The War on Drugs

Dave!

Hey folks,

Just wondering what the general Garda's thoughts on the so-called war on drugs that has been on-going for decades.

If I recall correctly I think the Garda or customs estimate was that they only stop about 10% coming into the country. The Gardaí have some pretty significant seizures every so often, and secure a conviction of a few (small-time/patsy?) dealers, but do ye think this is majorly affecting the drug market in Ireland?

Is there anything that could be done that would make it more successful? Do ye think it will ever be successful?

The UN I believe had set 2008 as their target for eradicating the scourge of drugs..... suffice to say, it hasn't been successful!

Has production reduced or increased? Has consumption reduced or increased? Has related crime reduced or increased? Anybody got the stats?

Just looking to gauge opinions, since ye are the ones out there fighting this ostensibly noble, but apparantly futile, fight.

Cheers

ps. I don't fancy a debate on the merits of legalisation, so shall we just discuss the merits of the current approach then?

Eru

The problem is when you remove a supplier your opening up the door for another to start or expand and therefore it really is an eternal struggle because the profit margins are so big that theres a line of replacements waiting in the wings.

In my opinion its going to take a 3 pronged assault on drugs. First of being addicitive means a customer remains a customer once they have started and its not like sticking on a patch once a day. I can honestly say I would rather stay oon heroin than try to kick it after seeing people in various stages of cold turkey. But anyway, you need to work to get addicts clean and more importantly, keep them clean. I dont have the answer to that one Im afraid.

Secondly you need to keep people away in the first place. Ads and awareness is a good method but it needs to be done more and its vital that every myth surrounding the various drugs are exterminated and the cold hard reality nailed into peoples heads.

Lastly you need severe and loop hole free laws and sentencing on a universal front. Global is unrealistic but I think the EU could sit down and draw up EU wide laws so regardless of where or when your involved in drugs every EU state that come down hard. IE sitting in Amsterdam is not going to get you any protection or different treatment than being involved / caught in Ireland or the UK regardless of what your involvement was.

I know some will disagree but I think we need to come down hard on people that are just 'holding' and 'personal use' as this will work with parts 1 and 2 to reduce the customers. No customers = no supplier. Take Spain for example, its perfectly legal to have drugs in your posession once the quantity falls within a 'personal use' limit. Thats not compatable with our laws and does nothing to decrease demand IMHO.

Of course that means a combined and genuine effort from every department and at the moment theres neither the will power or resources within Irish prisons to genuinely combat drug use within the prison population.

And Im not even getting into the governments stance on drugs considering the recent newspaper articles concerning our 'zero tolerance' politicians :rolleyes:

In regards use, I think certain drugs are going down, certain rocketing up and others are just not being noticed as much as they used to so its hard to gauge. Cocaine use within 'normal' people has blown up completely for various reason such as more cash, mis truths concerning use and pure stupidity. Heroin is down I think whereas hash, ectasy and others have simple slipped into acceptance.

yayamark

Theres a million ways to help fight this and this discussion could go on for ever which is good:)

We are a small island and have a smaller fleet of customs and naval ships policing our coasts. Increase those ships on our coasts ASAP.

Manadatory Sentences should mean Manadatory Sentences

The Customs Drug Dogs seem to be unbelieveably successful at the moment

---

increase those muuts now.

OK those points will cost millions on our state that at the moment does not have a copper excuse the pun

I dont think we'll ever stop the importation of drugs into this country but definitely more can be done.

sunnyjim

There is a problem with 'education' people about drugs, because it gives them a sense that they know all their is to know about the drug.

For example, the more educated ravers in London don't buy E anymore, because it's cut with so much **** - they get MDMA in a powder form, the actual active compound in E. Educated - yes, as they know it's not cut with X, Y or Z, but at the end of the day the MDMA can do the damage itself.

deadwood

Lets start with fags and booze so. They're killing a lot more people than controlled drugs.
Maybe Mr. Lenihan will consider legalising them to raise revenue, now that things are a bit tight and we can spend more time on motorways dishing out tickets to decent joes to pay for our lavish lifestyles etc...:)

timmywex

Every district should have a dedictated divisional drugs unit...they dont! In wexford for example, the ordinary detectives do drugs, but they cant give it full resources, and they cover rossalre europort also!

deadwood

timmywex wrote: »

Every district should have a dedictated divisional drugs unit...they dont! In wexford for example, the ordinary detectives do drugs, but they cant give it full resources, and they cover rossalre europort also!

How about a divisional/district unit looking out for alcoholics and related problems? We spend a hell of a lot more time dealing with them than drug addicts... no matter where we work.
What i'm saying is, shouldn't we (i.e. society, not just guards) be looking at drug abuse as more of a social problem than a criminal one?

keen

The war will never be won, it will only be dented slighly.

There's just too a high a demand and their will always be people willing to buy no amount of education will change that.

deadwood

Heh heh heh.
Love it.
Pop-up ad on top of the thread for "grow your own".
And it's beside the "Garda Preparaion" course ad.
I couldn't have planned it better myself.

TheNog

Can we win the war on drugs?

Answer = No. If we look at the many big siezures, there was a huge amount of work, time and resources put into the seizure long before the actual seizure took place. Sometimes of course we get lucky but these are put down to pure chance.

At the moment I feel that it is the Customs and the Gardai who are getting the most resources in an effort to comabt the drugs problem but quite frankly we need more addiction treatment centres and better education. Not to take away from the people who work in education and drug addiction centres, they do a brilliant job with the little resources they have.

Fyr.Fytr

Neighbour of mine recently got out of prision clean, had a place in rehab but the earliest they could take him was october, so with nothing to do he got back on drugs again.

They need to go straight from one to the other, but alas not enough room

KozmicKitten

Is there anything you can do about drug addicts openly shooting-up in your area?

TheNog

If its a constant thing then sent in a letter to your local superintendent or highlight it to your local TD who will in turn notify the super. Either way is a good thing to do also the council may get involved if there is something they can do to move them on.

It kind of makes sense of the Dutch approach of having centres for drug addicts to use clean needles and in a safe environment.

Dyr

Fyr.Fytr wrote: »

Neighbour of mine recently got out of prision clean, had a place in rehab but the earliest they could take him was october, so with nothing to do he got back on drugs again.

They need to go straight from one to the other, but alas not enough room

rehab is no great shakes when its only a fye clinic tbh. I hate to say it but if you legalise or regulate certain drugs then you're going to do a lot to lower crime in this country, prohibition hasnt worked.

Eru

KozmicKitten wrote: »

Is there anything you can do about drug addicts openly shooting-up in your area?

As a citizen contact your td and complain complain complain. 3 years ago they announced drop in centres for addicts to get them away from public areas and safe disposal of needles etc. Not a single centre has been opened to date.

Fyr.Fytr wrote: »

Neighbour of mine recently got out of prision clean, had a place in rehab but the earliest they could take him was october, so with nothing to do he got back on drugs again.

They need to go straight from one to the other, but alas not enough room

Mostly agree that straight from a to b is better but dont agree with the highlighted. Everyone has a choice, I realise its very hard but its his CHOICE on what to do and he is making his decisions.

Fyr.Fytr

I'm not condoning his actions but im just saying the govt need to put the services in place.

The judicial system has played his part (arrested, charged, had a fair trial and incarceration) and the the health service is a let down only for them to come back into the judicial system again.

Standman

The war on drugs is a futile wast of time and money. In my opinion the only way to stop illegal drug use is to have a totalitarian government. I think it is absolutely impossible otherwise, demonstrated by the prohibition of drug use failing time and time again, not just in Ireland, but all over the world.

That's the thing about freedom, you have to take the "bad" with the "good" when it comes to personal choice, otherwise it just ain't freedom!