The Xavi Hernandez Appreciation Thread

The G Child

Of course you'd take Fabregas if you had a straight choice between the 2, but thats because of his age. But on ability I would prefer Xavi. Cesc is a great player definitely but so is Xavi. Xavi is treated like a god in Barcelona and its not just because he's a Catalan (although they do "big up" the homegrown boys over there). It's because he is the heartbeat of the team. Everything goes through Xavi. I dont have anything against Fabregas, Just that I think Xavi is better.

My point was about the RTE pundits Brady, Giles and Dunphy villifying Aragones for not playing Fabregas. But if they are going with a 4-4-2 formation, I understand why he wasn't in the starting line-up. By them saying that it was a disgrace that he wasnt in was insinuating that Xavi was some sort of inferior player, which is ridiculous. To try and accomodate them both in the centre would mean dropping Senna which would be madness.

Boggles

The G Child wrote: »

Of course you'd take Fabregas if you had a straight choice between the 2, but thats because of his age.

No I would take Fabregas because of ability, 7 league goals and 19 league assists. Even more impressive when you consider he went off the boil for a bit after he got injured.

The G Child

Boggles wrote: »

No I would take Fabergas because of ability, 7 league goals and 19 league assists. Even more impressive when you consider he went off the boil for a bit after he got injured.

He got most of them goals at the begining of the season in a burst that was somewhat out of character. Don't let stats blind your judgement, as your glorious Paul Scholes only brought something like 2 goals to United this season. A midfield player is more than just scoring. If that was the case, Frank Lampard would be the best midfielder in the world. He's not. A player can be involved in goals without being credited with the assist also. A recent example of this is Arshavin for Zenit in the Uefa Cup final for the 2nd goal. He cut open the defence with a through ball and the other player rolled the ball across goal, but it was Arshavin who opened them up. Stats are misleading in the grand scheme of things.

Boggles

The G Child wrote: »

He got most of them goals at the begining of the season in a burst that was somewhat out of character. Don't let stats blind your judgement, as your glorious Paul Scholes only brought something like 2 goals to United this season. A midfield player is more than just scoring. If that was the case, Frank Lampard would be the best midfielder in the world. He's not. A player can be involved in goals without being credited with the assist also. A recent example of this is Arshavin for Zenit in the Uefa Cup final for the 2nd goal. He cut open the defence with a through ball and the other player rolled the ball across goal, but it was Arshavin who opened them up. Stats are misleading in the grand scheme of things.

A creative midfielders is exactly what it says - a midfielder who creates scoring chances, directly or indirectly.

Fabergas has 45 games played this season 13 goals and 24 assists. Stats like that can't be ignored, whatever spin you put on it. I'm a big fan of Fabergas and is the reason I make it my business to watch Arsenal. To compare him to Arshavin is ridiculous, Fabergas has played the "assist assist" ball plenty times this season.

As for your digg at Paul Scholes, if you actually watch football you will see his role as a midfielder has changed in the past 2 years.

Xavi6

Boggles wrote: »

A creative midfielders is exactly what it says - a midfielder who creates scoring chances, directly or indirectly.

Fabergas has 45 games played this season 13 goals and 24 assists. Stats like that can't be ignored, whatever spin you put on it. I'm a big fan of Fabergas and is the reason I make it my business to watch Arsenal. To compare him to Arshavin is ridiculous, Fabergas has played the "assist assist" ball plenty times this season.

As for your digg at Paul Scholes, if you actually watch football you will see his role as a midfielder has changed in the past 2 years.

To be fair, if you're going to count "assist assists" then Xavi is just as good if not better. There are very few Barca goals he isn't involved in at some point.

Boggles

Xavi6 wrote: »

To be fair, if you're going to count "assist assists" then Xavi is just as good if not better. There are very few Barca goals he isn't involved in at some point.

I wasn't counting them, it was a stupid point brought up that usually goes without saying when discussing the likes of Xavi and Fabregas. Of course more often than not they will be involved in a fair percentage of goals without being the actual person to deliver the final ball.

24 assists in 45 games can not be dismissed as a blind stat thou.

The G Child

Boggles wrote: »

I wasn't counting them, it was a stupid point brought up that usually goes without saying when discussing the likes of Xavi and Fabregas. Of course more often than not they will be involved in a fair percentage of goals without being the actual person to deliver the final ball.

24 assists in 45 games can not be dismissed as a blind stat thou.

How was it a stupid point brought up? You started pulling out the stats. What I said was that stats cant be dismissed but they cannot be taken as gospel either. If that was the case Lampard and Gerrard would be the best around. But they are not. And I wasn't comparing Fabregas to Arshavin, I was using a recent memorable example where a player supplied the decisive part in the goal but would not be credited in the stats. As Xavi6 stated, Xavi has a hand in most goals that Barca score at some stage.

I wasn't having a dig at Scholes as such, just that you keep bringing him up. His game has changed this season, but what are his goal and assist figures for last season? I don't know how many assists he got, but I'm sure he has been involved in many United goals that go uncredited. Sort of proves my point that stats can be decieving.

Boggles

The G Child wrote: »

How was it a stupid point brought up? You started pulling out the stats. What I said was that stats cant be dismissed but they cannot be taken as gospel either. If that was the case Lampard and Gerrard would be the best around. But they are not. And I wasn't comparing Fabregas to Arshavin, I was using a recent memorable example where a player supplied the decisive part in the goal but would not be credited in the stats. As Xavi6 stated, Xavi has a hand in most goals that Barca score at some stage.

Okay you don't take stats as gospel, Fabregas has the highest assist rate in the league for the past 2 seasons. Your point is Xavi although not having a high assist rate is involved in the build up play, would that not be the same as Fabgregas?

Something I think goes without saying since they are both creative midfielders who play in high passing teams. Maybe "stupid" was the wrong word, "obvious" would be better.

Stop speaking of Lampard and Gerrard as if they are nothing players, they are pretty decent too you know.

eZe^

I love Xavi, Xavi Xavi Xavi... He bailed Barca out of 2/3 games this season by grabbing a last ditch goal to salvage something... Lets hope with Barca's new defensive additions of Henrique, Pique, Alves, Cacares and to a lesser extent Keita means that Xavi can weave his magical passes...

The G Child

Boggles wrote: »

Okay you don't take stats as gospel, Fabregas has the highest assist rate in the league for the past 2 seasons. Your point is Xavi although not having a high assist rate is involved in the build up play, would that not be the same as Fabgregas?

Something I think goes without saying since they are both creative midfielders who play in high passing teams. Maybe "stupid" was the wrong word, "obvious" would be better.

Stop speaking of Lampard and Gerrard as if they are nothing players, they are pretty decent too you know.

I'm a Liverpool fan, but I don't buy into the Gerrard myth that he is the best midfield player in the world. He is a very good player, as is Lampard, but they are highlight players if ever there was highlight players. I use them in the example that if you were looking at stats, these 2 have scored and assisted more than any other midfielders in the last few years. Does it make them better players than the likes of Fabregas, Pirlo or Xavi? No of course it doesn't. As I've said before, I dont have anything against Fabregas, I just rate Xavi higher.

jank

I'm a Liverpool fan,

Oh that explains it....:D

MooseJam

never heard of the guy tbh

MementoMori

From the BBC gossip roundup website

Inter boss Jose Mourinho has told President Massimo Moratti he wants to sign Barcelona superstar Xavi, while Manchester United and Liverpool are also considering making a move. (Marca, 1240)

Cant see it happening in a million years,but out of interest Xavi6 who would you prefer he sign for if he did end up in England Utd or Pool? :):)

Mitch Connor

Marca.... what a joke. No chance barcelona would sell him. Just some messing from Madrid's media department.

Would be estactic if United managed to sign him though, obviously. Xavi has confirmed there has been interest from United in the past, but that he didn't and doesn't want to leave barcelona.

Xavi6

MementoMori wrote: »

Cant see it happening in a million years,but out of interest Xavi6 who would you prefer he sign for if he did end up in England Utd or Pool? :):)

It's 23.11, I'm about 20 minutes away from going to bed and you put that feckin thought in my head. I'll be having nightmares all night :mad:

It's a question I refuse to answer. Let's just say that if it ever did somehow happen then there would be a mass burning of jersys and I'd be straight over to Help Desk for a name change.

MementoMori

Sorry Xavi6 couldnt resist

TBH I think it's just a case of Xavi looking for a pay bump after Euro 2008combined with Marca winding up the Barca fans.

Reganio 2

He's good but he is no Stephen Ireland.

Jivin Turkey

The G Child wrote: »

Xavi is treated like a god in Barcelona and its not just because he's a Catalan (although they do "big up" the homegrown boys over there). It's because he is the heartbeat of the team. Everything goes through Xavi.

It is because he is a local lad. If he was "The Heartbeat of the Team" how come they managed to have their most succesful ever with him injured for most of it in 2006? He is just one of a collection of great players that make the club. It would be like solely attributing United's success this year to Ronaldo.

Also if he was THAT good, he would have finished more than two of Spain's games in the Euros. The fact that he was subbed off around the hour mark speaks volumes.

He is a fantastic player, no doubt about, but seeing as he was officially recognised as the best by UEFA he seems to have a few more hyperbolic fans who now feel their opinions are validated.

Sure it was Arshavin last week? Who next? Gareth Barry?

DSB

The idea of Xavi even considering joining Liverpool for a second is actually hilarious.

eZe^

Jivin Turkey wrote: »

Also if he was THAT good, he would have finished more than two of Spain's games in the Euros. The fact that he was subbed off around the hour mark speaks volumes.

Thats also down to fitness, he had been nursing some niggily injuries for a couple of weeks now...

The G Child

Jivin Turkey wrote: »

It is because he is a local lad. If he was "The Heartbeat of the Team" how come they managed to have their most succesful ever with him injured for most of it in 2006? He is just one of a collection of great players that make the club. It would be like solely attributing United's success this year to Ronaldo.

Also if he was THAT good, he would have finished more than two of Spain's games in the Euros. The fact that he was subbed off around the hour mark speaks volumes.

He is a fantastic player, no doubt about, but seeing as he was officially recognised as the best by UEFA he seems to have a few more hyperbolic fans who now feel their opinions are validated.

Sure it was Arshavin last week? Who next? Gareth Barry?

Yeah good points there, Barca's succesful period coincided with him being injured. It was nothing to do with players like Eto'o and Ronaldinho being at their peak, it was all about Xavi being injured :rolleyes:. Anyone who has watched this guy on a regular basis will know the type of player he is and his value to his teams. He is the heartbeat of the Barcelona and Spanish teams.

So you wouldn't solely attribute Uniteds success to Ronaldo last year would you not? Without his 40 odd goals, they still would have won the double? I wouldn't be so sure. How many games last year were they dragged through by him? Yeah, they have a brilliant defence, But without his attacking they might have struggled for the goals. Just my opinion.

Xavi might have only finished 2 of the 5 games for Spain, but he still started 5 of them ahead of Fabregas because Aragones knew his worth to the team and the Spanish style of play.

Xavi6

At half-time, Xavi, a player often taken for granted, had lost the ball just three times out of 37 passes while covering 5.74km. By full-time his pass completion stood at 93 per cent.

Podge2k7

Xavi6 wrote: »

money grabbing whores

Man City players?

Warper

Xavi has been the composer of Barcelona for the past 8-9 yrs (if not more). Everything flows through him. His touch, vision and intelligence is unique. This guy has been doing what he produced last night for years.

Now he has the perfect duo around him and he looks even better. The trio of Iniesta, Xavi and Messi is the best I have ever seen. They are almost telepathic and make the game look so easy which is always a sign of genius.

How much are these 3 worth? Priceless but for everything else there is Man City.

eirebhoy

Warper wrote: »

The trio of Iniesta, Xavi and Messi is the best I have ever seen.

I seriously doubt a team has ever had a better trio of playmakers together. I never realised Iniesta was so good until this season but he just has everything.

Pepe LeFrits

That Xavi, he's no Iniesta

The conductor, the accelerator and the Messi.

SlickRic

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

The conductor, the accelerator and the Messi.

i laughed

i agree, no need for a metaphor, 'messi' should be word in the dictionary.

Davaeo09

Quite simply Xavi is the link between attack and defense for Barca. He grabs the ball from a defender and finds gaps in mid-field, which in turn applies pressure to the opposition back line. But what really sets him apart for me is the fact he remains loyal to himself and the logic of Barcelona. He is the essence of the Spanish game. Pass and move, and always keeping possesion.

BUT

Without so many other stars at Barca, teams could appoint 2 or 3 players to choke him out. Luckily Barca have Iniesta who this season has become equal to, if not slightly better than Xavi, solely because he can drift into spaces with ease and gaurd the ball superbly.

As for the Cesc vs Xavi argument, all I can say is that they are both amazing players of similar quality, but Xavi seems to stand up and be counted when it matters, and is also slightly harder working.

Boggles

Between him now and Scholes in his prime, I'd have Scholes hands down.

And I'd put Fabregas just gone 22 before the both of them.

ironictoaster

Xavi, what a player. He's the ringleader of Barcalona, have a lot of respect for him.

I bought him in my FIFA game for 14 million! What a steal!

SlickRic

Boggles wrote: »

Between him now and Scholes in his prime, I'd have Scholes hands down.

And I'd put Fabregas just gone 22 before the both of them.

hands down is a little much, no?

preferring Scholes i've no problem with; i'd take Xavi because i prefer his style of football, but i can obviously see how someone would take Scholes - more of a goal threat etc.

thing is, for me, xaxi creates 30 goals a season too.

Xavi6

Boggles wrote: »

Between him now and Scholes in his prime, I'd have Scholes hands down.

No way

And I'd put Fabregas just gone 22 before the both of them.

You do realise how good Xavi was at 22? I know he wasn't in the Premiership for all to see like Fabregas....

JPA

Fabregas over Xavi? WTH?
Xavi is what Fabregas wishes he could one day become.

besty

Iniesta > Xavi.

Boggles

SlickRic wrote: »

thing is, for me, xaxi creates 30 goals a season too.

He this season, thats what makes it so exceptional, I think his record before that was 8.

Don't get me wrong, Xavi has been beyond exceptional this season and deserves world player of the year IMO.

I stand by what I said though Scholes for me in the last 15 years, rivals anyone in controlling and passing hands down.

Fabregas for at his age is more accomplished then the both of them at similar points in their careers.

SlickRic

besty wrote: »

Iniesta > Xavi.

for many he was better in the Champions League final, including myself.

but Xavi has been Barca's most important player for the guts of his career. for me it's doing him a massive disservice to put him as worse than anyone in that Barca team.

JPA

Fabregas for at his age is more accomplished then the both of them at similar points in their careers.

If you're talking in terms of a hypothetical transfer then Fabregeas would be a better signing. But Xavi is better than Fabregas now.

SlickRic

Boggles wrote: »

He this season, thats what makes it so exceptional, I think his record before that was 8.

Don't get me wrong, Xavi has been beyond exceptional this season and deserves world player of the year IMO.

I stand by what I said though Scholes for me in the last 15 years, rivals anyone in controlling and passing hands down.

i'm not touching the Cesc argument!

all of what you say is fine, and i agree with it really, but you did say Xavi 'now' and Scholes in his prime.

so i'd personally still take Xavi for the reasons i originally gave, though it is closer than many will argue.

Boggles

Xavi6 wrote: »

You do realise how good Xavi was at 22? I know he wasn't in the Premiership for all to see like Fabregas....

Jesus La Liga matches for the past 10-15 years have been widely more freely available than Prem matches, lets not go down that route, please.

Boggles

JPA wrote: »

If you're talking in terms of a hypothetical transfer then Fabregeas would be a better signing. But Xavi is better than Fabregas now.

Last 5 seasons All Comps including internationals.

Xavi Played 236 Goals 35 Assists 48

Fab Played 218 Goals 30 Assists 69

JPA

Boggles wrote: »

Last 5 seasons All Comps including internationals.

Xavi Played 236 Goals 35 Assists 48

Fab Played 218 Goals 30 Assists 69

Xavi is more withdrawn then Fabregas. Barcelona have Messi and Iniesta and had Ronaldinho and Deco who would receive the ball from Xavi and then do their magic. Xavi is more subtle and the team with him in it runs like clockwork. All IMO.

Boggles

JPA wrote: »

Xavi is more withdrawn then Fabregas. Barcelona have Messi and Iniesta and had Ronaldinho and Deco who would receive the ball from Xavi and then do their magic. Xavi is more subtle and the team with him in it runs like clockwork. All IMO.

Makes Fabs stats more impressive, considering Arsenals redevolpement and the fact he doesn't have all those stars that you mention around him.

Stats won't solve or answer the debate, but what we can get from them is that Fab 7/8 years Xavis junior has been more consistent over the past 5 seasons.

Age aside if I had 50-60 million to spend, Fab would be the purchase. IMO.

el rabitos

i'm reminded of what it was pep said to xavi years ago regarding iniesta.

"You're going to retire me. He's going to retire all of us." :pac:

Xavi6

Boggles wrote: »

Jesus La Liga matches for the past 10-15 years have been widely more freely available than Prem matches, lets not go down that route, please.

It wasn't meant as a dig. IMO lack of exposure is the only reason to say Xavi at 22 was not as good as Cesc is now.

gimmick

Holy thread bump Batman. I knew this was already here, so diod not feel the need to start a new one.

With all the paudits Messi is rightly getting, some (fewer and fewer it seems) are forgetting the little fella in the middle. The man who never gives a bad pass, and never gets caught in possession. Since Euro 2008 he has been head and shoulders above any other midfielder in the world. Such a pleasure to watch, he seems to be getting better as he has gone into his 30s.

I can see him lasting a few years yet as his game does not involve too much sprinting as he allows his easy passing game dictate what he needs to do.

A joy to behold.

Ush1

Yep, the man plays with slippers on he's so smooth.

Spiritoftheseventies

Xavi6 wrote: »

That's right folks, it's time to lavish praise on the Euro 2008 Player of the Tournament and the most creative midfielder in the world.

So where does he rank in terms of all time great central midfielders? Did he merely have one lucky good tournament or is his presence the catalyst for Spain's revival? (Somehow he was an unused sub in Euro 2004 and only returned from a cruciate ligament injury a few weeks before the last World Cup).

Personally I love the guy and worship every complete pass he makes (which is quite a lot). He's also adding a goal scoring aspect to his game, bagging 5 in the qualifiers.

So, opinions?

From Uefa.com

Jesus Xavi had no idea you liked him . For me Alonso gets the nod.

Ush1

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

Jesus Xavi had no idea you liked him . For me Alonso gets the nod.

Alonso gets the nod for what?

SlickRic

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

For me Alonso gets the nod.

forgive me, but are you on crack?

Tusky

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

Jesus Xavi had no idea you liked him . For me Alonso gets the nod.

Alonso is one of my favorite players - but thats a crazy statement. Xavi is a class above.