RSA Opinion

peachystarr

jhegarty wrote: »

The RSA chief executive Noel Brett good enough ?


http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0630/licence.html

Ok so that one person??

I still firmly believe its not the only reason the law was changed. Whether it will or will not reduce fatal/serious crashes nobody knows, theres still people out there with very little driving experience thinking they are perfectly safe to go solo and this is what needs to be changed.

Everyone improves with practices and experience and those withoutit should not be driving unaccompanied. End of.

Thanks

Solitaire

And, funny coincidence, that article is like almost everything coming out from between the RSA's buttcheeks - curiously lacking in statistics to prove their point :rolleyes:

Not that I approve of the old system - it could only be improved significantly with massively strengthened observation of the provisional drivers so that they couldn't get away with not making any effort at improving their skills, being safe drivers and getting the test done. Now that the RSA has done a good job of terrifying all the old provisional drivers into either getting pinkslips or getting off the roads the new system, while abhorrent to those who knew and loved the old system, is effective in this new era, against the new crop of learners. And I'm guessing the moves to make the test a bit easier will have to be permanent because of it - 30-40 hours at €35-50/hr will not give the same kind of driving experience (and is a lot more financially crippling) as 20-30 hrs and several thousand more learning unaccompanied like we used to. But those rotten apples spoiled that barrel, didn't they?

Er... actually they didn't. It wasn't the rotten apples that turned the barrel (though bad drivers there most certainly were), it was our old chums in the EU injecting it with a healthy dose of cyanide that did it. What annoys me most isn't the deluded chanting that all provisional drivers were lethal (note to mods: If you're so passionate, show us the stats!) or that the new system fixes the problems with the old system, it's the risible idea that the RSA has anyone's best interests in mind, other than getting us EU-compliant and undoubtedly giving favourable nudges to several (dozen) rich people's *cough*Gaybo*cough* stock portfolios. Oh, and as a platform to introduce more dodgy legislation to STOP THOSE EVIL LEARNERS!!1! (probably something along the lines of 42 days detention; after all we MUST copy all of England's mistakes at every available opportunity!) The idea that ANY of this was to improve road safety for OUR sake isn't naive, its just ignorant. Its the usual game of reaching full compliance with the EU standard whatever the cost.

Ultimately, while this rank-tasting medicine has been very hard to swallow, its still doing its job and making us better. I think that the new system, while rather draconian, will serve us well in the long run even if not the most effective way of dealing with the situation we had (just the cheapest way, par the course for our bhoys in the dail). But I'd still like to see all those stats RSA! Until then stop trying to prejudice us against some of our most vulnerable road users for no good reason and just say it like it is! :mad:

sonicthebadger*

Solitaire wrote: »

And, funny coincidence, that article is like almost everything coming out from between the RSA's buttcheeks - curiously lacking in statistics to prove their point :rolleyes:

...

But I'd still like to see all those stats RSA! Until then stop trying to prejudice us against some of our most vulnerable road users for no good reason and just say it like it is! :mad:

Here's a few concerning motorbikes.

http://www.rsa.ie/Home/upload/File/Motorcycle%20Report%2097%20-%2006.pdf

wil

Why all this call for statistics, it's not exactly rocket science.
The rest of the world has been driving for decades, we're hardly even in to the teenage years. It doesnt take a genius to see we've been doing it aresways here for most of that time.

Statistics for Ireland at this time would be almost impossible to interpret as we've had such a mixed up system where people do and dont learn to drive. How do you figure out which learners actually took some lessons and which never bothered, which never drove yet had provisionals for years, which drove daily.

Take it from the rest of the world, what we had was NOT a good thing. It just suited some people. And the gov didnt want to upset the apple tart.

We've been told by the EU years ago to sort out our roads or they would do it for us. Time they honoured that threat.

sonicthebadger*

wil wrote: »

Why all this call for statistics, it's not exactly rocket science.
The rest of the world has been driving for decades, we're hardly even in to the teenage years. It doesnt take a genius to see we've been doing it aresways here for most of that time.

Statistics for Ireland at this time would be almost impossible to interpret as we've had such a mixed up system where people do and dont learn to drive. How do you figure out which learners actually took some lessons and which never bothered, which never drove yet had provisionals for years, which drove daily.

Take it from the rest of the world, what we had was NOT a good thing. It just suited some people. And the gov didnt want to upset the apple tart.

We've been told by the EU years ago to sort out our roads or they would do it for us. Time they honoured that threat.

Lies, damn lies, and statistics

I agree with most of what you say there, but if we want to make decisions based on facts and not hear say or popular opinion then we have to record observable events in the real world and compare them to similar observations made in countries where we believe things are being done better. After we make a change the whole process must start again in order to see if we're fixing the problem, making it worse, or having no effect.

Without the stats we're flying blind. What works in another country is likely to work here, but not guaranteed to work. One size does not fit all.

Feachan

To help this debate along-the current thinking on novice drivers and their needs can be found in a Publication Young Drivers-The Road to Safety. For anyone who would like to dip in here is a link to the Report

http://www.erso.eu/knowledge/Fixed/06_young/novice%20drivers.pdf

wil

sonicthebadger* wrote: »

Without the stats we're flying blind. What works in another country is likely to work here, but not guaranteed to work. One size does not fit all.

Theres a job in the dail for people with ideas like that.

Lies, damned lies and politics:D:D

Yes lets honour the future dead on our roads by making them statistics. :rolleyes:
Then armed with the results in say 20 years form a delegation to appoint a committee to commission a report on what might be the best strategy to consider in another few decades. By which time everyone involved is retired or dead.

Or we could just do now what everyone else has done decades ago.
But of course we have to be different.:rolleyes:

sonicthebadger*

wil wrote: »

Theres a job in the dail for people with ideas like that.

As long as you'll vote for me!


But on a serious note, more southerly countries opposing things like DRL's has led to novel solutions to the problem by manufacturers like Audi and BMW.

I never said wait 20 years. It's the stats we have already that can highlight for us current areas in need of attention, the stats we have in 20 years will tell us how good a job we're doing then.

If we keep going the way we're going in 20 years we'll have sparse stats, which would be a very good thing and would show we're doing well.

Between 1998 and 2005 the number of licence holders increased by 21% while the number of road deaths decreased by 13%. Analysis of why that happened is extremely important. Unless you just magically know all the factors involved in bringing that about?