Minister announces new firearms laws on the way for handguns

fat-tony

bunny shooter wrote: »

Mr. Super, I'm telling you a Glock .40 is an ISSF pistol

Sorry BS - Glock .40 is not an ISSF pistol.
Rule 8.4.6 - max calibre for centrefire pistol is .38 (9.65mm)

bunny shooter

fat-tony wrote: »

Sorry BS - Glock .40 is not an ISSF pistol.
Rule 8.4.6 - max calibre for centrefire pistol is .38 (9.65mm)

I was actually being sarcastic in the light of the recent judgement (should have added a :rolleyes: to comment :eek:)

Grizzly 45

Sorry Sparks...my country???????I am asking not what I can do for my country..But what has my country done for me recently!!
We are all supposedly Europeans nowadays.If it wasnt for the fact that I have an elderly parent living here,and a large hunk of real estate.I would never have set foot back here in the 90s,I was living in one of the most gun friendly states in the US.I sure as hell didnt come back here for our friendly gun laws.A few emigrations??Hmm reckon the next lot leaving here will be on the same if not more than the 80s.
So if I had to leave DEAR ol Ireland.Iwouldnt be too upset.

Dunno where you are getting he wants them gone...all he has said is tighting up the legislation,not an outright ban.At this point may it would be more helpful that people start finding out how many illegal handguns and firearms out there in general in Ireland,and make the minister aware that he should be concentrating on that,and leave ligit gunowners alone.Another grassroots campain is in order again in Oct when he comes back nice and tanned from Cannes or wherever.We have till Autumn,organise and use the time to do somting useable.



BS.
IS that market value?Or Irish Govt value??And what grauntee will you have it is paid out??The UK had the same,and not many people were paid out if I remember correctly.Of course you could surrender it too.With the barrels plugged up the mechanisms destroyed,all accessories and scopes removed,and they stillhave to compensate you for scrap.Doesnt say they have to be woirking guns either.Very Celtic too.Irish warriors in olden times destroyed their swords rather than surrender them to the enemy in defeat.
Proff of throwing off cliff. Video cam,and youtube it.

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Sorry Sparks...my country???????I am asking not what I can do for my country..But what has my country done for me recently!!

Then think of it as leaving your house and land. Or whatever else you think you'll lose if you decide to take your firearm and GTFO of here.

IS that market value?Or Irish Govt value??And what grauntee will you have it is paid out??The UK had the same,and not many people were paid out if I remember correctly.

You don't. They paid out far more than any estimate and everyone got bluebook value for their firearms as new - cue lots of people finding old rusted-up pieces of crud and getting paid large sums for them.

Very Celtic too.Irish warriors in olden times destroyed their swords rather than surrender them to the enemy in defeat.

FFS Grizzly...

Grizzly 45

Sparks wrote: »

Then think of it as leaving your house and land. Or whatever else you think you'll lose if you decide to take your firearm and GTFO of here.You don't. They paid out far more than any estimate and everyone got bluebook value for their firearms as new - cue lots of people finding old rusted-up pieces of crud and getting paid large sums for them.FFS Grizzly...

Good point there Sparks that the payouts cost more than expected...Make that point loud&clear in the media here,that if the minister goes around banning and paying as he must under law.It will cost the taxpayer many more millions,and be seen as more govt wastage in a looming recession..Oh more good politics there boys.Pay a minority who have done nothing a fortune in taxpayers money for private property.
Watch those ratings go dowwwwwnnnn.

Take it as a historical ditty,nothing else.Loosen up abit Mr Spock,you are going all Vulcan on us again:):)

sidneyreilly

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Just for an example were full bore practical pistol to fall here[NOTE I am now speaking in a personal capacity,not on behalf of the IPSA ].It would be no big deal to change down to doing the same shooting with a pistol in 22lr,so simply sureender the 9mm upper and put a 22lr conversion kit on the lower.Or buy a ruger.22lr and shoot the same course.It is being done in Europe and countries where full bore is a problem.So ban 22lr pistols..fine.Go to airsoft!
[YES there would be eventually a crossover].legally bought here ,no liscense,can have ALL the nasty restricted features of the real thing.And this is becoming the fastest growth of practical shooting sports ,out in the Far East& China,where gun ownership is a problem.

NOT that I would want to do this type of shooting,but if needs be I can adapt..And I cant see why the average Irish shooter cant do likewise.
Didnt the UK adapt after Dunblane and Hungerford???Freaky long barreled handguns and straight pull bolt actions.Adapt,Improvise,Overcome.

Sweet Jesus! How many compititions have you shot? There is utterly no comparison between airsoft/.22 and 9mm/.40. Does your ,other know you are out?

cavan shooter

Lads get away from those scary pistol rounds that has everyone having heart attacks over. Black militaristic multiple shot magazines.
Go for a shiny 22 Hornet revolver, it's only 22 after all:D:D

http://www.magnumresearch.com/news_detail.asp?story=shoottimes04.asp

bunny shooter

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

.....Irish warriors in olden times destroyed their swords rather than surrender them to the enemy in defeat.....

And you have firearms. Not very often I agree with Sparks, FFS are you for real ?

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Good point there Sparks that the payouts cost more than expected...Make that point loud&clear in the media here,that if the minister goes around banning and paying as he must under law.It will cost the taxpayer many more millions,and be seen as more govt wastage in a looming recession..Oh more good politics there boys.Pay a minority who have done nothing a fortune in taxpayers money for private property.
Watch those ratings go dowwwwwnnnn.

You're assuming that 2,000-odd pistols at 500-odd quid each (because the rest of the kit won't be banned, just the firearm) will cause a stir. Or that they'll even have a buy-back program instead of simply refusing to licence them (which legally means you cannot have them, but you'd find that there'd be no problem with handing them in to your local garda and then selling them internationally).

Grizzly 45

sidneyreilly wrote: »

Sweet Jesus! How many compititions have you shot? There is utterly no comparison between airsoft/.22 and 9mm/.40. Does your ,other know you are out?

Sidney I would suggest you have a good enquiry on the latest IPSC AGM .There is already a comission set up on this and it is going ahead apprently so that a huge market of Japan,China and SE Aisa can get into dynamic shooting,because of the total gun bans out there.Take it up with IPSC HQ not me if you dont like it!
And WTF has how many competitions I have shot got to do with anything???Oh DUH!! I dont know the difference between 9mm/40SW and 22 airsoft.??
I demand a retaction of your last statement here Sir!:mad::mad:

Grizzly 45

bunny shooter wrote: »

And you have firearms. Not very often I agree with Sparks, FFS are you for real ?

See last post on this.:rolleyes:

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

I demand a retaction of your last statement here Sir!:mad::mad:

Let's not go down that road here, thanks. Grizzly, if you're right, then that's sufficient. If you're not, then that's sufficient too. You've cited supporting evidence; leave it there.

BS, I think we can leave it there too.

bunny shooter

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

See last post on this.:rolleyes:

I did and still ask same questions :rolleyes:

Grizzly 45

Sparks wrote: »

You're assuming that 2,000-odd pistols at 500-odd quid each (because the rest of the kit won't be banned, just the firearm) will cause a stir. Or that they'll even have a buy-back program instead of simply refusing to licence them (which legally means you cannot have them, but you'd find that there'd be no problem with handing them in to your local garda and then selling them internationally).

Thats pretty cheap Sparks.A common or garden Glock here fetches between 700/1000 euros here.Les Bear monolith 45 ACP OTOH is appx 2.5K.Not to mind all the " firearm components" that have to go as well.That includes now everything from grip screws to replacement slides,mags etc etc.So being liberal with bits value each gun could cost in around 2K if not more if the owner is constructive.
Not al ot but still another barb in the govt frivilous spending dept.Plus,it will certainly buy us some nice new "legal" firearms here again.:D

Sparks

How many will be high-end, top-of-the-line race guns though Grizzly?
And who says they'll even bother with paying for them? If they just refuse to give you a licence, they're not depriving you of your ownership of the property - you can sell it to reclaim your investment. That worked for thirty years the last time...

bunny shooter

Sparks wrote: »

............
And who says they'll even bother with paying for them? If they just refuse to give you a licence, they're not depriving you of your ownership of the property - you can sell it to reclaim your investment. That worked for thirty years the last time...

True, shafted again

meathstevie

Well lads there's two angles to this.

The first one is the completely pessimistic one. Handguns will be banned on some spurious safety grounds. This would be an action that has no justification in facts and figures. How many crimes have been committed by licenced hand gun owners wih their pistols and revolvers ? None to the best of my knowledge. Yeah but criminals could steal them and blah blah blah... Well why would they FFS they can ship in tons of cocaine every day of the week with virtual impunity so shipping in a few bang bang sticks that have no trace in the state can't be that hard either and that's where your criminal use handguns are coming from. Not from law abiding licenced sports shooters. Go and sort that before you start talking about taking away law abiding people's sports equipment. While your at it you can confiscate hurleys as well because to the best of my knowledge there's a lot more crimes/assaults taking place on GAA pitches than on shooting ranges.

The second option could be a slightly more optimistic one. Restrictions could be placed on the types of pistols. Single-action only, maximum magazine capacity of 5 rounds etc etc but for some reason I don't think this will happen.

From the Prime Time episode that rattled or cages to the judge last week it all seems like someone/group has an agenda based on uninformed scare mongering wishy washy politcally correct BS. And please don't call it liberal, liberals believe in the freedom/responsibility of the individual and argue for an unrestrictive state. Jeezes, the people who drew up the American constitution are just about the definition of liberal minded politicians.

As licenced gun owners which most of us in here are we should all be very alert after this shot in front of our bough. Personally I have very little interest in handguns but my rifle and shotguns are firearms as well and where does the wishy washy BS stop. As law abiding sports shooters we should stick together and lobby our TD's and tell them in no unclear terms that we will put pressure on our organisations and convince our friends and relatives to vote against the government in the next local elections and eventual Lisbon rerun and will continue to do so untill they see sense and stop trying to tackle an issue that isn't even an issue except in the mind of a few scaremongers.

Sparks

As law abiding sports shooters we should stick together

So from now on, associations will stop doing anything individually, and we'll just all do things together, right? The NARGC will pause all their cases until the NTSA, NASRPC, NRAI, NSAI, ICPSA, Pony Club and IFA agree to continue with such a demonstratedly risky course of action, right?

Yeah, didn't think so.
If we're all going to stand together, can it be before the point where we're all having to take a bite out of the fecal sandwich one of us prepared?

G17

Em, HELLOOOO?

If the powers that be are reading here that sporting shooters are talking about what they expect to get if they have to surrender their sporting firearms, maybe someone will say, "They've taken that idea well....


Not exactly from my cold dead hand but certainly from my barrister's office. I bend over backwards to be safe, law abiding and sporting. If you're reading this, the man, I'll give you one hell of a legal battle if you try to take my sport away. I'll scream, "WASTE OF TAXPAYERS MONEY!!!!!"as loud as my lungs will allow. It's easy for the anti's to argue danger and massacre, but there's simply no evidence of that in Ireland in relation to sporting shooting.


I don't want compensation for my sporting firearm, I want to shoot it. I've done nothing wrong and always act in the safest most responsible manner. Go and sort out some real problems, come back to me in 50 years.

I've written to the Department of Justice today to plead sense in the wake of the current incessant media deluge, which has come from I don't know where.

----

also

Sparks wrote: »

fecal sandwich

That's a whole bag of pleasant.:D

---

Sparks

G17 wrote: »

I've written to the Department of Justice today to plead sense in the wake of the current incessant media deluge, which has come from I don't know where.

That at least might be useful!

That's a whole bag of pleasant.:D

It's not really, but it is fairly accurate...

Sparks

G17 wrote: »

If you're reading this, the man, I'll give you one hell of a legal battle if you try to take my sport away.

I do wish that people who can find that kind of money (and we're talking in excess of 250k before getting in the door, and before VAT as well...) for this sort of thing would also find it when the local club could use a new clubhouse or new target holders or the junior program could use funds to send the current crop of juniors to an international competition, or, you know, something actually sport-related

G17

Sparks wrote: »

I do wish that people who can find that kind of money for this sort of thing would also find it when the local club could use a new clubhouse or new target holders or the junior program could use funds to send the current crop of juniors to an international competition, or, you know, something actually sport-related

Purely, I hasten to add, as an absolute, last, they've just taken my sporting firearms into 'storage' awaiting shredding, resort.

cavan shooter

Sparks wrote: »

I do wish that people who can find that kind of money for this sort of thing would also find it when the local club could use a new clubhouse or new target holders or the junior program could use funds to send the current crop of juniors to an international competition, or, you know, something actually sport-related

You forget, People woudn't have their pistols if it wasn't for a court case, Regrettable, that it had to be done but that is the truth of the matter.

Sparks

Yeah, but to be honest G17, after the last few years of crap from our own side, I'm not sure I'd do that myself. Maybe others aren't so jaded, but the first email I can find where I told people that trying to beat the DoJ into submission using the High Court wasn't going to work and would cause grief for us was from 1999. And others were there before me saying the same thing.

I mean, how much are we expected to accept? Years of asking for a course of action not to be taken and being ignored until the fecal matter is in the air circulation device and then being asked to weigh in to the clean-up effort? And worse, if we decline this appealing invitation, we end up being accused of some form of betrayal of the same people who wouldn't listen to us in the first place!

Sparks

cavan shooter wrote: »

You forget, People woudn't have their pistols if it wasn't for a court case, Regrettable, that it had to be done but that is the truth of the matter.

No, you're forgetting, we were offered .22 and air pistols ten years earlier. Instead of doing this step-by-step (get those first, build up familiarity and go back looking for more a year or two later), the offer was rejected to pursue the "all or nothing" approach. The comparison with the Donegal case (to me at least) is striking.

G17

Sparks! The answer! Not politicians or representative bodies or individuals or public opinion!

.50 cal Senokot!!!

Sparks

*hehe*
You know, that's the first laugh I've had today
Cheers for that G17

cavan shooter

And you think we'd all have 9mm now??, because weve all been good little shooters and earned our stripes on little 22lr??.

Sparks

Yes, and for longer than we've had them today, but more than that, I think we'd have had air and .22lr pistols for fourteen years instead of four.
I'd love to know who gets to decide that that's not so important when air and .22lr are so popular, if not so vocal.

And besides, how many times have we advised new shooters here to start with air or .22 and learn to shoot and then progress to heavier calibres? Why not take our own advice? What the hell is so damn disgraceful about doing things step-by-step? Why must everything be about getting everything you want, all at once?

cavan shooter

Then why the panic if they ban 9mm, can't you shoot targets just as well with air pistol and 22lr