision we get to make!

Boston

david_the_great wrote: »

and then secondly your-not everyone wants to be gay- YOU should know that this isn't a decision we get to make!

Thats irrelevant. Something can be completely out of your control and you can still have positive or negative desires wrt it.

Reflector

I'm gay,

I play sports,

I despise labels,

I was definitely conceived and raised "naturally".

I do not wish I was straight. (then I'd have to navigate a vagina, uck)

Loads of people have come through the way you feel. you need to start taking control of your life. It's simple a matter of your perspective. You fancy men, this is perfectly normal and natural and has been happening for 100's of years before you were born. It's only some negative attitudes that you have come across that have made you think the way you do. I'm not sure what age you are but believe me when I say that being gay can be great once you start respecting yourself.

cps_goodbuy

MessedUp99 wrote: »

Now, this next statement will definitely annoy some of you. Do none of you believe the whole gay thing is inherently wrong? Come on, nature created man and woman. Man reproduces with woman. Thats the way it's supposed to be.

This isn't going to be 100% right, probably cause I'm wrecked but..

Wasn't there a documentry on recently that was investigating links between "being gay/bi" and individuals specific genes, their birth placement (being born first second third etc and how many brothers born ahead of you), and your body makeup (finger length!) Several research documents suggest that gayness/bisexual etc are just part of animal (including human behaviours) Dolphins openly practice homosexualality as a way to bond in their pods and some have been found to have homo preferences.

Don't people realise that bi/gay/curious behaviour or preference has been traced back through mankinds history

I think it was the spartans for example, they openly practised homosexuality and saw that the love between men was purer than between man and woman. Woman being seen as childbearers and currency (maybe i'm confused with another culture)

Tired...:cool: <putting on my sleeping glasses now

Resi12

Why do people have to get so into it! WOW someone's gay why is it still so shocking! I just think people try to affiliate being gay and always go back to ADAM AND FRICKIN EVE! Well i'm sorry but I don't play that way, ever think God made me gay, well by going with the natural man and woman its a religious approach so follow thorough being religious you also knoew God created us, everything about us, therefore he made me Gay..

Bein gay is not some temptation or deadly sin we must repress it is a way of life something no one will ever get rid of. I honestly think its horrible were 2nd classs citizens to some people especially in Ireland. People need to come into the 21st century, blow out the candle install a fúckin lightbulb and open there god damn eyes!! JEESH!!!

LegacyUser

I'm surprised this topic is still knocking around, but I suppose I should post a "progress" report.

First off, some of you were wondering what age I am. I am in my early twenties and in college.

At the moment I am feeling the exact same way as my original post. I still hate who I am. I am sort of in a downward spiral. I think about the fact of being gay, then I look upon other aspects of my life and then realise how bad it is.

I don't know to expect in the future. I am never really happy. I am not suicidal before you think that, it's just that everything seems to get worse and worse as the weeks go by.

I do not want to come out, and that is my decision. However, what I fear now is that my friends will soon realise that I might be gay. Hell, if I knew someone like me I'd presume I was gay! It's getting very difficult to go on a night out with my friends and be the only one not chatting up some woman.

I feel I need to really talk to someone, but I have never spoken to anyone face to face about this, and in a weird way, I don't want to! I know it doesn't make sense, but the thoughts of someone knowing the real me is just frightening.

I know you have given me a lot of advice, but I keep ignoring it. It seems to me that the only solution is coming out, which is the last thing I want to do.

I wish I could confide in someone, but I cannot trust anyone. I feel my friends aren't really my friends, that I just tag along while they have their laughs. I have poor people skills, shy, uninteresting, not funny. Nothing really going for me.


And the friend that I mentioned in my original post that I liked? I still really like him. I find it very hard seeing him chatting up women, and being "with" them. Although one thing that did bring a little smile to my face is that he kissed another guy. What that means, I don't know, but it gave me a glimmer of hope.

LegacyUser

Hey there,

If this is any help I feel very similar to you and your situation. I'm almost 20 and I'm also in college.

I don't like the fact that I'm gay either. I don't like the culture that surrounds it or the attitudes that are attached to it. I think I've got a lot going for me in many areas of my life, but I don't think being gay does me any favours.

I don't want to come out either for many reasons - people's opinions, the inevitable backlash from friends, having to explain why I've been lying for years etc. But at the same time I feel like I'm half a person. The person that my friends, acquaintances and associated know is merely a facade.

I explored the gay scene in college a bit last year. I didn't really like what I found and I can't say I was that taken with the gay bars and most of their clientele. Without any real outlet to meet gay people like myself how will I ever find someone? And if I do will anything come of it, because the opinions I've heard all point to young gay guys being total headwreckers.

I also understand when you say you can't confide in anyone - I'm the same. I don't tell anyone - friends, family or otherwise - anything of any real importance anymore because I firmly believe there's only two things you can rely on - yourself and your instinct.

Regarding your friends, I think you should try and forget about your sexuality with them and just be confident. Obviously you can't be confident fully in yourself because you are unhappy being gay but try and let go of that hang up when with your friends. Being miserable around them is only going to distance you more from them which sounds like the last thing you need right now.

Dwn Wth Vwls

I really wish I knew what to say that could help you, but I know that when you're living under that big black cloud of doom and gloom that nothing seems easy or straight forward.

Step one is accepting that you're gay (or bi, etc). It seems like you already know that you're attracted to men. That's all that being gay is. Homosexuality is being sexually and romantically attracted to your own gender. Everything else is a stereotype.

As for it being wrong... why? Because some people say so? Because you say so? Our ideas of right and wrong are taught to us. If you had been told as a child, "Sometimes people like girls. Sometimes people like boys. Sometimes people like both and sometimes it changes.", would you still think it was in any way a big deal? The reality is that's true, and with every new generation acceptance is growing. You just need to accept that morality is not always what it seems.

Two people of the same gender being together is not natural? Even with conservative estimates, 5% of 6 billion, there would be at least 300 million homosexual people in the world at the moment. It seems to me like nature is pretty busy cranking out the gays. Everybody knows it goes back to ancient times too, it's nothing new. Why would two consenting adults falling in love with each other not be natural? Nobody is hurt by it.

The reality is you are gay, and no amount of denying it in your mind or hiding it will change anything. It's the way you were born, it's who you are. It's natural because it happened. You weren't exposed to radioactive waste, you were just born. If you can just accept to yourself, entirely and absolutely, that you are gay and it's just part of who you are, then you'll be much better off. Anything else is trying to deny reality, and that's pointless.

The rest is easy by comparison.

Step two is understanding that "coming out" is not some huge process or transformation. It's not a caterpillar into a butterfly type situation, you are who you are already. Coming out is just telling people that while they presumed you were straight, actually you're gay. It's not even that this information is important or relevant to them in many cases, the real point of it is the effect it has on you.

When you are afraid of people finding out that you're gay, you live with a terrible fear. You might not ever realise just how much it's affecting you and your life until after you tell people, if you choose to. You scrutinize everything you say and do before saying or doing it. Everything has to pass through the magic de-gaying filter in case you give yourself away. You have to feign interest or gloss over subjects that come too close.

This is most likely why you feel shy, uninteresting and not funny. You are not being yourself. It's impossible to ever truly relax when you feel you have some big dark terrible secret festering inside you. If you could just choose one person to tell, anyone at all, it will change your life. Even if you never tell anyone else ever again, the fact that you tell another person goes a long way towards stopping it being a horrible burden.

Yes, you could go on living the rest of your life, never being yourself, never letting anybody get too close. And all for what? To hide such a basic human emotion as love? Do you really want to put a clamp on your heart and be miserable just in case something doesn't quite turn out as you think it "should"? I know sometimes it can be tough to accept that you're not a unique and beautiful snowflake. If millions of other people can cope with being gay, then the world probably won't end if you accept it too. That's all you have to do, accept it, because you can't change it.

As for your straight friend, I imagine that would pass. At the moment he's probably the only guy you really allow yourself to have feelings for, because it's safe. If you actually open yourself up to other people though, you'll find unreciprocated love can't compete with another person loving you back. And that's what you're denying yourself out of... fear?

swiss

That has got to be one of the most insightful posts I've seen on this board. There is nothing more I can add, except "+ 1".

Cabbage Brained

I posted this in a thread on another forum (www.gaire.com) entitled "Is coming out really necessary".

I certainly don't think it's necessary to shout it from the rooftops or announce it at every opportunity, but I think it is extremely important to tell close family and friends.

My own coming out process was extremely difficult, but only because I put if off for so long. All of the depression, anxiety, and difficulty that I had with it was a result of the stress I put myself through when I was trying to hide my sexuality. I absolutely hated myself and the fact that I was attracted to men. I considered suicide on quite a few occasions, and for most of my teenage years and early twenties I was majorly depressed as a result of it all. I knew that nobody had any idea that I was gay apart from me, which made it all the more difficult. I built it up so much in my head that I was quite literally terrified that people would find out.

I entertained thoughts of getting married, and I tried to be with girls and maintain relationships. Not only did it make me feel awful about myself, but I now realise just how selfish that it was towards those girls. Then one day I was really drunk with my sister and I told her. She was extremely shocked, and told me that she had never expected it, but I realised pretty quickly that she didn't care. I swore her to secrecy and didn't tell anybody else for a while, but just having one other person know made the whole thing a reality, and I gradually became comfortable in myself as a result. It was a very slow process, and perhaps I'm not all of the way there yet, but having even just one person know was definitely the catalyst which helped me stop hating myself so much.

Since then I've told my entire immediate family and all of my closest friends, and I've never felt better. Everybody has been utterly shocked (everything about me is straight apart from my sexual orientation ), but nobody has reacted badly. No matter what you think, the reaction is never as bad as what you think it will be.

I'll never be the sort to announce to people who I don't know well that I'm gay, and I'll always feel a little bit funny saying it. I have a boyfriend who I live with, but if I don't know somebody I'll generally avoid bringing him up in conversation. It's just a personal preference, I don't feel like I need to hide it as such, and if somebody really pryed I'd tell them, but I'm just not entirely comfortable "outing" myself to literally everybody. But what I do think is very important is being able to talk about it comfortably with my family and friends, and I'll tell anybody who I consider a mate.

The key thing to realise is that people won't hate you for what you're attracted to, and once you realise this you'll stop hating yourself. Well that's how it has been for me anyway. Honestly I can't recommend it strongly enough. So anybody who isn't "out" yet, my advice would be not to rush it, just tell one person that you can really trust and take it from there. I promise you won't regret it.

As you can probably see, I used to be in EXACTLY your situation, and I have news for you; things will get worse and worse until you accept who you are. It's a very slow process but I promise, you'll be happy one day if you accept who you are. PM me if you'd like to chat personally about it.

needhelpguy

Dwn Wth Vwls wrote: »

I really wish I knew what to say that could help you, but I know that when you're living under that big black cloud of doom and gloom that nothing seems easy or straight forward.

Step one is accepting that you're gay (or bi, etc). It seems like you already know that you're attracted to men. That's all that being gay is. Homosexuality is being sexually and romantically attracted to your own gender. Everything else is a stereotype.

As for it being wrong... why? Because some people say so? Because you say so? Our ideas of right and wrong are taught to us. If you had been told as a child, "Sometimes people like girls. Sometimes people like boys. Sometimes people like both and sometimes it changes.", would you still think it was in any way a big deal? The reality is that's true, and with every new generation acceptance is growing. You just need to accept that morality is not always what it seems.

Two people of the same gender being together is not natural? Even with conservative estimates, 5% of 6 billion, there would be at least 300 million homosexual people in the world at the moment. It seems to me like nature is pretty busy cranking out the gays. Everybody knows it goes back to ancient times too, it's nothing new. Why would two consenting adults falling in love with each other not be natural? Nobody is hurt by it.

The reality is you are gay, and no amount of denying it in your mind or hiding it will change anything. It's the way you were born, it's who you are. It's natural because it happened. You weren't exposed to radioactive waste, you were just born. If you can just accept to yourself, entirely and absolutely, that you are gay and it's just part of who you are, then you'll be much better off. Anything else is trying to deny reality, and that's pointless.

The rest is easy by comparison.

Step two is understanding that "coming out" is not some huge process or transformation. It's not a caterpillar into a butterfly type situation, you are who you are already. Coming out is just telling people that while they presumed you were straight, actually you're gay. It's not even that this information is important or relevant to them in many cases, the real point of it is the effect it has on you.

When you are afraid of people finding out that you're gay, you live with a terrible fear. You might not ever realise just how much it's affecting you and your life until after you tell people, if you choose to. You scrutinize everything you say and do before saying or doing it. Everything has to pass through the magic de-gaying filter in case you give yourself away. You have to feign interest or gloss over subjects that come too close.

This is most likely why you feel shy, uninteresting and not funny. You are not being yourself. It's impossible to ever truly relax when you feel you have some big dark terrible secret festering inside you. If you could just choose one person to tell, anyone at all, it will change your life. Even if you never tell anyone else ever again, the fact that you tell another person goes a long way towards stopping it being a horrible burden.

Yes, you could go on living the rest of your life, never being yourself, never letting anybody get too close. And all for what? To hide such a basic human emotion as love? Do you really want to put a clamp on your heart and be miserable just in case something doesn't quite turn out as you think it "should"? I know sometimes it can be tough to accept that you're not a unique and beautiful snowflake. If millions of other people can cope with being gay, then the world probably won't end if you accept it too. That's all you have to do, accept it, because you can't change it.

As for your straight friend, I imagine that would pass. At the moment he's probably the only guy you really allow yourself to have feelings for, because it's safe. If you actually open yourself up to other people though, you'll find unreciprocated love can't compete with another person loving you back. And that's what you're denying yourself out of... fear?

The flaw here is that you assume that everyone needs romantic companionship. This is not true. I can assure you that there are millions of others who feel attracted to the same sex, like me, who do not like it, don't want that life, are uncomfortable with it, whatever. Fact is, life is, or would be harder for many people who come out or act on their attractions.

I don't really have time to delve further atm but I had to reply just to say that it's ok to not want to be a gay/bi person and nobody has to be.

Boston

MessedUp99: There is no "silver bullet" advice we can give you, I personally don't even know if coming out will make things better for you. All we can do here is recount some of our experiences and hope you don't make the same mistakes we did. It sounds to me like you've very little to loose by coming out to just one person and a huge amount to potentially gain.


Dwn Wth Vwls: Very true words

needhelpguy:

The original poster clearly has a desire for a romantic relationship though. Yes, there are those that feel no desire to have a romantic relationship, but more often then not those who claim to feel this way are actually just to scared to try and convince themselves life's "easier" without the "hassle" of love or lust.

Dwn Wth Vwls

needhelpguy wrote: »

The flaw here is that you assume that everyone needs romantic companionship. This is not true. I can assure you that there are millions of others who feel attracted to the same sex, like me, who do not like it, don't want that life, are uncomfortable with it, whatever. Fact is, life is, or would be harder for many people who come out or act on their attractions.

I don't really have time to delve further atm but I had to reply just to say that it's ok to not want to be a gay/bi person and nobody has to be.

I don't assume that at all, I was just addressing MessedUp99 specifically. I completely agree with you that people don't need romantic companionship and that you never have to discuss your sexuality with anyone if you don't want to.

What I do believe is that everyone can be happy. I also think that not accepting your sexuality is one of the most depressing things a person can do. If you're telling me that you're completely happy with your life and that your sexuality just isn't a problem for you in any way, then great! I get the impression that's not the case though.

The life you are living is already a "gay life", because it's your life, and you are gay (or bi etc. from here on). You don't receive a new life. Accepting this or coming out doesn't change anything. You do not become something else, you don't receive your complimentary Madonna album and begin practicing your lisp. You are not other people who are gay, you are you. When you accept that you're gay you don't automatically buy into a collective mindset or join a club.

You say that it's okay to not want to be gay and that you don't have to be. That's really like saying it's okay to not want to be Irish or Caucasian and you don't have to be. Being gay is not a persona you adopt, it's a sexual attraction to your own gender. Your choices are only to be gay and accept it, or be gay and deny it. Sorry, but people don't get any other choice, no matter how you spin it. Straight people don't get a choice either.

You've said that you have no intention of dating girls, and that you are "dealing" with your attraction to guys. Essentially you are making yourself asexual. This is not who you are. Hiding, repressing and denying aspects of yourself is most likely making you miserable, whether you realise it or not. It makes you shy (or aggressive), stressed, anxious and a whole host of other feelings that are not nice and completely unnecessary.

Times have changed. The fact that someone might be gay and hiding it is a thought that regularly occurs to a large percentage of people. The chances are that some day, someone you care about will you ask to your face if you are gay. If you haven't accepted it, you will lie to them. Is that what you want? Do you lie about other things? Why is it so important that people don't know how you feel? It's a really basic emotion that you have no control over. If you were attracted to girls I don't think it would ever even occur to you to hide it. Why is being attracted to guys so different? That's all that being gay is.

For me, I think the only thing that matters is accepting yourself. Put an end to the doubt and self-loathing and accept reality for what it is.

(I will gladly discuss this kind of stuff in private with anyone if they want to.)

DubArk

Dwn Wth Vwls wrote: »

I don't assume that at all, I was just addressing MessedUp99 specifically. I completely agree with you that people don't need romantic companionship and that you never have to discuss your sexuality with anyone if you don't want to.

What I do believe is that everyone can be happy. I also think that not accepting your sexuality is one of the most depressing things a person can do. If you're telling me that you're completely happy with your life and that your sexuality just isn't a problem for you in any way, then great! I get the impression that's not the case though.

The life you are living is already a "gay life", because it's your life, and you are gay (or bi etc. from here on). You don't receive a new life. Accepting this or coming out doesn't change anything. You do not become something else, you don't receive your complimentary Madonna album and begin practicing your lisp. You are not other people who are gay, you are you. When you accept that you're gay you don't automatically buy into a collective mindset or join a club.

You say that it's okay to not want to be gay and that you don't have to be. That's really like saying it's okay to not want to be Irish or Caucasian and you don't have to be. Being gay is not a persona you adopt, it's a sexual attraction to your own gender. Your choices are only to be gay and accept it, or be gay and deny it. Sorry, but people don't get any other choice, no matter how you spin it. Straight people don't get a choice either.

You've said that you have no intention of dating girls, and that you are "dealing" with your attraction to guys. Essentially you are making yourself asexual. This is not who you are. Hiding, repressing and denying aspects of yourself is most likely making you miserable, whether you realise it or not. It makes you shy (or aggressive), stressed, anxious and a whole host of other feelings that are not nice and completely unnecessary.

Times have changed. The fact that someone might be gay and hiding it is a thought that regularly occurs to a large percentage of people. The chances are that some day, someone you care about will you ask to your face if you are gay. If you haven't accepted it, you will lie to them. Is that what you want? Do you lie about other things? Why is it so important that people don't know how you feel? It's a really basic emotion that you have no control over. If you were attracted to girls I don't think it would ever even occur to you to hide it. Why is being attracted to guys so different? That's all that being gay is.

For me, I think the only thing that matters is accepting yourself. Put an end to the doubt and self-loathing and accept reality for what it is.

(I will gladly discuss this kind of stuff in private with anyone if they want to.)

Personally I think you’re a very insightful person and your power of debate is above and beyond. I’d of wished when I was in the same position as the OP, hating myself, life, and in such a dark place, that I could of read your wise words.:)

Cabbage Brained

Great post Dwn Wth Vwls, agree with 100% of what you have said.

Reflector

Great post dwn wth vwls, couldn't agree more. I hope the guys on this forum listen up.
Take control of your lives guys , being gay doesn't turn you into some limp wristed, lisping queen. you'll still be you and there is plenty of people out there like you.

In fact MessedUp99 and I_can_Relate should hook up????

DubArk

Reflector wrote: »

In fact MessedUp99 and I_can_Relate should hook up????

I feel love in the air!

needhelpguy

Dwn Wth Vwls wrote: »

I don't assume that at all, I was just addressing MessedUp99 specifically. I completely agree with you that people don't need romantic companionship and that you never have to discuss your sexuality with anyone if you don't want to.

What I do believe is that everyone can be happy. I also think that not accepting your sexuality is one of the most depressing things a person can do. If you're telling me that you're completely happy with your life and that your sexuality just isn't a problem for you in any way, then great! I get the impression that's not the case though.

The life you are living is already a "gay life", because it's your life, and you are gay (or bi etc. from here on). You don't receive a new life. Accepting this or coming out doesn't change anything. You do not become something else, you don't receive your complimentary Madonna album and begin practicing your lisp. You are not other people who are gay, you are you. When you accept that you're gay you don't automatically buy into a collective mindset or join a club.

You say that it's okay to not want to be gay and that you don't have to be. That's really like saying it's okay to not want to be Irish or Caucasian and you don't have to be. Being gay is not a persona you adopt, it's a sexual attraction to your own gender. Your choices are only to be gay and accept it, or be gay and deny it. Sorry, but people don't get any other choice, no matter how you spin it. Straight people don't get a choice either.

You've said that you have no intention of dating girls, and that you are "dealing" with your attraction to guys. Essentially you are making yourself asexual. This is not who you are. Hiding, repressing and denying aspects of yourself is most likely making you miserable, whether you realise it or not. It makes you shy (or aggressive), stressed, anxious and a whole host of other feelings that are not nice and completely unnecessary.

Times have changed. The fact that someone might be gay and hiding it is a thought that regularly occurs to a large percentage of people. The chances are that some day, someone you care about will you ask to your face if you are gay. If you haven't accepted it, you will lie to them. Is that what you want? Do you lie about other things? Why is it so important that people don't know how you feel? It's a really basic emotion that you have no control over. If you were attracted to girls I don't think it would ever even occur to you to hide it. Why is being attracted to guys so different? That's all that being gay is.

For me, I think the only thing that matters is accepting yourself. Put an end to the doubt and self-loathing and accept reality for what it is.

(I will gladly discuss this kind of stuff in private with anyone if they want to.)

I see what you are trying to say, but all of this is much easier said than done. I am in work again so I cant give you a long response.

It's true that I have been asked on several occasions by family and friends if I am gay. Of course I have denied it. It is much easier that way. I cant even imagine telling people I like boys. I am not afraid of becomming a limp wristed screaming queen, but I do not want people's opinions to change, which they would. I don't want those looks of disgust I have seen gay/bi people get, the talking behind the back, the friends and family who treat you differently with shock realisation that you are not who they thought you were, the change of opinions. The haters and bigots. I dont want to be different. And that is the choice I have.

I don't mean to hijack Messedup99's thread, I just wanted to reply to let him know there are many other guys out there just like him and while it's hard, it's ok to be not open or comfortable with being gay/bi. You don't have to go out with guys, tell anyone etc. It can be done. Yeah sometimes it's hard but there are consequences to everything. It can be dealt with. Personally, what other people think of me and how they perceive me is far more important than who I sleep with. Call me a coward, fool, whatever but that is how I feel. I just want to be "regular"and not have to deal with being different (not to offend anyone, for the purposes of this discussion regular=straight, might not be the right word).

I will be more than happy to continue this discussion here or via PM. Again, I do not want to offend anyone here, what I write is how I feel about my own situation, I have no problems with gay people, I love them! But it's not a life for me, not in this world.

Boston

That's fair enough, I seriously mean that. You're right, there are consequences to coming out and being gay/bi, I personally had my fair share of what you described. When you come out you face those consequences, pay that price, here and now, and of course with anything that is difficult is easier to put off. But there is a price to be paid for keeping it a secret as well, it may cost you your future happiness, and by the time you realise that it may be too late to do anything about it. You're putting the opinions of others a head of your own well being, that's your choice and I respect that, but know that a time may come when your regret your choice.

Dwn Wth Vwls

needhelpguy wrote: »

I see what you are trying to say, but all of this is much easier said than done.

You're absolutely right, it's not easy at all. For a lot of people it's the most difficult thing they ever do in their life. It can be a really terrifying concept, but the reason we all do it is because it's worth it. You won't find that many people who want to go back to the doom and gloom of being in the closet, even if it didn't go as they had hoped. You can be happy and you deserve to be happy.

needhelpguy wrote: »

I am not afraid of becomming a limp wristed screaming queen, but I do not want people's opinions to change, which they would. I don't want those looks of disgust I have seen gay/bi people get, the talking behind the back, the friends and family who treat you differently with shock realisation that you are not who they thought you were, the change of opinions. The haters and bigots. I dont want to be different. And that is the choice I have.

Personally, what other people think of me and how they perceive me is far more important than who I sleep with. Call me a coward, fool, whatever but that is how I feel. I just want to be "regular"and not have to deal with being different

I think this is probably your main issue, and it's not even anything to do with being gay to be honest. I have bad news for you. At this very moment, there are people all over the world who dislike you. They dislike you because you're irish, because you're male, because you're white, because you're different. They don't even need to meet you, and hiding that you're gay won't stop them. They already dislike you for that too. The good news? You don't have to care.

There are countless books on this subject, so I don't know if I'm qualified to explain it, but I'll try. No other person can effect your mood, make you miserable or upset. The only person who can do that is you. Your thoughts are what make you happy or unhappy. When someone says something to you, or does something to you, it's not what they do or say that's a problem. It's your thoughts about it.

If someone says you're selfish, the fact that they say it means nothing. If they think that about you, it doesn't change anything. It's when your own thoughts react to what they say, and you start questioniong your own self worth, that's where the trouble begins. You let it offend you because you believe it as something that's true, just because someone said it. Your generosity etc. is not changed by what someone says. They're just words. That person can't even see the real you, all they see is what they think you are. What they think you are isn't what you are.

What I'm trying to say is, opinions of you don't mean anything. You are what you are. What someone else thinks has no bearing on that whatsoever. Nobody else can insult or hurt you, it's your own thoughts that do that to yourself. You say how much you care about what other people think of you. Why? What does that have to do with you? You will never truly know what someone thinks of you, because you cannot read their mind. Even if they say it to you, you can't know for sure. Even if you did know what they thought of you, it doesn't matter, because it doesn't change who you are.

If someone looks at you with disgust, it does not mean you are disgusting. It means that person's thoughts have disgusted them. If someone call you names, it doesn't mean you are what they call you, it means they can't cope with the thoughts they are having about who they think you are. They are always the one with the problem, it's their thoughts that are getting to them. It has nothing to do with you.

You are already different. Everybody is different. It seems like you feel that trying to be as "normal" as possible is really important. Normality doesn't exist, it's just an average. Everybody is weird in their own way. There isn't even anything weird about being gay, so many people are. More every day in fact. You're right that people will have to adjust to the new information that you're gay, but that's it. You will be exactly the same person, but you won't be hiding a huge secret. If anything, the huge weight on your shoulders from all of this is making you different, that's the part that's not normal. I don't know what your friends or family are like, but how would you feel if someone was keeping a huge secret from you, because they were afraid you wouldn't like them anymore? Would you not think they were being ridiculous?

needhelpguy wrote: »

I don't mean to hijack Messedup99's thread, I just wanted to reply to let him know there are many other guys out there just like him and while it's hard, it's ok to be not open or comfortable with being gay/bi. You don't have to go out with guys, tell anyone etc. It can be done. Yeah sometimes it's hard but there are consequences to everything. It can be dealt with.

I will be more than happy to continue this discussion here or via PM. Again, I do not want to offend anyone here, what I write is how I feel about my own situation, I have no problems with gay people, I love them! But it's not a life for me, not in this world.

You refer to gay people as if you're not one. Coming out is not what makes you gay, being attracted to your own gender is. Hiding it and refusing to accept it doesn't change anything, you are still gay. The first step is accepting that, because nothing will ever change it. It's not going to go away, you can't bury it no matter how hard you try.

Yes, it's okay to not be comfortable with it, but why do that to yourself? You can accept it and become comfortable with it, and still not tell anyone. Even if you come out, you don't have to scream it from the rooftops. I don't think words will ever explain the difference you'll feel just by accepting it or even telling a single person. It's not easy but it's worth it.

MicraBoy

needhelpguy wrote:

It's true that I have been asked on several occasions by family and friends if I am gay.

That is a pretty critical statement. People already have an opinion of you, if they have asked this question then they believe you are gay whether you are out or not, and whether you like it or not. If they have asked this question they are unlikely to change their opinion about you for the worseby you saying 'yes' the next time. In fact I suspect they will think better of you.

Reflector

needhelpguy wrote: »

It's true that I have been asked on several occasions by family and friends if I am gay. Of course I have denied it.

You've already been asked. They already suspect your lack of interest in the opposite sex might mean you are gay. If they are willing to ask they are probably willing to accept. No-one can help you guys until you help yourselves. In the meantime try and think about what has you so upset about being gay. You don't want a gay lifestyle. Well you can have whatever lifestyle you choose. Of course being gay means that you'll be having sex with men if this is what you mean by not wanting a gay lifestyle then you need to address this first.
Believe me when I say that many many gay men have gone through these feelings including myself. I am a much happier person for having come out. Get some help, professional help. Colleges all have councellors who are none judgemental. They wont try and convince you to do something but they are a good service to talk things through.

LegacyUser

Boston wrote: »

The original poster clearly has a desire for a romantic relationship though.

In fact, I don't have a desire for a romantic relationship. I am very much a solitary person.

Maybe thats due to the fact that I never tell anyone anything personal, which is probably due to being gay.

I am so secretive about me being gay that even chatting to someone online, I wouldn't disclose even the smallest bit of information in case, in the highly unlikely situation, that they could identify me!

Someone said exactly how I feel earlier, that I have to filter everything I say. I have to lie everytime I speak, I have to lead two lives, one public, and the other in my head. If I see a good looking woman going down the street I have to say "man, she's really hot". It's beyond a joke.

I really want to tell someone how I feel, but who can I tell? My brother? No, he's completely homophobic. My father? He would probably disown me? My mother? She probably wouldn't mind too much, except she would tell the world. My close friends? I can't trust any of them with a secret that big....

I feel like I'm stuck in some sort of limbo. I don't want to come out, but I'm depressed if I don't.

Cabbage Brained

MessedUp99 wrote: »

In fact, I don't have a desire for a romantic relationship. I am very much a solitary person.

Maybe thats due to the fact that I never tell anyone anything personal, which is probably due to being gay.

I am so secretive about me being gay that even chatting to someone online, I wouldn't disclose even the smallest bit of information in case, in the highly unlikely situation, that they could identify me!

Someone said exactly how I feel earlier, that I have to filter everything I say. I have to lie everytime I speak, I have to lead two lives, one public, and the other in my head. If I see a good looking woman going down the street I have to say "man, she's really hot". It's beyond a joke.

I really want to tell someone how I feel, but who can I tell? My brother? No, he's completely homophobic. My father? He would probably disown me? My mother? She probably wouldn't mind too much, except she would tell the world. My close friends? I can't trust any of them with a secret that big....

I feel like I'm stuck in some sort of limbo. I don't want to come out, but I'm depressed if I don't.

Mate, it seems to me that all of this bottling up your true emotions is making you both paranoid and delusional. Other people really don't care about you or what you're sexually attracted to, honestly. People are far too selfish and concerned with their own lives to give a **** about what you get up to behind closed doors.

There must be somebody you can tell. If you stress to them how important it is that it's kept secret, and tell them what you have told us, I really think it's extremely unlikely that they'll be that stupid and inconsiderate.

And as regards your brother, Dad etc, you'll be extremely surprised how their opinions will change once somebody they know and love turns out to be gay. Honestly, all that Irish male macho homophobic thing is simply down to lack of exposure to homosexuality in their every day lives. Nearly all of my mates used to make negative comments about gays in the past until I came out to them. Now they get more wound up about homophobia than I do! Honestly, you'd be really surprised how quickly peoples' opinions will change about an issue once it effects somebody they know and love. People are alot more adaptable and accepting than you are giving them credit for.

DubArk

MessedUp99 wrote: »

In fact, I don't have a desire for a romantic relationship. I am very much a solitary person.

Maybe thats due to the fact that I never tell anyone anything personal, which is probably due to being gay.

I am so secretive about me being gay that even chatting to someone online, I wouldn't disclose even the smallest bit of information in case, in the highly unlikely situation, that they could identify me!

Someone said exactly how I feel earlier, that I have to filter everything I say. I have to lie everytime I speak, I have to lead two lives, one public, and the other in my head. If I see a good looking woman going down the street I have to say "man, she's really hot". It's beyond a joke.

I really want to tell someone how I feel, but who can I tell? My brother? No, he's completely homophobic. My father? He would probably disown me? My mother? She probably wouldn't mind too much, except she would tell the world. My close friends? I can't trust any of them with a secret that big....

I feel like I'm stuck in some sort of limbo. I don't want to come out, but I'm depressed if I don't.

I really think that you are homophobic and once you get over the whole I Hate Being a Queer! thing and start to like the person you are that'll be good first move. Glass half empty or full?