Post June 30th: Driving unaccompanied and got stopped - post your experience here

--amadeus-- · 02-07-2008 1:13pm

The Scientist wrote: »

No he was a 19yr old apprentice carpenter on his way home from work in a normal peugeot work van. He said the Cops just said its illegal to drive without a full licence driver and slapped the fine on him.
Pretty harsh for a 19yr apprentice to be shelling out a grand.

Would it be harsh if he was fined €1,000 for assault or burglary? Or for speeding? Or drunk driving?

Like it or not that's the law, he knew the risk and took a chance.

Hanley · 02-07-2008 1:24pm

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Would it be harsh if he was fined €1,000 for assault or burglary? Or for speeding? Or drunk driving?

Like it or not that's the law, he knew the risk and took a chance.

Ah yeah.... sure having green paper instead of pink is the same as attacking someone, or driving in an unsafe manner likely to cause harm....

I'm sure there are some draconian laws that aren't being enforced that we need to dig up and make sure the Gardai are aware of them. Cos you know, like it or not, it's the law.

--amadeus-- · 02-07-2008 1:26pm

Hanley wrote: »

Ah yeah.... sure having green paper instead of pink is the same as attacking someone, or driving in an unsafe manner likely to cause harm....

I hate to break it to you but in the law's eye's what a learner is doing by driving unancompanied is driving in an unsafe manner. The Guards can fine you if your tyres don't have the right depth of tread because the car is then considered unsafe. Think of the experinced driver in the same way - a piece of safety equipment you have to have with you at all times!

TheElf · 02-07-2008 1:28pm

Hanley wrote: »

I'm sure there are some draconian laws that aren't being enforced that we need to dig up and make sure the Gardai are aware of them. Cos you know, like it or not, it's the law.

There's a law that states

Any person who shall pretend or exercise to use any type of witchcraft, sorcery, enchantment, or pretend knowledge in any occult or or craft or science shall for any such offense suffer imprisonment at the time of one whole year and also shall be obliged to obscursion for his/her good behavior.

I'd love to see that one enforced! :pac:

But seriously, I think the new laws are going to iron out well over the next few months, It's a bit messy how it's playing out now but in the long run it will stop too many L drivers driving around like they own the roads, BTW I am still on my 2nd prov. Waiting for my test a couple of months now.

It is a shame to see the hard working L drivers who are actually good drivers, better than some full license drivers I know,put off the roads until their test, but arguing to a computer screen wont allow you to drive your car against the new laws, I'm not taking a dig at any L drivers, I'm still one myself, I'm just giving my opinion that the law is here, we just have to adapt to it in a reasonable way.

Hanley · 02-07-2008 2:14pm

--amadeus-- wrote: »

I hate to break it to you but in the law's eye's what a learner is doing by driving unancompanied is driving in an unsafe manner. The Guards can fine you if your tyres don't have the right depth of tread because the car is then considered unsafe. Think of the experinced driver in the same way - a piece of safety equipment you have to have with you at all times!

I take your point, but the other offences that you mentioned are ones which are pretty much guaranteed to hurt another person in some way. Every robbery, attack and a lot of drink driving cases end in injury or other issues for the third party.

I would say the majority of provisional holders aren't going to go around effecting third parties in a dangerous way.

Anyway, this article was posted in another thread and thought it might be of interest here;
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/learner-drivers-to-be-spared-new-rules-crackdown-1422902.html

It seems they WON'T be issuing on the spot fines, which makes me wonder whether that chap in Chareville was telling the truth. And it seems they don't intend impounding cars... The one that the previous posters OH saw being put on a tow truck could have been for several other reasons such as +3 months out of tax/insurance or it may have been non-VRT'd.

Hanley · 02-07-2008 2:18pm

TheElf wrote: »

There's a law that states

Any person who shall pretend or exercise to use any type of witchcraft, sorcery, enchantment, or pretend knowledge in any occult or or craft or science shall for any such offense suffer imprisonment at the time of one whole year and also shall be obliged to obscursion for his/her good behavior.

I'd love to see that one enforced! :pac:

But seriously, I think the new laws are going to iron out well over the next few months, It's a bit messy how it's playing out now but in the long run it will stop too many L drivers driving around like they own the roads, BTW I am still on my 2nd prov. Waiting for my test a couple of months now.

It is a shame to see the hard working L drivers who are actually good drivers, better than some full license drivers I know,put off the roads until their test, but arguing to a computer screen wont allow you to drive your car against the new laws, I'm not taking a dig at any L drivers, I'm still one myself, I'm just giving my opinion that the law is here, we just have to adapt to it in a reasonable way.

I fully agree with that post and would quite honestly have no problem supporting the sensible enforcement of it. As a long run thing it should be good... 2 years down the road test times should be pretty much zero as the only people looking for tests are gonna be 17-19 year olds.

But right now, with the way the testing system is, I can't say I back the way it's being brought in. I'm waiting 6 weeks on a test date at this stage, so I'll have been a minimum of 10 weeks waiting. Almost twice the "average" waiting period in my test centre...

JP Liz · 02-07-2008 2:18pm

If you are caught without L Plates and without a full licence driver accompaning you what exactly are the penalties please? I'm confused?

Is it €1000? Is the car impounded by Gardai? Do you get penalty points?

Snakeblood · 02-07-2008 2:24pm

JP Liz wrote: »

If you are caught without L Plates and without a full licence driver accompaning you what exactly are the penalties please? I'm confused?

Is it €1000? Is the car impounded by Gardai? Do you get penalty points?

Without L PLates: 1000
Without full licensed driver: 1000

I think the impounding or whatever is at the guards discretion. Presumably if you have caved in someone's head with the car, they might want to take it in and swab it for teeth and bone fragments.

Hanley · 02-07-2008 2:26pm

Snakeblood wrote: »

Without L PLates: 1000
Without full licensed driver: 1000

I think the impounding or whatever is at the guards discretion. Presumably if you have caved in someone's head with the car, they might want to take it in and swab it for teeth and bone fragments.

Is this only on the back of a court appearance tho?

SheroN · 02-07-2008 2:32pm

Hanley wrote: »

Is this only on the back of a court appearance tho?

Yes. It's not an on the spot fine. It has to go to court. Hence if someone is charged 80% of the cases will be struck out because the guard in question won't be bothered showing up on the day.

Hanley · 02-07-2008 2:36pm

SheroN wrote: »

Yes. It's not an on the spot fine. It has to go to court. Hence if someone is charged 80% of the cases will be struck out because the guard in question won't be bothered showing up on the day.

Is that some hyperbole or are you serious? I genuinely have no idea how many cases are struck down for guard non-appearance.

Presumably this gives you the chance to go talk to the guard yourself personally and plead your case before the court date and see if it can be pulled?

Snakeblood · 02-07-2008 2:38pm

Hanley wrote: »

Is that some hyperbole or are you serious? I genuinely have no idea how many cases are struck down for guard non-appearance.

Presumably this gives you the chance to go talk to the guard yourself personally and plead your case before the court date and see if it can be pulled?

Probably the time to make your case is when he has you pulled over. That's how I plan on doing it.

Hanley · 02-07-2008 2:42pm

Snakeblood wrote: »

Probably the time to make your case is when he has you pulled over. That's how I plan on doing it.

Well of course, but unless the Robocop project has been implement the Gardai are still human and can be subject to having the odd bad day here or there.

They might be having a bad day, maybe been dealing with a shower of knobs all day etc and you might be the poor soul who gets punished for it!

techdiver · 02-07-2008 2:43pm

Hanley wrote: »

I'm waiting 6 weeks on a test date at this stage, so I'll have been a minimum of 10 weeks waiting. Almost twice the "average" waiting period in my test centre...

I've been waiting 10 weeks and still no date yet. Which means I will have been waiting at least 14 weeks for my test (assuming I get my date this week, which I won't!). That is not the 7 week wait that is advertised!

So I'm waiting at least twice the average waiting time. I wonder who's getting the test within 1 week to balance out my outlandish wait!!

SheroN · 02-07-2008 2:44pm

Hanley wrote: »

Is that some hyperbole or are you serious? I genuinely have no idea how many cases are struck down for guard non-appearance.

Presumably this gives you the chance to go talk to the guard yourself personally and plead your case before the court date and see if it can be pulled?

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/learner-drivers-to-be-spared-new-rules-crackdown-1422902.html

"As one senior member of the garda traffic corps explained: "There have been no specific instructions to come down in any way heavy on anybody. If they haven't got a qualified driver with them they won't be fined on the spot, but they are liable to be prosecuted and brought to court.

But, he said, "it's down to the individual garda's discretion and it will generally be people who have been misbehaving who will end up in court. If people are driving at the correct speed, then they are not going to be drawing attention to themselves."

Hanley · 02-07-2008 2:51pm

techdiver wrote: »

I've been waiting 10 weeks and still no date yet. Which means I will have been waiting at least 14 weeks for my test (assuming I get my date this week, which I won't!). That is not the 7 week wait that is advertised!

So I'm waiting at least twice the average waiting time. I wonder who's getting the test within 1 week to balance out my outlandish wait!!

Lol I got into that argument last night and was told it all balances itself out. Tbh I'm still very skeptical as to the accuracy of the advertised "average" waiting times.

What test centre are you waiting that long for?

techdiver · 02-07-2008 3:03pm

Hanley wrote: »

Lol I got into that argument last night and was told it all balances itself out. Tbh I'm still very skeptical as to the accuracy of the advertised "average" waiting times.

What test centre are you waiting that long for?

Churchtown.

It's the same crap all over the place. Girlfriend was waiting since March for a test in Limerick and she finally got her date for next Friday 11th.

That's not even near the 7 weeks average claimed either.

I think they doctored their numbers to ensure they "met their commitment" to have the test less than 10 weeks for all applicants. Not at all like the Irish public service to deliver in such a timely and quality manner.

Hanley · 02-07-2008 3:07pm

techdiver wrote: »

Churchtown.

It's the same crap all over the place. Girlfriend was waiting since March for a test in Limerick and she finally got her date for next Friday 11th.

That's not even near the 7 weeks average claimed either.

I think they doctored their numbers to ensure they "met their commitment" to have the test less than 10 weeks for all applicants. Not at all like the Irish public service to deliver in such a timely and quality manner.

Sounds like an exact repeat of the things I said yesterday. Anyway I'm waiting on Finglas and as it stands I'll be AT LEAST 10 weeks.

The worst part about the wait is that it makes not driving that much harder since there's no real indication as to when I'll be put out of my misery.

muletide · 02-07-2008 3:11pm

Jesus Christ this thread is in bad need of a mod that is doing ther job.

Only one or two posts have been on topic. Can you people read

Post June 30th: Driving unaccompanied and got stopped - post your experience here

Stop your debates or else go somewhere else and Mods do your job.

techdiver · 02-07-2008 3:12pm

Hanley wrote: »

Sounds like an exact repeat of the things I said yesterday. Anyway I'm waiting on Finglas and as it stands I'll be AT LEAST 10 weeks.

The worst part about the wait is that it makes not driving that much harder since there's no real indication as to when I'll be put out of my misery.

I feel your pain. They could at least provide us with a test date. Surely the system can allocate test dates upon receipt of applications in a quicker manner? All I'm asking for is a date for Gods sake, is that too much to ask for?

I'm probably going to just break the law until I get my test as they have not kept to their commitment, so why should I play by their rules.

Anyway the Gardaí have no interest in enforcing this. They have already enough to be doing then enforcing the RSA's lip service crusade!

Not one life will be saved by this measure, not one!

Wishbone Ash · 02-07-2008 3:30pm

muletide wrote: »

Jesus Christ this thread is in bad need of a mod that is doing ther job.

Only one or two posts have been on topic. Can you people read

Post June 30th: Driving unaccompanied and got stopped - post your experience here

Stop your debates or else go somewhere else and Mods do your job.

See posts #2,3,4 and 5. I knew it wouldn't work and said so.

I'll let the whinging and ranting go on for another while before I lock 'er up. Things might have settled then. If I deleted every off topic post, there would be about 6 left!

And muletide - no back seat modding please.

(or I'll have to get out the big stick).

Noonan21 · 02-07-2008 3:46pm

I have just walked all the way from town (conygham road) to lucan. Got stopped by a Garda. He pounded me car and fined me a grand, big lanky red head from boggerland. He said he was on commission for any fines he is giving out :eek:

SheroN · 02-07-2008 3:49pm

Noonan21 wrote: »

I have just walked all the way from town (conygham road) to lucan. Got stopped by a Garda. He pounded me car and fined me a grand, big lanky red head from boggerland. He said he was on commission for any fines he is giving out :eek:

Did you have L plates up?

Did you get stopped at a checkpoint?

Did you have a letter of test application with you?

Snakeblood · 02-07-2008 3:50pm

SheroN wrote: »

Did you have L plates up?

Did you get stopped at a checkpoint?

Did you have a letter of test application with you?

I doubt they're on comission.

SheroN · 02-07-2008 3:52pm

Snakeblood wrote: »

I doubt they're on comission.

I doubt it too

Noonan21 · 02-07-2008 3:53pm

SheroN wrote: »

Did you have L plates up?

Did you get stopped at a checkpoint?

Did you have a letter of test application with you?

I got me kid to draw me my own L plates up , Garda didnt seem too impressed with them. No it wasnt a checkpoint , lukcy he didnt breathalise me but..
dont know how to apply for my test? think i better now

Noonan21 · 02-07-2008 3:54pm

Snakeblood wrote: »

I doubt they're on comission.

he said he was seemed delighted with himself big red headed grin on him,:mad:

Snakeblood · 02-07-2008 3:56pm

Noonan21 wrote: »

I got me kid to draw me my own L plates up , Garda didnt seem too impressed with them. No it wasnt a checkpoint , lukcy he didnt breathalise me but..
dont know how to apply for my test? think i better now

Stick a copper penny under your tongue, that'll neutralise the gargle.

unkel · 02-07-2008 4:11pm

Noonan21 banned for trolling

yom 1 · 02-07-2008 4:14pm

techdiver wrote: »

I've been waiting 10 weeks and still no date yet. Which means I will have been waiting at least 14 weeks for my test (assuming I get my date this week, which I won't!). That is not the 7 week wait that is advertised!

So I'm waiting at least twice the average waiting time. I wonder who's getting the test within 1 week to balance out my outlandish wait!!

Yeah there advertised times are nowhere near reality

By the time I sit my test in a few weeks I will have been waiting 18 weeks for it

Post June 30th: Driving unaccompanied and got stopped - post your experience here

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